How many top 50 recruits does Lavin bring in for 2011?

Does Lavin take advantage of the buzz around the program?

I say 2 and a few more between 50 and 100.

I think because Lavin is smart enough to recognize how weak NYC basketball has become, he'll have a much wider range to choose from. I'm going with 3.

But let's clarify here. Top 50 consensus makes sense. So Scout, Rivals, MaxPreps etc and the whoever else has a kid in the top 50. Not a Willie Shaw recruit where he's 30 in SI, and 260 in Rivals.

I think because Lavin is smart enough to recognize how weak NYC basketball has become, he'll have a much wider range to choose from. I'm going with 3.

But let's clarify here. Top 50 consensus makes sense. So Scout, Rivals, MaxPreps etc and the whoever else has a kid in the top 50. Not a Willie Shaw recruit where he's 30 in SI, and 260 in Rivals.

Agreed top 50 consensus.  Average rating among the major services.

I say 3 ...Lavin is motivated to make a splash and I think he will.

Consensus top 50....  I'll go with 3, as well.  I think one, if not two of 'em will be amongst (consensus) the top 30 in the 2011 class.

I know it seems like some of us are jumping the gun and have extraordinary expectations, but I truly believe we'll have a pretty solid 2011 recruiting class.

I think we're setting the bar a little to High for Lavin. He hasn't coached a game in over 5 years.

Lets be real. As of today I know Scout is out of date & we've been
 recently mentioned (Not as favorite) by a few top 50 players but,

Who would not right now sign up for 2 top 50's, 3 50-120, 
2 good JUCO's & save  2 for 2012 (or late 2011 stud) ?

Lets keep expectations grounded, so we can celebrate if 2 (or 3) top 50's committ.

I say expect 1, celebrate if 2, 3 is dreaming right now. But its fun to dream.

I don't know that we're setting a bar.  I won't be disappointed if he doesn't land 3 top 50 guys.  Just hoping he will.

it's not how many top 50 recruits you get going in...it's how many top 50 players you have going out.

with this coaching staff of guys who have proven themselves, some kids who are under the radar will be outstanding if they're around for four years.

we may have a few cedric jacksons coming in...a guy who was lambasted by posters including me...but who was able to blossom under real coaching.

3 top 50s in his first year would be phenomenal...def not holding him to that though

I like the thought of the lone poster who believes Lavin and staff will sign 4-5 top 50 players for the 2011 class.  I wonder who is that particular poster.   

I like the thought of the lone poster who believes Lavin and staff will sign 4-5 top 50 players for the 2011 class.  I wonder who is that particular poster.   

it was manbearpig. manbearpig has big expectations of coach lavin

Quote from: Poison on June 28, 2010, 01:58:31 PM

I think because Lavin is smart enough to recognize how weak NYC basketball has become, he'll have a much wider range to choose from. I'm going with 3.

But let's clarify here. Top 50 consensus makes sense. So Scout, Rivals, MaxPreps etc and the whoever else has a kid in the top 50. Not a Willie Shaw recruit where he's 30 in SI, and 260 in Rivals.

Agreed top 50 consensus.  Average rating among the major services.

I say 3 ...Lavin is motivated to make a splash and I think he will.

You're basically talking hte RSCI rankings.  Their final 2010 list should be out in the next 1-4 weeks.   http://home.roadrunner.com/~rsci/

I think the mindset has to change.   In his seven years at UCLA, Steve Lavin brought in 22 scholarship players.

Here's the talent he signed in his first go-round. The listed rankings from Gadzuric On are the Composite RSCI rankings. The first 6 players  are an average of the   Hoopscoop/Prepstars/Blue Ribbon rankings from 1997 (pre-RSCI):

In 1997 Steve gave out 5 total Rides. In 1998, he gave out 5 more. In 1999 he Gave out 2. In 2000, the gave out 3. in 2001 he gave out 4. In 2002, he gave out 2. And 2003 had 1 recruit. (This isn't counting 4 transfer students - including an RSCI #26 in Brian Morrison, and a #94 in Jon Crispin).

#3 Baron Davis
#5 Schea Cotton
#57 Trevor Reed
#73 Rico Hines
#81 Billy Knight
#99 Todd Ramasar
#4 Dan Gadzuric
#7 Jaron Rusn
#16 Ray Young
#54 Matt Barnes
#75 Jerome Moiso
#10 Jason Kapono
#28 TJ Cummings
#19 Cedric Bozeman
#28 Dijon Thompson
#39 Andre Patterson
#100 Michael Fey
#13 Evans Burns
#19 Trevor Ariza

In otherwords, he brought in 22 freshman Scholarship players in 7 classes.  TWELVE of those players were top 40 or better.  NINETEEN were top 100 talent. And he brought in 4 transfers, 1 of them top 30, bot  2 of them top 100.

21 of 26 recruits were "top 100" talent. Exactly half - 13 of 26 were top 40 or better kids.   

And the remaining five included two future long-term NBA players.  10 year NBA PG Earl Watson (who played out of position at POWER FORWARD in HS - so he wasn't highly ranked) andTimberwolf Center  Ryan Hollins.  Hollins couldn't have been higher ranked in HS - he was a 6'6 Junior in high school = whose sport was track and field, a skinny 6'8 post as a Senior - and as such was out of the top 100.  He was also a year younger than his class - he was a 16 year old senior.  He grew over two inches between Sr. year of high school and frosh season at UCLA.   Then grew 2 1/2 more inches over the next 3 years.  He headed to the pros at almost 7'1.... By the way, he may be the ONLY person in the WORLD who IS seven feet tall, and has competitively JUMPED 7 feet - In addition to basketball, Hollins continued to jump for the Bruin track team as a frosh and Soph.  His personal-bests in the jumps: 7-0.25 (high jump), 22-3 (long jump) and 48-7.50 (triple jump)....

Crgreen:

Why does the mindset have to change?  Lavin brought in 12 top 50s in 7 years for an avg of a little less than 2 per year.  Pretty much everyone is predicting he brings in 2 or 3 top 50 next year.  What's wrong about that?

Crgreen:

Why does the mindset have to change?  Lavin brought in 12 top 50s in 7 years for an avg of a little less than 2 per year.  Pretty much everyone is predicting he brings in 2 or 3 top 50 next year.  What's wrong about that?

It's not a matter of years, but of RIDES.  For 2011 there are NINE avaialable rides (and possibly 10, if Remi has to come in as a 2011 instead of 2010).  Folks are talking 1/5 to 1/4 MIGHT be top 50.    I think t 5 or more out of that class (including transfers) should be EXPECTED.  8 top 100 kids should be EXPECTED.   22 wins and an NCAA bid should be EXPECTED.  A win or two in the Dance should be EXPECTED.    Come 2012, kids making NBA rosters should be EXPECTED.   

Mindset change.

Quote from: Tha Kid on June 29, 2010, 09:11:18 AM

Crgreen:

Why does the mindset have to change?  Lavin brought in 12 top 50s in 7 years for an avg of a little less than 2 per year.  Pretty much everyone is predicting he brings in 2 or 3 top 50 next year.  What's wrong about that?

It's not a matter of years, but of RIDES.  For 2011 there are NINE avaialable rides (and possibly 10, if Remi has to come in as a 2011 instead of 2010).  Folks are talking 1/5 to 1/4 MIGHT be top 50.    I think t 5 or more out of that class (including transfers) should be EXPECTED.  8 top 100 kids should be EXPECTED.   22 wins and an NCAA bid should be EXPECTED.  A win or two in the Dance should be EXPECTED.    Come 2012, kids making NBA rosters should be EXPECTED.   

Mindset change.

Dude Lavin is not going to use all 9 rides next year.  I expect him to use maybe 5-6 on freshmen which would mean based on his averages that 2-3 are top 50, and the rest are top 100.  After those 5-6 freshman, you then have 10 guys on roster when you count stith, quincy roberts, polee, and hopefully barry or another frosh this year.  I would expect then he'd add a transfer or two and/or a juco or two.

5 top 50 kids would  just be amazing...but Steve has never pulled that off in a single year and how many coaches have EVER pulled that off, I wonder? 

I think 2-3 IS changing the mindset.  If this was Norm we'd expect 0 or maybe steal 1 (probably not though).  You can't expect us to EXPECT Lavin will come in and recruit 5 top 50s when that is probably hardly ever done by ANY coach....

Quote from: crgreen on June 29, 2010, 11:00:04 AM

Quote from: Tha Kid on June 29, 2010, 09:11:18 AM

Crgreen:

Why does the mindset have to change?  Lavin brought in 12 top 50s in 7 years for an avg of a little less than 2 per year.  Pretty much everyone is predicting he brings in 2 or 3 top 50 next year.  What's wrong about that?

It's not a matter of years, but of RIDES.  For 2011 there are NINE avaialable rides (and possibly 10, if Remi has to come in as a 2011 instead of 2010).  Folks are talking 1/5 to 1/4 MIGHT be top 50.    I think t 5 or more out of that class (including transfers) should be EXPECTED.  8 top 100 kids should be EXPECTED.   22 wins and an NCAA bid should be EXPECTED.  A win or two in the Dance should be EXPECTED.    Come 2012, kids making NBA rosters should be EXPECTED.   

Mindset change.

Dude Lavin is not going to use all 9 rides next year.  I expect him to use maybe 5-6 on freshmen which would mean based on his averages that 2-3 are top 50, and the rest are top 100.  After those 5-6 freshman, you then have 10 guys on roster when you count stith, quincy roberts, polee, and hopefully barry or another frosh this year.  I would expect then he'd add a transfer or two and/or a juco or two.

5 top 50 kids would  just be amazing...but Steve has never pulled that off in a single year and how many coaches have EVER pulled that off, I wonder? 

I think 2-3 IS changing the mindset.  If this was Norm we'd expect 0 or maybe steal 1 (probably not though).  You can't expect us to EXPECT Lavin will come in and recruit 5 top 50s when that is probably hardly ever done by ANY coach....

Gadz, Rush, Young, Moiso, Barnes - Barnes was #54, Moiso was the #1 Foreign import - The way they compute RSCI today (as opposed to that very first season) Moiso would definately be top 10, not just top 50, and Barnes would have been high 40s

Yes - its POSSIBLE Coach uses only 5 rides.   However, knowing Steve, i just don't see him going into the 2012 season with only 8 scholarship players, which is what he'll have if he only uses 5 of the 10.  I expect at least 5-6 frosh, and we'll see some transfers sitting out this coming year who'll be active on that 2012  squad - I certainly count them torwards the total of signees.....Think there won't be to 50 transfer out there?  From the top 50 2 years ago, if Steve had been here 3 months earlier, Top 50 players who've transferred from that class include Elliott Williams, Mike Rosario, J'misson Morgan, Drew Gordon, Jeff Withy.....And that's just off the top of my head!

There's no way Coach Lavin  is going into a year with less than 10 scholarship players.   And again, its a mindset thing.  You think he should conserve rides, split them over classes.  But if you're bringing in MULTIPLE TOP 50 players,  you're not worrying about  conserving Rides  - Half the rides you use will be kids gone to the pros in a year or two. 

If you'd had 10 available rides 2 years ago, had Lavin been here and handed them to top 50 kids like Landesberg, Ebanks, Babbitt, Elliott Williams, Willie Warren, Samuels, Deroazan, Monroe, BJ Mullin, Evans, Ed Davis - they'd ALL be gone already.

I never suggested we'd only have 8-10 scholarship players. We will have 4 returnees next year. Add 5-6 frosh and you're' at 9-10. Then I said add 1-2 jucos and 1-2 transfers.

I hope to god your right but 5 top 50s is pie in the sky.

Realistically, I'm expecting zero for this year, but with the outside hope that he'll be able to get as many as two (Sampson, Pelle) of the 25-50 variety. I think he'll be able to be more effective at going after the 2012 and beyond kids. Staffs need some time to build relationships and, with the accelerated nature of recruiting, they're getting in relatively late with this class. He had an excellent track record as a recruiter at UCLA, but, other than being a high-major basketball program in an international city, UCLA and St. John's don't have an enormous amount in common.

but, other than being a high-major basketball program in an international city, UCLA and St. John's don't have an enormous amount in common.

Well, yeah.  Actually they do.  An incredibly important thing in common.   The head coach.

Look around at bhe basketball countryside these days.  Look at the teams who's coaches have moved on this offseason - and look at the number of recruits jumping ship.  Those schools weren't "ideal" one day, and "totally sucked" the next ....Kid's commit to coaches.   Schools are very important, obviously.  But in many cases, of secondary importance to the Coach.   Put it this way.  if coach Lavin were to say today "oops, made a mistake - I'm going back to ESPN",  how fast do you think Remi Barry's back looking at Pac 10 schools only - and how long would it take Dwayne Polee to reopen his recruiting?

Steve Lavin will bring in the bodies.  He's always been a GREAT recruiter, and he's even stronger this 2nd time around, thanks to the support STAFF he's put together.  Virtually every perceived weakness from has last gig has EMPHATICALLY addressed.   Which leaves him free to SELL SELL SELL the St. Johns/Steve Lavin program....

Look around at bhe basketball countryside these days.  Look at the teams who's coaches have moved on this offseason - and look at the number of recruits jumping ship.  Those schools weren't "ideal" one day, and "totally sucked" the next ....Kid's commit to coaches.   Schools are very important, obviously.  But in many cases, of secondary importance to the Coach.   Put it this way.  if coach Lavin were to say today "oops, made a mistake - I'm going back to ESPN",  how fast do you think Remi Barry's back looking at Pac 10 schools only - and how long would it take Dwayne Polee to reopen his recruiting?

Steve Lavin will bring in the bodies.  He's always been a GREAT recruiter, and he's even stronger this 2nd time around, thanks to the support STAFF he's put together.  Virtually every perceived weakness from has last gig has EMPHATICALLY addressed.   Which leaves him free to SELL SELL SELL the St. Johns/Steve Lavin program....

Most coaches have to "earn" their way up the ladder. Lavin was in the fortunate position to begin his head coaching career at UCLA, the coaching equivalent of being given keys to a Bentley. It's difficult to gauge how much credit one can give to the salesman versus the car. In the rare case of Lavin, we have absolutely no track record to base his ability to sell anything other than a Bentley. This isn't the equivalent of Roy Williams leaving Kansas for UNC, swapping one elite program for another. I certainly hope he can sell a Toyota, but this will definitely be a greater test of his ability to recruit.