What has Norm done well?

I want this thread to be a DETAILED list of all the things the Normies --- or anyone --- thinks Norm does well as a Division 1 head coach.  Let's put the situation he came into aside for the moment, and let's also put all of his negatives to the side for a moment.  What does Norm do WELL as our head coach?

I'll start:  He works tirelessly.

he "cleaned up the program"

he's a nice guy.

Now, don't call me a "Normie" (is this a thread to out Norm defenders?  Who are nearly non-existent?) - but I think he has uncovered a little talent in Sean Evans and Burrell before other coaches got on them.  Whether they are developed fully is another story.

He is also not a public a-hole. 

I don't think the issue is necessarily "Norm sucks as a Div I coach".  He is probably not a coach for this level in this conference at this time.  Many mid-major shining stars or hot assistants crash at their next level; Norm's performance doesn't mean he can't be an okay coach in the CAA or MAAC, and part of the problem is that Norm Roberts pulled what will now be known as a Sarah Palin - he accepted a job "with no hesitation" that he should have, perhaps, had some hesitation about. 

That's my opinion.  For all we know, some posters may be entirely correct in saying he should be a lifetime assistant.  But those questions are never definitively answered; some people never get the right situation for them.  Is Fran Fraschilla the recruiter and coach he was at Manhattan, or was he the mediocre coach he was at New Mexico?  We may never know.

I like Norm.  I like Norm a lot.  I would just like him better if he coached another school.

First Post!!!

Now, don't call me a "Normie" (is this a thread to out Norm defenders?  Who are nearly non-existent?) - but I think he has uncovered a little talent in Sean Evans and Burrell before other coaches got on them.  Whether they are developed fully is another story.

He is also not a public a-hole. 

I don't think the issue is necessarily "Norm sucks as a Div I coach".  He is probably not a coach for this level in this conference at this time.  Many mid-major shining stars or hot assistants crash at their next level; Norm's performance doesn't mean he can't be an okay coach in the CAA or MAAC, and part of the problem is that Norm Roberts pulled what will now be known as a Sarah Palin - he accepted a job "with no hesitation" that he should have, perhaps, had some hesitation about. 

That's my opinion.  For all we know, some posters may be entirely correct in saying he should be a lifetime assistant.  But those questions are never definitively answered; some people never get the right situation for them.  Is Fran Fraschilla the recruiter and coach he was at Manhattan, or was he the mediocre coach he was at New Mexico?  We may never know.

Taking the St. John's job at the end of Clark's tenure was like taking the Oakland Raiders job.  The program was a shell of its former self and all it had left was a base of its hardcore fans.  The Raiders got Lane Kiffin (youngest head coach in NFL history) the Storm got Norm. 

The Job is not as easy a sell as you might think.  To Norm's credit.  He has represented STJ well in the media.  He has recruited some local talent, he has gone through the NCAA probation and he has come out the other end. 

I am never going to stop supporting the team or Norm.  Call me a Normie, say I'm the problem, but I will still go to the games and still cheer for our boys.

He run a clean ship. He do thing the right way. He carry hisself like a tru gentleman and righteous brother. He is nice to many peeps out there in the land. 

The one thing he does better than  anyone else is LOSE!

despite all his failures, he has people believing he can coach.

despite bringing in spears who had a record and recruiting wiggins who got a record and hiring an assistant who did time, he has people believing he's running a clean program.

despite having mostly out of towners with a couple of token nyc players, he has people believing he's recruiting the city.

norm is the king of the street hustlers.

welcome Norm Wooden great name

To add to what Choz said:

Took over a program whose talent level and recruiting relationships were an utter joke. Improved the talent every year.. which includes something we haven’t seen in a long time – individual kids (not all and not all at the same pace) are improving. The recruiting relationships are being rebuilt and improving every year. The school’s reputation, which was in the toilet, is unbelievably better.

Tailored his coaching to his talent. When it was nonexistent he played one way. Now, with some talent, we’re running. Often good plays and play out of time-outs and half-time.

Doing a very difficult job the right way. And before we hear Baylor! Ohio State! I’ve said for a long time that even Baylor was nowhere near in as bad shape as we were.

And by the way, News.. the assistant did his time. In your mind he still shouldn’t be hired?? And Malik, Justin, Omari are tokens??

gotta add Rob to that list of tokens

To add to what Choz said:

Took over a program whose talent level and recruiting relationships were an utter joke. Improved the talent every year.. which includes something we haven’t seen in a long time – individual kids (not all and not all at the same pace) are improving. The recruiting relationships are being rebuilt and improving every year. The school’s reputation, which was in the toilet, is unbelievably better.

Tailored his coaching to his talent. When it was nonexistent he played one way. Now, with some talent, we’re running. Often good plays and play out of time-outs and half-time.

Doing a very difficult job the right way. And before we hear Baylor! Ohio State! I’ve said for a long time that even Baylor was nowhere near in as bad shape as we were.

And by the way, News.. the assistant did his time. In your mind he still shouldn’t be hired?? And Malik, Justin, Omari are tokens??

If  you are not being sarcastic, this is one of the worst posts I've ever read.  Brought in better talent every year?  Our recruiting class this year consisted of Q and Ty.  That is terrible for Wright State let alone STJ.

lol Not being sarcastic, Mar.. and I'm proud to be even in your top ten!

Norm runs a clean program and the assistances he brought in have strong ties to NY.

Norm does a great job lowering expectations for Fr Harrington

I hate the double posts but I will give the same response.

I know something Norm does well. He doesnt pay his players well, thats something every other coach at St Johns succeeded in

To add to what Choz said:

Took over a program whose talent level and recruiting relationships were an utter joke. Improved the talent every year.. which includes something we haven’t seen in a long time – individual kids (not all and not all at the same pace) are improving. The recruiting relationships are being rebuilt and improving every year. The school’s reputation, which was in the toilet, is unbelievably better.

Tailored his coaching to his talent. When it was nonexistent he played one way. Now, with some talent, we’re running. Often good plays and play out of time-outs and half-time.

Doing a very difficult job the right way. And before we hear Baylor! Ohio State! I’ve said for a long time that even Baylor was nowhere near in as bad shape as we were.

And by the way, News.. the assistant did his time. In your mind he still shouldn’t be hired?? And Malik, Justin, Omari are tokens??

First and most important..  if you think that the coaches in the city thinking Norm is a good guy means the "recruiting relationships" are repaired you are sorely mistaken. Multiple coaches in the CHSAA would never ever send a top player to Norm.

Baylor had a player on their team MURDER another player and the coach trying to blatantly cover up paying players. Do you really think the situation St. John's was worse than that.?

Malik has shown himself to NOT be a Big East player, Justin Burrell, while from the Bronx, is not a city player. He attended school on Long Island and in CT. Omari is a legit recruit but until he actually steps on the courtt for St. John's, he doesn't count.

Lastly, as a selfish fan, I hope Coach Young can get some players here. The reality of the situation is that Norm showed himself desperate to get some connection to recruit city players because he had failed miseribly since the day he started. He didn't hire some guy who was convicted of disorderly condcut or possesion of a little marajiuna. He hired a convicted DRUG DEALER who got caught with 96lbs of pot. Paid his time or not, this guy could not get a job teaching in any school system in America and his record would immediately disqualify him from mulitple professions.

I hate the double posts but I will give the same response.

I know something Norm does well. He doesnt pay his players well, thats something every other coach at St Johns succeeded in

The stipend was legal --- what proof do you have that any other payments were made?  Jarvis paid Keita, yes.  Please detail how Fraschilla, Mahoney, and Looie broke NCAA violations by paying players illegally or stop with this ridiculous accusation.

Quote from: Jacstorm on December 29, 2008, 05:27:09 PM

To add to what Choz said:

Took over a program whose talent level and recruiting relationships were an utter joke. Improved the talent every year.. which includes something we haven’t seen in a long time – individual kids (not all and not all at the same pace) are improving. The recruiting relationships are being rebuilt and improving every year. The school’s reputation, which was in the toilet, is unbelievably better.

Tailored his coaching to his talent. When it was nonexistent he played one way. Now, with some talent, we’re running. Often good plays and play out of time-outs and half-time.

Doing a very difficult job the right way. And before we hear Baylor! Ohio State! I’ve said for a long time that even Baylor was nowhere near in as bad shape as we were.

And by the way, News.. the assistant did his time. In your mind he still shouldn’t be hired?? And Malik, Justin, Omari are tokens??

First and most important..  if you think that the coaches in the city thinking Norm is a good guy means the "recruiting relationships" are repaired you are sorely mistaken. Multiple coaches in the CHSAA would never ever send a top player to Norm.

Baylor had a player on their team MURDER another player and the coach trying to blatantly cover up paying players. Do you really think the situation St. John's was worse than that.?

Malik has shown himself to NOT be a Big East player, Justin Burrell, while from the Bronx, is not a city player. He attended school on Long Island and in CT. Omari is a legit recruit but until he actually steps on the courtt for St. John's, he doesn't count.

Lastly, as a selfish fan, I hope Coach Young can get some players here. The reality of the situation is that Norm showed himself desperate to get some connection to recruit city players because he had failed miseribly since the day he started. He didn't hire some guy who was convicted of disorderly condcut or possesion of a little marajiuna. He hired a convicted DRUG DEALER who got caught with 96lbs of pot. Paid his time or not, this guy could not get a job teaching in any school system in America and his record would immediately disqualify him from mulitple professions.

Can you explain how you know about all the opinions of all the CHSAA coaches?

How has Malik shown he isn't a Big East player?

We praise other schools for their hirings of assistant coaches and administrative  assistants for their connections with certain recruits but when our coach does it we call him desperate. This is clearly what they call a double standard.

Quote from: pmg911 on December 30, 2008, 08:19:16 AM

Quote from: Jacstorm on December 29, 2008, 05:27:09 PM

To add to what Choz said:

Took over a program whose talent level and recruiting relationships were an utter joke. Improved the talent every year.. which includes something we haven’t seen in a long time – individual kids (not all and not all at the same pace) are improving. The recruiting relationships are being rebuilt and improving every year. The school’s reputation, which was in the toilet, is unbelievably better.

Tailored his coaching to his talent. When it was nonexistent he played one way. Now, with some talent, we’re running. Often good plays and play out of time-outs and half-time.

Doing a very difficult job the right way. And before we hear Baylor! Ohio State! I’ve said for a long time that even Baylor was nowhere near in as bad shape as we were.

And by the way, News.. the assistant did his time. In your mind he still shouldn’t be hired?? And Malik, Justin, Omari are tokens??

First and most important..  if you think that the coaches in the city thinking Norm is a good guy means the "recruiting relationships" are repaired you are sorely mistaken. Multiple coaches in the CHSAA would never ever send a top player to Norm.

Baylor had a player on their team MURDER another player and the coach trying to blatantly cover up paying players. Do you really think the situation St. John's was worse than that.?

Malik has shown himself to NOT be a Big East player, Justin Burrell, while from the Bronx, is not a city player. He attended school on Long Island and in CT. Omari is a legit recruit but until he actually steps on the courtt for St. John's, he doesn't count.

Lastly, as a selfish fan, I hope Coach Young can get some players here. The reality of the situation is that Norm showed himself desperate to get some connection to recruit city players because he had failed miseribly since the day he started. He didn't hire some guy who was convicted of disorderly condcut or possesion of a little marajiuna. He hired a convicted DRUG DEALER who got caught with 96lbs of pot. Paid his time or not, this guy could not get a job teaching in any school system in America and his record would immediately disqualify him from mulitple professions.

Can you explain how you know about all the opinions of all the CHSAA coaches?

How has Malik shown he isn't a Big East player?

We praise other schools for their hirings of assistant coaches and administrative  assistants for their connections with certain recruits but when our coach does it we call him desperate. This is clearly what they call a double standard.

If you look at our roster, we have one kid from the CHSAA, Boothe, and many thought he was a reach to go to high major in the first place.  I like Boothe, but I think the situation was too good for his coach to not recommend St. John's. 

If I were a high school coach I would steer just about all of my players away from St. John's, but I would have seen a good fit for Malik with the chance to start four years and possibly play the last 2-3 with a new coach.

Also, I don't see a double-standard with PMG and other posters being mad about hiring a convicted drug felon on the staff when other programs don't have one.  To be a double-standard most variables have to be the same, which they clearly are not here. 

I have no problem hiring somebody who makes one mistake like that and does the time, but guys like PMG and Marco have been pretty consistent on issues like this for years irrespective of the situation or schools/teams involved.