The Perfect Coach for ST John's

'we are sju',

you are absolutely correct, censoring posters is not the way to go - i totally agree with you.
I just don't get how certain nonsense is allowed to be posted over and over.

reasonable discourse is fine about any topic is debated, whether positive or negative. 
Making up rumors, and repeating the same negative things over shouldn't be.
So i guess the answer is other posters just have to continue to call out the baloney.

But you are right, my censoring comment was me ranting.

Damn message boards have destroyed the program.

No, but your wretched posts waste everyone else's energy and time.

Quote from: Marco Baldi on January 21, 2018, 10:10:46 AM

Damn message boards have destroyed the program.

No, but your wretched posts waste everyone else's energy. Get lost.

Baldi is Baldi.
The "true fans" that want every coach fired every two years are more annoying.
Hey and I get complaining. There is a lot to complain about. And I have taken Mullin shots, he left himself open for them. I just don't get the he is the worst, he needs to be fired posts everyday.

There are posters that are not happy. You can tell Paultz, Maher, Masejr just to name a few are getting frustrated with the process. But they still root for the team and don't constantly push the same agenda every post.

The only way you bring this staff back for another year is if you think they can do well and compete. I can not see how anyone in their right mind believes that. Nothing they have done has warranted another year. The longer this experiment goes on. The more embarrassing it becomes.

The only way you bring this staff back for another year is if you think they can do well and compete. I can not see how anyone in their right mind believes that. Nothing they have done has warranted another year. The longer this experiment goes on. The more embarrassing it becomes.

Do you have that on auto type?
Starting to act like Jack Torrence at the Overlook Hotel.

"All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy"
You know things didn't go so well for poor Jack.

just slide the assistants down one seat on the bench with Ritchmond backt to special assistant, STJ as 3rd assistant, and make room for Mike Rice as # 1 assistant....doubt it will happen that way, but something needs to happen at season end.

Really wonder who Mullin may currently be tapping into for advice, inputs etc. other than Louie for moral support..  Who might be in his sphere of possible coaches he'd welcome on a staff ?

Quote from: TONYD3 on January 21, 2018, 09:36:27 AM

Quote from: Marillac on January 21, 2018, 09:20:37 AM

Quote from: TONYD3 on January 21, 2018, 08:08:50 AM

Quote from: Marillac on January 21, 2018, 06:53:54 AM

Add a PG and retain all the seniors plus key recruits and we'll be fine next year. I'd make all three seniors captains.

Agree trust the process

The process didn't include having Mussini go pro and Lovett holding the program hostage. You can ding staff for not recruiting a complete roster for this year but nobody could win with this group. I called it on the summer. "What happens if Ponds sprains an ankle. Does the season just end?"

It was Lovet, but yes it does just end.

Not going to argue. But if you think a 6 foot guard with no athleticism and no PG skills would help I disagree. Him being recruited in the first place was a mistake first by Lavin then by Mullin. As was the German .
I don’t follow recuiting as much some of you. All I know is in high profile job you can’t keep making mistakes and keep a job. Huge mistakes and incompetence what this staff is about.
I assume you mean ok is winning 18 games next year and making the NIT. First off that isn’t good enough. Second - and most importantly not going to happen. Can’t win without a coach

Simple math. Guy was averaging 14 points a game. Other guys like Ahmed and Owens had to try and make up for some of that and are not equipped to. Use whatever revisionist history you want but losing your 2nd best player hurts.

Especially when we have no bench.    I agree posters are entitled to their opinion. But some just repeat themselves over and over again. It gets boring.       This may be the most frustrating year for me as a fan. And that’s saying a lot. We were so close in so many games, even against great teams like Nova and Xavier on the road. We gave away the GT game.  I think you have to give Mullin another year. But what really worries me is we have to retain Ponds and Owens and we need Brooks, a true inside player. We also need to upgrade staff. .. It wasn’t just the Lovett loss that hurt, but the mass exodus of players last year. Another year of Exodus and all is lost.

The only way you bring this staff back for another year is if you think they can do well and compete. I can not see how anyone in their right mind believes that. Nothing they have done has warranted another year. The longer this experiment goes on. The more embarrassing it becomes.

Just a thought but you know many on here wanted Lavin gone after years 2-4. He came in with a shoddy reputation but did a really good job with Norm's seniors. But outside of the Cancer year most of his problems were self inflicted. Now I did not think Lavin was a good coach and the silly nicknames, self promoting and camera coaching were annoying but I though if he had a good year his last season he would have done enough to warrant. So I was all for him being retained. Posted as much. He is gone now and Mullin is here until he isn't. Criticize all you want but if you keep posting the same thing over and over you will drive yourself and others crazy. Just look what happened to Jack Torrence.

Quote from: we are sju on January 21, 2018, 10:09:05 AM

Quote from: TONYD3 on January 21, 2018, 09:36:27 AM

Quote from: Marillac on January 21, 2018, 09:20:37 AM

Quote from: TONYD3 on January 21, 2018, 08:08:50 AM

Quote from: Marillac on January 21, 2018, 06:53:54 AM

Add a PG and retain all the seniors plus key recruits and we'll be fine next year. I'd make all three seniors captains.

Agree trust the process

The process didn't include having Mussini go pro and Lovett holding the program hostage. You can ding staff for not recruiting a complete roster for this year but nobody could win with this group. I called it on the summer. "What happens if Ponds sprains an ankle. Does the season just end?"

It was Lovet, but yes it does just end.

Not going to argue. But if you think a 6 foot guard with no athleticism and no PG skills would help I disagree. Him being recruited in the first place was a mistake first by Lavin then by Mullin. As was the German .
I don’t follow recuiting as much some of you. All I know is in high profile job you can’t keep making mistakes and keep a job. Huge mistakes and incompetence what this staff is about.
I assume you mean ok is winning 18 games next year and making the NIT. First off that isn’t good enough. Second - and most importantly not going to happen. Can’t win without a coach

Simple math. Guy was averaging 14 points a game. Other guys like Ahmed and Owens had to try and make up for some of that and are not equipped to. Use whatever revisionist history you want but losing your 2nd best player hurts.

Especially when we have no bench.    I agree posters are entitled to their opinion. But some just repeat themselves over and over again. It gets boring.       This may be the most frustrating year for me as a fan. And that’s saying a lot. We were so close in so many games, even against great teams like Nova and Xavier on the road. We gave away the GT game.  I think you have to give Mullin another year. But what really worries me is we have to retain Ponds and Owens and we need Brooks, a true inside player.. It wasn’t just the Lovett loss that hurt, but the mass exodus of players last year. Another year of Exodus and all is lost.

If Ponds leaves might as well fire Mullin because we would have no shot next year. Keeping Mullin goes hand in hand with assuming his best player is staying. No Ponds might as well start the rebuild again.

I don’t know if I have the stomach to sit through another rebuild.

Aside from President Gempeshaw, which board makes the decision on coaching ?

Board of  Trustees   https://www.stjohns.edu/about/leadership/board-trustees

or

Board of Governors  https://www.stjohns.edu/about/leadership/board-governors

What's the difference ?


PS - Never realized Tarik Turner was on Board of Trustees so assuming that group is one that helps decide hiring/firing for BB coach etc.

Quote from: ras on January 21, 2018, 11:54:42 AM

Quote from: we are sju on January 21, 2018, 10:09:05 AM

Quote from: TONYD3 on January 21, 2018, 09:36:27 AM

Quote from: Marillac on January 21, 2018, 09:20:37 AM

Quote from: TONYD3 on January 21, 2018, 08:08:50 AM

Quote from: Marillac on January 21, 2018, 06:53:54 AM

Add a PG and retain all the seniors plus key recruits and we'll be fine next year. I'd make all three seniors captains.

Agree trust the process

The process didn't include having Mussini go pro and Lovett holding the program hostage. You can ding staff for not recruiting a complete roster for this year but nobody could win with this group. I called it on the summer. "What happens if Ponds sprains an ankle. Does the season just end?"

It was Lovet, but yes it does just end.

Not going to argue. But if you think a 6 foot guard with no athleticism and no PG skills would help I disagree. Him being recruited in the first place was a mistake first by Lavin then by Mullin. As was the German .
I don’t follow recuiting as much some of you. All I know is in high profile job you can’t keep making mistakes and keep a job. Huge mistakes and incompetence what this staff is about.
I assume you mean ok is winning 18 games next year and making the NIT. First off that isn’t good enough. Second - and most importantly not going to happen. Can’t win without a coach

Simple math. Guy was averaging 14 points a game. Other guys like Ahmed and Owens had to try and make up for some of that and are not equipped to. Use whatever revisionist history you want but losing your 2nd best player hurts.

Especially when we have no bench.    I agree posters are entitled to their opinion. But some just repeat themselves over and over again. It gets boring.       This may be the most frustrating year for me as a fan. And that’s saying a lot. We were so close in so many games, even against great teams like Nova and Xavier on the road. We gave away the GT game.  I think you have to give Mullin another year. But what really worries me is we have to retain Ponds and Owens and we need Brooks, a true inside player.. It wasn’t just the Lovett loss that hurt, but the mass exodus of players last year. Another year of Exodus and all is lost.

If Ponds leaves might as well fire Mullin because we would have no shot next year. Keeping Mullin goes hand in hand with assuming his best player is staying. No Ponds might as well start the rebuild again.

One player shouldn’t determine this decision. The decision should be made based on the team’s collective improvement. In December, it certainly appeared like things were moving in the right direction.

We don’t have an identity on defense. We don’t run an offense. We don’t box out. We don’t even make free throws now.

Next year should everyone return sans LoVett, I see a 15 win season. We’ll win some of the close game we’ve lost this year because we don’t have a BE front court but Ron Artest ain’t walking through that door. 6 new players next year. The best of best which is a freshman PF. Big men take time. What can we really expect Brooks to give us (if he still comes here) as a freshman? I’d go with 5 and 4.5 and maybe a block per game. The NIT will be a reach in 18/19 without a change.

I don’t know if I have the stomach to sit through another rebuild.

What are you going to go through that’s worse than being winless?

Why should it be presumed that we will have to go through an entire rebuild?  Before I get crushed with “because that’s what always happens here” this team is balanced for the next 5-6 years which is completely different than any other coach in last 15 years.

If Mullin does not succeed, which I don’t believe he will, the next hire will have more players to start with, which is what normally happens in cbb. Will there be defections and recruits not coming, of course but at least that coach will have a base to work with, and hopefully is a competent coach, currently somewhere with experience.

Quote from: ras on January 21, 2018, 12:02:45 PM

I don’t know if I have the stomach to sit through another rebuild.

What are you going to go through that’s worse than being winless?

Makes perfect sense.

Why should it be presumed that we will have to go through an entire rebuild?  Before I get crushed with “because that’s what always happens here” this team is balanced for the next 5-6 years which is completely different than any other coach in last 15 years.

If Mullin does not succeed, which I don’t believe he will, the next hire will have more players to start with, which is what normally happens in cbb. Will there be defections and recruits not coming, of course but at least that coach will have a base to work with, and hopefully is a competent coach, currently somewhere with experience.

Yes if Mo were to leave after this year or probably even next year he would be leaving the program in much better shape then when he came in. The next coach would have the opportunity to convince remaining players tot stay and recruits to remain committed. When Mahoney left FF was able to keep all 5 recruits on board. Of course Mully still has a chance to resurrect the program if he keeps most of and the impt pieces to stay and the incoming recruits intact and someone on whatever the staff looks like next year can coach.

Quote from: ras on January 21, 2018, 12:02:45 PM

I don’t know if I have the stomach to sit through another rebuild.

What are you going to go through that’s worse than being winless?

Don’t have the stomach for this year either.

The only way you bring this staff back for another year is if you think they can do well and compete. I can not see how anyone in their right mind believes that. Nothing they have done has warranted another year. The longer this experiment goes on. The more embarrassing it becomes.

Playing devils advocate here and keep in mind I'm one of the unhappy ones. BUT would you say last year was on ok year ? Not great year and not horrible year ?

So while not throwing out this year from our memory but if we have a chance of having fuller and potentially better and more experienced roster next year and let's assume chance Mullin learns from mistakes of this year and grows from it dont we at least give the homegrown Hall of fame player the chance to coach that 4th year with full team and see what happens after all we have been through as fans over the last 20 years ?

What IF next year everyone came back and it became that breakthrough year ( I'm not saying it will be but what if there was a chance ) and if we hit our stride next year and we have a home grown Hall of Fame player coaching our team

I'll take the chance on that 4th year instead of blowing everything up and starting over knowing we have well over 3 million a year already committed for 3 more years and pray he gets it right

Quote from: TONYD3 on January 21, 2018, 11:40:43 AM

The only way you bring this staff back for another year is if you think they can do well and compete. I can not see how anyone in their right mind believes that. Nothing they have done has warranted another year. The longer this experiment goes on. The more embarrassing it becomes.

Playing devils advocate here and keep in mind I'm one of the unhappy ones. BUT would you say last year was on ok year ? Not great year and not horrible year ?

So while not throwing out this year from our memory but if we have a chance of having fuller and potentially better and more experienced roster next year and let's assume chance Mullin learns from mistakes of this year and grows from it dont we at least give the homegrown Hall of fame player the chance to coach that 4th year with full team and see what happens after all we have been through as fans over the last 20 years ?

What IF next year everyone came back and it became that breakthrough year ( I'm not saying it will be but what if there was a chance ) and if we hit our stride next year and we have a home grown Hall of Fame player coaching our team

I'll take the chance on that 4th year instead of blowing everything up and starting over knowing we have well over 3 million a year already committed for 3 more years and pray he gets it right

More than reasonable.