Sorry yo

But I cant feel this W like some y'all is.

What it really do?

Make us close in on the dance? Nah.
Make us close in on the NIT? Nah.
Give us some national recognition? Nah.
Make some in-roads wit NYC's best? Nah.

Give the St. John brass mo of an excuse to keep this here staff fo another year 'stead of spending some cash money on real coaches who know what they doin, who know how to manage a team, who know how to build, who know basic O, who can inspire D, who know how to get the most outta they players?

....Yeah.   

Some peeps love winnin the battles even when they know they losin the war. Never got that myselve.

This ship aint turnin yo. It been six years and this damn ship aint turnin. 

But I cant feel this W like some y'all is.

What it really do?

Make us close in on the dance? Nah.
Make us close in on the NIT? Nah.
Give us some national recognition? Nah.
Make some in-roads wit NYC's best? Nah.

No win is going to do any of that. No loss either. I guess there's no point in playing the games.

Give the St. John brass mo of an excuse to keep this here staff fo another year 'stead of spending some cash money on real coaches who know what they doin, who know how to manage a team, who know how to build, who know basic O, who can inspire D, who know how to get the most outta they players?

....Yeah.   

Some peeps love winnin the battles even when they know they losin the war. Never got that myselve.

This ship aint turnin yo. It been six years and this damn ship aint turnin.

A repulsive post, and disappointing, considering the source. Perhaps you could be happy for the players, who have lately shown some character, when they could have rolled over like a bunch of pussies. They're just kids. You know, like the ones whose welfare you're always bleating about? 

When I got home from dinner, I went to check the final score and, yes i'll admit my initial feeling was one of hollowness. 

I have been a season ticket holder for 25 years and I have to agree with Choz.

The kids are going to play hard and you want to see that and you want them to win, but at the same time you want the program to rise again.

The administration has to realize that winning 2 in a row is not a STREAK nor is it an "excuse" to keep the program going in the same direction

Ya know what, they can go 6-12 in the league, and they could still fire him. What it do-it gives the kids and the fans something to smile about.

A win against a university like ND means something no matter what.

No matter what.

You have to give Norm credit for not loosing the team after the West Virgina game. The team really stayed together and now we have some hope.

You have to give Norm credit for not loosing the team after the West Virgina game. The team really stayed together and now we have some hope.

I wonder if Norm used his famous "Ball up" quote to motivate them.

I'm not convinced Norm motivated anyone.  I think these kids might be really proud and don't want to feel responsible for their coach getting fired so something lit up inside them --- something that Norm couldnt get out of them....similar to Jarvis' players in the 03 season (though maybe that was attributed to Herm edwards who jarvis brought in for motivation since he couldnt do it himself)

for a second i thought i put out a new topic when i saw yo

I agree with Choz, every win is another excuse for them to keep Norm around. And we all know they're looking for any little thing to make him stay, so after the season when we're 4-14 in BE play they'll say, oh well we played well for two games against those two powerhouses ND and L-ville, so that's why we're keeping Norm. Then next year will be the same thing.

You have to give Norm credit for not loosing the team after the West Virgina game. The team really stayed together and now we have some hope.

But the question is...hope for what?

NCAA tourney? No
NIT? No
anything else this season? No
Norm staying next season? yes.

 CBI bubble team

The NIT is certainly within reach.
We have wins over Temple, Siena, Louisville and ND.

Not incredible, but not meaningless either.

The only thing that could keep us out is pathetic scheduling like Bryant, Brown, Fordham and LIU.

Quote from: Choz4Life on February 15, 2010, 09:17:00 AM

But I cant feel this W like some y'all is.

What it really do?

Make us close in on the dance? Nah.
Make us close in on the NIT? Nah.
Give us some national recognition? Nah.
Make some in-roads wit NYC's best? Nah.

No win is going to do any of that. No loss either. I guess there's no point in playing the games.

Quote

Give the St. John brass mo of an excuse to keep this here staff fo another year 'stead of spending some cash money on real coaches who know what they doin, who know how to manage a team, who know how to build, who know basic O, who can inspire D, who know how to get the most outta they players?

....Yeah.   

Some peeps love winnin the battles even when they know they losin the war. Never got that myselve.

This ship aint turnin yo. It been six years and this damn ship aint turnin.

A repulsive post, and disappointing, considering the source. Perhaps you could be happy for the players, who have lately shown some character, when they could have rolled over like a bunch of pussies. They're just kids. You know, like the ones whose welfare you're always bleating about?

Oh man, you got me rollin, son.

Repulsive? Think you outta keep to makin fun of a brother's God-given ears than playin moral barometer.

College ball aint no place fo sentiment. Its straight up big business. Where I feel fo the "kids" is that they is continually bein exploited by not gettin paid. Other than that they is big enough and old enough (and certainly mo thick-skinned) to deal wit the pressures of bein a D1 athlete. Let alone a coach who bring in a half mill evry year.

As for what I do on my time... I dont help the Rob Thomas of the world. I help the Rob Thomas that aint 6'7", that aint got no post moves, that aint a superstar by the time he 14, but still cant read or write and been abandon by his folk. The coaches at St. John, Syracuse, UConn, UNC, Iona or Monroe CC aint gonna come within 90 feet of this kid. 

Later....

-Choz4Life

But I cant feel this W like some y'all is.

What it really do?

Make us close in on the dance? Nah.
Make us close in on the NIT? Nah.
Give us some national recognition? Nah.
Make some in-roads wit NYC's best? Nah.

Give the St. John brass mo of an excuse to keep this here staff fo another year 'stead of spending some cash money on real coaches who know what they doin, who know how to manage a team, who know how to build, who know basic O, who can inspire D, who know how to get the most outta they players?

....Yeah.   

Some peeps love winnin the battles even when they know they losin the war. Never got that myselve.

This ship aint turnin yo. It been six years and this damn ship aint turnin.

Choz, I see where you're coming from.  In all likelihood, this team is not going anywhere this season except the CBI Tournament, with an outside shot at the NIT Tournament.  They are playing 2 winnable games against Seton Hall and South Florida and should definitely take down DePaul in the last game of the season.  But at the end of the day, does anyone really believe they will go .500 the rest of the way?

That being said, I'm glad to see the players still working their tails off out there.  JB is finally coming into his own, averaging 12 PPG and 5 RPG over his last 5 games.  DJ is still holding up his end with 13 PPG and 7 RPG over his last 5 games, although he has to cut down on his turnovers.  And to be honest, yesterday was a very entertaining game, which is what sports is all about.

Will 16 or 17 wins be enough to keep Norm in town?  Who knows?  My guess is yes, due mainly to the fact that I haven't seen this school pull off any good decisions in a long time.  But to be perfectly honest, if 16 or 17 turns out to be good enough, do you really think 14 or 15 would've made a difference?  The school is not blind and they certainly are not deaf.  I'm sure they are aware of what they should do.  But at the end of the day, they are the ones who will make the final decision and they are the ones that will live by it.  If they end up bringing him back, I'm certain ticket sales will once again decline and I'm sure donations will go down even further.  Whether they can accept those consequences is entirely up to them.

for a second i thought i put out a new topic when i saw yo

hahhahaha so did I

The end justifies the means bandwagon continues to gain momentum. What's the next stage - condemn the players for winning and thereby thwarting the cause?
I have no respect for a St. John's "fan" who roots for Notre Dame and is disappointed after we beat them.

The end justifies the means bandwagon continues to gain momentum. What's the next stage - condemn the players for winning and thereby thwarting the cause?
I have no respect for a St. John's "fan" who roots for Notre Dame and is disappointed after we beat them.

QC,

There's a difference in rooting against St. john's rather than rooting for them and seeing what the ND win is  --- a win against a VERY mediocre team who didt have their best player --- and realize that NOTHING should change.

If people had confidence the st johns admin would make the SMART decision no one would even CONSIDER rooting against the team, as a VERY few amount of people are doing....but can you blame them?  Norm should have been fired 2 years ago.  17 wins and they might keep Norm employed...and that is HORRIBLE both for these kids and the long term success of the program.

Like Foad said no one win or one loss is going to change anything.

Like Foad said no one win or one loss is going to change anything.

How do you know that?

At some point perhaps the record becomes tolerable.  It might be at 16 wins, it might be at 17 wins.  If that is the case, then one win could mean the difference. 

If you believe that the admin loves Norm and wants to keep him around at all costs, one win at this stage of the season might make the diff.  We'll never know.

You're right to a degree. I just wouldn't get hung up on one game.

I look at how we play and how I believe we could play as the gauge not really W/L.

If we somehow win 18 games this year, I believe we could/should have won 21/22. To me that is the problem. Could Norm Roberts take us from being bad to average? Yes. Can he turn us into average to good to good to great? There has been no indication of that which is what fans are most upset about.

Repulsive? Think you outta keep to makin fun of a brother's God-given ears than playin moral barometer.

I didn't make fun of anyone's ears. And I don't pretend to be moral. Quite the opposite.

College ball aint no place fo sentiment.

What's all that cheering that goes on about then? And the booing? And the jumping up and down and the rushing the court and kids carrying their coach around on their shoulders and the cutting down of the nets? That's not sentiment? What about how bad you and the rest of the city purportedly feel about SJ sucking? What about all the nauseating jibber jabber about how far this once proud program has fallen? Fact is, it couldn't be more about sentiment, the more maudlin the better.

Its straight up big business. Where I feel fo the "kids" is that they is continually bein exploited by not gettin paid.

Please. They're getting all paid. At SJ they get an education. At Kentucky an education and shoe boxes full of twenties. At Memphis they get an education and shoe boxes full of twenties and a get out of jail free card. Not to mention the trim.

Other than that they is big enough and old enough (and certainly mo thick-skinned) to deal wit the pressures of bein a D1 athlete. Let alone a coach who bring in a half mill evry year.

I'm not talking about what kids are or are not old enough to deal with and I DGAF how much the coach makes. I'm talking about your post, which wishes misfortune on SJ players today lest some other hypothetical players suffer in the future. You can couch it in whatever sort of AAU realpolitik you want, but it is what it is.

As for what I do on my time... I dont help the Rob Thomas of the world. I help the Rob Thomas that aint 6'7", that aint got no post moves, that aint a superstar by the time he 14, but still cant read or write and been abandon by his folk. The coaches at St. John, Syracuse, UConn, UNC, Iona or Monroe CC aint gonna come within 90 feet of this kid.

So you want kudos for your good works while at the same time denying Norm kudos for helping Thomas while also wishing misfortune on Thomas because Norm's not helping Thomas enough to make the NIT. That's even worse than what you wrote originally. If that's your er sentiment, fine, but at least own it.