SJU season prediction

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Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #20 on: November 04, 2008, 08:57:28 AM »
Sorry but I can not see this team winning more than 15 games in this loaded conference. Roberts will probably not survive another sub .500 season either.  He had better pray that Mason stays healthy for the entire season, which incidentily he has yet to do his entire career at st. johns.

14-16, 6-12, no postseason, new coach.

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #21 on: November 04, 2008, 02:30:57 PM »
Agree.  I see a split in the NIT.  If they perchance win both in Boston (BC isn't THAT strong this year)  they likely lose both in NY.  In fact if they lose one in Boston they have a better chance at going 3-1 (while reducing the SOS for the RPI) but that's not likely as they will likely end up facing Davidson.  Agree too with losses to Miami and Duke.  Va-Tech is the game I can go either way on.  They're supposed to be pretty good and MSG offers no home court advantage during BE play much less the Holiday Festival so that game I feel will be the true indicator of the season.  Of course if they don't come into that game 8-2 it may be the make or break game of the season.  So OOC looks like 8-5 or 9-4.

In conference I see 6 likely wins with a chance of stealing 2 more but I don't see how the team, without above average progress from last year, can go .500 in conference play.  If I split it down the middle I see 7-11 in conference with 15-16 or 16-15 overall.

Now if Pitino and Calhoun are serious and SJU is not who we think they are they all bets could be off.  But most of all I'm just looking forward to them rolling the ball out on the floor and playing. 

On a side note Davidson got jobbed being sent to Oklahoma in the Season Tip Off.  They're head and shoulders better than BC and Georgia (both teams that SJU should be competitive with).
Generally, I view you as one of the more level headed and national in scope posters here.

a) Where do you see the marked improvement to the team? Or are you putting your faith simply in the natural maturation of the remaining ball players?

b) Given that we only play South Florida once, how are you accounting for the seven potential wins in the Big East?

c) What did you see last season that would warrant confidence in Malik Boothe? Or do you view the departures of Lawrence and Wright as additions by subtractions?

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #22 on: November 04, 2008, 02:34:35 PM »
Sorry but I can not see this team winning more than 15 games in this loaded conference. Roberts will probably not survive another sub .500 season either.  He had better pray that Mason stays healthy for the entire season, which incidentily he has yet to do his entire career at st. johns.

14-16, 6-12, no postseason, new coach.
He may very well survive another losing season.
What would lead you to believe that there would necessarily be an improvement in standards?

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #23 on: November 04, 2008, 03:07:18 PM »
Agree.  I see a split in the NIT.  If they perchance win both in Boston (BC isn't THAT strong this year)  they likely lose both in NY.  In fact if they lose one in Boston they have a better chance at going 3-1 (while reducing the SOS for the RPI) but that's not likely as they will likely end up facing Davidson.  Agree too with losses to Miami and Duke.  Va-Tech is the game I can go either way on.  They're supposed to be pretty good and MSG offers no home court advantage during BE play much less the Holiday Festival so that game I feel will be the true indicator of the season.  Of course if they don't come into that game 8-2 it may be the make or break game of the season.  So OOC looks like 8-5 or 9-4.

In conference I see 6 likely wins with a chance of stealing 2 more but I don't see how the team, without above average progress from last year, can go .500 in conference play.  If I split it down the middle I see 7-11 in conference with 15-16 or 16-15 overall.

Now if Pitino and Calhoun are serious and SJU is not who we think they are they all bets could be off.  But most of all I'm just looking forward to them rolling the ball out on the floor and playing. 

On a side note Davidson got jobbed being sent to Oklahoma in the Season Tip Off.  They're head and shoulders better than BC and Georgia (both teams that SJU should be competitive with).
Generally, I view you as one of the more level headed and national in scope posters here.

a) Where do you see the marked improvement to the team? Or are you putting your faith simply in the natural maturation of the remaining ball players?

b) Given that we only play South Florida once, how are you accounting for the seven potential wins in the Big East?

c) What did you see last season that would warrant confidence in Malik Boothe? Or do you view the departures of Lawrence and Wright as additions by subtractions?

My OPINIONS on the questions posed:

a)  Even in these days of early entry I still live by the Louie credo.  The best thing about freshmen is they become sophomores.  Not matter if these kids came from Oak Hill, CHSAA or Podunk High the game they were playing before they got to the Big East only vaguely resembles the play they experienced last year.  There will be some improvement by most and more improvement by some and that in and of itself will improve the level of play if not the record.  Given the first line I also think there will be improvement because this year's team will not be relying on frosh anywhere near as much as last year's team though I hope Roberts and Edmondson do get to make contributions.

Also Mase playing for a full year (hopefully) with a year's experience playing with last year's frosh will help.  He may be a somewhat limited player for a BE team's star but he brings more to the table than some give him credit for and he's in a "contract year".   Oh and another big body to throw fouls at opposing big men. 

b)  I said 6 BE wins:  H:  Cincy, Rutgers, USF, SHU  Away:  SHU, Depaul.   Then if the team can steal another one or two, either an upset at MSG or a surprise on the road or both then they achieve my optimistic 8 conference wins. 

c)  I definitely believe Geno = addition by subtraction.  Would like to see a backup PG on the roster but believe that Malik even last year in limited minutes looked far better than Geno at running a team, anticipating play, defending opposing points, getting into the lane, and generally understanding the game.  Did he make freshmen mistakes, of course he did but he's no longer a freshman.  And it's not like Geno was a dead eye shooter so the team won't be missing his scoring too much.  PG is an upgrade and that's the most important position on the floor.

Re Larry I was not a huge fan of though I do believe he would have brought one thing to this team - an outside threat.  But when he wasn't shooting what was he doing?  Answer, not much.  I believe due to the overall lack of talent the past 4 years lots of folks made Larry out to be better than he was.  There's a reason he transferred to the school he did and not a B10 or even MAC or Horizon League team closer to home.  I appreciate all he did for the team the past couple years and would welcome his presence on the team as a designated shooter but he's not JJ Redick and I'm pretty sure if he couldn't start last year he wasn't going to start this year.  I just hope a couple wings can shoot at least 35% from beyond the (new further) arc while playing D and contributing assists at the same time.

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #24 on: November 04, 2008, 03:38:36 PM »
The other bottom-feeders in the Big East are penciling in St. John's as a win. It will be a long year for all three locals in the BE, and Met Area basketball in general (both college and pro).

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #25 on: November 04, 2008, 04:27:57 PM »

Re Larry I was not a huge fan of though I do believe he would have brought one thing to this team - an outside threat.  But when he wasn't shooting what was he doing?  Answer, not much.  I believe due to the overall lack of talent the past 4 years lots of folks made Larry out to be better than he was.  There's a reason he transferred to the school he did and not a B10 or even MAC or Horizon League team closer to home.  I appreciate all he did for the team the past couple years and would welcome his presence on the team as a designated shooter but he's not JJ Redick and I'm pretty sure if he couldn't start last year he wasn't going to start this year.  I just hope a couple wings can shoot at least 35% from beyond the (new further) arc while playing D and contributing assists at the same time.

LW dropped in 9 a night playin severely limited mins on a team that could hardly score.

Larry gonna be missed big time y'all.
Parking only for NYCHA permit holders.

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #26 on: November 04, 2008, 05:38:38 PM »
 iI strongly believe that St.John's will have a season to remember because this team will have four players in double figures this season. Mase, Just, Q, and Rob. The team will win 17+games this year. I know St.John is back Y'all.

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #27 on: November 04, 2008, 05:52:55 PM »
Agree.  I see a split in the NIT.  If they perchance win both in Boston (BC isn't THAT strong this year)  they likely lose both in NY.  In fact if they lose one in Boston they have a better chance at going 3-1 (while reducing the SOS for the RPI) but that's not likely as they will likely end up facing Davidson.  Agree too with losses to Miami and Duke.  Va-Tech is the game I can go either way on.  They're supposed to be pretty good and MSG offers no home court advantage during BE play much less the Holiday Festival so that game I feel will be the true indicator of the season.  Of course if they don't come into that game 8-2 it may be the make or break game of the season.  So OOC looks like 8-5 or 9-4.

In conference I see 6 likely wins with a chance of stealing 2 more but I don't see how the team, without above average progress from last year, can go .500 in conference play.  If I split it down the middle I see 7-11 in conference with 15-16 or 16-15 overall.

Now if Pitino and Calhoun are serious and SJU is not who we think they are they all bets could be off.  But most of all I'm just looking forward to them rolling the ball out on the floor and playing. 

On a side note Davidson got jobbed being sent to Oklahoma in the Season Tip Off.  They're head and shoulders better than BC and Georgia (both teams that SJU should be competitive with).
Generally, I view you as one of the more level headed and national in scope posters here.

a) Where do you see the marked improvement to the team? Or are you putting your faith simply in the natural maturation of the remaining ball players?

b) Given that we only play South Florida once, how are you accounting for the seven potential wins in the Big East?

c) What did you see last season that would warrant confidence in Malik Boothe? Or do you view the departures of Lawrence and Wright as additions by subtractions?

My OPINIONS on the questions posed:

a)  Even in these days of early entry I still live by the Louie credo.  The best thing about freshmen is they become sophomores.  Not matter if these kids came from Oak Hill, CHSAA or Podunk High the game they were playing before they got to the Big East only vaguely resembles the play they experienced last year.  There will be some improvement by most and more improvement by some and that in and of itself will improve the level of play if not the record.  Given the first line I also think there will be improvement because this year's team will not be relying on frosh anywhere near as much as last year's team though I hope Roberts and Edmondson do get to make contributions.

Also Mase playing for a full year (hopefully) with a year's experience playing with last year's frosh will help.  He may be a somewhat limited player for a BE team's star but he brings more to the table than some give him credit for and he's in a "contract year".   Oh and another big body to throw fouls at opposing big men. 

b)  I said 6 BE wins:  H:  Cincy, Rutgers, USF, SHU  Away:  SHU, Depaul.   Then if the team can steal another one or two, either an upset at MSG or a surprise on the road or both then they achieve my optimistic 8 conference wins. 

c)  I definitely believe Geno = addition by subtraction.  Would like to see a backup PG on the roster but believe that Malik even last year in limited minutes looked far better than Geno at running a team, anticipating play, defending opposing points, getting into the lane, and generally understanding the game.  Did he make freshmen mistakes, of course he did but he's no longer a freshman.  And it's not like Geno was a dead eye shooter so the team won't be missing his scoring too much.  PG is an upgrade and that's the most important position on the floor.

Re Larry I was not a huge fan of though I do believe he would have brought one thing to this team - an outside threat.  But when he wasn't shooting what was he doing?  Answer, not much.  I believe due to the overall lack of talent the past 4 years lots of folks made Larry out to be better than he was.  There's a reason he transferred to the school he did and not a B10 or even MAC or Horizon League team closer to home.  I appreciate all he did for the team the past couple years and would welcome his presence on the team as a designated shooter but he's not JJ Redick and I'm pretty sure if he couldn't start last year he wasn't going to start this year.  I just hope a couple wings can shoot at least 35% from beyond the (new further) arc while playing D and contributing assists at the same time.
When you wrote "split down the middle," I assumed that what followed was your ultimate prediction-thus the seven wins reference.

Venturing a guess, I believe we will be favored only in either 4 or 5 BE games.

1) Rutgers returns all 5 starters and brings in a high quality recruiting class, with the notable additions of sharpshooter Rosario and the rugged inside force of Echenique. As with Roberts, it remains to be seen whether Hill is even a good head coach, but he will have an improved and deeper squad. Inman will likely be back from his suspension by the time we play them.

2) Cincy brings in a great class and will be much improved inside (Mike Williams, Yancey Gates, and John Riek :o), but, like DePaul, they've lost three starters. Cashmere Wright should open things up for Vaughan to score at will.

3) Seton Hall's depth and lack of a consistent inside presence should plague them.

4) I'm not in the camp that views Larry Wright as the 2nd coming of Redick, but a 40% 3 point shooter should've been utilized more effectively by this coaching staff-if nothing else but in terms of creating spacing for Burrell and Mason.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2008, 07:53:01 PM by JJ »

peter

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Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #28 on: November 04, 2008, 05:54:32 PM »
iI strongly believe that St.John's will have a season to remember because this team will have four players in double figures this season. Mase, Just, Q, and Rob. The team will win 17+games this year. I know St.John is back Y'all.
Q?!  And Thomas has to get on the floor first.  What about Paris? DJ Kennedy?  I think they are more likely to hit double figures... I don't think Q will be on the floor long enough.

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #29 on: November 04, 2008, 06:21:59 PM »
NTSG - Cashmere Wright tore his ACL and is out for the season.  That certainly helps in the Cincy match up, right?  They don't have a lot of PG depth and forcing Vaughn back there doesn't help them.  As you see I have SJU winning in Carnesecca but losing at Cincy.  I put a lot of faith in the Jungle to make that place a real home court advantage.   :o   Plus while Riek is likely to play he still is not totally cleared unless I missed something (like Cashmere Wright blowing out his knee  ;))

The coaching and play was so bad out of Rutgers and SHU last year that I don't see them high above SJU.  Home court advantage plays out and SHU shuld have imploded by February when we play them on the road but I agree if Rutgers plays to their abilities that game will be tough, especially since it's at the Garden.  Should have made them play at The Lou as well.

Mase shot 38% and Paris 37% from three last year.  If they can maintain or even slightly increase those percentages with the new 20'9" distance that'll be relative improvement.  Larry, besides suspect D, was the worst rebounder on the team and not a great passer.  I also hope Roberts can shoot from out there when playing.

Oh, and I'm always way too optimistic in October.  Talk to me in mid-December and you'll get my rational opinion.



« Last Edit: November 04, 2008, 06:26:24 PM by yankcranker »

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #30 on: November 04, 2008, 06:40:32 PM »
Oh, and I'm always way too optimistic in October.  Talk to me in mid-December and you'll get my rational opinion.

haha..aren't we all.  Everybody gets a clean slate to start the season.
When you're a kid from New York and you do it in New York, that lasts forever!

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #31 on: November 04, 2008, 06:56:01 PM »
NTSG - Cashmere Wright tore his ACL and is out for the season.  That certainly helps in the Cincy match up, right?  They don't have a lot of PG depth and forcing Vaughn back there doesn't help them.  As you see I have SJU winning in Carnesecca but losing at Cincy.  I put a lot of faith in the Jungle to make that place a real home court advantage.   :o   Plus while Riek is likely to play he still is not totally cleared unless I missed something (like Cashmere Wright blowing out his knee  ;))

The coaching and play was so bad out of Rutgers and SHU last year that I don't see them high above SJU.  Home court advantage plays out and SHU shuld have imploded by February when we play them on the road but I agree if Rutgers plays to their abilities that game will be tough, especially since it's at the Garden.  Should have made them play at The Lou as well.

Mase shot 38% and Paris 37% from three last year.  If they can maintain or even slightly increase those percentages with the new 20'9" distance that'll be relative improvement.  Larry, besides suspect D, was the worst rebounder on the team and not a great passer.  I also hope Roberts can shoot from out there when playing.

Oh, and I'm always way too optimistic in October.  Talk to me in mid-December and you'll get my rational opinion.
Sure, I'm usually optimistic as well, but, for some reason,  how last season concluded [both with the mounting losses down the stretch and the preemptive "vote of confidence" after assuring the fan base that they would evaluate Roberts after the season] and the weak incoming class have really dampened my spirits. Hopefully, Coker and Boothe have improved their play enough to complement the core of Mason, Kennedy, and Burrell. I am looking forward to the P-NIT.

peter

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Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #32 on: November 04, 2008, 07:21:10 PM »
NTSG - Cashmere Wright tore his ACL and is out for the season.  That certainly helps in the Cincy match up, right?  They don't have a lot of PG depth and forcing Vaughn back there doesn't help them.  As you see I have SJU winning in Carnesecca but losing at Cincy.  I put a lot of faith in the Jungle to make that place a real home court advantage.   :o   Plus while Riek is likely to play he still is not totally cleared unless I missed something (like Cashmere Wright blowing out his knee  ;))

The coaching and play was so bad out of Rutgers and SHU last year that I don't see them high above SJU.  Home court advantage plays out and SHU shuld have imploded by February when we play them on the road but I agree if Rutgers plays to their abilities that game will be tough, especially since it's at the Garden.  Should have made them play at The Lou as well.

Mase shot 38% and Paris 37% from three last year.  If they can maintain or even slightly increase those percentages with the new 20'9" distance that'll be relative improvement.  Larry, besides suspect D, was the worst rebounder on the team and not a great passer.  I also hope Roberts can shoot from out there when playing.

Oh, and I'm always way too optimistic in October.  Talk to me in mid-December and you'll get my rational opinion.




Mase hit like 41% in conference.  Paris hit 45.5% - though on 10-22 shooting.  So he might be good... or might have been a fluke.

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #33 on: November 05, 2008, 10:46:10 AM »


Mase shot 38% and Paris 37% from three last year.  If they can maintain or even slightly increase those percentages with the new 20'9" distance that'll be relative improvement.  Larry, besides suspect D, was the worst rebounder on the team and not a great passer.  I also hope Roberts can shoot from out there when playing.

Oh, and I'm always way too optimistic in October.  Talk to me in mid-December and you'll get my rational opinion.

I think they will maintain or improve from last year for 3 reasons. The first, Boothe will get them better shots. The second, Burrell will be double teamed down low (and I am assuming he will recognize when this happens and kick it out to the open man). The last reason, I am sure these guys have been hitting the gym/weightroom hard this off season... which will make the extra distance a non factor.

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #34 on: November 05, 2008, 10:49:23 AM »
we will be better and surprisingly better. (even with absence of lw)

pmg911

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Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #35 on: November 05, 2008, 11:36:03 AM »
we will be better and surprisingly better. (even with absence of lw)

Can you elaborate on the areas where you think this will happen..?

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #36 on: November 05, 2008, 12:00:06 PM »
Sorry but I can not see this team winning more than 15 games in this loaded conference. Roberts will probably not survive another sub .500 season either.  He had better pray that Mason stays healthy for the entire season, which incidentily he has yet to do his entire career at st. johns.

14-16, 6-12, no postseason, new coach.
He may very well survive another losing season.
What would lead you to believe that there would necessarily be an improvement in standards?

You could be right. However if the fans, students and even some of the alumni start chanting for Roberts to be fired at both CA and MSG to close out the season. I think he is a goner at that point. The st. johns administration is very image conscious. It is one thing for fans to be calling for his ouster on the net. But it is a whole different ballgame if it happens on a regular basis in our home arena for all to see and hear and for the media to report on a daily basis.

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #37 on: November 05, 2008, 12:33:38 PM »
Sorry but I can not see this team winning more than 15 games in this loaded conference. Roberts will probably not survive another sub .500 season either.  He had better pray that Mason stays healthy for the entire season, which incidentily he has yet to do his entire career at st. johns.

14-16, 6-12, no postseason, new coach.
He may very well survive another losing season.
What would lead you to believe that there would necessarily be an improvement in standards?

You could be right. However if the fans, students and even some of the alumni start chanting for Roberts to be fired at both CA and MSG to close out the season. I think he is a goner at that point. The st. johns administration is very image conscious. It is one thing for fans to be calling for his ouster on the net. But it is a whole different ballgame if it happens on a regular basis in our home arena for all to see and hear and for the media to report on a daily basis.

werent the fans chanting that towards the end of last season?

Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #38 on: November 05, 2008, 01:30:51 PM »
Q reminds me of Richard Hamilton because of strong mid range game, he is going to come off the bench  and give scoring. DJ is going to start because he is griity defender, and he is a fighter. Paris is athletely giften but he is not double figure constantly. If johnnies are able to have six players to score between 6-9 points a game would be welcome. Do not think so.

Poison

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Re: SJU season prediction
« Reply #39 on: November 05, 2008, 01:51:15 PM »

Re Larry I was not a huge fan of though I do believe he would have brought one thing to this team - an outside threat.  But when he wasn't shooting what was he doing?  Answer, not much.  I believe due to the overall lack of talent the past 4 years lots of folks made Larry out to be better than he was.  There's a reason he transferred to the school he did and not a B10 or even MAC or Horizon League team closer to home.  I appreciate all he did for the team the past couple years and would welcome his presence on the team as a designated shooter but he's not JJ Redick and I'm pretty sure if he couldn't start last year he wasn't going to start this year.  I just hope a couple wings can shoot at least 35% from beyond the (new further) arc while playing D and contributing assists at the same time.

LW dropped in 9 a night playin severely limited mins on a team that could hardly score.

Larry gonna be missed big time y'all.

He will be missed if only because he's capable of shooting, and we have no returning legit threat.
However, Wright hit a lot of his threes when we were down by 25. He was given a chance, and he really didn't get it done against the good teams.