Luther Muhammed-6-4 PG Hudson Catholic, NJ - OHIO ST.

Recruiting ain't easy. The longer the fish is in the sea the more sharks it will attract.

That may be true but that excuse isn't going to fly much longer.  No I don't believe Mullin is in any danger of losing his job this year if he does not make a major post-season, but at some point it won't matter.  My point is Norm was never in any danger until he got to year 6 but the apathy towards the program in the later years was devastating.  Legend or not he was brought in here to resurrect his alma mater and land big time local recruits and if he can't do either nobody is going to care after this year.

You fired Lavin for not working hard enough, too much drama around the program and ultimately not winning enough.  That's fine.  But in two years under Mullin I think we can see some of the things that we saw under Lavin: you got rid of a major assistant coach, had multiple transfers, failed to land many significant recruits, had a late signee transfer after spending just a few weeks on campus and now one key recruit could be slipping away.  That is just in two years with no significant winning to show yet.  Again it is still early.  But I would hardly call this a great start.

Forget about being in danger of losing his job, he doesn't win this year and show some strength in recruiting no one is going to care about the program regardless if he is still the coach.  This is a BIG YEAR on the court.

Duane Washington Jr.‏ 
@TheDuaneWash  Columbus!!! Buckeye Nation!!! O-H!!!
 
Combo guard to OSU.

Recruiting ain't easy. The longer the fish is in the sea the more sharks it will attract.

This one didn't really attract more sharks than anticipated. This one wasn't like Nas Little. Obviously OSU and West Virginia are solid programs but it's not like we were the only ones recruiting this kid from the start. I don't expect to beat Duke or Kentucky for a kid but if we want to get top 100 kids then we have to beat out the OSUs and WVUs of the world on occasion.

We have one recruiter and apparently everybody except for Mullin or whoever is calling the shots there sees that we need to add another one. With only one recruiter it seems like we can't hit recruiting from all the areas it needs to be hit from. We can't devote 2-3 years to 4/5 star HS players AND locate 3 star HS talent with big upside AND dominate the transfer game.

We either need to add another recruiter pronto or turn our focus to attainable kids like Josh Roberts and hope he develops into a stud. Then hope to pick off a few transfers during the offseason.

So where do we go from here? After this likely Luther whiff we will hear the same old "it's ok we are positioned well for the '19 class" that we heard during the Lavin years. And we'll be told frequently that we are very much in the mix for guys like Precious and Lewis and Aidan when we won't actually land any of them. We've all seen this movie before many times and for some reason we think it's going to end differently every time

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 09:28:32 PM

Recruiting ain't easy. The longer the fish is in the sea the more sharks it will attract.

This one didn't really attract more sharks than anticipated. This one wasn't like Nas Little. Obviously OSU and West Virginia are solid programs but it's not like we were the only ones recruiting this kid from the start. I don't expect to beat Duke or Kentucky for a kid but if we want to get top 100 kids then we have to beat out the OSUs and WVUs of the world on occasion.

We have one recruiter and apparently everybody except for Mullin or whoever is calling the shots there sees that we need to add another one. With only one recruiter it seems like we can't hit recruiting from all the areas it needs to be hit from. We can't devote 2-3 years to 4/5 star HS players AND locate 3 star HS talent with big upside AND dominate the transfer game.

We either need to add another recruiter pronto or turn our focus to attainable kids like Josh Roberts and hope he develops into a stud. Then hope to pick off a few transfers during the offseason.

So where do we go from here? After this likely Luther whiff we will hear the same old "it's ok we are positioned well for the '19 class" that we heard during the Lavin years. And we'll be told frequently that we are very much in the mix for guys like Precious and Lewis and Aidan when we won't actually land any of them. We've all seen this movie before many times and for some reason we think it's going to end differently every time

Problem is the movie is Groundhog Day ever since Louie left.  We are still a sleeping giant the problem is the giant is a lion and The Lion Sleeps Tonight (and every night unfortunately).

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 09:28:32 PM

Recruiting ain't easy. The longer the fish is in the sea the more sharks it will attract.

This one didn't really attract more sharks than anticipated. This one wasn't like Nas Little. Obviously OSU and West Virginia are solid programs but it's not like we were the only ones recruiting this kid from the start. I don't expect to beat Duke or Kentucky for a kid but if we want to get top 100 kids then we have to beat out the OSUs and WVUs of the world on occasion.

We have one recruiter and apparently everybody except for Mullin or whoever is calling the shots there sees that we need to add another one. With only one recruiter it seems like we can't hit recruiting from all the areas it needs to be hit from. We can't devote 2-3 years to 4/5 star HS players AND locate 3 star HS talent with big upside AND dominate the transfer game.

We either need to add another recruiter pronto or turn our focus to attainable kids like Josh Roberts and hope he develops into a stud. Then hope to pick off a few transfers during the offseason.

So where do we go from here? After this likely Luther whiff we will hear the same old "it's ok we are positioned well for the '19 class" that we heard during the Lavin years. And we'll be told frequently that we are very much in the mix for guys like Precious and Lewis and Aidan when we won't actually land any of them. We've all seen this movie before many times and for some reason we think it's going to end differently every time

When he left his travel team in the spring it wasn't a good sign to me.

1. Not under same coach who has good relationship with staff.
2. He had to be unhappy with role / wanted bigger spotlight.
3. Switched to new league with a bunch of new people in his ear.

I don't have intimate knowledge of what's going on but I've seen this movie before. I know its discouraging but onto the next one has to be the mentality. You want dudes who want to be here period.

Quote from: goredmen on September 20, 2017, 10:03:52 PM

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 09:28:32 PM

Recruiting ain't easy. The longer the fish is in the sea the more sharks it will attract.

This one didn't really attract more sharks than anticipated. This one wasn't like Nas Little. Obviously OSU and West Virginia are solid programs but it's not like we were the only ones recruiting this kid from the start. I don't expect to beat Duke or Kentucky for a kid but if we want to get top 100 kids then we have to beat out the OSUs and WVUs of the world on occasion.

We have one recruiter and apparently everybody except for Mullin or whoever is calling the shots there sees that we need to add another one. With only one recruiter it seems like we can't hit recruiting from all the areas it needs to be hit from. We can't devote 2-3 years to 4/5 star HS players AND locate 3 star HS talent with big upside AND dominate the transfer game.

We either need to add another recruiter pronto or turn our focus to attainable kids like Josh Roberts and hope he develops into a stud. Then hope to pick off a few transfers during the offseason.

So where do we go from here? After this likely Luther whiff we will hear the same old "it's ok we are positioned well for the '19 class" that we heard during the Lavin years. And we'll be told frequently that we are very much in the mix for guys like Precious and Lewis and Aidan when we won't actually land any of them. We've all seen this movie before many times and for some reason we think it's going to end differently every time

Problem is the movie is Groundhog Day ever since Louie left.  We are still a sleeping giant the problem is the giant is a lion and The Lion Sleeps Tonight (and every night unfortunately).

While I do think St. John's ceiling can be higher in no way shape or form are they a giant. I think simply winning consistently would be a refreshing thing.

Quote from: goredmen on September 20, 2017, 10:03:52 PM

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 09:28:32 PM

Recruiting ain't easy. The longer the fish is in the sea the more sharks it will attract.

This one didn't really attract more sharks than anticipated. This one wasn't like Nas Little. Obviously OSU and West Virginia are solid programs but it's not like we were the only ones recruiting this kid from the start. I don't expect to beat Duke or Kentucky for a kid but if we want to get top 100 kids then we have to beat out the OSUs and WVUs of the world on occasion.

We have one recruiter and apparently everybody except for Mullin or whoever is calling the shots there sees that we need to add another one. With only one recruiter it seems like we can't hit recruiting from all the areas it needs to be hit from. We can't devote 2-3 years to 4/5 star HS players AND locate 3 star HS talent with big upside AND dominate the transfer game.

We either need to add another recruiter pronto or turn our focus to attainable kids like Josh Roberts and hope he develops into a stud. Then hope to pick off a few transfers during the offseason.

So where do we go from here? After this likely Luther whiff we will hear the same old "it's ok we are positioned well for the '19 class" that we heard during the Lavin years. And we'll be told frequently that we are very much in the mix for guys like Precious and Lewis and Aidan when we won't actually land any of them. We've all seen this movie before many times and for some reason we think it's going to end differently every time

When he left his travel team in the spring it wasn't a good sign to me.

1. Not under same coach who has good relationship with staff.
2. He had to be unhappy with role / wanted bigger spotlight.
3. Switched to new league with a bunch of new people in his ear.

I don't have intimate knowledge of what's going on but I've seen this movie before. I know its discouraging but onto the next one has to be the mentality. You want dudes who want to be here period.

Agree with you that you want players who want to be here but you have to make it an attractive destination that the better players want to be at.

Quote from: goredmen on September 20, 2017, 10:03:52 PM

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 09:28:32 PM

Recruiting ain't easy. The longer the fish is in the sea the more sharks it will attract.

This one didn't really attract more sharks than anticipated. This one wasn't like Nas Little. Obviously OSU and West Virginia are solid programs but it's not like we were the only ones recruiting this kid from the start. I don't expect to beat Duke or Kentucky for a kid but if we want to get top 100 kids then we have to beat out the OSUs and WVUs of the world on occasion.

We have one recruiter and apparently everybody except for Mullin or whoever is calling the shots there sees that we need to add another one. With only one recruiter it seems like we can't hit recruiting from all the areas it needs to be hit from. We can't devote 2-3 years to 4/5 star HS players AND locate 3 star HS talent with big upside AND dominate the transfer game.

We either need to add another recruiter pronto or turn our focus to attainable kids like Josh Roberts and hope he develops into a stud. Then hope to pick off a few transfers during the offseason.

So where do we go from here? After this likely Luther whiff we will hear the same old "it's ok we are positioned well for the '19 class" that we heard during the Lavin years. And we'll be told frequently that we are very much in the mix for guys like Precious and Lewis and Aidan when we won't actually land any of them. We've all seen this movie before many times and for some reason we think it's going to end differently every time

When he left his travel team in the spring it wasn't a good sign to me.

1. Not under same coach who has good relationship with staff.
2. He had to be unhappy with role / wanted bigger spotlight.
3. Switched to new league with a bunch of new people in his ear.

I don't have intimate knowledge of what's going on but I've seen this movie before. I know its discouraging but onto the next one has to be the mentality. You want dudes who want to be here period.

Recruiting is fluid and I get that, but when do any of these ever break our way? Before a couple weeks ago maybe Sid Wilson was one that went our way but look how that turned out. We seem to always lose out because of last second change of hearts or forces outside the staff's control but we literally never win one that way

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 09:28:32 PM

Recruiting ain't easy. The longer the fish is in the sea the more sharks it will attract.

That may be true but that excuse isn't going to fly much longer.  No I don't believe Mullin is in any danger of losing his job this year if he does not make a major post-season, but at some point it won't matter.  My point is Norm was never in any danger until he got to year 6 but the apathy towards the program in the later years was devastating.  Legend or not he was brought in here to resurrect his alma mater and land big time local recruits and if he can't do either nobody is going to care after this year.

You fired Lavin for not working hard enough, too much drama around the program and ultimately not winning enough.  That's fine.  But in two years under Mullin I think we can see some of the things that we saw under Lavin: you got rid of a major assistant coach, had multiple transfers, failed to land many significant recruits, had a late signee transfer after spending just a few weeks on campus and now one key recruit could be slipping away.  That is just in two years with no significant winning to show yet.  Again it is still early.  But I would hardly call this a great start.

Forget about being in danger of losing his job, he doesn't win this year and show some strength in recruiting no one is going to care about the program regardless if he is still the coach.  This is a BIG YEAR on the court.

Fair.

I think in both cases I think you see how much assistant coaches and school funding play a role in success.

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 10:33:30 PM

Quote from: goredmen on September 20, 2017, 10:03:52 PM

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 09:28:32 PM

Recruiting ain't easy. The longer the fish is in the sea the more sharks it will attract.

This one didn't really attract more sharks than anticipated. This one wasn't like Nas Little. Obviously OSU and West Virginia are solid programs but it's not like we were the only ones recruiting this kid from the start. I don't expect to beat Duke or Kentucky for a kid but if we want to get top 100 kids then we have to beat out the OSUs and WVUs of the world on occasion.

We have one recruiter and apparently everybody except for Mullin or whoever is calling the shots there sees that we need to add another one. With only one recruiter it seems like we can't hit recruiting from all the areas it needs to be hit from. We can't devote 2-3 years to 4/5 star HS players AND locate 3 star HS talent with big upside AND dominate the transfer game.

We either need to add another recruiter pronto or turn our focus to attainable kids like Josh Roberts and hope he develops into a stud. Then hope to pick off a few transfers during the offseason.

So where do we go from here? After this likely Luther whiff we will hear the same old "it's ok we are positioned well for the '19 class" that we heard during the Lavin years. And we'll be told frequently that we are very much in the mix for guys like Precious and Lewis and Aidan when we won't actually land any of them. We've all seen this movie before many times and for some reason we think it's going to end differently every time

When he left his travel team in the spring it wasn't a good sign to me.

1. Not under same coach who has good relationship with staff.
2. He had to be unhappy with role / wanted bigger spotlight.
3. Switched to new league with a bunch of new people in his ear.

I don't have intimate knowledge of what's going on but I've seen this movie before. I know its discouraging but onto the next one has to be the mentality. You want dudes who want to be here period.

Recruiting is fluid and I get that, but when do any of these ever break our way? Before a couple weeks ago maybe Sid Wilson was one that went our way but look how that turned out. We seem to always lose out because of last second change of hearts or forces outside the staff's control but we literally never win one that way

Seems like it but few do bounce our way too.

I think what hurts is it feels like overtime the scab is almost healed it's busted open again.

Quote from: goredmen on September 20, 2017, 10:41:20 PM

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 10:33:30 PM

Quote from: goredmen on September 20, 2017, 10:03:52 PM

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 09:28:32 PM

Recruiting ain't easy. The longer the fish is in the sea the more sharks it will attract.

This one didn't really attract more sharks than anticipated. This one wasn't like Nas Little. Obviously OSU and West Virginia are solid programs but it's not like we were the only ones recruiting this kid from the start. I don't expect to beat Duke or Kentucky for a kid but if we want to get top 100 kids then we have to beat out the OSUs and WVUs of the world on occasion.

We have one recruiter and apparently everybody except for Mullin or whoever is calling the shots there sees that we need to add another one. With only one recruiter it seems like we can't hit recruiting from all the areas it needs to be hit from. We can't devote 2-3 years to 4/5 star HS players AND locate 3 star HS talent with big upside AND dominate the transfer game.

We either need to add another recruiter pronto or turn our focus to attainable kids like Josh Roberts and hope he develops into a stud. Then hope to pick off a few transfers during the offseason.

So where do we go from here? After this likely Luther whiff we will hear the same old "it's ok we are positioned well for the '19 class" that we heard during the Lavin years. And we'll be told frequently that we are very much in the mix for guys like Precious and Lewis and Aidan when we won't actually land any of them. We've all seen this movie before many times and for some reason we think it's going to end differently every time

When he left his travel team in the spring it wasn't a good sign to me.

1. Not under same coach who has good relationship with staff.
2. He had to be unhappy with role / wanted bigger spotlight.
3. Switched to new league with a bunch of new people in his ear.

I don't have intimate knowledge of what's going on but I've seen this movie before. I know its discouraging but onto the next one has to be the mentality. You want dudes who want to be here period.

Recruiting is fluid and I get that, but when do any of these ever break our way? Before a couple weeks ago maybe Sid Wilson was one that went our way but look how that turned out. We seem to always lose out because of last second change of hearts or forces outside the staff's control but we literally never win one that way

Seems like it but few do bounce our way too.

I think what hurts is it feels like overtime the scab is almost healed it's busted open again.

When was the last one to break our way? JaKarr Sampson? And that's just because we didn't end up losing him

Gotta win some games, man.  It's that simple. Immediate playing time attracts kids, and that is largely gone.  Lavin couldn't recruit past the initial class when the PT disappeared. Let's see if this group can.  Nobody knows if this staff can even coach yet.  Win and we'll be fine.

Quote from: goredmen on September 20, 2017, 10:41:20 PM

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 10:33:30 PM

Quote from: goredmen on September 20, 2017, 10:03:52 PM

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 09:28:32 PM

Recruiting ain't easy. The longer the fish is in the sea the more sharks it will attract.

This one didn't really attract more sharks than anticipated. This one wasn't like Nas Little. Obviously OSU and West Virginia are solid programs but it's not like we were the only ones recruiting this kid from the start. I don't expect to beat Duke or Kentucky for a kid but if we want to get top 100 kids then we have to beat out the OSUs and WVUs of the world on occasion.

We have one recruiter and apparently everybody except for Mullin or whoever is calling the shots there sees that we need to add another one. With only one recruiter it seems like we can't hit recruiting from all the areas it needs to be hit from. We can't devote 2-3 years to 4/5 star HS players AND locate 3 star HS talent with big upside AND dominate the transfer game.

We either need to add another recruiter pronto or turn our focus to attainable kids like Josh Roberts and hope he develops into a stud. Then hope to pick off a few transfers during the offseason.

So where do we go from here? After this likely Luther whiff we will hear the same old "it's ok we are positioned well for the '19 class" that we heard during the Lavin years. And we'll be told frequently that we are very much in the mix for guys like Precious and Lewis and Aidan when we won't actually land any of them. We've all seen this movie before many times and for some reason we think it's going to end differently every time

When he left his travel team in the spring it wasn't a good sign to me.

1. Not under same coach who has good relationship with staff.
2. He had to be unhappy with role / wanted bigger spotlight.
3. Switched to new league with a bunch of new people in his ear.

I don't have intimate knowledge of what's going on but I've seen this movie before. I know its discouraging but onto the next one has to be the mentality. You want dudes who want to be here period.

Recruiting is fluid and I get that, but when do any of these ever break our way? Before a couple weeks ago maybe Sid Wilson was one that went our way but look how that turned out. We seem to always lose out because of last second change of hearts or forces outside the staff's control but we literally never win one that way

Seems like it but few do bounce our way too.

I think what hurts is it feels like overtime the scab is almost healed it's busted open again.

Again I don't want to argue about assistants but ultimately the Head Coach is in charge. If he hires good assistants and he fails it is his responsibility, if he doesn't hire good assistants and he fails guess what...it is his responsibility.  So I really don't care, if he feels he can win with this staff then guess what?  Win with this staff, it is his decision.  He is getting paid to make that decision.  Either way it is on him.

Bottom line he was brought in not to make SJU mediocre or even decent, he was brought in to make SJU competitive with Villanova.  That doesn't mean it needs to happen this year, but he needs to make a major step towards that goal this year.

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 10:43:51 PM

Quote from: goredmen on September 20, 2017, 10:41:20 PM

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 10:33:30 PM

Quote from: goredmen on September 20, 2017, 10:03:52 PM

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 09:28:32 PM

Recruiting ain't easy. The longer the fish is in the sea the more sharks it will attract.

This one didn't really attract more sharks than anticipated. This one wasn't like Nas Little. Obviously OSU and West Virginia are solid programs but it's not like we were the only ones recruiting this kid from the start. I don't expect to beat Duke or Kentucky for a kid but if we want to get top 100 kids then we have to beat out the OSUs and WVUs of the world on occasion.

We have one recruiter and apparently everybody except for Mullin or whoever is calling the shots there sees that we need to add another one. With only one recruiter it seems like we can't hit recruiting from all the areas it needs to be hit from. We can't devote 2-3 years to 4/5 star HS players AND locate 3 star HS talent with big upside AND dominate the transfer game.

We either need to add another recruiter pronto or turn our focus to attainable kids like Josh Roberts and hope he develops into a stud. Then hope to pick off a few transfers during the offseason.

So where do we go from here? After this likely Luther whiff we will hear the same old "it's ok we are positioned well for the '19 class" that we heard during the Lavin years. And we'll be told frequently that we are very much in the mix for guys like Precious and Lewis and Aidan when we won't actually land any of them. We've all seen this movie before many times and for some reason we think it's going to end differently every time

When he left his travel team in the spring it wasn't a good sign to me.

1. Not under same coach who has good relationship with staff.
2. He had to be unhappy with role / wanted bigger spotlight.
3. Switched to new league with a bunch of new people in his ear.

I don't have intimate knowledge of what's going on but I've seen this movie before. I know its discouraging but onto the next one has to be the mentality. You want dudes who want to be here period.

Recruiting is fluid and I get that, but when do any of these ever break our way? Before a couple weeks ago maybe Sid Wilson was one that went our way but look how that turned out. We seem to always lose out because of last second change of hearts or forces outside the staff's control but we literally never win one that way

Seems like it but few do bounce our way too.

I think what hurts is it feels like overtime the scab is almost healed it's busted open again.

Again I don't want to argue about assistants but ultimately the Head Coach is in charge. If he hires good assistants and he fails it is his responsibility, if he doesn't hire good assistants and he fails guess what...it is his responsibility.  So I really don't care, if he feels he can win with this staff then guess what?  Win with this staff, it is his decision.  He is getting paid to make that decision.  Either way it is on him.

Bottom line he was brought in not to make SJU mediocre or even decent, he was brought in to make SJU competitive with Villanova.  That doesn't mean it needs to happen this year, but he needs to make a major step towards that goal this year.

+1,000

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 10:43:51 PM

Quote from: goredmen on September 20, 2017, 10:41:20 PM

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 10:33:30 PM

Quote from: goredmen on September 20, 2017, 10:03:52 PM

Quote from: Dave on September 20, 2017, 09:28:32 PM

Recruiting ain't easy. The longer the fish is in the sea the more sharks it will attract.

This one didn't really attract more sharks than anticipated. This one wasn't like Nas Little. Obviously OSU and West Virginia are solid programs but it's not like we were the only ones recruiting this kid from the start. I don't expect to beat Duke or Kentucky for a kid but if we want to get top 100 kids then we have to beat out the OSUs and WVUs of the world on occasion.

We have one recruiter and apparently everybody except for Mullin or whoever is calling the shots there sees that we need to add another one. With only one recruiter it seems like we can't hit recruiting from all the areas it needs to be hit from. We can't devote 2-3 years to 4/5 star HS players AND locate 3 star HS talent with big upside AND dominate the transfer game.

We either need to add another recruiter pronto or turn our focus to attainable kids like Josh Roberts and hope he develops into a stud. Then hope to pick off a few transfers during the offseason.

So where do we go from here? After this likely Luther whiff we will hear the same old "it's ok we are positioned well for the '19 class" that we heard during the Lavin years. And we'll be told frequently that we are very much in the mix for guys like Precious and Lewis and Aidan when we won't actually land any of them. We've all seen this movie before many times and for some reason we think it's going to end differently every time

When he left his travel team in the spring it wasn't a good sign to me.

1. Not under same coach who has good relationship with staff.
2. He had to be unhappy with role / wanted bigger spotlight.
3. Switched to new league with a bunch of new people in his ear.

I don't have intimate knowledge of what's going on but I've seen this movie before. I know its discouraging but onto the next one has to be the mentality. You want dudes who want to be here period.

Recruiting is fluid and I get that, but when do any of these ever break our way? Before a couple weeks ago maybe Sid Wilson was one that went our way but look how that turned out. We seem to always lose out because of last second change of hearts or forces outside the staff's control but we literally never win one that way

Seems like it but few do bounce our way too.

I think what hurts is it feels like overtime the scab is almost healed it's busted open again.

Again I don't want to argue about assistants but ultimately the Head Coach is in charge. If he hires good assistants and he fails it is his responsibility, if he doesn't hire good assistants and he fails guess what...it is his responsibility.  So I really don't care, if he feels he can win with this staff then guess what?  Win with this staff, it is his decision.  He is getting paid to make that decision.  Either way it is on him.

Bottom line he was brought in not to make SJU mediocre or even decent, he was brought in to make SJU competitive with Villanova.  That doesn't mean it needs to happen this year, but he needs to make a major step towards that goal this year.

Agree

Hire a coach who can recruit and understands in game stuff.  How about Rice.
This is all on Mullin

Mullin chose this path.  No room for error now.  Which means no surprising losses to Delaware f-ing State, LIU Brooklyn or blowout losses at MSG to a Penn State team that ends up going 15-18 and 6-12 in the Big 10.  Need to be no worse than 9-3 going into the Big East season.  Need to be no worse than 10-8 in Big East play.  Even assuming we lose to Duke, that means that the baseline for growth and success going forward is 19-12 going into the BET.

Mullin chose this path.  No room for error now.  Which means no surprising losses to Delaware f-ing State, LIU Brooklyn or blowout losses at MSG to a Penn State team that ends up going 15-18 and 6-12 in the Big 10.  Need to be no worse than 9-3 going into the Big East season.  Need to be no worse than 10-8 in Big East play.  Even assuming we lose to Duke, that means that the baseline for growth and success going forward is 19-12 going into the BET.

It has always been on him.  I actually think the team can be good so I have not given up at all.

But be clear many people excuse this staff for things they never would have excused the previous one.

And wrt Muhammad this idea that West Virginia, Ohio St, Xavier and Virginia are blue bloods that SJU can't recruit against is beyond laughable....and Muhammad is a nice recruit but not the type of kid any of the true blue bloods would go after.

He is exactly the type of kid they SHOULD be getting.

Mullin chose this path.  No room for error now.  Which means no surprising losses to Delaware f-ing State, LIU Brooklyn or blowout losses at MSG to a Penn State team that ends up going 15-18 and 6-12 in the Big 10.  Need to be no worse than 9-3 going into the Big East season.  Need to be no worse than 10-8 in Big East play.  Even assuming we lose to Duke, that means that the baseline for growth and success going forward is 19-12 going into the BET.

Hire a coach who can recruit and understands in game stuff.  How about Rice.
This is all on Mullin

This.

Quote from: wpc77 on September 21, 2017, 10:38:24 AM

Mullin chose this path.  No room for error now.  Which means no surprising losses to Delaware f-ing State, LIU Brooklyn or blowout losses at MSG to a Penn State team that ends up going 15-18 and 6-12 in the Big 10.  Need to be no worse than 9-3 going into the Big East season.  Need to be no worse than 10-8 in Big East play.  Even assuming we lose to Duke, that means that the baseline for growth and success going forward is 19-12 going into the BET.

It has always been on him.  I actually think the team can be good so I have not given up at all.

But be clear many people excuse this staff for things they never would have excused the previous one.

And wrt Muhammad this idea that West Virginia, Ohio St, Xavier and Virginia are blue bloods that SJU can't recruit against is beyond laughable....and Muhammad is a nice recruit but not the type of kid any of the true blue bloods would go after.

He is exactly the type of kid they SHOULD be getting.

absolutely.  Which is why, when the kid sat on the shitter too long and ND, his preferred choice, filled up and pulled his offer, the window was short to seal the deal before a competitor scooped him up.  Holtzman being hired by OSU didn't help, as I would guess that the kid probably would have preferred SJU & Mullin over Butler & Holtzman as opposed to OSU & Holtzman, but even given that change in the fact pattern, I thought that Mullin & Matt would get this kid once ND passed on him.