Grading the coaching staff

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Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #60 on: March 09, 2018, 11:23:58 AM »
Mullin couldn’t be bothered with this. Our players don’t shake hands because their feelings were hurt. Where is the leadership?

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/college/st-john-routed-xavier-big-east-tournament-quarterfinals-article-1.3863498
Mullin shook hands yesterday. Didn’t say good game. Walked down the line. Didn’t move his mouth once.

You’d rather him say shit about the others teams players? What’s your point here

Coach K would have gone up to kid who dunked and called him out on it. He has done it before.
Mullin did nothing wrong. They would have said he was a sore loser if he said something to Mack.
Agreeing with you Mase

Lol no caveat needed. I had a ton of respect for Mack. His teams are #$%^ing great and tough as hell. But that shit he pulled after the game was bullshit. You see gates talking shit to Bashir as he’s walking by. Regardless of how he felt he came off as real peice of shit pointing fingers.
*wipes ketchup from his eyes* - I guess Heinz sight isn’t 20/20.

TONYD3

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Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #61 on: March 09, 2018, 11:25:09 AM »
Mullin couldn’t be bothered with this. Our players don’t shake hands because their feelings were hurt. Where is the leadership?

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/college/st-john-routed-xavier-big-east-tournament-quarterfinals-article-1.3863498
Mullin shook hands yesterday. Didn’t say good game. Walked down the line. Didn’t move his mouth once.

You’d rather him say shit about the others teams players? What’s your point here
I found it odd. Wojo wasn’t happy. He said good game

TONYD3

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Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #62 on: March 09, 2018, 11:28:56 AM »
I like the way Xavier plays. I think Mack is a great coach. They play great defense. They don’t give up easy Baskets. Their players are tough. Number 0 is a dick, teams need dicks.

Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #63 on: March 09, 2018, 11:31:54 AM »
Mullin couldn’t be bothered with this. Our players don’t shake hands because their feelings were hurt. Where is the leadership?

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/college/st-john-routed-xavier-big-east-tournament-quarterfinals-article-1.3863498
Mullin shook hands yesterday. Didn’t say good game. Walked down the line. Didn’t move his mouth once.

You’d rather him say shit about the others teams players? What’s your point here
I found it odd. Wojo wasn’t happy. He said good game

Got ya. I think coaches should not be petty. Would like it if he said good game. Would like Mack to act like a #$%^ing adult as well.
*wipes ketchup from his eyes* - I guess Heinz sight isn’t 20/20.

TONYD3

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Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #64 on: March 09, 2018, 11:34:28 AM »
Mullin couldn’t be bothered with this. Our players don’t shake hands because their feelings were hurt. Where is the leadership?

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/college/st-john-routed-xavier-big-east-tournament-quarterfinals-article-1.3863498
Mullin shook hands yesterday. Didn’t say good game. Walked down the line. Didn’t move his mouth once.

You’d rather him say shit about the others teams players? What’s your point here
I found it odd. Wojo wasn’t happy. He said good game

Got ya. I think coaches should not be petty. Would like it if he said good game. Would like Mack to act like a #$%^ing adult as well.
Didn’t see any of that. Or anything on tv. I was at the garden all day. So I missed mack’s Interview.

Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #65 on: March 09, 2018, 11:35:38 AM »
I like the way Xavier plays. I think Mack is a great coach. They play great defense. They don’t give up easy Baskets. Their players are tough. Number 0 is a dick, teams need dicks.

Yeah they started that Cincy fight because they were up big and started talking. Then they got beat up. Big goofy white Center got punched and the two little guards they had got beat up. If guys on our team acted like that people would complain.

Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #66 on: March 09, 2018, 11:43:45 AM »
Vaccaro nails it.  For a guy with a .388 winning percentage he probably has more job security than any coach in the country.  And that's fine, FOR NOW. But it needs to start changing next year.  Again 2 year plan.  First become relevant next year and then be right there with X and Nova in year 5. 

Absolutely no reason for SJU not to be in that position a year from now.  And I think Chris Mullin would agree.

https://nypost.com/2018/03/08/its-desperately-time-for-st-johns-to-be-great-again/
You keep saying that . Why do you think improvement is coming?

Let's be clear I am repeating what I was told, that is the expectation.  I didn't say I personally was that optimistic or pessimistic.

There is no excuse to be in the 4th year at SJU and still be a country mile behind Villanova.  Not when you fired the previous guy because he could not get you over the hump with regards to that.  That is why the expectations are getting JACKED up next year.  And they should.   You want to make excuses about Lovett fine.  But that is gone now.  He wouldn't have been here past this year anyway.

That is what Vaccaro is saying, this 4th year is pivotal for a program that even Vac agrees should not be a second tier program in its own conference.  No way.  Again you fired the last guy because you thought he was not going to get you there (and that is absolutely reasonable).  There is no need to keep making excuses for the next guy because his name is Chris Mullin.

If you are asking me personally do I think they have enough talent to make a sizable leap next year, I have my own questions about that.  I definitely think they should improve but he needs to make SERIOUS improvement.
I agree with your outlook entirely.  The team has to make the tournament next year, and I don't see a roster loaded with superior talent.  Perhaps very good, but definitely not exceptional.

But to dismiss the Lovett departure as a footnote on the season, and therefore the perception of the program's trajectory, seems unfair to Mullin (who should rightly shoulder the blame in other departments).  If Kyron Cartwright missed the whole season, Providence wouldn't make the tournament, for example.  Same with, say, Carrington/Seton Hall and Foster/Creighton.  Lovett was an absolutely critical piece of the puzzle for this season.  We built the team around having two dynamic guards and, like most other teams would, struggled to adjust on the fly.  Mullin is responsible for the backup plan for key players, and he clearly whiffed.   Winning programs have either depth, a system that does not rely on spectacular talents, or both.  I doubt we'll be in that position next year even if everybody returns.  So lots of wood left to chop, and the pressure is on.

I did not dismiss the Lovett injury.  And if Mullin were getting fired based on this year then you can make it more of an excuse.  The fact that he is not getting fired should tell you that he is already getting the benefit of the doubt on that issue.  What else do you want?  Do you think he deserves a 10 year extension?   And if you think I am kidding Pitt just fired an established coach who inherited a program sliding, a roster about to implode and this year lost several key players including his best player Ryan Luther.  That coach got exactly 2 years and had a $9.4 million buyout...And he was canned.

Again regardless of what excuse you want to give for the 4-14 league record everyone agrees that he needs to take a BIG step up next year.  Year 4 was always going to be a huge year the difference is many of us thought the improvement would come from say a 9-9 type THIRD season with at least an NIT bid. 
Even if Lovett played this season, there was no way Mullin was getting fired with 16 wins.  The financial commitment made by the university, and the optics around canning the most famous individual to ever attend the university, rendered that an impossibility unless the program regressed to the extreme that Pitt did under Kevin Stallings.

Stallings won zero conference games in his second year.  They finished with a KenPom rank of 227 after finishing 79th in his first year.  By comparison, Mullin has improved markedly each year: 211 in 2016, 99 in 2017, 79 in 2018. 

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Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #67 on: March 09, 2018, 12:22:35 PM »
I like the way Xavier plays. I think Mack is a great coach. They play great defense. They don’t give up easy Baskets. Their players are tough. Number 0 is a dick, teams need dicks.

Yeah they started that Cincy fight because they were up big and started talking. Then they got beat up. Big goofy white Center got punched and the two little guards they had got beat up. If guys on our team acted like that people would complain.
What does that have to do with Xavier Basketball? If it’s even all true

Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #68 on: March 09, 2018, 12:28:07 PM »
I like the way Xavier plays. I think Mack is a great coach. They play great defense. They don’t give up easy Baskets. Their players are tough. Number 0 is a dick, teams need dicks.

Yeah they started that Cincy fight because they were up big and started talking. Then they got beat up. Big goofy white Center got punched and the two little guards they had got beat up. If guys on our team acted like that people would complain.
What does that have to do with Xavier Basketball? If it’s even all true

Even if you don't like Mullin or are unhappy with the results Xavier has a history of this,  Macura is the most annoying player in the country, 99% of teams wouldn't have dunked on last possession and Mack blaming ST John's was horse shit..

TONYD3

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Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #69 on: March 09, 2018, 12:47:36 PM »
I like the way Xavier plays. I think Mack is a great coach. They play great defense. They don’t give up easy Baskets. Their players are tough. Number 0 is a dick, teams need dicks.

Yeah they started that Cincy fight because they were up big and started talking. Then they got beat up. Big goofy white Center got punched and the two little guards they had got beat up. If guys on our team acted like that people would complain.
What does that have to do with Xavier Basketball? If it’s even all true

Even if you don't like Mullin or are unhappy with the results Xavier has a history of this,  Macura is the most annoying player in the country, 99% of teams wouldn't have dunked on last possession and Mack blaming ST John's was horse shit..
You guys forget. It was “Rucker Park at Carnesecca “ when we destroyed Nebraska. Don’t remember much let up. Plenty of dunks. Plenty of showboating.

Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #70 on: March 09, 2018, 12:55:23 PM »
Vaccaro nails it.  For a guy with a .388 winning percentage he probably has more job security than any coach in the country.  And that's fine, FOR NOW. But it needs to start changing next year.  Again 2 year plan.  First become relevant next year and then be right there with X and Nova in year 5. 

Absolutely no reason for SJU not to be in that position a year from now.  And I think Chris Mullin would agree.

https://nypost.com/2018/03/08/its-desperately-time-for-st-johns-to-be-great-again/
You keep saying that . Why do you think improvement is coming?

Let's be clear I am repeating what I was told, that is the expectation.  I didn't say I personally was that optimistic or pessimistic.

There is no excuse to be in the 4th year at SJU and still be a country mile behind Villanova.  Not when you fired the previous guy because he could not get you over the hump with regards to that.  That is why the expectations are getting JACKED up next year.  And they should.   You want to make excuses about Lovett fine.  But that is gone now.  He wouldn't have been here past this year anyway.

That is what Vaccaro is saying, this 4th year is pivotal for a program that even Vac agrees should not be a second tier program in its own conference.  No way.  Again you fired the last guy because you thought he was not going to get you there (and that is absolutely reasonable).  There is no need to keep making excuses for the next guy because his name is Chris Mullin.

If you are asking me personally do I think they have enough talent to make a sizable leap next year, I have my own questions about that.  I definitely think they should improve but he needs to make SERIOUS improvement.
I agree with your outlook entirely.  The team has to make the tournament next year, and I don't see a roster loaded with superior talent.  Perhaps very good, but definitely not exceptional.

But to dismiss the Lovett departure as a footnote on the season, and therefore the perception of the program's trajectory, seems unfair to Mullin (who should rightly shoulder the blame in other departments).  If Kyron Cartwright missed the whole season, Providence wouldn't make the tournament, for example.  Same with, say, Carrington/Seton Hall and Foster/Creighton.  Lovett was an absolutely critical piece of the puzzle for this season.  We built the team around having two dynamic guards and, like most other teams would, struggled to adjust on the fly.  Mullin is responsible for the backup plan for key players, and he clearly whiffed.   Winning programs have either depth, a system that does not rely on spectacular talents, or both.  I doubt we'll be in that position next year even if everybody returns.  So lots of wood left to chop, and the pressure is on.

I did not dismiss the Lovett injury.  And if Mullin were getting fired based on this year then you can make it more of an excuse.  The fact that he is not getting fired should tell you that he is already getting the benefit of the doubt on that issue.  What else do you want?  Do you think he deserves a 10 year extension?   And if you think I am kidding Pitt just fired an established coach who inherited a program sliding, a roster about to implode and this year lost several key players including his best player Ryan Luther.  That coach got exactly 2 years and had a $9.4 million buyout...And he was canned.

Again regardless of what excuse you want to give for the 4-14 league record everyone agrees that he needs to take a BIG step up next year.  Year 4 was always going to be a huge year the difference is many of us thought the improvement would come from say a 9-9 type THIRD season with at least an NIT bid. 
Even if Lovett played this season, there was no way Mullin was getting fired with 16 wins.  The financial commitment made by the university, and the optics around canning the most famous individual to ever attend the university, rendered that an impossibility unless the program regressed to the extreme that Pitt did under Kevin Stallings.

Stallings won zero conference games in his second year.  They finished with a KenPom rank of 227 after finishing 79th in his first year.  By comparison, Mullin has improved markedly each year: 211 in 2016, 99 in 2017, 79 in 2018. 


I tend to agree but who cares about the 0 conference wins by Stallings.  Mullin started 0-11 in year 3.  And Jim Christian went 0-18 in year 2 did not get fired.

My larger point was asking for a serious bump in YEAR 4 is not much to ask since a coach with a HUGE financial commitment, 9 4 million buyout, was just canned even though he was given almost no opportunity to get his players recruited and coached.  That's my point.  The same arguments people were making for why year 4 under Mullin should be where we really judge him since he will have a full roster of HIS players.

Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #71 on: March 09, 2018, 12:56:20 PM »
I like the way Xavier plays. I think Mack is a great coach. They play great defense. They don’t give up easy Baskets. Their players are tough. Number 0 is a dick, teams need dicks.

Yeah they started that Cincy fight because they were up big and started talking. Then they got beat up. Big goofy white Center got punched and the two little guards they had got beat up. If guys on our team acted like that people would complain.
What does that have to do with Xavier Basketball? If it’s even all true

Even if you don't like Mullin or are unhappy with the results Xavier has a history of this,  Macura is the most annoying player in the country, 99% of teams wouldn't have dunked on last possession and Mack blaming ST John's was horse shit..
You guys forget. It was “Rucker Park at Carnesecca “ when we destroyed Nebraska. Don’t remember much let up. Plenty of dunks. Plenty of showboating.


When ST John's is leading at end of games they don't shoot. Kid dunked with 3 seconds left.

Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #72 on: March 09, 2018, 12:58:39 PM »
I like the way Xavier plays. I think Mack is a great coach. They play great defense. They don’t give up easy Baskets. Their players are tough. Number 0 is a dick, teams need dicks.

Yeah they started that Cincy fight because they were up big and started talking. Then they got beat up. Big goofy white Center got punched and the two little guards they had got beat up. If guys on our team acted like that people would complain.
What does that have to do with Xavier Basketball? If it’s even all true

Even if you don't like Mullin or are unhappy with the results Xavier has a history of this,  Macura is the most annoying player in the country, 99% of teams wouldn't have dunked on last possession and Mack blaming ST John's was horse shit..
You guys forget. It was “Rucker Park at Carnesecca “ when we destroyed Nebraska. Don’t remember much let up. Plenty of dunks. Plenty of showboating.


Couple of differences there I think. In the beginning of the season with a new team you want to make a statement. There were 4 dunks in the last 4 minutes and two of those were off steals/fastbreaks. You think Simon isn't going to want to show off on his 3rd game with a  new team. Just a bad comparison.

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Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #73 on: March 09, 2018, 01:00:59 PM »
I like the way Xavier plays. I think Mack is a great coach. They play great defense. They don’t give up easy Baskets. Their players are tough. Number 0 is a dick, teams need dicks.

Yeah they started that Cincy fight because they were up big and started talking. Then they got beat up. Big goofy white Center got punched and the two little guards they had got beat up. If guys on our team acted like that people would complain.
What does that have to do with Xavier Basketball? If it’s even all true

Even if you don't like Mullin or are unhappy with the results Xavier has a history of this,  Macura is the most annoying player in the country, 99% of teams wouldn't have dunked on last possession and Mack blaming ST John's was horse shit..
You guys forget. It was “Rucker Park at Carnesecca “ when we destroyed Nebraska. Don’t remember much let up. Plenty of dunks. Plenty of showboating.


When ST John's is leading at end of games they don't shoot. Kid dunked with 3 seconds left.
If you don’t want him to dunk stop him. Players quit by that time. Coach was sitting. Game ended with us still having 2 timeouts. Last 2 years we get killed on Thursday. Fan base is mad the other team piled on. Sad

Foad

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Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #74 on: March 09, 2018, 01:02:18 PM »
You guys forget. It was “Rucker Park at Carnesecca “ when we destroyed Nebraska. Don’t remember much let up. Plenty of dunks. Plenty of showboating.

St John's scored 13 points in the last 10 minutes of the Nebraska game.

Tha Kid

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Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #75 on: March 09, 2018, 01:15:49 PM »
I don’t agree w end game showboating but I also feel:

1) if you don’t like getting showboated against, play better so they can’t.
2) if you showboat at end of blowout, be prepared to get laid out.
"I drink and I know things"

Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #76 on: March 09, 2018, 01:19:56 PM »
I like the way Xavier plays. I think Mack is a great coach. They play great defense. They don’t give up easy Baskets. Their players are tough. Number 0 is a dick, teams need dicks.

Yeah they started that Cincy fight because they were up big and started talking. Then they got beat up. Big goofy white Center got punched and the two little guards they had got beat up. If guys on our team acted like that people would complain.
What does that have to do with Xavier Basketball? If it’s even all true

Even if you don't like Mullin or are unhappy with the results Xavier has a history of this,  Macura is the most annoying player in the country, 99% of teams wouldn't have dunked on last possession and Mack blaming ST John's was horse shit..
You guys forget. It was “Rucker Park at Carnesecca “ when we destroyed Nebraska. Don’t remember much let up. Plenty of dunks. Plenty of showboating.


When ST John's is leading at end of games they don't shoot. Kid dunked with 3 seconds left.
If you don’t want him to dunk stop him. Players quit by that time. Coach was sitting. Game ended with us still having 2 timeouts. Last 2 years we get killed on Thursday. Fan base is mad the other team piled on. Sad

When I was in College we were losing like 12-2 to Seton Hall as I was sitting on the bench nursing a hangover. In the last inning a guy on their team wasn't be held on and stole 2nd. Our coach starts screaming at their coach who was an ass and wound up getting fired for being an ass and his response was" If you don't like it stop them from getting on base". The next pitch from our pitcher hit their best player in his shoulder blade.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2018, 01:21:17 PM by we are sju »

Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #77 on: March 09, 2018, 01:21:21 PM »
I don’t agree w end game showboating but I also feel:

1) if you don’t like getting showboated against, play better so they can’t.
2) if you showboat at end of blowout, be prepared to get laid out.

Agree with that 100%. Dude should've been put on the floor on those last few dunks.

Poison

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Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #78 on: March 09, 2018, 01:27:30 PM »
Mullin couldn’t be bothered with this. Our players don’t shake hands because their feelings were hurt. Where is the leadership?

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/college/st-john-routed-xavier-big-east-tournament-quarterfinals-article-1.3863498

Chris Mack is a peeping Tom
Pointer and Obekpa repeatedly took cheap shots at guys. Where was the leadership?

Where did I say that Pointer and Obekpa provided leadership? Lavin wasn’t the answer. Mullin is f’ing terrible. This thread isn’t about Steve Lavin. It’s about the only coach in the BE arrogant enough to think he could do a job w zero experience.

You asked where was leadership with guys getting angry about a team dunking at the buzzer in a 25 point loss that ended their season. Most normal guys would get mad at that.
Team has shown slight progress every year. Once they decided to let Lavin go they started over. If Lovett had not quit we would be in NIT. If they don't make the NCAA next year gripe away. Pretty sure you, Tony and others are hoping we are not good next year so you can say I told you so. 


Blaming LoVett is pathetic. LoVett didn’t do a horrible job building this roster. I wanted a real coach. If you’re happy with this shit, good for you. They can give him an extension to be Chris Mullin.

And there’s no I told you so next year. I’m telling you that now. I never signed up for a 4 year rebuild.

He quit if he didn't quit and we won 2 more games I would have given Mullin a B

You've come up with that how? He had a knee injury, and didn't play. That knee is worth more than a degree from St.John's.

Re: Grading the coaching staff
« Reply #79 on: March 09, 2018, 01:30:12 PM »
Mullin couldn’t be bothered with this. Our players don’t shake hands because their feelings were hurt. Where is the leadership?

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/college/st-john-routed-xavier-big-east-tournament-quarterfinals-article-1.3863498

Chris Mack is a peeping Tom
Pointer and Obekpa repeatedly took cheap shots at guys. Where was the leadership?

Where did I say that Pointer and Obekpa provided leadership? Lavin wasn’t the answer. Mullin is f’ing terrible. This thread isn’t about Steve Lavin. It’s about the only coach in the BE arrogant enough to think he could do a job w zero experience.

You asked where was leadership with guys getting angry about a team dunking at the buzzer in a 25 point loss that ended their season. Most normal guys would get mad at that.
Team has shown slight progress every year. Once they decided to let Lavin go they started over. If Lovett had not quit we would be in NIT. If they don't make the NCAA next year gripe away. Pretty sure you, Tony and others are hoping we are not good next year so you can say I told you so. 


Blaming LoVett is pathetic. LoVett didn’t do a horrible job building this roster. I wanted a real coach. If you’re happy with this shit, good for you. They can give him an extension to be Chris Mullin.

And there’s no I told you so next year. I’m telling you that now. I never signed up for a 4 year rebuild.

He quit if he didn't quit and we won 2 more games I would have given Mullin a B

You've come up with that how? He had a knee injury, and didn't play. That knee is worth more than a degree from St.John's.

He quit. I liked Lovett but he was no longer hurt. I am pretty sure you know this too, but if you don't he wasn't for awhile.