Nova Game

Great win. Only took 15 3’s. Out rebounded nova. Held them to 24 percent from 3. Great win. Certainly an upset. But we didn’t look like any Cinderella last night. Brunson is really good. Ponds was also.

The biggest things you can take from this past week are:

1)The team has not quit in any way shape or form.  That is a credit to Chris and the staff.  That doesn't excuse the 0-11 start but it shows that people who actually thought he would resign or wanted to be somewhere else were wrong.  He is 100% into this.  That is big.  As Tierney tweeted last night, CM did not come back to his alma mater to be embarrassed.  His goal was to make SJU relevant again Nationally.  Has not been the smoothest ride but we may be seeing it finally turn now.  And he is not quitting until that happens.

2)The argument that they are close because of close losses has much more credibility now than before.  If you win 4-5 then you can plausibly argue that they were a play or two away in 4-5 more games,  Heck can you imagine if they made a play or two late at home against Xavier, you could have had 3 straight wins in a week over top 5 teams...

3)The 2 year plan is now not just a plan but becoming a clearer reality.  Now if they hold the class together and keep the core (Ponds, Clark, Owens, Simon etc) the significant jump they can make next year doesn't look so daunting...

My opinion is changing. Nothing lucky about our last 2 wins. Hoping the staff figured somethings out. Excited for Saturday.

Quote from: goredmen on February 08, 2018, 01:51:09 AM

Quote from: Marillac on February 07, 2018, 11:41:04 PM

Quote from: goredmen on February 07, 2018, 10:21:49 PM

Great win. Let's enjoy it. But let's also cool it with NCAA Tournament talk. It is not happening. Even if we win out during the regular season we'd still have work to do in the BET to get in. Going 4-2 over the last 6 and we have to win BET to get in. 4-2 plus a loss in the BET championship game puts us at an 8-14 overall conference record. That doesn't even put us in the conversation

You have no idea what you're talking about. We are going to finish with the #1 SOS. 5 wins means a top 45 RPI and a strong finish. Let me know the last time a high major was left out with a top 50 RPI. We have two of the biggest resume wins you can ask for. We also lost a bunch of close games adjusting to losing our second leading scorer. We'd check every box the committee looks for.

Now whether we can go 5-2 or 6-2 is another story. 

Ok, let's say for the sake argument we go 4-2 in the last 6 regular season games with the losses @ Marquette and @Providence. That puts us at 5-13. That means we play Wednesday against Georgetown or DePaul. Win that, play Thursday vs Nova or Xavier. Let's say we win that too because why not. Friday night the fatigue from a short rotation shows and we lose to Butler. That puts us at 7-14 in conference and 18-15 overall. That doesn't get us in the conversation.

Last year Providence was 20-12 overall, 10-9 in conference. Barely got them in.

Yes, good wins count for a lot by the committee. But so do bad losses. We have 3 of those right now too.

Comparing us to Providence last year shows that you don't understand the math. Providence had the #61 RPI and the #50 SOS last year. We would be top 45 RPI and #1 SOS with 6 more wins. The only two good comps would be 16-14 Georgia from over a decade ago and 19-15 Vanderbilt from last year. Both had top 50 RPIs and a top 5 SOS. Wed have that and two February wins over top 5 teams in a 4 day span.

4-2 won't get it done. 5-1 with a BET win or a 6-0 finish regardless of what happens in the BET would get us in.

Again, I don't expect us to win 5-6 to close things out, but you bet your arse there will be an article talking about our chances to dance if we win the next three games and have 2/3 left at home and a date with #10 Depaul in the first round of the BET.

What exactly is "the math ?"

Quote from: fordham96 on February 08, 2018, 09:06:58 AM

The biggest things you can take from this past week are:

1)The team has not quit in any way shape or form.  That is a credit to Chris and the staff.  That doesn't excuse the 0-11 start but it shows that people who actually thought he would resign or wanted to be somewhere else were wrong.  He is 100% into this.  That is big.  As Tierney tweeted last night, CM did not come back to his alma mater to be embarrassed.  His goal was to make SJU relevant again Nationally.  Has not been the smoothest ride but we may be seeing it finally turn now.  And he is not quitting until that happens.

2)The argument that they are close because of close losses has much more credibility now than before.  If you win 4-5 then you can plausibly argue that they were a play or two away in 4-5 more games,  Heck can you imagine if they made a play or two late at home against Xavier, you could have had 3 straight wins in a week over top 5 teams...

3)The 2 year plan is now not just a plan but becoming a clearer reality.  Now if they hold the class together and keep the core (Ponds, Clark, Owens, Simon etc) the significant jump they can make next year doesn't look so daunting...

My opinion is changing. Nothing lucky about our last 2 wins. Hoping the staff figured somethings out. Excited for Saturday.

See that is surprising. Usually really, really dumb people are so set in their ways that they simply are unable to change. But I guess beating the number 4 and number 1 teams back to back can reach even the feeblest mind.
Good for you Tony

Quote from: TONYD3 on February 08, 2018, 09:09:03 AM

Quote from: fordham96 on February 08, 2018, 09:06:58 AM

The biggest things you can take from this past week are:

1)The team has not quit in any way shape or form.  That is a credit to Chris and the staff.  That doesn't excuse the 0-11 start but it shows that people who actually thought he would resign or wanted to be somewhere else were wrong.  He is 100% into this.  That is big.  As Tierney tweeted last night, CM did not come back to his alma mater to be embarrassed.  His goal was to make SJU relevant again Nationally.  Has not been the smoothest ride but we may be seeing it finally turn now.  And he is not quitting until that happens.

2)The argument that they are close because of close losses has much more credibility now than before.  If you win 4-5 then you can plausibly argue that they were a play or two away in 4-5 more games,  Heck can you imagine if they made a play or two late at home against Xavier, you could have had 3 straight wins in a week over top 5 teams...

3)The 2 year plan is now not just a plan but becoming a clearer reality.  Now if they hold the class together and keep the core (Ponds, Clark, Owens, Simon etc) the significant jump they can make next year doesn't look so daunting...

My opinion is changing. Nothing lucky about our last 2 wins. Hoping the staff figured somethings out. Excited for Saturday.

See that is surprising. Usually really, really dumb people are so set in their ways that they simply are unable to change. But I guess beating the number 4 and number 1 teams back to back can reach even the feeblest mind.
Good for you Tony

Does that mean I finally get a pass?

St John's Villanova recap: http://www.bigeastboards.com/

Quote from: goredmen on February 08, 2018, 01:51:09 AM

Quote from: Marillac on February 07, 2018, 11:41:04 PM

Quote from: goredmen on February 07, 2018, 10:21:49 PM

Great win. Let's enjoy it. But let's also cool it with NCAA Tournament talk. It is not happening. Even if we win out during the regular season we'd still have work to do in the BET to get in. Going 4-2 over the last 6 and we have to win BET to get in. 4-2 plus a loss in the BET championship game puts us at an 8-14 overall conference record. That doesn't even put us in the conversation

You have no idea what you're talking about. We are going to finish with the #1 SOS. 5 wins means a top 45 RPI and a strong finish. Let me know the last time a high major was left out with a top 50 RPI. We have two of the biggest resume wins you can ask for. We also lost a bunch of close games adjusting to losing our second leading scorer. We'd check every box the committee looks for.

Now whether we can go 5-2 or 6-2 is another story. 

Ok, let's say for the sake argument we go 4-2 in the last 6 regular season games with the losses @ Marquette and @Providence. That puts us at 5-13. That means we play Wednesday against Georgetown or DePaul. Win that, play Thursday vs Nova or Xavier. Let's say we win that too because why not. Friday night the fatigue from a short rotation shows and we lose to Butler. That puts us at 7-14 in conference and 18-15 overall. That doesn't get us in the conversation.

Last year Providence was 20-12 overall, 10-9 in conference. Barely got them in.

Yes, good wins count for a lot by the committee. But so do bad losses. We have 3 of those right now too.

Comparing us to Providence last year shows that you don't understand the math. Providence had the #61 RPI and the #50 SOS last year. We would be top 45 RPI and #1 SOS with 6 more wins. The only two good comps would be 16-14 Georgia from over a decade ago and 19-15 Vanderbilt from last year. Both had top 50 RPIs and a top 5 SOS. Wed have that and two February wins over top 5 teams in a 4 day span.

4-2 won't get it done. 5-1 with a BET win or a 6-0 finish regardless of what happens in the BET would get us in.

Again, I don't expect us to win 5-6 to close things out, but you bet your arse there will be an article talking about our chances to dance if we win the next three games and have 2/3 left at home and a date with #10 Depaul in the first round of the BET.

The 16-14 Georgia team didn't go to the NCAA Tournament. Last year's Vanderbilt team was 12-9 in conference.

Quote from: Marillac on February 08, 2018, 03:00:53 AM

Quote from: goredmen on February 08, 2018, 01:51:09 AM

Quote from: Marillac on February 07, 2018, 11:41:04 PM

Quote from: goredmen on February 07, 2018, 10:21:49 PM

Great win. Let's enjoy it. But let's also cool it with NCAA Tournament talk. It is not happening. Even if we win out during the regular season we'd still have work to do in the BET to get in. Going 4-2 over the last 6 and we have to win BET to get in. 4-2 plus a loss in the BET championship game puts us at an 8-14 overall conference record. That doesn't even put us in the conversation

You have no idea what you're talking about. We are going to finish with the #1 SOS. 5 wins means a top 45 RPI and a strong finish. Let me know the last time a high major was left out with a top 50 RPI. We have two of the biggest resume wins you can ask for. We also lost a bunch of close games adjusting to losing our second leading scorer. We'd check every box the committee looks for.

Now whether we can go 5-2 or 6-2 is another story. 

Ok, let's say for the sake argument we go 4-2 in the last 6 regular season games with the losses @ Marquette and @Providence. That puts us at 5-13. That means we play Wednesday against Georgetown or DePaul. Win that, play Thursday vs Nova or Xavier. Let's say we win that too because why not. Friday night the fatigue from a short rotation shows and we lose to Butler. That puts us at 7-14 in conference and 18-15 overall. That doesn't get us in the conversation.

Last year Providence was 20-12 overall, 10-9 in conference. Barely got them in.

Yes, good wins count for a lot by the committee. But so do bad losses. We have 3 of those right now too.

Comparing us to Providence last year shows that you don't understand the math. Providence had the #61 RPI and the #50 SOS last year. We would be top 45 RPI and #1 SOS with 6 more wins. The only two good comps would be 16-14 Georgia from over a decade ago and 19-15 Vanderbilt from last year. Both had top 50 RPIs and a top 5 SOS. Wed have that and two February wins over top 5 teams in a 4 day span.

4-2 won't get it done. 5-1 with a BET win or a 6-0 finish regardless of what happens in the BET would get us in.

Again, I don't expect us to win 5-6 to close things out, but you bet your arse there will be an article talking about our chances to dance if we win the next three games and have 2/3 left at home and a date with #10 Depaul in the first round of the BET.

The 16-14 Georgia team didn't go to the NCAA Tournament. Last year's Vanderbilt team was 12-9 in conference.

The only reason the Georgia team (from a decade ago) went to the Tournament because they won the SEC Tournament.

IMO, the only way we get in is to run the table in conference play and win a game (or two) in the conference tournament.  If we're not able to win out, then we're gonna have to win the Big East Tournament.

I'm not hopeful of the NCAA's, so I'm thinking more of our chances of participating in the NIT.

need to win out 18-13 (7-11) then need to go 1-1 or 2-1 in big east conference .....19/20-14 will get us in the tournament ....lets enjoy this and take it one game at a time!! Bring on Marquette!!!  Fun 5 days to be a St John's fan lets keep it going!

No I think Marillac is talking about the 2000-1 Georgia team coached by Jim Herrick.  They made the Tourney at 16-14.  That is the fewest wins of any at large team.

That team however was 9-7 in the SEC, meaning they had a winning league record.  Also their RPI was ridiculous, I believe it was top 20.  So the committee had a choice leave out the highest RPI from a power conference or invite the fewest wins team from a power conference.  They chose the latter.

St John's Villanova recap: http://www.bigeastboards.com/

At the 1:43 mark in the video of that other historic MSG win vs. Dook, look who we find in the MSG stands!  Coach Mullin!

I think if the Lovett not playing news had broke earlier, the staff and team would have regrouped sooner and won 3 or 4 of those games. The Lovett uncertainty and then sudden announcement really derailed things.

We'd have to run the table, and lose in the BET championship game to get an at large bid. And even then we'd probably be a bubble team.

We'd have to run the table, and lose in the BET championship game to get an at large bid. And even then we'd probably be a bubble team.

All of these are far fetched and hypotheticals but if you think we’d only be a bubble team after winnin what would be at least 8 straight with some road wins and ranked teams along the way you’re nuts. Our rpi and sos would make us shoe ins.

We'd have to run the table, and lose in the BET championship game to get an at large bid. And even then we'd probably be a bubble team.

I think we would have a shot if we went 5-1 and lost BET championship game. If we run the table then lose title game I think we would get in. But conference record would be the issue even running the table.

Quote from: Foad on February 08, 2018, 11:44:45 AM

St John's Villanova recap: http://www.bigeastboards.com/

At the 1:43 mark in the video of that other historic MSG win vs. Dook, look who we find in the MSG stands!  Coach Mullin!

Quote from: Foad on February 08, 2018, 11:44:45 AM

St John's Villanova recap: http://www.bigeastboards.com/

At the 1:43 mark in the video of that other historic MSG win vs. Dook, look who we find in the MSG stands!  Coach Mullin!

Foad-good write and thanks for including that 2003 video; remember it and the Garden going crazy

We'd have to run the table, and lose in the BET championship game to get an at large bid. And even then we'd probably be a bubble team.

so you think if we run the table and lose in BET with a 21-14 record with wins over Duke Nova, seton hall, butler, 2x Marq and Nebraska and say hypothetical (Depaul, Xavier and Creighton) in big east tourney and lose nova in championship we would be still only bubble? i think thats more like a lock 11-1 last 12 games....again what are chances that happens or we do that but hey its fun to dream!!

Clark is not perfect, but spirited guy:

https://twitter.com/b_rabold/status/961477394417713152

We're 1 and 11.  The last thing we need is bulletin board material.

Quote from: redstorm212 on February 08, 2018, 01:26:55 PM

We'd have to run the table, and lose in the BET championship game to get an at large bid. And even then we'd probably be a bubble team.

so you think if we run the table and lose in BET with a 21-14 record with wins over Duke Nova, seton hall, butler, 2x Marq and Nebraska and say hypothetical (Depaul, Xavier and Creighton) in big east tourney and lose nova in championship we would be still only bubble? i think thats more like a lock 11-1 last 12 games....again what are chances that happens or we do that but hey its fun to dream!!

I think it would be very tough to overcome a losing conference record. Has there ever been a team with a losing conference record that was considered much more than a bubble team?

Coach will be on the Michael Kay Show at 4:30