Breaking the zone

How about putting Simon on the foul line? Or even Shamorie?

How about putting Simon on the foul line? Or even Shamorie?

Shamorie can play anywhere, but he's needed on the perimeter. Simon belongs in the middle and teams do us a favor by going zone because it allows us to find a place for him while still spacing the floor.

They should take turns flashing through.

Need to recruit a PG

Not sure how why we can’t break the zone when we’ve beaten the very best one (Cuse) the last 2 years. It’s obvious there has been a change in approach. Against Cuse we had two guys at the foul line who would quickly attack towards the hoop behind the zone. Ain’t happening this year for some reason. 

Need to recruit a PG

We have 3 guys that can run the point. I don’t think that’s the problem. As a whole the team has fallen in love with the 3 point shot and in this game, they didn’t fall, it spiraled out of control. Still, they won, so it only matters if they refuse to learn from it.

LoVett used to get assists. He’s not setting up others. He needs to get back being a point guard, but two bad games doesn’t mean he can be a point guard anymore.

I think they’ll be able to work through this. Fran said it best when he said that we are rushing our offense. We need to have a plan for the zone that revolves around moving the ball.

Need to recruit a PG

This is a joke right..... our biggest problem is Ahmed. He is the worst perimeter defender I have ever seen. He basically gave away the Mizzou game all by himself.

Quote from: Marco Baldi on November 26, 2017, 04:24:16 PM

Need to recruit a PG

This is a joke right..... our biggest problem is Ahmed. He is the worst perimeter defender I have ever seen. He basically gave away the Mizzou game all by himself.

Joke? No.  We need a leader on the floor who can take control and get guys where they need to be. Do we have someone like that? But I agree that's it's just 1 of the glaring problems

Not sure how why we can’t break the zone when we’ve beaten the very best one (Cuse) the last 2 years. It’s obvious there has been a change in approach. Against Cuse we had two guys at the foul line who would quickly attack towards the hoop behind the zone. Ain’t happening this year for some reason. 

I honestly think it's because it's really early in the season ans we probably haven't work d on it much.  3 games in 3 days is also a lot to prepare for.  It's time though that we start working on how to attack these things.  Mullin did a great job against zones the past 2 years.  We seemed to be very focused on defense early, which is of major importance, but now need to focus on the offense a bit.

I think Ponds and/or Lovett can be that guy.  We ask them to score so much I think it probably hurts that aspect of their game and they are obviously still learning. 

Quote from: Mullin77 on November 26, 2017, 07:10:43 PM

Quote from: Marco Baldi on November 26, 2017, 04:24:16 PM

Need to recruit a PG

This is a joke right..... our biggest problem is Ahmed. He is the worst perimeter defender I have ever seen. He basically gave away the Mizzou game all by himself.

Joke? No.  We need a leader on the floor who can take control and get guys where they need to be. Do we have someone like that? But I agree that's it's just 1 of the glaring problems

We do miss Mussini against the Zone....His shooting obviously and also his movement which got him or the next guy open looks.  Re Zone, obviously need good play at the foulline, probably Simon, and need to run the baseline in tandem with ball movement to the weak side creating open corner jumpers.

Quote from: Mullin77 on November 26, 2017, 07:10:43 PM

Quote from: Marco Baldi on November 26, 2017, 04:24:16 PM

Need to recruit a PG

This is a joke right..... our biggest problem is Ahmed. He is the worst perimeter defender I have ever seen. He basically gave away the Mizzou game all by himself.

Joke? No.  We need a leader on the floor who can take control and get guys where they need to be. Do we have someone like that? But I agree that's it's just 1 of the glaring problems

Ponds is averaging 5 assists/1 to a game. He is obviously one of the best point guards/ players in the Big East. If u can’t see that I would change your prescription.

IMO, our two weakness are rebounding and Ahmed’s defense -  which is horrendous.

Need to recruit a PG

We have two already...one will be playing in the NBA. They have to shoulder crazy responsibility because we don't have a reliable third option or any kind of a post presence. We also have a subpar screening game thus far which really has me confused with the NBA experienced  coaching staff. Clark and Yakwe can't keep their feet set and refrain from leaning and our staff isn't running enough guys into Bash at 210, Simon at 215, and Clark at 230. Tell me why we see one-on-one without screens when we haven't scored for 3-4 minutes and not double screens?

Help Ponds out and get Lovett back on the ball 50-60% of the time.

We do miss Mussini against the Zone....His shooting obviously and also his movement which got him or the next guy open looks.  Re Zone, obviously need good play at the foulline, probably Simon, and need to run the baseline in tandem with ball movement to the weak side creating open corner jumpers.

He was also a very reliable ball-handler.

Quote from: cjfish on November 26, 2017, 09:42:49 PM

We do miss Mussini against the Zone....His shooting obviously and also his movement which got him or the next guy open looks.  Re Zone, obviously need good play at the foulline, probably Simon, and need to run the baseline in tandem with ball movement to the weak side creating open corner jumpers.

He was also a very reliable ball-handler.

...and was terrible on one-on-one D, couldn't rebound and barely created any turnovers.

Quote from: Marco Baldi on November 26, 2017, 04:24:16 PM

Need to recruit a PG

We have two already...one will be playing in the NBA. They have to shoulder crazy responsibility because we don't have a reliable third option or any kind of a post presence. We also have a subpar screening game thus far which really has me confused with the NBA experienced  coaching staff. Clark and Yakwe can't keep their feet set and refrain from leaning and our staff isn't running enough guys into Bash at 210, Simon at 215, and Clark at 230. Tell me why we see one-on-one without screens when we haven't scored for 3-4 minutes and not double screens?

Help Ponds out and get Lovett back on the ball 50-60% of the time.

We lack post presence, but I think a bigger lookin problem right now is lack of wing presence except for Ahmed who’s gone next year.  We are gonna have to sign some sort of wing/SF.   I don’t think  Diakite is likely ready for that role, and Simon doesn’t have the ability to be a consistent perimeter threat.

Quote from: Marillac on November 27, 2017, 05:25:22 AM

Quote from: cjfish on November 26, 2017, 09:42:49 PM

We do miss Mussini against the Zone....His shooting obviously and also his movement which got him or the next guy open looks.  Re Zone, obviously need good play at the foulline, probably Simon, and need to run the baseline in tandem with ball movement to the weak side creating open corner jumpers.

He was also a very reliable ball-handler.

...and was terrible on one-on-one D, couldn't rebound and barely created any turnovers.

He shot 43% from three as a soph as a marked shooter and he shot 86% from the FT line with only 18 turnovers all of last year.  When he played starter minutes he averaged 1.2 steals per game and 2.4 rebounds.  His defense was terrible his first year, but he was solid last year.  He didn't commit stupid fouls (1.3 total fouls per game for his career).  Most importantly, he spaced the floor on offense and forced the other team to mark him at all times and face guard him.  That impact is very hard to quantify.

How was Vanleer's defense for Mizzou or Rousey's for Marquette?  Kyron Cartwright can't defend Louie but Providence wouldn't trade him in.

No idea why, but this staff likes to have two guys in the high post against a 2-3. It makes no sense..all you do is clog the middle and you take away any baseline threat so the zone can move out higher.

We have the perfect personnel to attack it the way Lavs did, with one guy at the foul line. You have Shamorie, LoVett and Bash on the perimeter, and you run Clark, who can hit that little midrange jumper all day (see: Brownlee, Justin) if the top guys get extended and the bottom guys have to stay home to respect the baseline presence, to the high post. You let Simon, who can jump out of the #$%^ing building, roam the baseline for back cuts or alley oops.

You do it that way, you're spreading the D that much more, creating a ton of open space in the middle and it makes it easier to go inside out. Or inside and to the hole. Or for our guards to penetrate. Why they want to bunch everybody up, I have no idea.

No idea why, but this staff likes to have two guys in the high post against a 2-3. It makes no sense..all you do is clog the middle and you take away any baseline threat so the zone can move out higher.

We have the perfect personnel to attack it the way Lavs did, with one guy at the foul line. You have Shamorie, LoVett and Bash on the perimeter, and you run Clark, who can hit that little midrange jumper all day (see: Brownlee, Justin) if the top guys get extended and the bottom guys have to stay home to respect the baseline presence, to the high post. You let Simon, who can jump out of the #$%^ing building, roam the baseline for back cuts or alley oops.

You do it that way, you're spreading the D that much more, creating a ton of open space in the middle and it makes it easier to go inside out. Or inside and to the hole. Or for our guards to penetrate. Why they want to bunch everybody up, I have no idea.

Spot on. Please forward this post to the staff

No idea why, but this staff likes to have two guys in the high post against a 2-3. It makes no sense..all you do is clog the middle

That wasn't by design. They had the wrong guy in the middle and Simon cheated towards the lane instead of spacing the floor. It's easily corrected. Simon has to go in the middle because he can't shoot, but can pass and even take the center on a 1-2 dribble move if the floor is spaced. Owens doesn't have the hands to play the middle and be of any use, so he needs to be a screener and baseline threat.


Our personnel is actually better suited for the zone, but we can be caught off guard with wrong guys on the floor because we Owens/Yakwe/Simon all want to be the guy in the middle.