I'm mostly in the middle of the whole Mullin thing but you are exaggerating things in the opposite direction or are purposely misrepresenting the situation but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.
Gosh thanks, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt too as to who's purposefully misrepresenting, so I won't call you a liar yet as you've called me or a cunt as I might end up calling you later. Hold your breath. Let's see how the evening unfolds.
Just because Christian Jones and Damien Williams graduated doesn't mean they didn't transfer. It is called grad transfer for a reason, because it's a transfer. They were here in school, still had eligibility remaining and went to another school to complete that eligibility. That's a transfer.
Yeah possibly, it might be called a grad transfer because it's a transfer or it might be called a grad transfer because they graduated. Let's google and see what turns up. Huh. Here's an article that disagrees with you. It's in Forbes (that's a newspaper) and it's called "Why It's Wrong to Call Graduate Transfers in College Sports Transfers"
https://www.forbes.com/sites/bdavidridpath/2015/09/04/graduate-transfers-in-college-sports-even-calling-them-transfers-is-wrong/#5e6963eb4a2c
WTF. Evidently Forbes thinks you're full of shit. Those bastards.
Oddly the NCAA doesn't count players who graduate and thereafter transfer against the APR - that's an advanced analytic the NCAA uses to gauge a school's academic progress for its student athletes - and in fact transferring following graduating is benefical to APR because the player has - wait for it - graduated. Still, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt as to whether you're purposefully misrepresenting reality, or as I like to cal it, lying out your ass. Because maybe you're just woefully misinformed. Without further data I hesitate to call you stupid or a liar, as you've called me.
I'm not saying they were good or bad but they transferred. That plus Ellison and Sima equals 4 transfers. That's still actually probably less than the D1 average but those guys are transfers. Those combined with the other guys leaving well before the staff had planned for them to leave is a very concerning trend
You're very concerned about me "exaggerating." Poster A says nine guys transferred - and he qualifies that but saying that he was only talking about Mullin's players. I correct the record, saying no, two guys transferred. You extend the definition of transfer to include players who graduated and transfered and include players who weren't Mullin's which taking into that account means four players transferred. So I said two and you say four and he said nine and your problem is with me. I know that you're into all this advanced math I'm not capable of understanding but 2 versus a sketchy 4 versus 9, you might want to call the other gut on the carpet before me. Unless you're a cunt obviously, in which case never mind.
Yeah, the first source I go to when I think about college basketball is an opinion piece by a dude at Forbes. I don't exactly how APR works but I'd think that players that transfer from a school after a semester in good academic standing don't hurt that program's APR either. If it did, every program in the country would have APR issues as there will probably be 1,000 D1 transfers this year.
I didn't call the guy you were responding to a liar or an idiot because you did a pretty good job of doing that yourself. If you wan't to not count Jones because he was a Lavin guy that's one thing, but Williams was a Mullin guy and transferred away when all indications were the staff wanted him to stay. If that wasn't the case and the staff pushed him out then I apologize but Williams was a Mullin guy that transferred.
Anyway, that's all semantics. The hard anti-Mullin people are exaggerating one way and the pro-Mullin guys are doing the opposite. The point is the players leaving this program has been very concerning. You say it's not a big deal because it's only 2 transfers and Mullin can't be blamed for the guys that "went pro". Well the fact is that once Yakwe leaves Mullin's entire 6 man initial recruiting class left before their eligibility expired. So instead of me calling you a cunt, I'll try to have an actual discussion. Please tell me if you disagree with my assessment of how much each player can be counted against the staff, relatively speaking.
Lovett - He wasn't supposed to be here long originally and his true colors showed this year. This one is not on Mullin at all.
Sima - Was supposed to be one of the building blocks. Got plenty of PT in his first year and a half and wasn't recruited over. This one definitely counts against the staff.
Yakwe - Showed promise in his Freshman season but then regressed drastically the rest of his time here. Him moving on is the obvious decision for both sides. Won't totally count this one against the staff but his regression was concerning.
Williams - A guy that would have had a role on this team this year that chose to leave. Was brought in by this staff. I count this one against the staff.
Ellison - Probably would have had a role this year but felt he got recruited over. Instead chose to go and sit out a year at one of the few power conference programs that's more of a dumpster fire than this one. This is a half count against the staff to me.
Mussini - Definitely got his fair share of minutes his first couple of years here and that would have continued into this year. I don't think the staff only wanted him for 2 years here just to see him leave when he finally had players around him capable of getting him open shots. His two years here didn't really improve his pro stock in Italy so I count this one against the staff.
Freudenberg - Left after one year of not playing much. Everybody knew he would be a project and wasn't going to play much in year 1 anyway. Staff wouldn't have spent time and resources recruiting him from Germany and brought him here if the plan was for him to play minimal minutes and then leave after one year. Another guy who left despite his stock not yet improving. This one is definitely on the staff.
So yes, the guys that count Rysheed and Obekpa in that are definitely either exaggerating, misrepresenting, idiots or all 3. But to me, to say this hasn't been a problem because the guys that graduated or went pro don't count against the staff is almost equally stupid. That said, I realize Mullin isn't going anywhere and unlike some others here I am rooting for him to succeed and think he still has a chance to. I'm willing to see how the roster shakes out over the spring before entering complete panic mode over yet another defection, but this massive amount of defections are definitely concerning and unsustainable for a program like ours.