Incoming Talent

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 06:53:17 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 06:29:46 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 04:41:31 PM

Is Darien Williams on that list because the guy we're gonna get is going to be healthy, and nothing like the guy we saw last season? Also, why is Tariq Owens lumped in with two other players? Seems like you don't think very highly of him?

The configuration of a poll on this board only allows five options. I would've put each of them on a separate line if I could.

I expect Owens to be ready. He's technically a junior, and he's now had a season of being coached at Tennessee followed immediately by one at St.John's. Ahmed and Freudenberg are both wild cards IMO. Ahmed is a wild card if for no other reason than he's a juco, and Freudenberg didnt play basketball in the US, and that means that where he did play was easier. It doesn't mean that they can't turn out to be stars, but rather that they haven't been tested in enough situations like Shamorie Ponds has been.

Couldn't disagree more Poison, we're getting two superstar recruits in Rich and Bash. They're both extremely versatile, have great speed, length and height for hybrid G/F, and most importantly can flat out score. I have no doubt that Mullin is going to make RF a NBA player.

You argue that Bash has never been through what Shamorie has seen. Have you forgotten that he was also once king of the city alongside Lance while he dominated the Bronx PSAL circuit as one of JFK's all time greats? He has also wanted to be a Johnny since his JFK days. This excerpt is from 2013, sounds a lot like Shamorie to me:

He had a phenomenal year for the Knights averaging 25 points and 12 rebounds a game playing as a hybrid 3/4 type for the Bronx school. On Friday he continued to prove why he is one of the best, helping lead the PSAL to the Mayor's Cup title with 20 points. We caught up with Ahmed after the game to get the scoop as to what's going on with his recruitment.

With his numbers, and the fact he played with New Heights 17's last summer,  you would think Ahmed would be rolling with interest and offers, but academic question marks have held him back, though he says he is starting to receive some attention now.

"I have an offer from Norfolk State, and St. John's, Providence, and Iona are showing interest." Ahmed said.

I would love nothing more than for you to be right, but history, namely our own history says it's a mystery. For every Bootsy Thornton, we've had two Avery Pattersons. You're talking about Bash and Rich like you've been watching them play up close consistently. Maybe you have. I have not.

But if you're basing your analysis only what you've read and limited video you've seen, don't you think that maybe that's not enough to present a clear picture of where these guys are? In your post, if Bash was "king of the city" why is it that only Norfolk State had offered him at that time?

Hopefully, that's because over the last years Bash went from promising mid major recruit to future NBA prospect.

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 07:04:56 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 06:53:17 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 06:29:46 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 04:41:31 PM

Is Darien Williams on that list because the guy we're gonna get is going to be healthy, and nothing like the guy we saw last season? Also, why is Tariq Owens lumped in with two other players? Seems like you don't think very highly of him?

The configuration of a poll on this board only allows five options. I would've put each of them on a separate line if I could.

I expect Owens to be ready. He's technically a junior, and he's now had a season of being coached at Tennessee followed immediately by one at St.John's. Ahmed and Freudenberg are both wild cards IMO. Ahmed is a wild card if for no other reason than he's a juco, and Freudenberg didnt play basketball in the US, and that means that where he did play was easier. It doesn't mean that they can't turn out to be stars, but rather that they haven't been tested in enough situations like Shamorie Ponds has been.

Couldn't disagree more Poison, we're getting two superstar recruits in Rich and Bash. They're both extremely versatile, have great speed, length and height for hybrid G/F, and most importantly can flat out score. I have no doubt that Mullin is going to make RF a NBA player.

You argue that Bash has never been through what Shamorie has seen. Have you forgotten that he was also once king of the city alongside Lance while he dominated the Bronx PSAL circuit as one of JFK's all time greats? He has also wanted to be a Johnny since his JFK days. This excerpt is from 2013, sounds a lot like Shamorie to me:

He had a phenomenal year for the Knights averaging 25 points and 12 rebounds a game playing as a hybrid 3/4 type for the Bronx school. On Friday he continued to prove why he is one of the best, helping lead the PSAL to the Mayor's Cup title with 20 points. We caught up with Ahmed after the game to get the scoop as to what's going on with his recruitment.

With his numbers, and the fact he played with New Heights 17's last summer,  you would think Ahmed would be rolling with interest and offers, but academic question marks have held him back, though he says he is starting to receive some attention now.

"I have an offer from Norfolk State, and St. John's, Providence, and Iona are showing interest." Ahmed said.

I would love nothing more than for you to be right, but history, namely our own history says it's a mystery. For every Bootsy Thornton, we've had two Avery Pattersons. You're talking about Bash and Rich like you've been watching them play up close consistently. Maybe you have. I have not.

But if you're basing your analysis only what you've read and limited video you've seen, don't you think that maybe that's not enough to present a clear picture of where these guys are? In your post, if Bash was "king of the city" why is it that only Norfolk State had offered him at that time?

Hopefully, that's because over the last years Bash went from promising mid major recruit to future NBA prospect.

It was bc of academics. I'm not arguing with you, you don't know your history on Bash and how talented he is, nor do you realize how elite of a international prospect RF is, I'm done.

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 07:14:43 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 07:04:56 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 06:53:17 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 06:29:46 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 04:41:31 PM

Is Darien Williams on that list because the guy we're gonna get is going to be healthy, and nothing like the guy we saw last season? Also, why is Tariq Owens lumped in with two other players? Seems like you don't think very highly of him?

The configuration of a poll on this board only allows five options. I would've put each of them on a separate line if I could.

I expect Owens to be ready. He's technically a junior, and he's now had a season of being coached at Tennessee followed immediately by one at St.John's. Ahmed and Freudenberg are both wild cards IMO. Ahmed is a wild card if for no other reason than he's a juco, and Freudenberg didnt play basketball in the US, and that means that where he did play was easier. It doesn't mean that they can't turn out to be stars, but rather that they haven't been tested in enough situations like Shamorie Ponds has been.

Couldn't disagree more Poison, we're getting two superstar recruits in Rich and Bash. They're both extremely versatile, have great speed, length and height for hybrid G/F, and most importantly can flat out score. I have no doubt that Mullin is going to make RF a NBA player.

You argue that Bash has never been through what Shamorie has seen. Have you forgotten that he was also once king of the city alongside Lance while he dominated the Bronx PSAL circuit as one of JFK's all time greats? He has also wanted to be a Johnny since his JFK days. This excerpt is from 2013, sounds a lot like Shamorie to me:

He had a phenomenal year for the Knights averaging 25 points and 12 rebounds a game playing as a hybrid 3/4 type for the Bronx school. On Friday he continued to prove why he is one of the best, helping lead the PSAL to the Mayor's Cup title with 20 points. We caught up with Ahmed after the game to get the scoop as to what's going on with his recruitment.

With his numbers, and the fact he played with New Heights 17's last summer,  you would think Ahmed would be rolling with interest and offers, but academic question marks have held him back, though he says he is starting to receive some attention now.

"I have an offer from Norfolk State, and St. John's, Providence, and Iona are showing interest." Ahmed said.

I would love nothing more than for you to be right, but history, namely our own history says it's a mystery. For every Bootsy Thornton, we've had two Avery Pattersons. You're talking about Bash and Rich like you've been watching them play up close consistently. Maybe you have. I have not.

But if you're basing your analysis only what you've read and limited video you've seen, don't you think that maybe that's not enough to present a clear picture of where these guys are? In your post, if Bash was "king of the city" why is it that only Norfolk State had offered him at that time?

Hopefully, that's because over the last years Bash went from promising mid major recruit to future NBA prospect.

It was bc of academics. I'm not arguing with you, you don't know your history on Bash and how talented he is, nor do you realize how elite of a international prospect RF is, I'm done.

I don't realize quite a bit because I haven't seen them play. But since you're so well informed, it must be because you have.

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 07:50:44 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 07:14:43 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 07:04:56 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 06:53:17 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 06:29:46 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 04:41:31 PM

Is Darien Williams on that list because the guy we're gonna get is going to be healthy, and nothing like the guy we saw last season? Also, why is Tariq Owens lumped in with two other players? Seems like you don't think very highly of him?

The configuration of a poll on this board only allows five options. I would've put each of them on a separate line if I could.

I expect Owens to be ready. He's technically a junior, and he's now had a season of being coached at Tennessee followed immediately by one at St.John's. Ahmed and Freudenberg are both wild cards IMO. Ahmed is a wild card if for no other reason than he's a juco, and Freudenberg didnt play basketball in the US, and that means that where he did play was easier. It doesn't mean that they can't turn out to be stars, but rather that they haven't been tested in enough situations like Shamorie Ponds has been.

Couldn't disagree more Poison, we're getting two superstar recruits in Rich and Bash. They're both extremely versatile, have great speed, length and height for hybrid G/F, and most importantly can flat out score. I have no doubt that Mullin is going to make RF a NBA player.

You argue that Bash has never been through what Shamorie has seen. Have you forgotten that he was also once king of the city alongside Lance while he dominated the Bronx PSAL circuit as one of JFK's all time greats? He has also wanted to be a Johnny since his JFK days. This excerpt is from 2013, sounds a lot like Shamorie to me:

He had a phenomenal year for the Knights averaging 25 points and 12 rebounds a game playing as a hybrid 3/4 type for the Bronx school. On Friday he continued to prove why he is one of the best, helping lead the PSAL to the Mayor's Cup title with 20 points. We caught up with Ahmed after the game to get the scoop as to what's going on with his recruitment.

With his numbers, and the fact he played with New Heights 17's last summer,  you would think Ahmed would be rolling with interest and offers, but academic question marks have held him back, though he says he is starting to receive some attention now.

"I have an offer from Norfolk State, and St. John's, Providence, and Iona are showing interest." Ahmed said.

I would love nothing more than for you to be right, but history, namely our own history says it's a mystery. For every Bootsy Thornton, we've had two Avery Pattersons. You're talking about Bash and Rich like you've been watching them play up close consistently. Maybe you have. I have not.

But if you're basing your analysis only what you've read and limited video you've seen, don't you think that maybe that's not enough to present a clear picture of where these guys are? In your post, if Bash was "king of the city" why is it that only Norfolk State had offered him at that time?

Hopefully, that's because over the last years Bash went from promising mid major recruit to future NBA prospect.

It was bc of academics. I'm not arguing with you, you don't know your history on Bash and how talented he is, nor do you realize how elite of a international prospect RF is, I'm done.

I don't realize quite a bit because I haven't seen them play. But since you're so well informed, it must be because you have.

I agree, in reference to people being careful about labeling someone a "superstar" before they ever step foot on a collegiate court.  I'd rather stick with "contributor" with the potential to be "big-time," before giving 'em such a tag.  Prospects like Kevin Durant, John Wall, and other kids of similar talent.  One can still be off on their prognostications when speaking about those type of prospects.

I think Ahmed and Freudenberg will be solid players, but for now I'm holding off on calling 'em "superstars."   

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 08:20:32 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 07:50:44 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 07:14:43 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 07:04:56 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 06:53:17 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 06:29:46 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 04:41:31 PM

Is Darien Williams on that list because the guy we're gonna get is going to be healthy, and nothing like the guy we saw last season? Also, why is Tariq Owens lumped in with two other players? Seems like you don't think very highly of him?

The configuration of a poll on this board only allows five options. I would've put each of them on a separate line if I could.

I expect Owens to be ready. He's technically a junior, and he's now had a season of being coached at Tennessee followed immediately by one at St.John's. Ahmed and Freudenberg are both wild cards IMO. Ahmed is a wild card if for no other reason than he's a juco, and Freudenberg didnt play basketball in the US, and that means that where he did play was easier. It doesn't mean that they can't turn out to be stars, but rather that they haven't been tested in enough situations like Shamorie Ponds has been.

Couldn't disagree more Poison, we're getting two superstar recruits in Rich and Bash. They're both extremely versatile, have great speed, length and height for hybrid G/F, and most importantly can flat out score. I have no doubt that Mullin is going to make RF a NBA player.

You argue that Bash has never been through what Shamorie has seen. Have you forgotten that he was also once king of the city alongside Lance while he dominated the Bronx PSAL circuit as one of JFK's all time greats? He has also wanted to be a Johnny since his JFK days. This excerpt is from 2013, sounds a lot like Shamorie to me:

He had a phenomenal year for the Knights averaging 25 points and 12 rebounds a game playing as a hybrid 3/4 type for the Bronx school. On Friday he continued to prove why he is one of the best, helping lead the PSAL to the Mayor's Cup title with 20 points. We caught up with Ahmed after the game to get the scoop as to what's going on with his recruitment.

With his numbers, and the fact he played with New Heights 17's last summer,  you would think Ahmed would be rolling with interest and offers, but academic question marks have held him back, though he says he is starting to receive some attention now.

"I have an offer from Norfolk State, and St. John's, Providence, and Iona are showing interest." Ahmed said.

I would love nothing more than for you to be right, but history, namely our own history says it's a mystery. For every Bootsy Thornton, we've had two Avery Pattersons. You're talking about Bash and Rich like you've been watching them play up close consistently. Maybe you have. I have not.

But if you're basing your analysis only what you've read and limited video you've seen, don't you think that maybe that's not enough to present a clear picture of where these guys are? In your post, if Bash was "king of the city" why is it that only Norfolk State had offered him at that time?

Hopefully, that's because over the last years Bash went from promising mid major recruit to future NBA prospect.

It was bc of academics. I'm not arguing with you, you don't know your history on Bash and how talented he is, nor do you realize how elite of a international prospect RF is, I'm done.

I don't realize quite a bit because I haven't seen them play. But since you're so well informed, it must be because you have.

I agree, in reference to people being careful about labeling someone a "superstar" before they ever step foot on a collegiate court.  I'd rather stick with "contributor" with the potential to be "big-time," before giving 'em such a tag.  Prospects like Kevin Durant, John Wall, and other kids of similar talent.  One can still be off on their prognostications when speaking about those type of prospects.

I think Ahmed and Freudenberg will be solid players, but for now I'm holding off on calling 'em "superstars."   

Every St.John's fan should know better than to hype up a juco and a foreign kid like they're Larry Johnson and Dirk Nowitzki. Zero D1 experience. Zero BE experience. No player should have the burden of saving this program, except for the coach.

Quote from: mjdinkins on May 07, 2016, 12:43:20 AM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 08:20:32 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 07:50:44 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 07:14:43 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 07:04:56 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 06:53:17 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 06:29:46 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 04:41:31 PM

Is Darien Williams on that list because the guy we're gonna get is going to be healthy, and nothing like the guy we saw last season? Also, why is Tariq Owens lumped in with two other players? Seems like you don't think very highly of him?

The configuration of a poll on this board only allows five options. I would've put each of them on a separate line if I could.

I expect Owens to be ready. He's technically a junior, and he's now had a season of being coached at Tennessee followed immediately by one at St.John's. Ahmed and Freudenberg are both wild cards IMO. Ahmed is a wild card if for no other reason than he's a juco, and Freudenberg didnt play basketball in the US, and that means that where he did play was easier. It doesn't mean that they can't turn out to be stars, but rather that they haven't been tested in enough situations like Shamorie Ponds has been.

Couldn't disagree more Poison, we're getting two superstar recruits in Rich and Bash. They're both extremely versatile, have great speed, length and height for hybrid G/F, and most importantly can flat out score. I have no doubt that Mullin is going to make RF a NBA player.

You argue that Bash has never been through what Shamorie has seen. Have you forgotten that he was also once king of the city alongside Lance while he dominated the Bronx PSAL circuit as one of JFK's all time greats? He has also wanted to be a Johnny since his JFK days. This excerpt is from 2013, sounds a lot like Shamorie to me:

He had a phenomenal year for the Knights averaging 25 points and 12 rebounds a game playing as a hybrid 3/4 type for the Bronx school. On Friday he continued to prove why he is one of the best, helping lead the PSAL to the Mayor's Cup title with 20 points. We caught up with Ahmed after the game to get the scoop as to what's going on with his recruitment.

With his numbers, and the fact he played with New Heights 17's last summer,  you would think Ahmed would be rolling with interest and offers, but academic question marks have held him back, though he says he is starting to receive some attention now.

"I have an offer from Norfolk State, and St. John's, Providence, and Iona are showing interest." Ahmed said.

I would love nothing more than for you to be right, but history, namely our own history says it's a mystery. For every Bootsy Thornton, we've had two Avery Pattersons. You're talking about Bash and Rich like you've been watching them play up close consistently. Maybe you have. I have not.

But if you're basing your analysis only what you've read and limited video you've seen, don't you think that maybe that's not enough to present a clear picture of where these guys are? In your post, if Bash was "king of the city" why is it that only Norfolk State had offered him at that time?

Hopefully, that's because over the last years Bash went from promising mid major recruit to future NBA prospect.

It was bc of academics. I'm not arguing with you, you don't know your history on Bash and how talented he is, nor do you realize how elite of a international prospect RF is, I'm done.

I don't realize quite a bit because I haven't seen them play. But since you're so well informed, it must be because you have.

I agree, in reference to people being careful about labeling someone a "superstar" before they ever step foot on a collegiate court.  I'd rather stick with "contributor" with the potential to be "big-time," before giving 'em such a tag.  Prospects like Kevin Durant, John Wall, and other kids of similar talent.  One can still be off on their prognostications when speaking about those type of prospects.

I think Ahmed and Freudenberg will be solid players, but for now I'm holding off on calling 'em "superstars."   

Every St.John's fan should know better than to hype up a juco and a foreign kid like they're Larry Johnson and Dirk Nowitzki. Zero D1 experience. Zero BE experience. No player should have the burden of saving this program, except for the coach.

Since no one is doing that, there's no reason to repeatedly make this point

Quote from: Poison on May 07, 2016, 01:27:13 AM

Quote from: mjdinkins on May 07, 2016, 12:43:20 AM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 08:20:32 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 07:50:44 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 07:14:43 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 07:04:56 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 06:53:17 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 06:29:46 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 04:41:31 PM

Is Darien Williams on that list because the guy we're gonna get is going to be healthy, and nothing like the guy we saw last season? Also, why is Tariq Owens lumped in with two other players? Seems like you don't think very highly of him?

The configuration of a poll on this board only allows five options. I would've put each of them on a separate line if I could.

I expect Owens to be ready. He's technically a junior, and he's now had a season of being coached at Tennessee followed immediately by one at St.John's. Ahmed and Freudenberg are both wild cards IMO. Ahmed is a wild card if for no other reason than he's a juco, and Freudenberg didnt play basketball in the US, and that means that where he did play was easier. It doesn't mean that they can't turn out to be stars, but rather that they haven't been tested in enough situations like Shamorie Ponds has been.

Couldn't disagree more Poison, we're getting two superstar recruits in Rich and Bash. They're both extremely versatile, have great speed, length and height for hybrid G/F, and most importantly can flat out score. I have no doubt that Mullin is going to make RF a NBA player.

You argue that Bash has never been through what Shamorie has seen. Have you forgotten that he was also once king of the city alongside Lance while he dominated the Bronx PSAL circuit as one of JFK's all time greats? He has also wanted to be a Johnny since his JFK days. This excerpt is from 2013, sounds a lot like Shamorie to me:

He had a phenomenal year for the Knights averaging 25 points and 12 rebounds a game playing as a hybrid 3/4 type for the Bronx school. On Friday he continued to prove why he is one of the best, helping lead the PSAL to the Mayor's Cup title with 20 points. We caught up with Ahmed after the game to get the scoop as to what's going on with his recruitment.

With his numbers, and the fact he played with New Heights 17's last summer,  you would think Ahmed would be rolling with interest and offers, but academic question marks have held him back, though he says he is starting to receive some attention now.

"I have an offer from Norfolk State, and St. John's, Providence, and Iona are showing interest." Ahmed said.

I would love nothing more than for you to be right, but history, namely our own history says it's a mystery. For every Bootsy Thornton, we've had two Avery Pattersons. You're talking about Bash and Rich like you've been watching them play up close consistently. Maybe you have. I have not.

But if you're basing your analysis only what you've read and limited video you've seen, don't you think that maybe that's not enough to present a clear picture of where these guys are? In your post, if Bash was "king of the city" why is it that only Norfolk State had offered him at that time?

Hopefully, that's because over the last years Bash went from promising mid major recruit to future NBA prospect.

It was bc of academics. I'm not arguing with you, you don't know your history on Bash and how talented he is, nor do you realize how elite of a international prospect RF is, I'm done.

I don't realize quite a bit because I haven't seen them play. But since you're so well informed, it must be because you have.

I agree, in reference to people being careful about labeling someone a "superstar" before they ever step foot on a collegiate court.  I'd rather stick with "contributor" with the potential to be "big-time," before giving 'em such a tag.  Prospects like Kevin Durant, John Wall, and other kids of similar talent.  One can still be off on their prognostications when speaking about those type of prospects.

I think Ahmed and Freudenberg will be solid players, but for now I'm holding off on calling 'em "superstars."   

Every St.John's fan should know better than to hype up a juco and a foreign kid like they're Larry Johnson and Dirk Nowitzki. Zero D1 experience. Zero BE experience. No player should have the burden of saving this program, except for the coach.

Since no one is doing that, there's no reason to repeatedly make this point

You don't have to look further than 5 posts ago.

Quan, Dinkins, and others .... how would you compare Freudberg with Kostas A ?

Ive seen enough to know how good Bashir is.  But the foreign recruits (milwaukee included) are hard to really guage beyond YouTube clips. 

Desco , from what i gather,I've watched some richard f games online and ive seen KA play online once it seems to me that RF is a far more finished product with a better shot. Athletically I think KA is more gifted, but we've seen how that goes in pointers first 3 seasons (4th being amazing ). International game is also more fundamentally  based as in better boxing out and more defensively disciplined. I would say the ceiling might be higher in the long run on KA "maybe". But he will need alot of time to reach that. RF will be an immediate contributor and a very good player by year 3.

Thanks valgoth, really good stuff.
Freudberg is intriguing.  I hope you're right about him being able to contribute right away.
I've heard some people say hes more of a multi year development.

Games I watched he looked very good from outside ( when not rushed) . Thats going to be his biggest adjustment is Big East D-1 players get right up on you on the shot but also remember hes 6'9" and Mussini is short for a SG which contributed alot to his rushing especially with no penetration and kickouts for easy looks. His shot can be inconsistent ( i saw a few games he rushed shots and seemed frustrated ) but his stroke is pure.

Desco , from what i gather,I've watched some richard f games online and ive seen KA play online once it seems to me that RF is a far more finished product with a better shot. Athletically I think KA is more gifted, but we've seen how that goes in pointers first 3 seasons (4th being amazing ). International game is also more fundamentally  based as in better boxing out and more defensively disciplined. I would say the ceiling might be higher in the long run on KA "maybe". But he will need alot of time to reach that. RF will be an immediate contributor and a very good player by year 3.

RF is a much better athlete than KA. KA is a stiff.

Desco , from what i gather,I've watched some richard f games online and ive seen KA play online once it seems to me that RF is a far more finished product with a better shot. Athletically I think KA is more gifted, but we've seen how that goes in pointers first 3 seasons (4th being amazing ). International game is also more fundamentally  based as in better boxing out and more defensively disciplined. I would say the ceiling might be higher in the long run on KA "maybe". But he will need alot of time to reach that. RF will be an immediate contributor and a very good player by year 3.

A very good player by year 3 is perfectly reasonable. It's how Nova does it. If he was an "elite" recruit, he'd be a very good player right now.

Quote from: Gray Chudney on May 07, 2016, 08:08:23 AM

Quote from: Poison on May 07, 2016, 01:27:13 AM

Quote from: mjdinkins on May 07, 2016, 12:43:20 AM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 08:20:32 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 07:50:44 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 07:14:43 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 07:04:56 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 06:53:17 PM

Quote from: QuanMan on May 06, 2016, 06:29:46 PM

Quote from: Poison on May 06, 2016, 04:41:31 PM

Is Darien Williams on that list because the guy we're gonna get is going to be healthy, and nothing like the guy we saw last season? Also, why is Tariq Owens lumped in with two other players? Seems like you don't think very highly of him?

The configuration of a poll on this board only allows five options. I would've put each of them on a separate line if I could.

I expect Owens to be ready. He's technically a junior, and he's now had a season of being coached at Tennessee followed immediately by one at St.John's. Ahmed and Freudenberg are both wild cards IMO. Ahmed is a wild card if for no other reason than he's a juco, and Freudenberg didnt play basketball in the US, and that means that where he did play was easier. It doesn't mean that they can't turn out to be stars, but rather that they haven't been tested in enough situations like Shamorie Ponds has been.

Couldn't disagree more Poison, we're getting two superstar recruits in Rich and Bash. They're both extremely versatile, have great speed, length and height for hybrid G/F, and most importantly can flat out score. I have no doubt that Mullin is going to make RF a NBA player.

You argue that Bash has never been through what Shamorie has seen. Have you forgotten that he was also once king of the city alongside Lance while he dominated the Bronx PSAL circuit as one of JFK's all time greats? He has also wanted to be a Johnny since his JFK days. This excerpt is from 2013, sounds a lot like Shamorie to me:

He had a phenomenal year for the Knights averaging 25 points and 12 rebounds a game playing as a hybrid 3/4 type for the Bronx school. On Friday he continued to prove why he is one of the best, helping lead the PSAL to the Mayor's Cup title with 20 points. We caught up with Ahmed after the game to get the scoop as to what's going on with his recruitment.

With his numbers, and the fact he played with New Heights 17's last summer,  you would think Ahmed would be rolling with interest and offers, but academic question marks have held him back, though he says he is starting to receive some attention now.

"I have an offer from Norfolk State, and St. John's, Providence, and Iona are showing interest." Ahmed said.

I would love nothing more than for you to be right, but history, namely our own history says it's a mystery. For every Bootsy Thornton, we've had two Avery Pattersons. You're talking about Bash and Rich like you've been watching them play up close consistently. Maybe you have. I have not.

But if you're basing your analysis only what you've read and limited video you've seen, don't you think that maybe that's not enough to present a clear picture of where these guys are? In your post, if Bash was "king of the city" why is it that only Norfolk State had offered him at that time?

Hopefully, that's because over the last years Bash went from promising mid major recruit to future NBA prospect.

It was bc of academics. I'm not arguing with you, you don't know your history on Bash and how talented he is, nor do you realize how elite of a international prospect RF is, I'm done.

I don't realize quite a bit because I haven't seen them play. But since you're so well informed, it must be because you have.

I agree, in reference to people being careful about labeling someone a "superstar" before they ever step foot on a collegiate court.  I'd rather stick with "contributor" with the potential to be "big-time," before giving 'em such a tag.  Prospects like Kevin Durant, John Wall, and other kids of similar talent.  One can still be off on their prognostications when speaking about those type of prospects.

I think Ahmed and Freudenberg will be solid players, but for now I'm holding off on calling 'em "superstars."   

Every St.John's fan should know better than to hype up a juco and a foreign kid like they're Larry Johnson and Dirk Nowitzki. Zero D1 experience. Zero BE experience. No player should have the burden of saving this program, except for the coach.

Since no one is doing that, there's no reason to repeatedly make this point

You don't have to look further than 5 posts ago.

I'm still missing the part where someone burdened them with being saviors.  There are fewer fans that have those sort of optimistic expectations than there are posts by you pointing out that no one should have such expectations. 

The thread is getting too long to reply with quotes, but I think both Bash and RF have NBA potential.  Bash falls into a pretty broad category of players that have the size, athletic ability, and rough skill set to get drafted if they improve certain aspects of their game and produce.

RF, IMO is a category higher in the "should" be in the league unless something goes wrong category. We are St. John's so something usually goes wrong. The good news is both of these guys both have more skill now than most top Lavin recruits that were in similar categories almost solely on physical ability.  NBA potential and college success are two different things, though, as we learned first hand a few years ago.

The thread is getting too long to reply with quotes, but I think both Bash and RF have NBA potential.  Bash falls into a pretty broad category of players that have the size, athletic ability, and rough skill set to get drafted if they improve certain aspects of their game and produce.

RF, IMO is a category higher in the "should" be in the league unless something goes wrong category. We are St. John's so something usually goes wrong. The good news is both of these guys both have more skill now than most top Lavin recruits that were in similar categories almost solely on physical ability.  NBA potential and college success are two different things, though, as we learned first hand a few years ago.

How well will they coexist in year one?

Quote from: Marillac on May 10, 2016, 06:24:01 PM

The thread is getting too long to reply with quotes, but I think both Bash and RF have NBA potential.  Bash falls into a pretty broad category of players that have the size, athletic ability, and rough skill set to get drafted if they improve certain aspects of their game and produce.

RF, IMO is a category higher in the "should" be in the league unless something goes wrong category. We are St. John's so something usually goes wrong. The good news is both of these guys both have more skill now than most top Lavin recruits that were in similar categories almost solely on physical ability.  NBA potential and college success are two different things, though, as we learned first hand a few years ago.

How well will they coexist in year one?

One of the many unknowns for this year's squad. From a purely talent perspective this team should beat last year's team by 20 every time out. It's night and day. I am hoping to see the staff come out much more prepared than last year.

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on May 10, 2016, 11:27:21 PM

Quote from: Marillac on May 10, 2016, 06:24:01 PM

The thread is getting too long to reply with quotes, but I think both Bash and RF have NBA potential.  Bash falls into a pretty broad category of players that have the size, athletic ability, and rough skill set to get drafted if they improve certain aspects of their game and produce.

RF, IMO is a category higher in the "should" be in the league unless something goes wrong category. We are St. John's so something usually goes wrong. The good news is both of these guys both have more skill now than most top Lavin recruits that were in similar categories almost solely on physical ability.  NBA potential and college success are two different things, though, as we learned first hand a few years ago.

How well will they coexist in year one?

One of the many unknowns for this year's squad. From a purely talent perspective this team should beat last year's team by 20 every time out. It's night and day. I am hoping to see the staff come out much more prepared than last year.

You're familiar with Bashir. Think he can cut it as a 4 in certain lineups? With no big grad transfer I wonder if staff plans on using more small lineups when Sima or Yakwe are out. I personally hope so.

Desco , from what i gather,I've watched some richard f games online and ive seen KA play online once it seems to me that RF is a far more finished product with a better shot. Athletically I think KA is more gifted, but we've seen how that goes in pointers first 3 seasons (4th being amazing ). International game is also more fundamentally  based as in better boxing out and more defensively disciplined. I would say the ceiling might be higher in the long run on KA "maybe". But he will need alot of time to reach that. RF will be an immediate contributor and a very good player by year 3.

and he can shoot

Quote from: Marillac on May 16, 2016, 04:25:11 PM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on May 10, 2016, 11:27:21 PM

Quote from: Marillac on May 10, 2016, 06:24:01 PM

The thread is getting too long to reply with quotes, but I think both Bash and RF have NBA potential.  Bash falls into a pretty broad category of players that have the size, athletic ability, and rough skill set to get drafted if they improve certain aspects of their game and produce.

RF, IMO is a category higher in the "should" be in the league unless something goes wrong category. We are St. John's so something usually goes wrong. The good news is both of these guys both have more skill now than most top Lavin recruits that were in similar categories almost solely on physical ability.  NBA potential and college success are two different things, though, as we learned first hand a few years ago.

How well will they coexist in year one?

One of the many unknowns for this year's squad. From a purely talent perspective this team should beat last year's team by 20 every time out. It's night and day. I am hoping to see the staff come out much more prepared than last year.

You're familiar with Bashir. Think he can cut it as a 4 in certain lineups? With no big grad transfer I wonder if staff plans on using more small lineups when Sima or Yakwe are out. I personally hope so.

I'd be surprised if he didn't do well in that role. He's always played as a 3/4.  He could really do some damage to opposing fours with his ability to slash.  He's a big kid and he can jump with just about anyone.

The one negative with him is that he isn't consistently assertive and then tries to make up for it in bunches which leads to forced looks and mistakes. He's not unlike Durand Johnson in that aspect. Guys like Ponds and Lovett don't need reminders to get their share. Could be an issue. I don't know what to expect from RF year one. He's really young.  I think I his ceiling is pretty crazy though.