6th Man of St. John's Basketball
St. John's Red Storm => In The Jungle... => Topic started by: Marillac on January 10, 2018, 08:16:18 AM
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I've been pretty negative, so here is a little hope. St. John's has to be the most uniquely positioned team to make a run at the tournament after starting out 0-5 in conference play.
(1) We VERY likely will end up with the top SOS in the country (currently #9 by ESPN and #14 by realtime RPI)
(2) Even though I can't even look at him right now, we supposedly get our second best player back in time to take on the #1 team in the country Saturday at home and they are only playing 7 guys.
(3) No team from a major conference has been left out of the tournament with an RPI better than 49 and there is virtually no way St. John's can win 8 or more games without achieving an RPI inside that mark.
(4) 8-6 puts us on the bubble and a win in the BET puts us on the right side of it. That's probably the 7/10 game against DePaul. Really not that crazy.
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0-5 sucks and coaches and players have not shown up to do their job consistently. All that said weve had some bad breaks that have lead to it. Big shots by other teams(creighton/gtown), missed ft’s in key spots by our best shooters, extremely hot shooting by opponents ( prov/ hall). Don’t even get me started on the refs, it’s bad all around, disgusting really.
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0-5 sucks and coaches and players have not shown up to do their job consistently. All that said weve had some bad breaks that have lead to it. Big shots by other teams(creighton/gtown), missed ft’s in key spots by our best shooters, extremely hot shooting by opponents ( prov/ hall). Don’t even get me started on the refs, it’s bad all around, disgusting really.
Still, 8-6 means an RPI around 40 and Lovett missing several close games would be a consideration by the committee.
Ponds won't be held at 19% from three for long. It makes no sense and he's due for a sharp correction. Trimble to a lesser degree as well.
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How bout this, late in first half we get up by 6 and momentum is shifting heavy in our direction. Ponds makes a great defensive play at half court, knocks the ball loose. From there it looks like he got fouled, no call. Then gtown player kicks ball, no call. What should have been at the least our ball out of bonds with a chande to increase lead to 8, instead it’s gtowns ball and they end half on 6-0 run. Momentum over. Last part of game. We tie it up and our next possession Simon got hacked TWICE at mid court and ends up turning it over for a layup. Momentum gone. Lastly, gtown got two foul calls on jumpshots throughout the game, refs decide not to call the most important one of all on the last play of the game?
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8-6 means we only lose 1 more conference game. That's insane.
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I've been pretty negative, so here is a little hope. St. John's has to be the most uniquely positioned team to make a run at the tournament after starting out 0-5 in conference play.
(1) We VERY likely will end up with the top SOS in the country (currently #9 by ESPN and #14 by realtime RPI)
(2) Even though I can't even look at him right now, we supposedly get our second best player back in time to take on the #1 team in the country Saturday at home and they are only playing 7 guys.
(3) No team from a major conference has been left out of the tournament with an RPI better than 49 and there is virtually no way St. John's can win 8 or more games without achieving an RPI inside that mark.
(4) 8-6 puts us on the bubble and a win in the BET puts us on the right side of it. That's probably the 7/10 game against DePaul. Really not that crazy.
Practicing today does not mean LoVett immediately plays or he will take time to get in game shape.
Last night Ahmed came extremely close to being scratched because of illness. No way this season you can lose any of the key guys & expect positive results. The thin roster will continue to bite us in the ass.
I get the possibilities you put together, but can't buy in because of depth issue, the fact we have already lost 3 home games (with one to follow Sat.) & a really tough schedule remaining. Just can't see this squad & staff making any run.
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0-5 sucks and coaches and players have not shown up to do their job consistently. All that said weve had some bad breaks that have lead to it. Big shots by other teams(creighton/gtown), missed ft’s in key spots by our best shooters, extremely hot shooting by opponents ( prov/ hall). Don’t even get me started on the refs, it’s bad all around, disgusting really.
Still, 8-6 means an RPI around 40 and Lovett missing several close games would be a consideration by the committee.
Ponds won't be held at 19% from three for long. It makes no sense and he's due for a sharp correction. Trimble to a lesser degree as well.
Don’t get me wrong, i don’t think there is a team in the conference we can’t beat when healthy and playing well. I have close to zero concerns about ponds shooting ability, his shot selection is questionable but he’s also primary target of every other gameplan. Our top 6 is as good as anyone’s but we have zero room for error.
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How bout this, late in first half we get up by 6 and momentum is shifting heavy in our direction. Ponds makes a great defensive play at half court, knocks the ball loose. From there it looks like he got fouled, no call. Then gtown player kicks ball, no call. What should have been at the least our ball out of bonds with a chande to increase lead to 8, instead it’s gtowns ball and they end half on 6-0 run. Momentum over. Last part of game. We tie it up and our next possession Simon got hacked TWICE at mid court and ends up turning it over for a layup. Momentum gone. Lastly, gtown got two foul calls on jumpshots throughout the game, refs decide not to call the most important one of all on the last play of the game?
Ponds hasn't been getting the whistle all year. He's routinely knocked to the ground. Simon won't get many calls away from the basket since he looks so awkward with the ball.
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8-6 means we only lose 1 more conference game. That's insane.
We have 14 games left man
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8-6 means we only lose 1 more conference game. That's insane.
8-6 means we lose 5 or 6 MORE conference games depending on Duke outcome. That can be 5-2 at home overall and steal 3 road wins (DePaul/Gtown/Providence).
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Changes needed to be made. As bad as 0-5 is. Better to finally make it clear to everyone that something needs to be fixed. Worst case would have been making the NIT and keeping everything the same.
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Digging out of 0-5 BE hole will take getting on a roll obviously. Looking at the next six games, that seems a daunting task with this roster. SJU just seems lost offensively, plays too much schoolyard style ball with poor shot selection, rebounds poorly and clearly has a thin margin of error. Coaching aside, I would be shocked to see them turn this around. Good to be hopeful, but being realistic works for me. I do feel for the kids & staff. This is more painful for them than us.
Keep playing hard, stay close to recruiting commits, work to avoid more roster churn and grab an upset or two seems a good way to salvage something. Mullin will be back, hopefully shakes up staff & will have solid pieces. If he can't do it with a good roster with depth, the outcome is obvious.
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Digging out of 0-5 BE hole will take getting on a roll obviously. Looking at the next six games, that seems a daunting task with this roster. SJU just seems lost offensively, plays too much schoolyard style ball with poor shot selection, rebounds poorly and clearly has a thin margin of error. Coaching aside, I would be shocked to see them turn this around. Good to be hopeful, but being realistic works for me. I do feel for the kids & staff. This is more painful for them than us.
The play they kept running was Shamorie dribbling around until he tried to score.
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Look Coach said he thinks this thing is going to turn quickly. Fine. Let's see him work his magic.
But Villanova at home and Xavier on the road smell like losses to me, that would put them in an 0-7 hole. Assuming they lose to Duke they would have to go 8-3 remainder of the season to get to 8-10. I don't see it. Not to mention 8-10 would still be a major disappointment and would still put ENORMOUS pressure on this staff to deliver big in 18-19 season. Forget NCAA next year, they better be challenging for the League title next year.
Think about this in 13-14 Lavin started 0-5 and finished 10-8 went to the NIT with 20 wins. Not good enough even though they went 10-3 over the next 13 and 2 of the losses were tight road losses to the two top teams Creighton and Villanova. Next year went 10-8 made the NCAA's and was fired.
My point is not to say he did a good job, he didn't. My point is if we fire coaches with that type of back to back then not sure why we would give Mullin any more slack.
And unlike 13-14 I don't see a 10-3 League finish for this team. Heck I don't see 8-10.
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0-18 is sadly in play. W/o Lovett we are a 4 or 5 win team talent wise. And unless we quit we are good enough to be competitive. The problem is when a team that is talented enough to be competitive but not get over the hump, frustration sets in. Add to that the fact that we lost a couple we could have won and that just adds to the frustration. Throw in the whole Lovett situation and things could get worse. Clearly we are looking at 0-7. If we get to 0-10 now you are not only dealing with frustration but pressure not to go winless on top of that. For a team that is not as bad as its record will look the whole feeling bad for yourself and just looking out for self stuff starts happening.
Obviously I am not rooting that way and I think we win 2 or 3, but 0-18 is a possibility.
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0-18 is sadly in play. W/o Lovett we are a 4 or 5 win team talent wise. And unless we quit we are good enough to be competitive. The problem is when a team that is talented enough to be competitive but not get over the hump, frustration sets in. Add to that the fact that we lost a couple we could have won and that just adds to the frustration. Throw in the whole Lovett situation and things could get worse. Clearly we are looking at 0-7. If we get to 0-10 now you are not only dealing with frustration but pressure not to go winless on top of that. For a team that is not as bad as its record will look the whole feeling bad for yourself and just looking out for self stuff starts happening.
Obviously I am not rooting that way and I think we win 2 or 3, but 0-18 is a possibility.
I expect us to go 500 with LoVett back. Hopefully it’s soon.
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First off, we're not going 0-18. You'd have to try to real hard for that to happen and clearly our effort hasn't been there. Like I said last night, I think we win about 5 games in conf. If we win 7 or 8 that would be a small miracle. We end the season teetering right about .500 in terms of our overall record making the NIT a possibility. Mullin gets one more year, Brooks keeps his commitment to us. Staff changes need to be made or it will be more of the same next year with just a few more wins due to increased talent and depth but still way below the team's potential. I hope I'm wrong but we shall see.
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I don't understand how people can seriously talk about going 8-6 over the next 14 and making the ncaa tournament, when we've just lost to depaul and georgetown at home. that was likely the easiest 5 game span they'll have in the conference schedule and they lost every game. even if they beat georgetown and depaul on the road (two teams they just lost to at home) they'll need to find 6 more wins in this scenario. I don't see nova, xavier, seton hall, or creighton losing to us, and they're certainly not going into hinkle and winning. i think it's more likely that marquette drops 100 on this team than sju sweeping them, but even if they do sweep, that's 4 wins. beat providence on the road somehow and that's 5. beat butler at home and that's six; hopefully get depaul in the be tourney and that's seven. this also assumes that they haven't totally quit at this point because the butler (@CA), @prov, and depaul (BE tourn) games will close out the season.
look, as long as there are games left to be played it's possible to make the tourney, but has this team shown anything in conference play to suggest it's more than a remote possibility?
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First off, we're not going 0-18. You'd have to try to real hard for that to happen and clearly our effort hasn't been there. Like I said last night, I think we win about 5 games in conf. If we win 7 or 8 that would be a small miracle. We end the season teetering right about .500 in terms of our overall record making the NIT a possibility. Mullin gets one more year, Brooks keeps his commitment to us. Staff changes need to be made or it will be more of the same next year with just a few more wins due to increased talent and depth but still way below the team's potential. I hope I'm wrong but we shall see.
That is probably the scenario that plays out.
I can't imagine a 2-16 type of season, he may survive that but boy there will be some calls for his ouster.
But either way he is putting ENORMOUS pressure on himself for next year.
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Even when / if Lovett comes back going to take a couple games to get his game back. And I like Lovett but it is not like we are getting Marcus Hatten or Walter Berry back. No depth, no inside scoring and bad shooting team. Margin for error is real small. Like I said I expect us to win a couple but 0-18 would not shock me. If we get to 500 like Mase said they should throw Mullin a parade.
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First off, we're not going 0-18. You'd have to try to real hard for that to happen and clearly our effort hasn't been there. Like I said last night, I think we win about 5 games in conf. If we win 7 or 8 that would be a small miracle. We end the season teetering right about .500 in terms of our overall record making the NIT a possibility. Mullin gets one more year, Brooks keeps his commitment to us. Staff changes need to be made or it will be more of the same next year with just a few more wins due to increased talent and depth but still way below the team's potential. I hope I'm wrong but we shall see.
That is probably the scenario that plays out.
I can't imagine a 2-16 type of season, he may survive that but boy there will be some calls for his ouster.
But either way he is putting ENORMOUS pressure on himself for next year.
Yeah he really is and will be squarely on the hot seat.
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I don't understand how people can seriously talk about going 8-6 over the next 14 and making the ncaa tournament, when we've just lost to depaul and georgetown at home. that was likely the easiest 5 game span they'll have in the conference schedule and they lost every game. even if they beat georgetown and depaul on the road (two teams they just lost to at home) they'll need to find 6 more wins in this scenario. I don't see nova, xavier, seton hall, or creighton losing to us, and they're certainly not going into hinkle and winning. i think it's more likely that marquette drops 100 on this team than sju sweeping them, but even if they do sweep, that's 4 wins. beat providence on the road somehow and that's 5. beat butler at home and that's six; hopefully get depaul in the be tourney and that's seven. this also assumes that they haven't totally quit at this point because the butler (@CA), @prov, and depaul (BE tourn) games will close out the season.
look, as long as there are games left to be played it's possible to make the tourney, but has this team shown anything in conference play to suggest it's more than a remote possibility?
They have shown nothing. The only game you can argue they truly had control and lost it was the Creighton game. They led by double digits in the second half and had good tempo and then the run and then they failed to make a play.
The other 4 games quite frankly the better team won that game. Including last night. Georgetown led for most of the second half and other than a few ties I don't think SJU ever led in the second half. They trailed for most if not all of the second half including for good portions in double digits for the other 3 (PC, SHU and DePaul).
That is the most discouraging part besides the 0-5 start. Seriously try to find good play in those 5 games, other than a few spurts in the two road games, you can't. It has been downright terrible basketball.
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When you can't shoot, game will look ugly. Sounds simple but with all of the coaching bashing going on, I think people are missing that.
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Look Coach said he thinks this thing is going to turn quickly. Fine. Let's see him work his magic.
But Villanova at home and Xavier on the road smell like losses to me, that would put them in an 0-7 hole. Assuming they lose to Duke they would have to go 8-3 remainder of the season to get to 8-10. I don't see it. Not to mention 8-10 would still be a major disappointment and would still put ENORMOUS pressure on this staff to deliver big in 18-19 season. Forget NCAA next year, they better be challenging for the League title next year.
Think about this in 13-14 Lavin started 0-5 and finished 10-8 went to the NIT with 20 wins. Not good enough even though they went 10-3 over the next 13 and 2 of the losses were tight road losses to the two top teams Creighton and Villanova. Next year went 10-8 made the NCAA's and was fired.
My point is not to say he did a good job, he didn't. My point is if we fire coaches with that type of back to back then not sure why we would give Mullin any more slack.
And unlike 13-14 I don't see a 10-3 League finish for this team. Heck I don't see 8-10.
Agree on prognosis
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Even when / if Lovett comes back going to take a couple games to get his game back. And I like Lovett but it is not like we are getting Marcus Hatten or Walter Berry back. No depth, no inside scoring and bad shooting team. Margin for error is real small. Like I said I expect us to win a couple but 0-18 would not shock me. If we get to 500 like Mase said they should throw Mullin a parade.
Not get to 500, play 500 rest of the way with LoVett.
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Lets get out first BE win. Then we can talk about hope.
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I've been pretty negative, so here is a little hope. St. John's has to be the most uniquely positioned team to make a run at the tournament after starting out 0-5 in conference play.
(1) We VERY likely will end up with the top SOS in the country (currently #9 by ESPN and #14 by realtime RPI)
(2) Even though I can't even look at him right now, we supposedly get our second best player back in time to take on the #1 team in the country Saturday at home and they are only playing 7 guys.
(3) No team from a major conference has been left out of the tournament with an RPI better than 49 and there is virtually no way St. John's can win 8 or more games without achieving an RPI inside that mark.
(4) 8-6 puts us on the bubble and a win in the BET puts us on the right side of it. That's probably the 7/10 game against DePaul. Really not that crazy.
Practicing today does not mean LoVett immediately plays or he will take time to get in game shape.
Last night Ahmed came extremely close to being scratched because of illness. No way this season you can lose any of the key guys & expect positive results. The thin roster will continue to bite us in the ass.
I get the possibilities you put together, but can't buy in because of depth issue, the fact we have already lost 3 home games (with one to follow Sat.) & a really tough schedule remaining. Just can't see this squad & staff making any run.
-The luck of having Bash with a 102 degree fever last night was downright cruel. The players, staff and fans didn't deserve to be dealt that card, with a healthy Bash we win by 10 last night. To note, him putting on that long sleeve and battling through a fever that high speaks to his moxie and he should've learned a lot of new respect from a lot of you. He's been our best player during this Marcus nightmare and last night showed what type of character he has.
-With Marcus I think that they're giving to give Nova all that they can handle. 8-6 isn't the craziest of ideas with a full roster. Unfortunately 5 game losing streaks in a 30 game season are debilitating and very hard to recover from. We arguably should've beaten Creighton, GTown, and Hall during this stretch, it leaves very little room for error moving forward.
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At this point for any Ncaa dream that people may have they would have to beat Nova and Xavier in the next two games. Seems unlikely to say the least. The lack of depth is absolutely killer. We should have good depth next year but I won’t count on that until I see it on the court. It’s very depressing in January seeemigly always having the conversation of well we should be much better next year. This season unlike any other of recent memory is very very disappointing.
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Even when / if Lovett comes back going to take a couple games to get his game back. And I like Lovett but it is not like we are getting Marcus Hatten or Walter Berry back. No depth, no inside scoring and bad shooting team. Margin for error is real small. Like I said I expect us to win a couple but 0-18 would not shock me. If we get to 500 like Mase said they should throw Mullin a parade.
Not get to 500, play 500 rest of the way with LoVett.
Lets break it down like Francesa used to do:
Nova-L
@Xavier-L
@Gtown-Now here is a game you can point to but I do not like ourr chances on the road vs anyone. Think it will be close but we don't win close games.Going with L
Creighton-L
@Butler-L
Xavier -L
Duke-um L
@Nova-L
Marquette-Don't like this matchup and at this point by my calculations we will be 10-15/ 0-12 coming off 2 brutal losses in a row. I got an L
@Depaul-Again on road and they smoked us. But I am giving therm this one. W
@Marquette-L
SH-L
Butler-We play our best game of season and some people post about how maybe just maybe we win BET after the W.
@Providence-Back to Earth L
So I have us at 12-19 / 2-16 going into BET
Maybe we win @Gtown and vs Marquette at home? But I have them beating Butler for no rhyme or reason so in the end I am going with 2 wins.
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At the beginning of the season, the team was playing solid basketball with a full compliment of players and they were never going to an offensive force.. last season everyone complained about the defense and to start the season, the defensive improvement was all everyone was talking about a couple of weeks ago.
The team has lost 15ppg - for a team that struggles offensively, it's a really big deal. Not having Lovett on the court completely changes the offense.
I am not defending the coaching staff because you are only as good as your record and I do think a Mike Rice type coach would really help.The team has not played well of late but even when they played well (Seton Hall & Creighton) they are coming up short. I am not sure how the fans expect a team to replace the production of their second best player. I do think its ridiculous that they have not been a little more upfront about the extent of Lovett's injury.
There is ZERO chance of the school making a change at year end and people saying Mullin should resign are insane. He is an incredibly competitive person and losing bothers him 10x more than the players.
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How bout this, late in first half we get up by 6 and momentum is shifting heavy in our direction. Ponds makes a great defensive play at half court, knocks the ball loose. From there it looks like he got fouled, no call. Then gtown player kicks ball, no call. What should have been at the least our ball out of bonds with a chande to increase lead to 8, instead it’s gtowns ball and they end half on 6-0 run. Momentum over. Last part of game. We tie it up and our next possession Simon got hacked TWICE at mid court and ends up turning it over for a layup. Momentum gone. Lastly, gtown got two foul calls on jumpshots throughout the game, refs decide not to call the most important one of all on the last play of the game?
To me this is one of the biggest plays of the game, complete momentum shift. Clearly kick ball but not according to the three blind mice.
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How bout this, late in first half we get up by 6 and momentum is shifting heavy in our direction. Ponds makes a great defensive play at half court, knocks the ball loose. From there it looks like he got fouled, no call. Then gtown player kicks ball, no call. What should have been at the least our ball out of bonds with a chande to increase lead to 8, instead it’s gtowns ball and they end half on 6-0 run. Momentum over. Last part of game. We tie it up and our next possession Simon got hacked TWICE at mid court and ends up turning it over for a layup. Momentum gone. Lastly, gtown got two foul calls on jumpshots throughout the game, refs decide not to call the most important one of all on the last play of the game?
Ponds hasn't been getting the whistle all year. He's routinely knocked to the ground. Simon won't get many calls away from the basket since he looks so awkward with the ball.
He also looks for the foul way too much. He does a lot of acting.
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How bout this, late in first half we get up by 6 and momentum is shifting heavy in our direction. Ponds makes a great defensive play at half court, knocks the ball loose. From there it looks like he got fouled, no call. Then gtown player kicks ball, no call. What should have been at the least our ball out of bonds with a chande to increase lead to 8, instead it’s gtowns ball and they end half on 6-0 run. Momentum over. Last part of game. We tie it up and our next possession Simon got hacked TWICE at mid court and ends up turning it over for a layup. Momentum gone. Lastly, gtown got two foul calls on jumpshots throughout the game, refs decide not to call the most important one of all on the last play of the game?
Ponds hasn't been getting the whistle all year. He's routinely knocked to the ground. Simon won't get many calls away from the basket since he looks so awkward with the ball.
He also looks for the foul way too much. He does a lot of acting.
I thought he got fouled on a bunch of his drives.Now would he have hit the FT's?
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Even when / if Lovett comes back going to take a couple games to get his game back. And I like Lovett but it is not like we are getting Marcus Hatten or Walter Berry back. No depth, no inside scoring and bad shooting team. Margin for error is real small. Like I said I expect us to win a couple but 0-18 would not shock me. If we get to 500 like Mase said they should throw Mullin a parade.
Not get to 500, play 500 rest of the way with LoVett.
Lets break it down like Francesa used to do:
Nova-L
@Xavier-L
@Gtown-Now here is a game you can point to but I do not like ourr chances on the road vs anyone. Think it will be close but we don't win close games.Going with L
Creighton-L
@Butler-L
Xavier -L
Duke-um L
@Nova-L
Marquette-Don't like this matchup and at this point by my calculations we will be 10-15/ 0-12 coming off 2 brutal losses in a row. I got an L
@Depaul-Again on road and they smoked us. But I am giving therm this one. W
@Marquette-L
SH-L
Butler-We play our best game of season and some people post about how maybe just maybe we win BET after the W.
@Providence-Back to Earth L
So I have us at 12-19 / 2-16 going into BET
Maybe we win @Gtown and vs Marquette at home? But I have them beating Butler for no rhyme or reason so in the end I am going with 2 wins.
Problem with this is what would you have predicted for first five games?
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Even when / if Lovett comes back going to take a couple games to get his game back. And I like Lovett but it is not like we are getting Marcus Hatten or Walter Berry back. No depth, no inside scoring and bad shooting team. Margin for error is real small. Like I said I expect us to win a couple but 0-18 would not shock me. If we get to 500 like Mase said they should throw Mullin a parade.
Not get to 500, play 500 rest of the way with LoVett.
Lets break it down like Francesa used to do:
Nova-L
@Xavier-L
@Gtown-Now here is a game you can point to but I do not like ourr chances on the road vs anyone. Think it will be close but we don't win close games.Going with L
Creighton-L
@Butler-L
Xavier -L
Duke-um L
@Nova-L
Marquette-Don't like this matchup and at this point by my calculations we will be 10-15/ 0-12 coming off 2 brutal losses in a row. I got an L
@Depaul-Again on road and they smoked us. But I am giving therm this one. W
@Marquette-L
SH-L
Butler-We play our best game of season and some people post about how maybe just maybe we win BET after the W.
@Providence-Back to Earth L
So I have us at 12-19 / 2-16 going into BET
Maybe we win @Gtown and vs Marquette at home? But I have them beating Butler for no rhyme or reason so in the end I am going with 2 wins.
Problem with this is what would you have predicted for first five games?
Lovett thing killed them. Not same team even if he comes back. I predicted 9-9 in BE.
Listen I hope I am wrong and they make a run, play in NIT and set themselves up for next year.
I agree with PMG no matter what happens Mullin won't be fired or quit but next year will be huuuuge for him and maybe even his legacy.
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Even when / if Lovett comes back going to take a couple games to get his game back. And I like Lovett but it is not like we are getting Marcus Hatten or Walter Berry back. No depth, no inside scoring and bad shooting team. Margin for error is real small. Like I said I expect us to win a couple but 0-18 would not shock me. If we get to 500 like Mase said they should throw Mullin a parade.
Not get to 500, play 500 rest of the way with LoVett.
Lets break it down like Francesa used to do:
Nova-L
@Xavier-L
@Gtown-Now here is a game you can point to but I do not like ourr chances on the road vs anyone. Think it will be close but we don't win close games.Going with L
Creighton-L
@Butler-L
Xavier -L
Duke-um L
@Nova-L
Marquette-Don't like this matchup and at this point by my calculations we will be 10-15/ 0-12 coming off 2 brutal losses in a row. I got an L
@Depaul-Again on road and they smoked us. But I am giving therm this one. W
@Marquette-L
SH-L
Butler-We play our best game of season and some people post about how maybe just maybe we win BET after the W.
@Providence-Back to Earth L
So I have us at 12-19 / 2-16 going into BET
Maybe we win @Gtown and vs Marquette at home? But I have them beating Butler for no rhyme or reason so in the end I am going with 2 wins.
Problem with this is what would you have predicted for first five games?
And speaking of things no one could have predicted, seriously what the hell happened to Yakwe? I mean to me that is up there with who shot Kennedy and the Bermuda Triangle. Much to his chagrin I dragged Pops to the game last night. I had a 5 minute conversation with him explaining that Yakwe was actually pretty good his Frosh year. Pops didn't believe me. Some other ST John's fan sitting behind me happened to hear the conversation and backed up my claim. Just as Yakwe fumbled around in the paint. My dad did not believe guy behind me either.
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At the beginning of the season, the team was playing solid basketball with a full compliment of players and they were never going to an offensive force.. last season everyone complained about the defense and to start the season, the defensive improvement was all everyone was talking about a couple of weeks ago.
The team has lost 15ppg - for a team that struggles offensively, it's a really big deal. Not having Lovett on the court completely changes the offense.
I am not defending the coaching staff because you are only as good as your record and I do think a Mike Rice type coach would really help.The team has not played well of late but even when they played well (Seton Hall & Creighton) they are coming up short. I am not sure how the fans expect a team to replace the production of their second best player. I do think its ridiculous that they have not been a little more upfront about the extent of Lovett's injury.
There is ZERO chance of the school making a change at year end and people saying Mullin should resign are insane. He is an incredibly competitive person and losing bothers him 10x more than the players.
Not trying to be disrespectful towards you or anyone on board. But if coach Mullin was so competitive why is st. Jean doing all coaching? Usually when things go bad the head coach takes a bigger role.
Mullin great player. Mullin seems like a great guy. As a player hard worker. As a coach- does he recruit? Does he coach?
We can argue about how talented this team is, we shouldn’t be dead last
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I've been pretty negative, so here is a little hope. St. John's has to be the most uniquely positioned team to make a run at the tournament after starting out 0-5 in conference play.
(1) We VERY likely will end up with the top SOS in the country (currently #9 by ESPN and #14 by realtime RPI)
(2) Even though I can't even look at him right now, we supposedly get our second best player back in time to take on the #1 team in the country Saturday at home and they are only playing 7 guys.
(3) No team from a major conference has been left out of the tournament with an RPI better than 49 and there is virtually no way St. John's can win 8 or more games without achieving an RPI inside that mark.
(4) 8-6 puts us on the bubble and a win in the BET puts us on the right side of it. That's probably the 7/10 game against DePaul. Really not that crazy.
Even with plenty of stiff competition, this might be the most insane thing ever posted on this board. It would be a miracle if we are even in the discussion for the NIT by the end of the season let alone the NCAA tournament
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WASJU, remember when Yakwes struggles were pinned on Sima? Undersized front court players need to make up for their height by excelling in other areas. I thought it would be rebouding but despite his elite athleticism its not the case. He can’t dribble, pass, or shoot at a division two level. And his instincts unfortunately can only improve so much. In a limited role with 4 basketball players around him he can contribute.
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At the beginning of the season, the team was playing solid basketball with a full compliment of players and they were never going to an offensive force.. last season everyone complained about the defense and to start the season, the defensive improvement was all everyone was talking about a couple of weeks ago.
The team has lost 15ppg - for a team that struggles offensively, it's a really big deal. Not having Lovett on the court completely changes the offense.
I am not defending the coaching staff because you are only as good as your record and I do think a Mike Rice type coach would really help.The team has not played well of late but even when they played well (Seton Hall & Creighton) they are coming up short. I am not sure how the fans expect a team to replace the production of their second best player. I do think its ridiculous that they have not been a little more upfront about the extent of Lovett's injury.
There is ZERO chance of the school making a change at year end and people saying Mullin should resign are insane. He is an incredibly competitive person and losing bothers him 10x more than the players.
Not trying to be disrespectful towards you or anyone on board. But if coach Mullin was so competitive why is st. Jean doing all coaching? Usually when things go bad the head coach takes a bigger role.
Mullin great player. Mullin seems like a great guy. As a player hard worker. As a coach- does he recruit? Does he coach?
We can argue about how talented this team is, we shouldn’t be dead last
I think Mullin's decision to appear hands off was a huge error on his part. Maybe other coaches act this way, but because he is Chris Mullin and never did it before, most of us paid more attention to his sideline demeanor? But as I stated earlier I was right behind Gtown bench and Ewing was much more involved with everything that was going on.
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WASJU, remember when Yakwes struggles were pinned on Sima? Undersized front court players need to make up for their height by excelling in other areas. I thought it would be rebouding but despite his elite athleticism its not the case. He can’t dribble, pass, or shoot at a division two level. And his instincts unfortunately can only improve so much. In a limited role with 4 basketball players around him he can contribute.
I don't disagree with anything you posted but his athleticism doesn't even appear elite any longer. Even with all his faults could you imagine he would be this bad? At times it looks like they pulled him out of the stands and slapped a jersey on him.
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At the beginning of the season, the team was playing solid basketball with a full compliment of players and they were never going to an offensive force.. last season everyone complained about the defense and to start the season, the defensive improvement was all everyone was talking about a couple of weeks ago.
The team has lost 15ppg - for a team that struggles offensively, it's a really big deal. Not having Lovett on the court completely changes the offense.
I am not defending the coaching staff because you are only as good as your record and I do think a Mike Rice type coach would really help.The team has not played well of late but even when they played well (Seton Hall & Creighton) they are coming up short. I am not sure how the fans expect a team to replace the production of their second best player. I do think its ridiculous that they have not been a little more upfront about the extent of Lovett's injury.
There is ZERO chance of the school making a change at year end and people saying Mullin should resign are insane. He is an incredibly competitive person and losing bothers him 10x more than the players.
Not trying to be disrespectful towards you or anyone on board. But if coach Mullin was so competitive why is st. Jean doing all coaching? Usually when things go bad the head coach takes a bigger role.
Mullin great player. Mullin seems like a great guy. As a player hard worker. As a coach- does he recruit? Does he coach?
We can argue about how talented this team is, we shouldn’t be dead last
I think Mullin's decision to appear hands off was a huge error on his part. Maybe other coaches act this way, but because he is Chris Mullin and never did it before, most of us paid more attention to his sideline demeanor? But as I stated earlier I was right behind Gtown bench and Ewing was much more involved with everything that was going on.
I don’t think it was his decision to appear hands off. I think he felt really uncomfortable addressing 10 guys less than half his age in a huddle. That is a skill that is really under appreciated and taken for granted. He’s gotten better and more used to it like I thought he would but it’s still a huge disadvantage vs nearly every other division 1 coach.
-
At the beginning of the season, the team was playing solid basketball with a full compliment of players and they were never going to an offensive force.. last season everyone complained about the defense and to start the season, the defensive improvement was all everyone was talking about a couple of weeks ago.
The team has lost 15ppg - for a team that struggles offensively, it's a really big deal. Not having Lovett on the court completely changes the offense.
I am not defending the coaching staff because you are only as good as your record and I do think a Mike Rice type coach would really help.The team has not played well of late but even when they played well (Seton Hall & Creighton) they are coming up short. I am not sure how the fans expect a team to replace the production of their second best player. I do think its ridiculous that they have not been a little more upfront about the extent of Lovett's injury.
There is ZERO chance of the school making a change at year end and people saying Mullin should resign are insane. He is an incredibly competitive person and losing bothers him 10x more than the players.
Not trying to be disrespectful towards you or anyone on board. But if coach Mullin was so competitive why is st. Jean doing all coaching? Usually when things go bad the head coach takes a bigger role.
Mullin great player. Mullin seems like a great guy. As a player hard worker. As a coach- does he recruit? Does he coach?
We can argue about how talented this team is, we shouldn’t be dead last
I think Mullin's decision to appear hands off was a huge error on his part. Maybe other coaches act this way, but because he is Chris Mullin and never did it before, most of us paid more attention to his sideline demeanor? But as I stated earlier I was right behind Gtown bench and Ewing was much more involved with everything that was going on.
I don’t think it was his decision to appear hands off. I think he felt really uncomfortable addressing 10 guys less than half his age in a huddle. That is a skill that is really under appreciated and taken for granted. He’s gotten better and more used to it like I thought he would but it’s still a huge disadvantage vs nearly every other division 1 coach.
Maybe. Don't know but would be surprising. If that was the case then probably wasn't wise decision to take this on.
-
At the beginning of the season, the team was playing solid basketball with a full compliment of players and they were never going to an offensive force.. last season everyone complained about the defense and to start the season, the defensive improvement was all everyone was talking about a couple of weeks ago.
The team has lost 15ppg - for a team that struggles offensively, it's a really big deal. Not having Lovett on the court completely changes the offense.
I am not defending the coaching staff because you are only as good as your record and I do think a Mike Rice type coach would really help.The team has not played well of late but even when they played well (Seton Hall & Creighton) they are coming up short. I am not sure how the fans expect a team to replace the production of their second best player. I do think its ridiculous that they have not been a little more upfront about the extent of Lovett's injury.
There is ZERO chance of the school making a change at year end and people saying Mullin should resign are insane. He is an incredibly competitive person and losing bothers him 10x more than the players.
Not trying to be disrespectful towards you or anyone on board. But if coach Mullin was so competitive why is st. Jean doing all coaching? Usually when things go bad the head coach takes a bigger role.
Mullin great player. Mullin seems like a great guy. As a player hard worker. As a coach- does he recruit? Does he coach?
We can argue about how talented this team is, we shouldn’t be dead last
I think Mullin's decision to appear hands off was a huge error on his part. Maybe other coaches act this way, but because he is Chris Mullin and never did it before, most of us paid more attention to his sideline demeanor? But as I stated earlier I was right behind Gtown bench and Ewing was much more involved with everything that was going on.
Patrick is exceeding expecations, I think he'll be there a long time
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Difference between Patrick and Chris is that Patrick paid his dues.
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At the beginning of the season, the team was playing solid basketball with a full compliment of players and they were never going to an offensive force.. last season everyone complained about the defense and to start the season, the defensive improvement was all everyone was talking about a couple of weeks ago.
The team has lost 15ppg - for a team that struggles offensively, it's a really big deal. Not having Lovett on the court completely changes the offense.
I am not defending the coaching staff because you are only as good as your record and I do think a Mike Rice type coach would really help.The team has not played well of late but even when they played well (Seton Hall & Creighton) they are coming up short. I am not sure how the fans expect a team to replace the production of their second best player. I do think its ridiculous that they have not been a little more upfront about the extent of Lovett's injury.
There is ZERO chance of the school making a change at year end and people saying Mullin should resign are insane. He is an incredibly competitive person and losing bothers him 10x more than the players.
Not trying to be disrespectful towards you or anyone on board. But if coach Mullin was so competitive why is st. Jean doing all coaching? Usually when things go bad the head coach takes a bigger role.
Mullin great player. Mullin seems like a great guy. As a player hard worker. As a coach- does he recruit? Does he coach?
We can argue about how talented this team is, we shouldn’t be dead last
I think Mullin's decision to appear hands off was a huge error on his part. Maybe other coaches act this way, but because he is Chris Mullin and never did it before, most of us paid more attention to his sideline demeanor? But as I stated earlier I was right behind Gtown bench and Ewing was much more involved with everything that was going on.
I don’t think it was his decision to appear hands off. I think he felt really uncomfortable addressing 10 guys less than half his age in a huddle. That is a skill that is really under appreciated and taken for granted. He’s gotten better and more used to it like I thought he would but it’s still a huge disadvantage vs nearly every other division 1 coach.
Maybe. Don't know but would be surprising. If that was the case then probably wasn't wise decision to take this on.
Maybe this is agreeing with your original point but I think his initial hope was that he could take an NBA approach, have a good gameplan with good players and let the game play out. Unfortunately for that, in a 40 minute college game every single possession matters and players need to be reeled in or motivated constantly throughout.
-
At the beginning of the season, the team was playing solid basketball with a full compliment of players and they were never going to an offensive force.. last season everyone complained about the defense and to start the season, the defensive improvement was all everyone was talking about a couple of weeks ago.
The team has lost 15ppg - for a team that struggles offensively, it's a really big deal. Not having Lovett on the court completely changes the offense.
I am not defending the coaching staff because you are only as good as your record and I do think a Mike Rice type coach would really help.The team has not played well of late but even when they played well (Seton Hall & Creighton) they are coming up short. I am not sure how the fans expect a team to replace the production of their second best player. I do think its ridiculous that they have not been a little more upfront about the extent of Lovett's injury.
There is ZERO chance of the school making a change at year end and people saying Mullin should resign are insane. He is an incredibly competitive person and losing bothers him 10x more than the players.
Not trying to be disrespectful towards you or anyone on board. But if coach Mullin was so competitive why is st. Jean doing all coaching? Usually when things go bad the head coach takes a bigger role.
Mullin great player. Mullin seems like a great guy. As a player hard worker. As a coach- does he recruit? Does he coach?
We can argue about how talented this team is, we shouldn’t be dead last
I think Mullin's decision to appear hands off was a huge error on his part. Maybe other coaches act this way, but because he is Chris Mullin and never did it before, most of us paid more attention to his sideline demeanor? But as I stated earlier I was right behind Gtown bench and Ewing was much more involved with everything that was going on.
I don’t think it was his decision to appear hands off. I think he felt really uncomfortable addressing 10 guys less than half his age in a huddle. That is a skill that is really under appreciated and taken for granted. He’s gotten better and more used to it like I thought he would but it’s still a huge disadvantage vs nearly every other division 1 coach.
Maybe. Don't know but would be surprising. If that was the case then probably wasn't wise decision to take this on.
Maybe this is agreeing with your original point but I think his initial hope was that he could take an NBA approach, have a good gameplan with good players and let the game play out. Unfortunately for that, in a 40 minute college game every single possession matters and players need to be reeled in or motivated constantly throughout.
Don't know if anyone mentioned but how did they leave their best 3 point shooter in the game after a TO with 4 fouls in a fouling situation? Why didn't they sub out Clark when they were fouling then put him back in after the FT? It was the bonus not a 1 and 1. Little thing but still.
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At the beginning of the season, the team was playing solid basketball with a full compliment of players and they were never going to an offensive force.. last season everyone complained about the defense and to start the season, the defensive improvement was all everyone was talking about a couple of weeks ago.
The team has lost 15ppg - for a team that struggles offensively, it's a really big deal. Not having Lovett on the court completely changes the offense.
I am not defending the coaching staff because you are only as good as your record and I do think a Mike Rice type coach would really help.The team has not played well of late but even when they played well (Seton Hall & Creighton) they are coming up short. I am not sure how the fans expect a team to replace the production of their second best player. I do think its ridiculous that they have not been a little more upfront about the extent of Lovett's injury.
There is ZERO chance of the school making a change at year end and people saying Mullin should resign are insane. He is an incredibly competitive person and losing bothers him 10x more than the players.
Not trying to be disrespectful towards you or anyone on board. But if coach Mullin was so competitive why is st. Jean doing all coaching? Usually when things go bad the head coach takes a bigger role.
Mullin great player. Mullin seems like a great guy. As a player hard worker. As a coach- does he recruit? Does he coach?
We can argue about how talented this team is, we shouldn’t be dead last
I think Mullin's decision to appear hands off was a huge error on his part. Maybe other coaches act this way, but because he is Chris Mullin and never did it before, most of us paid more attention to his sideline demeanor? But as I stated earlier I was right behind Gtown bench and Ewing was much more involved with everything that was going on.
I don’t think it was his decision to appear hands off. I think he felt really uncomfortable addressing 10 guys less than half his age in a huddle. That is a skill that is really under appreciated and taken for granted. He’s gotten better and more used to it like I thought he would but it’s still a huge disadvantage vs nearly every other division 1 coach.
Maybe. Don't know but would be surprising. If that was the case then probably wasn't wise decision to take this on.
Maybe this is agreeing with your original point but I think his initial hope was that he could take an NBA approach, have a good gameplan with good players and let the game play out. Unfortunately for that, in a 40 minute college game every single possession matters and players need to be reeled in or motivated constantly throughout.
Don't know if anyone mentioned but how did they leave their best 3 point shooter in the game after a TO with 4 fouls in a fouling situation? Why didn't they sub out Clark when they were fouling then put him back in after the FT? It was the bonus not a 1 and 1. Little thing but still.
Great point and rest of staff should be all over that shit
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At the beginning of the season, the team was playing solid basketball with a full compliment of players and they were never going to an offensive force.. last season everyone complained about the defense and to start the season, the defensive improvement was all everyone was talking about a couple of weeks ago.
The team has lost 15ppg - for a team that struggles offensively, it's a really big deal. Not having Lovett on the court completely changes the offense.
I am not defending the coaching staff because you are only as good as your record and I do think a Mike Rice type coach would really help.The team has not played well of late but even when they played well (Seton Hall & Creighton) they are coming up short. I am not sure how the fans expect a team to replace the production of their second best player. I do think its ridiculous that they have not been a little more upfront about the extent of Lovett's injury.
There is ZERO chance of the school making a change at year end and people saying Mullin should resign are insane. He is an incredibly competitive person and losing bothers him 10x more than the players.
Not trying to be disrespectful towards you or anyone on board. But if coach Mullin was so competitive why is st. Jean doing all coaching? Usually when things go bad the head coach takes a bigger role.
Mullin great player. Mullin seems like a great guy. As a player hard worker. As a coach- does he recruit? Does he coach?
We can argue about how talented this team is, we shouldn’t be dead last
I think Mullin's decision to appear hands off was a huge error on his part. Maybe other coaches act this way, but because he is Chris Mullin and never did it before, most of us paid more attention to his sideline demeanor? But as I stated earlier I was right behind Gtown bench and Ewing was much more involved with everything that was going on.
I don’t think it was his decision to appear hands off. I think he felt really uncomfortable addressing 10 guys less than half his age in a huddle. That is a skill that is really under appreciated and taken for granted. He’s gotten better and more used to it like I thought he would but it’s still a huge disadvantage vs nearly every other division 1 coach.
Maybe. Don't know but would be surprising. If that was the case then probably wasn't wise decision to take this on.
Maybe this is agreeing with your original point but I think his initial hope was that he could take an NBA approach, have a good gameplan with good players and let the game play out. Unfortunately for that, in a 40 minute college game every single possession matters and players need to be reeled in or motivated constantly throughout.
Don't know if anyone mentioned but how did they leave their best 3 point shooter in the game after a TO with 4 fouls in a fouling situation? Why didn't they sub out Clark when they were fouling then put him back in after the FT? It was the bonus not a 1 and 1. Little thing but still.
Theo noted that somewhere. I was equally shocked that he put Marv at top of zone press, dangerous place when in foul trouble.
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Patrick and staff in Year 1 are way ahead of Mullin and staff in Year 3. Patrick gets it and isn't afraid to ream a guy out if he makes a mistake. His staff is also heavy on experience. Some key differences.
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At the beginning of the season, the team was playing solid basketball with a full compliment of players and they were never going to an offensive force.. last season everyone complained about the defense and to start the season, the defensive improvement was all everyone was talking about a couple of weeks ago.
The team has lost 15ppg - for a team that struggles offensively, it's a really big deal. Not having Lovett on the court completely changes the offense.
I am not defending the coaching staff because you are only as good as your record and I do think a Mike Rice type coach would really help.The team has not played well of late but even when they played well (Seton Hall & Creighton) they are coming up short. I am not sure how the fans expect a team to replace the production of their second best player. I do think its ridiculous that they have not been a little more upfront about the extent of Lovett's injury.
There is ZERO chance of the school making a change at year end and people saying Mullin should resign are insane. He is an incredibly competitive person and losing bothers him 10x more than the players.
Not trying to be disrespectful towards you or anyone on board. But if coach Mullin was so competitive why is st. Jean doing all coaching? Usually when things go bad the head coach takes a bigger role.
Mullin great player. Mullin seems like a great guy. As a player hard worker. As a coach- does he recruit? Does he coach?
We can argue about how talented this team is, we shouldn’t be dead last
I think Mullin's decision to appear hands off was a huge error on his part. Maybe other coaches act this way, but because he is Chris Mullin and never did it before, most of us paid more attention to his sideline demeanor? But as I stated earlier I was right behind Gtown bench and Ewing was much more involved with everything that was going on.
Patrick is exceeding expecations, I think he'll be there a long time
A good example to see the difference in how they built a staff
Georgetown hired Louis Orr - experienced college coach, been around the Big East, previous head coaching experience, we have no one like that on staff. They also hired an experience recruiter, Robert Kirby,, who had previously worked at the school and recruited high level players to Georgetown. Then they hired a guy with local ties to the Maryland area - SMART hires all around.
Part of being a great coach is to put the right people around you and it is something St. John's has just not done.
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At the beginning of the season, the team was playing solid basketball with a full compliment of players and they were never going to an offensive force.. last season everyone complained about the defense and to start the season, the defensive improvement was all everyone was talking about a couple of weeks ago.
The team has lost 15ppg - for a team that struggles offensively, it's a really big deal. Not having Lovett on the court completely changes the offense.
I am not defending the coaching staff because you are only as good as your record and I do think a Mike Rice type coach would really help.The team has not played well of late but even when they played well (Seton Hall & Creighton) they are coming up short. I am not sure how the fans expect a team to replace the production of their second best player. I do think its ridiculous that they have not been a little more upfront about the extent of Lovett's injury.
There is ZERO chance of the school making a change at year end and people saying Mullin should resign are insane. He is an incredibly competitive person and losing bothers him 10x more than the players.
Not trying to be disrespectful towards you or anyone on board. But if coach Mullin was so competitive why is st. Jean doing all coaching? Usually when things go bad the head coach takes a bigger role.
Mullin great player. Mullin seems like a great guy. As a player hard worker. As a coach- does he recruit? Does he coach?
We can argue about how talented this team is, we shouldn’t be dead last
I think Mullin's decision to appear hands off was a huge error on his part. Maybe other coaches act this way, but because he is Chris Mullin and never did it before, most of us paid more attention to his sideline demeanor? But as I stated earlier I was right behind Gtown bench and Ewing was much more involved with everything that was going on.
I don’t think it was his decision to appear hands off. I think he felt really uncomfortable addressing 10 guys less than half his age in a huddle. That is a skill that is really under appreciated and taken for granted. He’s gotten better and more used to it like I thought he would but it’s still a huge disadvantage vs nearly every other division 1 coach.
Maybe. Don't know but would be surprising. If that was the case then probably wasn't wise decision to take this on.
Maybe this is agreeing with your original point but I think his initial hope was that he could take an NBA approach, have a good gameplan with good players and let the game play out. Unfortunately for that, in a 40 minute college game every single possession matters and players need to be reeled in or motivated constantly throughout.
Don't know if anyone mentioned but how did they leave their best 3 point shooter in the game after a TO with 4 fouls in a fouling situation? Why didn't they sub out Clark when they were fouling then put him back in after the FT? It was the bonus not a 1 and 1. Little thing but still.
I don't think this is little at all. My buddy and I were saying the same thing at the time, why the hell do you have a guy in with 4 fouls in a fouling situation? Even if the approach was to try to steal first, Clarke should not have been on the ball.
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Patrick and staff in Year 1 are way ahead of Mullin and staff in Year 3. Patrick gets it and isn't afraid to ream a guy out if he makes a mistake. His staff is also heavy on experience. Some key differences.
Patrick took over an established/relevant Big East program. Mullin has more work to do but its heading in the right direction. He is running an NBA style system. We don't have the horses for that and unfortunately I don't believe he is comfortable running anything else. That's where his in-experience hurts. He is to reliant on the horses, but they are coming even though we continue to struggle.
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Patrick and staff in Year 1 are way ahead of Mullin and staff in Year 3. Patrick gets it and isn't afraid to ream a guy out if he makes a mistake. His staff is also heavy on experience. Some key differences.
Patrick took over an established/relevant Big East program. Mullin has more work to do but its heading in the right direction. He is running an NBA style system. We don't have the horses for that and unfortunately I don't believe he is comfortable running anything else. That's where his in-experience hurts. He is to reliant on the horses, but they are coming even though we continue to struggle.
I disagree, Georgetown was in the midst of a significant fade for a few years under JTIII.
BTW-I don't think either one has proven squat, all Patrick has proven is he can beat a lot of really bad teams. Not sure why anyone feels the need to praise Patrick at the expense of Chris, neither has proven anything.
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Here are Georgetown's wins this year:
Jacksonville, Mt. St. Mary's, MD Eastern Shore, Richmond (road), Maine, Coppin St., Howard, NC A & T, North Texas, Alabama A & M, DePaul and SJU on the road.
That is not a misprint. With that type of resume so far I think Patrick Ewing is the next Tom Izzo, what do you think? Although I am not sure they would have beaten MD Eastern Shore without the staff he put together, good thing he hired Louis Orr for that game. Drew up some unbelievable plays for Govan or else they may have only won by 20 instead of 26...
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At the beginning of the season, the team was playing solid basketball with a full compliment of players and they were never going to an offensive force.. last season everyone complained about the defense and to start the season, the defensive improvement was all everyone was talking about a couple of weeks ago.
The team has lost 15ppg - for a team that struggles offensively, it's a really big deal. Not having Lovett on the court completely changes the offense.
I am not defending the coaching staff because you are only as good as your record and I do think a Mike Rice type coach would really help.The team has not played well of late but even when they played well (Seton Hall & Creighton) they are coming up short. I am not sure how the fans expect a team to replace the production of their second best player. I do think its ridiculous that they have not been a little more upfront about the extent of Lovett's injury.
There is ZERO chance of the school making a change at year end and people saying Mullin should resign are insane. He is an incredibly competitive person and losing bothers him 10x more than the players.
Not trying to be disrespectful towards you or anyone on board. But if coach Mullin was so competitive why is st. Jean doing all coaching? Usually when things go bad the head coach takes a bigger role.
Mullin great player. Mullin seems like a great guy. As a player hard worker. As a coach- does he recruit? Does he coach?
We can argue about how talented this team is, we shouldn’t be dead last
I think Mullin's decision to appear hands off was a huge error on his part. Maybe other coaches act this way, but because he is Chris Mullin and never did it before, most of us paid more attention to his sideline demeanor? But as I stated earlier I was right behind Gtown bench and Ewing was much more involved with everything that was going on.
Patrick is exceeding expecations, I think he'll be there a long time
A good example to see the difference in how they built a staff
Georgetown hired Louis Orr - experienced college coach, been around the Big East, previous head coaching experience, we have no one like that on staff. They also hired an experience recruiter, Robert Kirby,, who had previously worked at the school and recruited high level players to Georgetown. Then they hired a guy with local ties to the Maryland area - SMART hires all around.
Part of being a great coach is to put the right people around you and it is something St. John's has just not done.
Spot on Patyy
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Here are Georgetown's wins this year:
Jacksonville, Mt. St. Mary's, MD Eastern Shore, Richmond (road), Maine, Coppin St., Howard, NC A & T, North Texas, Alabama A & M, DePaul and SJU on the road.
That is not a misprint. With that type of resume so far I think Patrick Ewing is the next Tom Izzo, what do you think? Although I am not sure they would have beaten MD Eastern Shore without the staff he put together, good thing he hired Louis Orr for that game. Drew up some unbelievable plays for Govan or else they may have only won by 20 instead of 26...
Who said Tom Izzo. I think people are just saying seems more coach ready then Chris Mullin. Certainly is more engaged. But as some people have noted he was an NBA asst for years, so it shouldn't be a surprise.
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Patrick and staff in Year 1 are way ahead of Mullin and staff in Year 3. Patrick gets it and isn't afraid to ream a guy out if he makes a mistake. His staff is also heavy on experience. Some key differences.
Patrick took over an established/relevant Big East program. Mullin has more work to do but its heading in the right direction. He is running an NBA style system. We don't have the horses for that and unfortunately I don't believe he is comfortable running anything else. That's where his in-experience hurts. He is to reliant on the horses, but they are coming even though we continue to struggle.
I disagree, Georgetown was in the midst of a significant fade for a few years under JTIII.
BTW-I don't think either one has proven squat, all Patrick has proven is he can beat a lot of really bad teams. Not sure why anyone feels the need to praise Patrick at the expense of Chris, neither has proven anything.
This. G'town hasn't been a relevant program in at least 5 years and closer to 10.
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Patrick and staff in Year 1 are way ahead of Mullin and staff in Year 3. Patrick gets it and isn't afraid to ream a guy out if he makes a mistake. His staff is also heavy on experience. Some key differences.
Patrick took over an established/relevant Big East program. Mullin has more work to do but its heading in the right direction. He is running an NBA style system. We don't have the horses for that and unfortunately I don't believe he is comfortable running anything else. That's where his in-experience hurts. He is to reliant on the horses, but they are coming even though we continue to struggle.
I disagree, Georgetown was in the midst of a significant fade for a few years under JTIII.
BTW-I don't think either one has proven squat, all Patrick has proven is he can beat a lot of really bad teams. Not sure why anyone feels the need to praise Patrick at the expense of Chris, neither has proven anything.
This. G'town hasn't been a relevant program in at least 5 years and closer to 10.
What is our relevancy clock at currently?
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Here are Georgetown's wins this year:
Jacksonville, Mt. St. Mary's, MD Eastern Shore, Richmond (road), Maine, Coppin St., Howard, NC A & T, North Texas, Alabama A & M, DePaul and SJU on the road.
That is not a misprint. With that type of resume so far I think Patrick Ewing is the next Tom Izzo, what do you think? Although I am not sure they would have beaten MD Eastern Shore without the staff he put together, good thing he hired Louis Orr for that game. Drew up some unbelievable plays for Govan or else they may have only won by 20 instead of 26...
Who said Tom Izzo. I think people are just saying seems more coach ready then Chris Mullin. Certainly is more engaged. But as some people have noted he was an NBA asst for years, so it shouldn't be a surprise.
I was obviously using hyperbole to make a point. He has 1 top 100 win so far and that believe it or not is from last night and anyone who saw that game would tell you Dr. Naismith is not clapping after that display.
What in God's name has he done so far to tell you his hire or his way is working anymore than Chris'? Nothing except an ugly 3 point win in a game his team did everything but give away last night.
And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
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Here are Georgetown's wins this year:
Jacksonville, Mt. St. Mary's, MD Eastern Shore, Richmond (road), Maine, Coppin St., Howard, NC A & T, North Texas, Alabama A & M, DePaul and SJU on the road.
That is not a misprint. With that type of resume so far I think Patrick Ewing is the next Tom Izzo, what do you think? Although I am not sure they would have beaten MD Eastern Shore without the staff he put together, good thing he hired Louis Orr for that game. Drew up some unbelievable plays for Govan or else they may have only won by 20 instead of 26...
I heard an interview with Ewing - he said something like that is a this years schedule was good for this current Georgetown team. He seemed well aware that it was very weak.
Patrick seems to be in charge. He certainly seems competent
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Here are Georgetown's wins this year:
Jacksonville, Mt. St. Mary's, MD Eastern Shore, Richmond (road), Maine, Coppin St., Howard, NC A & T, North Texas, Alabama A & M, DePaul and SJU on the road.
That is not a misprint. With that type of resume so far I think Patrick Ewing is the next Tom Izzo, what do you think? Although I am not sure they would have beaten MD Eastern Shore without the staff he put together, good thing he hired Louis Orr for that game. Drew up some unbelievable plays for Govan or else they may have only won by 20 instead of 26...
I heard an interview with Ewing - he said something like that is a this years schedule was good for this current Georgetown team. He seemed well aware that it was very weak.
Patrick seems to be in charge. He certainly seems competent
Guy I know why he did it, that does not mean you actually have PROVEN anything by executing against it.
So if Chris Mullin scheduled that this year and went 11-1 in the pre-season you would be OK because HE DID IT.
My point is simple, has he actually proven ANYTHING except he can beat a LOT of bad teams? NO? The best team he faced by far (Creighton at home) blew their doors off.
He very well may be a good coach in 2 or 3 years but I don't know what you can derive from what he has done so far to tell you he is ahead of anyone.
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Here are Georgetown's wins this year:
Jacksonville, Mt. St. Mary's, MD Eastern Shore, Richmond (road), Maine, Coppin St., Howard, NC A & T, North Texas, Alabama A & M, DePaul and SJU on the road.
That is not a misprint. With that type of resume so far I think Patrick Ewing is the next Tom Izzo, what do you think? Although I am not sure they would have beaten MD Eastern Shore without the staff he put together, good thing he hired Louis Orr for that game. Drew up some unbelievable plays for Govan or else they may have only won by 20 instead of 26...
Who said Tom Izzo. I think people are just saying seems more coach ready then Chris Mullin. Certainly is more engaged. But as some people have noted he was an NBA asst for years, so it shouldn't be a surprise.
I was obviously using hyperbole to make a point. He has 1 top 100 win so far and that believe it or not is from last night and anyone who saw that game would tell you Dr. Naismith is not clapping after that display.
What in God's name has he done so far to tell you his hire or his way is working anymore than Chris'? Nothing except an ugly 3 point win in a game his team did everything but give away last night.
And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
Just saying long way from saying someone is a better coach than Mullin to Tom Izzo.
Can't speak for anyone else but my only point is that Ewing seems much more involved. Obviously not in the huddle and he could be talking gobbidy gook, but he does seem more in tuned with everything. Even if that is only an impression, I think that kind of demeanor would have bought Chris Mullin more goodwill. BTW I can't believe I just typed Chris Mullin needs more goodwill from ST John's fans.
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Here are Georgetown's wins this year:
Jacksonville, Mt. St. Mary's, MD Eastern Shore, Richmond (road), Maine, Coppin St., Howard, NC A & T, North Texas, Alabama A & M, DePaul and SJU on the road.
That is not a misprint. With that type of resume so far I think Patrick Ewing is the next Tom Izzo, what do you think? Although I am not sure they would have beaten MD Eastern Shore without the staff he put together, good thing he hired Louis Orr for that game. Drew up some unbelievable plays for Govan or else they may have only won by 20 instead of 26...
Who said Tom Izzo. I think people are just saying seems more coach ready then Chris Mullin. Certainly is more engaged. But as some people have noted he was an NBA asst for years, so it shouldn't be a surprise.
I was obviously using hyperbole to make a point. He has 1 top 100 win so far and that believe it or not is from last night and anyone who saw that game would tell you Dr. Naismith is not clapping after that display.
What in God's name has he done so far to tell you his hire or his way is working anymore than Chris'? Nothing except an ugly 3 point win in a game his team did everything but give away last night.
And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
Just saying long way from saying someone is a better coach than Mullin to Tom Izzo.
Can't speak for anyone else but my only point is that Ewing seems much more involved. Obviously not in the huddle and he could be talking gobbidy gook, but he does seem more in tuned with everything. Even if that is only an impression, I think that kind of demeanor would have bought Chris Mullin more goodwill. BTW I can't believe I just typed Chris Mullin needs more goodwill from ST John's fans.
Again I answered that I was using hyperbole for crying out loud.
And no I don't think demeanor means squat. Georgetown's staff has proven nothing and they will be near the bottom of the BE this year and that is OK because they are projected to be bad. Time will tell on their staff.
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Patrick and staff in Year 1 are way ahead of Mullin and staff in Year 3. Patrick gets it and isn't afraid to ream a guy out if he makes a mistake. His staff is also heavy on experience. Some key differences.
Patrick took over an established/relevant Big East program. Mullin has more work to do but its heading in the right direction. He is running an NBA style system. We don't have the horses for that and unfortunately I don't believe he is comfortable running anything else. That's where his in-experience hurts. He is to reliant on the horses, but they are coming even though we continue to struggle.
I disagree, Georgetown was in the midst of a significant fade for a few years under JTIII.
BTW-I don't think either one has proven squat, all Patrick has proven is he can beat a lot of really bad teams. Not sure why anyone feels the need to praise Patrick at the expense of Chris, neither has proven anything.
This. G'town hasn't been a relevant program in at least 5 years and closer to 10.
What is our relevancy clock at currently?
Whatever it is it's not an excuse for Mullin. He needs to stay focused on his own mess.
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Here are Georgetown's wins this year:
Jacksonville, Mt. St. Mary's, MD Eastern Shore, Richmond (road), Maine, Coppin St., Howard, NC A & T, North Texas, Alabama A & M, DePaul and SJU on the road.
That is not a misprint. With that type of resume so far I think Patrick Ewing is the next Tom Izzo, what do you think? Although I am not sure they would have beaten MD Eastern Shore without the staff he put together, good thing he hired Louis Orr for that game. Drew up some unbelievable plays for Govan or else they may have only won by 20 instead of 26...
Who said Tom Izzo. I think people are just saying seems more coach ready then Chris Mullin. Certainly is more engaged. But as some people have noted he was an NBA asst for years, so it shouldn't be a surprise.
I was obviously using hyperbole to make a point. He has 1 top 100 win so far and that believe it or not is from last night and anyone who saw that game would tell you Dr. Naismith is not clapping after that display.
What in God's name has he done so far to tell you his hire or his way is working anymore than Chris'? Nothing except an ugly 3 point win in a game his team did everything but give away last night.
And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
Just saying long way from saying someone is a better coach than Mullin to Tom Izzo.
Can't speak for anyone else but my only point is that Ewing seems much more involved. Obviously not in the huddle and he could be talking gobbidy gook, but he does seem more in tuned with everything. Even if that is only an impression, I think that kind of demeanor would have bought Chris Mullin more goodwill. BTW I can't believe I just typed Chris Mullin needs more goodwill from ST John's fans.
Again I answered that I was using hyperbole for crying out loud.
And no I don't think demeanor means squat. Georgetown's staff has proven nothing and they will be near the bottom of the BE this year and that is OK because they are projected to be bad. Time will tell on their staff.
Fine for you but a great many on here it seems to bother. I never thought about it before and if Mullin was winning no one would probably bring it up. But since we are losing it is clearly bad optics. How many times did Maher bring up sitting on the table? The words dry board have probably been brought up 100 times on these boards. I am not arguing with your stance, but clearly his results combined with perception has him facing criticism earlier than imaginable.
Do disagree about Louie Orr, guy has had success and I would take him over ST Jean or Richmond obviously.
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
You really think Louis Orr is a bigger name in college hoops than Slice?
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
You really think Louis Orr is a bigger name in college hoops than Slice?
Orr is Ewing's bench coach with experience that everyone has been harping about for 3 years. I do not think Slice was ever supposed to be that.
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
You really think Louis Orr is a bigger name in college hoops than Slice?
Orr is Ewing's bench coach with experience that everyone has been harping about for 3 years. I do not think Slice was ever supposed to be that.
I agree but he definitely fits the bill as someone with deep college experience. Where he went wrong was st Jean as his third.
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
You really think Louis Orr is a bigger name in college hoops than Slice?
As a coach, definitely, as a bag man probably not.
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
You really think Louis Orr is a bigger name in college hoops than Slice?
As a coach, definitely, as a bag man probably not.
My point is that everyone including the rest of college b-ball world was exalting mullin and at Johns (something that never happens!) for hiring slice. Matt came with plenty of experience as well. To say at this point he didn’t go out and hire the right staff seems like revisionist history to me.
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
You really think Louis Orr is a bigger name in college hoops than Slice?
Orr is Ewing's bench coach with experience that everyone has been harping about for 3 years. I do not think Slice was ever supposed to be that.
I agree but he definitely fits the bill as someone with deep college experience. Where he went wrong was st Jean as his third.
Third? Who is first?
You really see us going 7-7?
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
You really think Louis Orr is a bigger name in college hoops than Slice?
As a coach, definitely, as a bag man probably not.
My point is that everyone including the rest of college b-ball world was exalting mullin and at Johns (something that never happens!) for hiring slice. Matt came with plenty of experience as well. To say at this point he didn’t go out and hire the right staff seems like revisionist history to me.
Slice and everyone's favorite midget were fine. Like you said ST Jean instead of George Blaney type was the issue. Orr fits that bill. BTW do you think in George Blaney's wildest dreams he thought he would would become an adjective? Or at the very least a description of a job type?
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
No I don't know it and I don't share your point.
Talk to me in 2-3 years way too early to draw any conclusions over staff
Hiring Louis Orr proves nothing at this point. It may well prove to pay dividends but at this point it means nothing. Georgetown is going nowhere this year with or without Orr.
Give Mullin their roster and their schedule and I don't see a difference with Georgetown's record. And yet you are drawing these conclusions now as opposed to 3 years from now.
That is the point, don't tell me what I should know
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
No I don't know it and I don't share your point.
Talk to me in 2-3 years way too early to draw any conclusions over staff
Hiring Louis Orr proves nothing at this point. It may well prove to pay dividends but at this point it means nothing. Georgetown is going nowhere this year with or without Orr.
Give Mullin their roster and their schedule and I don't see a difference with Georgetown's record. And yet you are drawing these conclusions now as opposed to 3 years from now.
That is the point, don't tell me what I should know
So your argument is you can't call anything anything until it plays itself out in 2 or 3 years? So if the Giants hire a guy off the street to coach them if it works out great it was a good hire and if it doesn't it was a bad hire?
Not sure life works that way. You can describe something by the facts you have at that moment in time. Is it possible to be proven wrong, sure. But I would call Orr hire better than ST Jean hire.
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
You really think Louis Orr is a bigger name in college hoops than Slice?
Orr is Ewing's bench coach with experience that everyone has been harping about for 3 years. I do not think Slice was ever supposed to be that.
I agree but he definitely fits the bill as someone with deep college experience. Where he went wrong was st Jean as his third.
Third? Who is first?
You really see us going 7-7?
Third hire. Is Lovett back for nova? Ill stick to 500 with him back. And in all honesty I expected to be better than 500 with Lovett prior to this stretch so going that now doesn't seem farfetched to me. We can certainly feel bad for ourselves, hell I blame myself for cursing the program, I must be the only guy in the world who became a fan of the program during our ohio state elite 8 loss. I havnt been able to get enough since and its basically been one long wait till next year. Mullin and team cant dwell and sulk. On to the next one.
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
No I don't know it and I don't share your point.
Talk to me in 2-3 years way too early to draw any conclusions over staff
Hiring Louis Orr proves nothing at this point. It may well prove to pay dividends but at this point it means nothing. Georgetown is going nowhere this year with or without Orr.
Give Mullin their roster and their schedule and I don't see a difference with Georgetown's record. And yet you are drawing these conclusions now as opposed to 3 years from now.
That is the point, don't tell me what I should know
So your argument is you can't call anything anything until it plays itself out in 2 or 3 years? So if the Giants hire a guy off the street to coach them if it works out great it was a good hire and if it doesn't it was a bad hire?
Not sure life works that way. You can describe something by the facts you have at that moment in time. Is it possible to be proven wrong, sure. But I would call Orr hire better than ST Jean hire.
No that's not my point. If Georgetown was doung something exceptional this year in recruting or on the court or both then you may be able to draw an early conclusion or something. But short if that no. Not really.
Bottom line is Ewing is doing with a decent roster and God awful schedule what any decent competent coach, say former HM assistant would do. So what. I could name dozens of nameless coaches who would have the same record.
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
You really think Louis Orr is a bigger name in college hoops than Slice?
Orr is Ewing's bench coach with experience that everyone has been harping about for 3 years. I do not think Slice was ever supposed to be that.
Slice is almost as much a pure recruiter as Matt is, however he does also do skill development with bigmen. I watched Slice's teams at Manhattan and can tell you he is not a bench coach. Louis Orr fits much more into the mold of a bench coach and PMG is absolutely correct that Ewing built a smarter staff in this respect. Have no problem with Matt/Slice or Matt/Mitch combo. It has always been the St. Jean hire that was befuddling, with him having 0 experience and being so young. He could very well be a prodigy and turn out to be a great coach one day but nothing replaces a coach that has experience practice-planning, gameplanning and being "THE GUY" on the bench for sub patterns, time/score situations late in games and thinking on your feet late in the game.
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
No I don't know it and I don't share your point.
Talk to me in 2-3 years way too early to draw any conclusions over staff
Hiring Louis Orr proves nothing at this point. It may well prove to pay dividends but at this point it means nothing. Georgetown is going nowhere this year with or without Orr.
Give Mullin their roster and their schedule and I don't see a difference with Georgetown's record. And yet you are drawing these conclusions now as opposed to 3 years from now.
That is the point, don't tell me what I should know
So your argument is you can't call anything anything until it plays itself out in 2 or 3 years? So if the Giants hire a guy off the street to coach them if it works out great it was a good hire and if it doesn't it was a bad hire?
Not sure life works that way. You can describe something by the facts you have at that moment in time. Is it possible to be proven wrong, sure. But I would call Orr hire better than ST Jean hire.
No that's not my point. If Georgetown was doing something exceptional this year in recruting or on the court or both then you may be able to draw an early conclusion or something. But short of that no. Not really.
Bottom line is Ewing is doing with a decent roster and God awful schedule what any decent competent coach, say former HM assistant would do. So what. I could name dozens of nameless coaches who would have the same record.
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I'm tired of arguing this. If you think SJU needs to hire a Louis Orr type fine. Go with that. I don't care.
Chris is the HC, he hires who he wants and who he feels comfortable with. That is all I care about. If he can't win like that then he needs to go, but he doesn't need me to tell him who he should surround himself with. He has been in basketball his whole life, if he needs a bunch of fans to tell him that then he has no business being the coach of SJU to begin with.
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I'm tired of arguing this. If you think SJU needs to hire a Louis Orr type fine. Go with that. I don't care.
Chris is the HC, he hires who he wants and who he feels comfortable with. That is all I care about. If he can't win like that then he needs to go, but he doesn't need me to tell him who he should surround himself with. He has been in basketball his whole life, if he needs a bunch of fans to tell him that then he has no business being the coach of SJU to begin with.
I am a Mullin guy but the reason these questions and suggestions are being brought up is because at the moment it is a very real question of does he have any business being a coach.
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Here are Georgetown's wins this year:
Jacksonville, Mt. St. Mary's, MD Eastern Shore, Richmond (road), Maine, Coppin St., Howard, NC A & T, North Texas, Alabama A & M, DePaul and SJU on the road.
That is not a misprint. With that type of resume so far I think Patrick Ewing is the next Tom Izzo, what do you think? Although I am not sure they would have beaten MD Eastern Shore without the staff he put together, good thing he hired Louis Orr for that game. Drew up some unbelievable plays for Govan or else they may have only won by 20 instead of 26...
Who said Tom Izzo. I think people are just saying seems more coach ready then Chris Mullin. Certainly is more engaged. But as some people have noted he was an NBA asst for years, so it shouldn't be a surprise.
I was obviously using hyperbole to make a point. He has 1 top 100 win so far and that believe it or not is from last night and anyone who saw that game would tell you Dr. Naismith is not clapping after that display.
What in God's name has he done so far to tell you his hire or his way is working anymore than Chris'? Nothing except an ugly 3 point win in a game his team did everything but give away last night.
And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
Just saying long way from saying someone is a better coach than Mullin to Tom Izzo.
Can't speak for anyone else but my only point is that Ewing seems much more involved. Obviously not in the huddle and he could be talking gobbidy gook, but he does seem more in tuned with everything. Even if that is only an impression, I think that kind of demeanor would have bought Chris Mullin more goodwill. BTW I can't believe I just typed Chris Mullin needs more goodwill from ST John's fans.
Again I answered that I was using hyperbole for crying out loud.
And no I don't think demeanor means squat. Georgetown's staff has proven nothing and they will be near the bottom of the BE this year and that is OK because they are projected to be bad. Time will tell on their staff.
Fine for you but a great many on here it seems to bother. I never thought about it before and if Mullin was winning no one would probably bring it up. But since we are losing it is clearly bad optics. How many times did Maher bring up sitting on the table? The words dry board have probably been brought up 100 times on these boards. I am not arguing with your stance, but clearly his results combined with perception has him facing criticism earlier than imaginable.
Do disagree about Louie Orr, guy has had success and I would take him over ST Jean or Richmond obviously.
A new head coach, not coaching, while his 23 year old assistant with 0 experience coaches a team is not bad optics it is absurd. Do you remember what it was like? My friend at the Fordham was laughing at me and said “the players don’t even look at him, they only look at the young guy.”
I get no joy in bashing Mullin or anyone else and I don’t believe I am. Just pointing out what really happened.
Patrick- 2 big east wins
Chris- 8 big east wins
Cupards, Rome wasn’t built in a day, and other excuses either stop or we keep getting killed.
New coach first needs to build a staff. - we have a terrible one
Instil culture - play defense - toughness- accountability- shot selection- boxing out - defense
That should start immediately- that first crappy team should have been tougher- that isn’t optics
No one deserves a pass - for being unprepared- blow out by a division 2 team- incarnate word blow out- their were more cupcake losses.
The solution- year 4- bring in x and o guy- what does that even mean? Syracuse was for 40 years because of an x and o guy? Why don’t we have x and o guys? At the end of a game Chris Mullin should be giving instructions, not st. Jean, not mike rice
Alternative solution- bring in an experienced head coach- who brings in 3 good assistant - they all coach- they all recruit - they all make a lot of money, but they earn it because they work hard- bring in people that really want to be here- this is their dream job- not guys who already had their dream jobs
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And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
That is not the point and you know it...
Ewing started his college coaching career by surrounding himself with some people with deep experience at the college level. It is the opposite of Coach Mullin did.
No I don't know it and I don't share your point.
Talk to me in 2-3 years way too early to draw any conclusions over staff
Hiring Louis Orr proves nothing at this point. It may well prove to pay dividends but at this point it means nothing. Georgetown is going nowhere this year with or without Orr.
Give Mullin their roster and their schedule and I don't see a difference with Georgetown's record. And yet you are drawing these conclusions now as opposed to 3 years from now.
That is the point, don't tell me what I should know
I am not drawing any conclusions.
Ewing was smart to hire an experienced staff, Mullin didn't. It's not difficult to understand.
Maybe you have reverted back to arguing just for arguments sake.
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I'm tired of arguing this. If you think SJU needs to hire a Louis Orr type fine. Go with that. I don't care.
Chris is the HC, he hires who he wants and who he feels comfortable with. That is all I care about. If he can't win like that then he needs to go, but he doesn't need me to tell him who he should surround himself with. He has been in basketball his whole life, if he needs a bunch of fans to tell him that then he has no business being the coach of SJU to begin with.
Personally, I don't want to tell Mullin who to put on his staff either. Rather, it's my hope that he's realized over time that he needs some different perspectives and levels of experience. And, that he then makes the changes himself this spring.
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I'm tired of arguing this. If you think SJU needs to hire a Louis Orr type fine. Go with that. I don't care.
Chris is the HC, he hires who he wants and who he feels comfortable with. That is all I care about. If he can't win like that then he needs to go, but he doesn't need me to tell him who he should surround himself with. He has been in basketball his whole life, if he needs a bunch of fans to tell him that then he has no business being the coach of SJU to begin with.
Personally, I don't want to tell Mullin who to put on his staff either. Rather, it's my hope that he's realized over time that he needs some different perspectives and levels of experience. And, that he then makes the changes himself this spring.
Coaches are told all the time to shake up their staffs and if they refuse then they are gone too. Happens all the time in football with offensive and defensive coordinators.
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Here are Georgetown's wins this year:
Jacksonville, Mt. St. Mary's, MD Eastern Shore, Richmond (road), Maine, Coppin St., Howard, NC A & T, North Texas, Alabama A & M, DePaul and SJU on the road.
That is not a misprint. With that type of resume so far I think Patrick Ewing is the next Tom Izzo, what do you think? Although I am not sure they would have beaten MD Eastern Shore without the staff he put together, good thing he hired Louis Orr for that game. Drew up some unbelievable plays for Govan or else they may have only won by 20 instead of 26...
Who said Tom Izzo. I think people are just saying seems more coach ready then Chris Mullin. Certainly is more engaged. But as some people have noted he was an NBA asst for years, so it shouldn't be a surprise.
I was obviously using hyperbole to make a point. He has 1 top 100 win so far and that believe it or not is from last night and anyone who saw that game would tell you Dr. Naismith is not clapping after that display.
What in God's name has he done so far to tell you his hire or his way is working anymore than Chris'? Nothing except an ugly 3 point win in a game his team did everything but give away last night.
And staff. For crying out loud a decent high school staff with some team managers could win 10 games with that schedule.
Just saying long way from saying someone is a better coach than Mullin to Tom Izzo.
Can't speak for anyone else but my only point is that Ewing seems much more involved. Obviously not in the huddle and he could be talking gobbidy gook, but he does seem more in tuned with everything. Even if that is only an impression, I think that kind of demeanor would have bought Chris Mullin more goodwill. BTW I can't believe I just typed Chris Mullin needs more goodwill from ST John's fans.
Again I answered that I was using hyperbole for crying out loud.
And no I don't think demeanor means squat. Georgetown's staff has proven nothing and they will be near the bottom of the BE this year and that is OK because they are projected to be bad. Time will tell on their staff.
Fine for you but a great many on here it seems to bother. I never thought about it before and if Mullin was winning no one would probably bring it up. But since we are losing it is clearly bad optics. How many times did Maher bring up sitting on the table? The words dry board have probably been brought up 100 times on these boards. I am not arguing with your stance, but clearly his results combined with perception has him facing criticism earlier than imaginable.
Everyone on the Maher bandwagon now :)
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I think above everything, we are seeing the issues with hiring a coach with zero experience, who has been completely removed from college basketball for 25+ years.
I was optimistic about the hire at first, hard to believe he will be able to bring the program back at this point. I'd ask if he'd be willing to "mutually part ways" at the end of the season. I don't see this happening though. I think it's Mullin's job until he doesn't want it anymore. That's what SJU signed up for when they chose to make the hire.
It just seems like he's in over his head as a coach, and I'm not sure he has the demeanor. Hope I'm wrong.
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How this get fixed, Mullin has to clean house
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How this get fixed, Mullin has to clean house
House was clean. What needs to happen is we need to see this roster of 10+ players in uniform next fall.
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How this get fixed, Mullin has to clean house
House was clean. What needs to happen is we need to see this roster of 10+ players in uniform next fall.
Get rid of all, hire Mike Rice and Jared Grasso
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How this get fixed, Mullin has to clean house
House was clean. What needs to happen is we need to see this roster of 10+ players in uniform next fall.
Get rid of all, hire Mike Rice and Jared Grasso
Matt A > Grasso. Not close
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How this get fixed, Mullin has to clean house
House was clean. What needs to happen is we need to see this roster of 10+ players in uniform next fall.
Get rid of all, hire Mike Rice and Jared Grasso
Matt A > Grasso. Not close
Not close? Ok tell me why
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How this get fixed, Mullin has to clean house
House was clean. What needs to happen is we need to see this roster of 10+ players in uniform next fall.
Get rid of all, hire Mike Rice and Jared Grasso
Matt A > Grasso. Not close
Not close? Ok tell me why
Not worth my time.
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How this get fixed, Mullin has to clean house
House was clean. What needs to happen is we need to see this roster of 10+ players in uniform next fall.
Get rid of all, hire Mike Rice and Jared Grasso
Matt A > Grasso. Not close
Not close? Ok tell me why
Not worth my time.
Time is all you have
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How this get fixed, Mullin has to clean house
House was clean. What needs to happen is we need to see this roster of 10+ players in uniform next fall.
Get rid of all, hire Mike Rice and Jared Grasso
Matt A > Grasso. Not close
Not close? Ok tell me why
Not worth my time.
Time is all you have
Ok maybe I'll ask on selection Sunday
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Dude I generally love your posts and find them hysterical but your absolute glee over SJU's failure and clogging the boards with stuff is getting old.
If you are pissed that they finally played this year and SJU beat them, who cares. It has absolutely nothing to do with the current mess. Hope Iona still makes the tourney; doesn't mean I should be pleased that our season is a mess.
As you all know I post and read this board and others on almost a daily basis. But I've stayed away recently because it is becoming unbearable. This season is bad enough and yes things need to get better quick. Having this board be clogged full of nonsense all day is beyond annoying.
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Dude I generally love your posts and find them hysterical but your absolute glee over SJU's failure and clogging the boards with stuff is getting old.
If you are pissed that they finally played this year and SJU beat them, who cares. It has absolutely nothing to do with the current mess. Hope Iona still makes the tourney; doesn't mean I should be pleased that our season is a mess.
As you all know I post and read this board and others on almost a daily basis. But I've stayed away recently because it is becoming unbearable. This season is bad enough and yes things need to get better quick. Having this board be clogged full of nonsense all day is beyond annoying.
Glee? I was a St Johns fan when most of you were still shitting in your diapers.
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WASJU, remember when Yakwes struggles were pinned on Sima? Undersized front court players need to make up for their height by excelling in other areas. I thought it would be rebouding but despite his elite athleticism its not the case. He can’t dribble, pass, or shoot at a division two level. And his instincts unfortunately can only improve so much. In a limited role with 4 basketball players around him he can contribute.
I don't disagree with anything you posted but his athleticism doesn't even appear elite any longer. Even with all his faults could you imagine he would be this bad? At times it looks like they pulled him out of the stands and slapped a jersey on him.
Agree. Simon athleticism is elite. Yakwe not even close
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How this get fixed, Mullin has to clean house
House was clean. What needs to happen is we need to see this roster of 10+ players in uniform next fall.
Get rid of all, hire Mike Rice and Jared Grasso
Matt A > Grasso. Not close
Not close? Ok tell me why
Matt has 4 NCAA Tournament wins under his belt. Grasso has 0. Don't need a ton of time for this one
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Not me my man. You got only a few years on me. Remember we spoke about the Iona connect (my brother's fraternity) - I know guys (like Beyrer you overlap with).
It comes across as glee and happiness..you have to see that
Dude I generally love your posts and find them hysterical but your absolute glee over SJU's failure and clogging the boards with stuff is getting old.
If you are pissed that they finally played this year and SJU beat them, who cares. It has absolutely nothing to do with the current mess. Hope Iona still makes the tourney; doesn't mean I should be pleased that our season is a mess.
As you all know I post and read this board and others on almost a daily basis. But I've stayed away recently because it is becoming unbearable. This season is bad enough and yes things need to get better quick. Having this board be clogged full of nonsense all day is beyond annoying.
Glee? I was a St Johns fan when most of you were still shitting in your diapers.
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How this get fixed, Mullin has to clean house
House was clean. What needs to happen is we need to see this roster of 10+ players in uniform next fall.
Get rid of all, hire Mike Rice and Jared Grasso
Matt A > Grasso. Not close
Not close? Ok tell me why
Not worth my time.
Time is all you have
Ok maybe I'll ask on selection Sunday
Baldi-man! The Iona grad!! :2funny: :2funny: ;D