Question for the Haters

Hatrid for Lavin is just tottally unwarranted. Criticize, when justified, but hatred? It's irrational. There is even one post above that argues the staff should get no credit for the way the team is playing , because the quality of play can simply be attributed to the team being more experienced. Some of this stuff is just nuts.

I don't think anyone hates Lavin. Norm I hated, but not Lavin. 
The coach is getting credit for the way the team is playing. It doesn't matter if 10 fans don't think he deserves it. But since you're so adamant about Lavin getting his due, I'm curious to know if you actually specifically see the difference in his coaching that wasn't here last year? 
Or was last year just the fault of the players? 

Quote from: mullin85berry86 on December 18, 2014, 11:14:43 PM

Quote from: Mullin20 on December 18, 2014, 09:06:03 PM

Quote from: mullin85berry86 on December 18, 2014, 06:41:15 PM

Quote from: TONYD3 on December 18, 2014, 06:12:13 PM

I think the team is playing hard and smart for him. As for being an optimist, the better St. John's is the more college basketball I watch. The more I watch the better I think our team is. I do believe most of you guys agree with that.

Yes, they are playing hard for him. I think they are playing harder for themselves and their temmates. The seniors know that this is their last shot at making the NCAA tournament, and they want no regrets. Don't let anyone or anything stand in the way. This year is starting to remind me of 2011. Only difference? That team didn't start playing really well until January. I believe this year the turning point is the Syracuse game on December 6th. Struggled somewhat vs. Niagara, since the Cuse game? 20+pnt wins vs. FDU and Fordham. Yeah, I know those two are nobody's, but that's what a real good team supposed to do to nobody's. Yes Tony, I agree with that.

My question would be why didn't they play for each other the last 3 years then? Maybe if they did they wouldn't have had to worry about this being there last shot. As players they should ALWAYS play for each other.

I don't know, but that's the past and there's no going back now. All they can control is the now.
Forget the past. why didn't why do this or that, You'll make yourself crazy.

The whole season is unfinished business until selection sunday.

The past is prologue.
If they did it once, then you must guard against reverting to that type of play.  You can't dismiss  so easily what we saw from this group on a regular basis for 3 years.

I hope we've turned a corner, but it's a mistake to say we're nothing like the teams of '11 '12 or '13.  Same staff, and by and large the same players too.

Yeah, they're the same players. Now here's the difference, after three years of frustration they are finally having the success that they always thought they'd have.   Now that they have that and it feels so damn good to them, did you see late in the Fordham game DLo, Green , and someone else (i forget who), were having a great time on the bench.  They are a top 20 team, getting the attention that they deserve.
Desco, I really doubt that they want it to come to an end. So yeah, I am damn confident that they'll continue this success.
UNFINISHED BUSINESS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Quote from: loughlinguy on December 19, 2014, 03:02:24 PM

Hatrid for Lavin is just tottally unwarranted. Criticize, when justified, but hatred? It's irrational. There is even one post above that argues the staff should get no credit for the way the team is playing , because the quality of play can simply be attributed to the team being more experienced. Some of this stuff is just nuts.

I don't think anyone hates Lavin. Norm I hated, but not Lavin. The coach is getting credit for the way the team is playing. It doesn't matter if 10 fans don't think he deserves it. But since you're so adamant about Lavin getting his due, I'm curious to know if you actually specifically see the difference in his coaching that wasn't here last year? Or was last year just the fault of the players?

Why do you hate Norm? He left the team in better shape than he got here. Jarvis is the man to blame. 

Quote from: Poison on December 19, 2014, 03:11:14 PM

Quote from: loughlinguy on December 19, 2014, 03:02:24 PM

Hatrid for Lavin is just tottally unwarranted. Criticize, when justified, but hatred? It's irrational. There is even one post above that argues the staff should get no credit for the way the team is playing , because the quality of play can simply be attributed to the team being more experienced. Some of this stuff is just nuts.

I don't think anyone hates Lavin. Norm I hated, but not Lavin. The coach is getting credit for the way the team is playing. It doesn't matter if 10 fans don't think he deserves it. But since you're so adamant about Lavin getting his due, I'm curious to know if you actually specifically see the difference in his coaching that wasn't here last year? Or was last year just the fault of the players?

Why do you hate Norm? He left the team in better shape than he got here. Jarvis is the man to blame.

lol   Blame Mike for 6 years of garbage basketball under Norm.

Quote from: Marco Baldi on December 19, 2014, 03:50:28 PM

Quote from: Poison on December 19, 2014, 03:11:14 PM

Quote from: loughlinguy on December 19, 2014, 03:02:24 PM

Hatrid for Lavin is just tottally unwarranted. Criticize, when justified, but hatred? It's irrational. There is even one post above that argues the staff should get no credit for the way the team is playing , because the quality of play can simply be attributed to the team being more experienced. Some of this stuff is just nuts.

I don't think anyone hates Lavin. Norm I hated, but not Lavin. The coach is getting credit for the way the team is playing. It doesn't matter if 10 fans don't think he deserves it. But since you're so adamant about Lavin getting his due, I'm curious to know if you actually specifically see the difference in his coaching that wasn't here last year? Or was last year just the fault of the players?

Why do you hate Norm? He left the team in better shape than he got here. Jarvis is the man to blame.

lol Blame Mike for 6 years of garbage basketball under Norm.

Same as we blame 6 years of garbage on norm

If we make the tourney and then Lavin walks off into the sunset, even if Balamou is the best player on next year's 8-24 team, the Lavin era was a success! Can't spin it any other way.

Is Lavin a great college basketball coach?  NO. But that is not an earth shattering comment. We heard this coming in.

Is Lavin full of crap? Yup, but so are 99% of college coaches. Succesful ones anyway.

The only thing seperating Lavin UCLA coach from Lavin SJU coach is even for an excellent rcruiter it is not as easy to recruit kids to Queens as it is to Cali.

Take away the posters with an agenda, most of us just question some of things Lavin does. Does not make us haters just not stepford fans. Perfectly understandable to question a coach on a fan forum. To me the Lavin apostles are just as annoying as the haters! 

A success? Do tell

 

Quote from: Poison on December 19, 2014, 03:11:14 PM

Quote from: loughlinguy on December 19, 2014, 03:02:24 PM

Hatrid for Lavin is just tottally unwarranted. Criticize, when justified, but hatred? It's irrational. There is even one post above that argues the staff should get no credit for the way the team is playing , because the quality of play can simply be attributed to the team being more experienced. Some of this stuff is just nuts.

I don't think anyone hates Lavin. Norm I hated, but not Lavin. The coach is getting credit for the way the team is playing. It doesn't matter if 10 fans don't think he deserves it. But since you're so adamant about Lavin getting his due, I'm curious to know if you actually specifically see the difference in his coaching that wasn't here last year? Or was last year just the fault of the players?

Why do you hate Norm? He left the team in better shape than he got here. Jarvis is the man to blame.

lol Blame Mike for 6 years of garbage basketball under Norm. [/quote]

Jarvis was the catalyst, the admin response the direct cause.  Norm did what Norm was expected to do, actual success on the floor would have been gravy for the admin.  Not a great time to be a Redmen fan.  But when Jarvis says he left the program in better shape than he found it I want to throw up.   If Norm said it it would only garner a meh.  Of course most know I blame Hatten for taking a piss poor 15-13 team and carrying them on his back to the 2003 NIT championship.  If they had lost first round NIT Jarvis would have been fired at the appropriate time, rather than 6 games into the next season, Pittsburgh wouldn't have happened and who knows who would have been hired as coach.  As long as it wasn't Doh, it would have had to have been better.

Quote from: loughlinguy on December 19, 2014, 03:02:24 PM

Hatrid for Lavin is just tottally unwarranted. Criticize, when justified, but hatred? It's irrational. There is even one post above that argues the staff should get no credit for the way the team is playing , because the quality of play can simply be attributed to the team being more experienced. Some of this stuff is just nuts.

I don't think anyone hates Lavin. Norm I hated, but not Lavin. The coach is getting credit for the way the team is playing. It doesn't matter if 10 fans don't think he deserves it. But since you're so adamant about Lavin getting his due, I'm curious to know if you actually specifically see the difference in his coaching that wasn't here last year? Or was last year just the fault of the players?

OK, let me add to loughlinguy's response.  Hatred for any basketball coach is irrational.  Won't stop some from going on like 14 year girls, but that doesn't mean it's not nuts.  Same way some folks don't understand the difference between opinions and facts and it's pointless to try and teach them..

If we make the tourney and then Lavin walks off into the sunset, even if Balamou is the best player on next year's 8-24 team, the Lavin era was a success! Can't spin it any other way. Is Lavin a great college basketball coach? NO. But that is not an earth shattering comment. We heard this coming in. Is Lavin full of crap? Yup, but so are 99% of college coaches. Succesful ones anyway. The only thing seperating Lavin UCLA coach from Lavin SJU coach is even for an excellent rcruiter it is not as easy to recruit kids to Queens as it is to Cali. Take away the posters with an agenda, most of us just question some of things Lavin does. Does not make us haters just not stepford fans. Perfectly understandable to question a coach on a fan forum. To me the Lavin apostles are just as annoying as the haters!

Haha, if that's considered a successful tenure then you are quite accepting of mediocrity

Two tourney's and Two NIT's in four years is almost Louiesque!

Norm beat  out of me any notions that my favorite college basketball program is elite

After the first year was followed up with that first recruiting class did I have delusions of grandeur? Sure. But really if he could just eliminate some of the drama, I am basically satisfied. Assuming of course we make tourney this year.

 

While I get your point WASJU, Louie went to 10 NCAA's in his last 11 years (the one year he didn't, NIT Champions), 15 in his last 17.  The fact that he got out of the second round only 4 of those 15 times, that's another discussion altogether.

I did say almost 

I'm smarter than the coach and I'm gonna prove it on these message boards!