Two bad losses...

Maybe they were actually a good thing. Maybe the seniors had to be really hit the low point to finally understand that they had to completely embrace Lavin or they would continue to fail. Reminds me of Hoosiers when Coach Dale made the team play with 4 guys rather than put in an insubordinate Rade Butcher. I am not sure how this season plays out record wise but I think the people who need to be are finally on board. I think the last of the Norm was finally free after the Fordham loss and the team can finally move on. Sort of like how you know you will feel better after finally throwing up the last of a bad sausage hero. You know when you finally heave out the last possible thing in your stomach and even though your eyes are blood shot you know you will start to feel better.  That final upchuck was the Fordham game.

In addition to the players I think Lavin has finally figured out who his best players are and has stop experimenting like a kid with a chemistry set. I have to tell you this process took a little longer than I thought. Only issue I still have is not sure why Coker has to play. Burrell should start and play 30 minutes. The only thing Coker brings to the table is the unintentional comedy of watching him wide open calling for the ball only to be ignored. Next game watch how he is posting up only he is not being guarded it pretty amusing.

The bottom line is I think we will be competitive the rest of the way and we finally have an identity. Maybe we have those two losses to thank.

I just wish it was one bad loss that accomplished that.

I just wish it was one bad loss that accomplished that.

I had them losing this game. They just made up for one of them in my book.

Quote from: jumpinjohnny on December 29, 2010, 11:34:29 PM

I just wish it was one bad loss that accomplished that.

I had them losing this game. They just made up for one of them in my book.

Nothing can make up for the loss to fordham. St B's wouldnt have been as bad if it was on the road, but at home, that makes it as inexusable as the fordham loss(home or away).

I love Coker starting. He sets the tone defensively and the offensive focus is set on Brownlee, Hardy and DJ. This also keeps Burrell out of foul trouble early on allowing him to play 30 minutes.

Horne and Burrell change the game dynamically off the bench.

I agree with you though maybe those losses finally hit home and they bought into the system. I love that this team is attacking the basket, being patient on offense (methodical to quote Lavin), and they are playing with defensive awareness.

I love Coker starting. He sets the tone defensively and the offensive focus is set on Brownlee, Hardy and DJ. This also keeps Burrell out of foul trouble early on allowing him to play 30 minutes.

Horne and Burrell change the game dynamically off the bench.

I agree with you though maybe those losses finally hit home and they bought into the system. I love that this team is attacking the basket, being patient on offense (methodical to quote Lavin), and they are playing with defensive awareness.

I agree about Coker, nearly every game that he has started he has gotten into the head of opposing players with his rough style of play, especially Cohen on Davidson.  Essentially he is our goon and I like it a lot. 

Quote from: Dave on December 29, 2010, 11:46:16 PM

I love Coker starting. He sets the tone defensively and the offensive focus is set on Brownlee, Hardy and DJ. This also keeps Burrell out of foul trouble early on allowing him to play 30 minutes.

Horne and Burrell change the game dynamically off the bench.

I agree with you though maybe those losses finally hit home and they bought into the system. I love that this team is attacking the basket, being patient on offense (methodical to quote Lavin), and they are playing with defensive awareness.

I agree about Coker, nearly every game that he has started he has gotten into the head of opposing players with his rough style of play, especially Cohen on Davidson.  Essentially he is our goon and I like it a lot. 

I don't know about the opponents but he certainly got into my head turning a 7 point lead to 3 with a riduculous karate chop foul. Got in Lavin's head as well as he wasn't seen again.

I love Coker starting. He sets the tone defensively and the offensive focus is set on Brownlee, Hardy and DJ. This also keeps Burrell out of foul trouble early on allowing him to play 30 minutes.

Horne and Burrell change the game dynamically off the bench.
.
Totally agree that keeping Burrell out of early foul trouble is real important as we need JB to play big minutes, especially in the second half. Somewhat surprised that Evans could not have taken the role that Coker has now

Quote from: Dave on December 29, 2010, 11:46:16 PM

I love Coker starting. He sets the tone defensively and the offensive focus is set on Brownlee, Hardy and DJ. This also keeps Burrell out of foul trouble early on allowing him to play 30 minutes.

Quote from: Dave on December 29, 2010, 11:46:16 PM

I love Coker starting. He sets the tone defensively and the offensive focus is set on Brownlee, Hardy and DJ. This also keeps Burrell out of foul trouble early on allowing him to play 30 minutes.

Horne and Burrell change the game dynamically off the bench.

I agree with you though maybe those losses finally hit home and they bought into the system. I love that this team is attacking the basket, being patient on offense (methodical to quote Lavin), and they are playing with defensive awareness.

Horne and Burrell change the game dynamically off the bench.

I agree with you though maybe those losses finally hit home and they bought into the system. I love that this team is attacking the basket, being patient on offense (methodical to quote Lavin), and they are playing with defensive awareness.

I agree with you though maybe those losses finally hit home and they bought into the system. I love that this team is attacking the basket, being patient on offense (methodical to quote Lavin), and they are playing with defensive awareness.

Totally agree that keeping Burrell out of early foul trouble is real important as we need JB to play major minutes, especially in the second half. JB will be a key guy if this is a successful season. Somewhat surprised that Evans could not have taken the role that Coker has now but it seems that his disappointing play early in the season has him glued to the bench. Hope that Sean keeps working hard in practice and maybe he gets a few minutes when JB is out of the game.

Quote from: Dave on December 29, 2010, 11:46:16 PM

I love Coker starting. He sets the tone defensively and the offensive focus is set on Brownlee, Hardy and DJ. This also keeps Burrell out of foul trouble early on allowing him to play 30 minutes.

Horne and Burrell change the game dynamically off the bench.
.
Totally agree that keeping Burrell out of early foul trouble is real important as we need JB to play big minutes, especially in the second half. Somewhat surprised that Evans could not have taken the role that Coker has now

Quote from: Dave on December 29, 2010, 11:46:16 PM

I love Coker starting. He sets the tone defensively and the offensive focus is set on Brownlee, Hardy and DJ. This also keeps Burrell out of foul trouble early on allowing him to play 30 minutes.

Quote from: Dave on December 29, 2010, 11:46:16 PM

I love Coker starting. He sets the tone defensively and the offensive focus is set on Brownlee, Hardy and DJ. This also keeps Burrell out of foul trouble early on allowing him to play 30 minutes.

Horne and Burrell change the game dynamically off the bench.

I agree with you though maybe those losses finally hit home and they bought into the system. I love that this team is attacking the basket, being patient on offense (methodical to quote Lavin), and they are playing with defensive awareness.

Horne and Burrell change the game dynamically off the bench.

I agree with you though maybe those losses finally hit home and they bought into the system. I love that this team is attacking the basket, being patient on offense (methodical to quote Lavin), and they are playing with defensive awareness.

I agree with you though maybe those losses finally hit home and they bought into the system. I love that this team is attacking the basket, being patient on offense (methodical to quote Lavin), and they are playing with defensive awareness.

Totally agree that keeping Burrell out of early foul trouble is real important as we need JB to play major minutes, especially in the second half. JB will be a key guy if this is a successful season. Somewhat surprised that Evans could not have taken the role that Coker has now but it seems that his disappointing play early in the season has him glued to the bench. Hope that Sean keeps working hard in practice and maybe he gets a few minutes when JB is out of the game.

See I would start Burrell and bring Evans off the bench for energy. If he plays well great, if he starts doing dumb Sean Evans things take him out. Seems like a perfect role for him. I would only play Coker if we had severe foul trouble or you need him to karate chop spomeone. He has no discernable basketball skills.

A: Evans is a terrible defender. Has no awareness off the ball
B: Evans hasn't played with energy all season. He is unwilling to accept his role
C: Evans put on weight and in my opinion is a little slower because of it. I like the extra beef to bang but I also thought one of Evans biggest assets was that he was strong and quick
D: Evans can't shoot anywhere outside of the paint. Defenses cheat on him all the time
E: Evans can't hit a free throw which is a liability

Coker on the other hand....

A: Is a good defender who can block shots. If he doesn't block shots he alters shots
B: Can shoot! Has a nice midrange game
C: Can make a freethrow
D: Underrated passer. He runs a nice high low with the other big man

Now Coker isn't flawless. His hands are surprisingly weak for a guy with his strength (I also think thats due to lack of playing time the more he touches the ball the better he'll get), he doesn't rebound particularly well, and he doesn't dunk the ball much like Evans.

A: Evans is a terrible defender. Has no awareness off the ball
B: Evans hasn't played with energy all season. He is unwilling to accept his role
C: Evans put on weight and in my opinion is a little slower because of it. I like the extra beef to bang but I also thought one of Evans biggest assets was that he was strong and quick
D: Evans can't shoot anywhere outside of the paint. Defenses cheat on him all the time
E: Evans can't hit a free throw which is a liability

Coker on the other hand....

A: Is a good defender who can block shots. If he doesn't block shots he alters shots
B: Can shoot! Has a nice midrange game
C: Can make a freethrow
D: Underrated passer. He runs a nice high low with the other big man

Now Coker isn't flawless. His hands are surprisingly weak for a guy with his strength (I also think thats due to lack of playing time the more he touches the ball the better he'll get), he doesn't rebound particularly well, and he doesn't dunk the ball much like Evans.

Allow me to retort, Coker stinks!
That is all.


Oh alright I will give you some stats to backup Coker's stinkyness. He is shooting 33% from the field and is 0-3 from the line. Not sure where this myth got started that Coker has a nice shot, but I can only assume the same person who started the myths about the lock ness monster, big foot, Norm's recruiting ability and Modern Family being a funny show.
   http://espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=36554

Quote from: Dave on December 30, 2010, 12:24:09 PM

A: Evans is a terrible defender. Has no awareness off the ball
B: Evans hasn't played with energy all season. He is unwilling to accept his role
C: Evans put on weight and in my opinion is a little slower because of it. I like the extra beef to bang but I also thought one of Evans biggest assets was that he was strong and quick
D: Evans can't shoot anywhere outside of the paint. Defenses cheat on him all the time
E: Evans can't hit a free throw which is a liability

Coker on the other hand....

A: Is a good defender who can block shots. If he doesn't block shots he alters shots
B: Can shoot! Has a nice midrange game
C: Can make a freethrow
D: Underrated passer. He runs a nice high low with the other big man

Now Coker isn't flawless. His hands are surprisingly weak for a guy with his strength (I also think thats due to lack of playing time the more he touches the ball the better he'll get), he doesn't rebound particularly well, and he doesn't dunk the ball much like Evans.

Allow me to retort, Coker stinks!
That is all.


Oh alright I will give you some stats to backup Coker's stinkyness. He is shooting 33% from the field and is 0-3 from the line. Not sure where this myth got started that Coker has a nice shot, but I can only assume the same person who started the myths about the lock ness monster, big foot, Norm's recruiting ability and Modern Family being a funny show.
   http://espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=36554

If he makes his next two shots then he's shooting 50% way too small of a sample size to use numbers. Either way I and others have seen Dele shoot nice midrange shots from FT line extended in addition to baseline shots. He misses more chippees than he does shots

Quote from: we are sju on December 30, 2010, 12:44:01 PM

Quote from: Dave on December 30, 2010, 12:24:09 PM

A: Evans is a terrible defender. Has no awareness off the ball
B: Evans hasn't played with energy all season. He is unwilling to accept his role
C: Evans put on weight and in my opinion is a little slower because of it. I like the extra beef to bang but I also thought one of Evans biggest assets was that he was strong and quick
D: Evans can't shoot anywhere outside of the paint. Defenses cheat on him all the time
E: Evans can't hit a free throw which is a liability

Coker on the other hand....

A: Is a good defender who can block shots. If he doesn't block shots he alters shots
B: Can shoot! Has a nice midrange game
C: Can make a freethrow
D: Underrated passer. He runs a nice high low with the other big man

Now Coker isn't flawless. His hands are surprisingly weak for a guy with his strength (I also think thats due to lack of playing time the more he touches the ball the better he'll get), he doesn't rebound particularly well, and he doesn't dunk the ball much like Evans.

Allow me to retort, Coker stinks!
That is all.


Oh alright I will give you some stats to backup Coker's stinkyness. He is shooting 33% from the field and is 0-3 from the line. Not sure where this myth got started that Coker has a nice shot, but I can only assume the same person who started the myths about the lock ness monster, big foot, Norm's recruiting ability and Modern Family being a funny show.
   http://espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=36554

If he makes his next two shots then he's shooting 50% way too small of a sample size to use numbers. Either way I and others have seen Dele shoot nice midrange shots from FT line extended in addition to baseline shots. He misses more chippees than he does shots

For his career he ia 44% shooter. Just becuase it is not an ugly looking shot does not make him a good shooter. Really we are talking about 10 or 15 minutes a game here. Personally I would take Evans upside in the slot over Coker's nothingness. Neither should ever be on the court in the last 10 minutes of a game.

Coker may yet have a few 6-8 point games. But his instincts on offense are too slow for us to give him the ball often.

He was right under the basket last night, he had the ball, and instead of throwing it down, he tries a right scoop lay up that was easily blocked.

You're the biggest guy on the floor. Dunk the ball, or have a seat. That's what he did. He took a seat.

On the defensive end, there is some hope. He can board a little, and block the occasional shot.

I think we've found our rotation. And it goes 8 deep.

Regarding Coker

He has started the last 4 games with the result being 3 wins and the FU loss which coach Lavin put the onus on himself.  In the 4 games we have seen Burrell's minutes and stats continue to climb.

Maybe the staff is superstious (remember Louie wouldn't change his ugly sweater in a streak).  I like it as he gets only 3/4 minutes in a half and maybe it puts less pressure on JB being the 6th man, a role he seems to have accepted with great success.  he is not committing silly fools out there but playing within himself and the team concept designed by the staff.

if is ain't broke, don't fix it.

Coker has a deadly midrange baseline jumper, but his percentages go down because he still struggles around the basket and is often too strong on his lay-ins and putbacks.

Quote from: Dave on December 30, 2010, 12:48:34 PM

Quote from: we are sju on December 30, 2010, 12:44:01 PM

Quote from: Dave on December 30, 2010, 12:24:09 PM

A: Evans is a terrible defender. Has no awareness off the ball
B: Evans hasn't played with energy all season. He is unwilling to accept his role
C: Evans put on weight and in my opinion is a little slower because of it. I like the extra beef to bang but I also thought one of Evans biggest assets was that he was strong and quick
D: Evans can't shoot anywhere outside of the paint. Defenses cheat on him all the time
E: Evans can't hit a free throw which is a liability

Coker on the other hand....

A: Is a good defender who can block shots. If he doesn't block shots he alters shots
B: Can shoot! Has a nice midrange game
C: Can make a freethrow
D: Underrated passer. He runs a nice high low with the other big man

Now Coker isn't flawless. His hands are surprisingly weak for a guy with his strength (I also think thats due to lack of playing time the more he touches the ball the better he'll get), he doesn't rebound particularly well, and he doesn't dunk the ball much like Evans.

Allow me to retort, Coker stinks!
That is all.


Oh alright I will give you some stats to backup Coker's stinkyness. He is shooting 33% from the field and is 0-3 from the line. Not sure where this myth got started that Coker has a nice shot, but I can only assume the same person who started the myths about the lock ness monster, big foot, Norm's recruiting ability and Modern Family being a funny show.
   http://espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=36554

If he makes his next two shots then he's shooting 50% way too small of a sample size to use numbers. Either way I and others have seen Dele shoot nice midrange shots from FT line extended in addition to baseline shots. He misses more chippees than he does shots

For his career he ia 44% shooter. Just becuase it is not an ugly looking shot does not make him a good shooter. Really we are talking about 10 or 15 minutes a game here. Personally I would take Evans upside in the slot over Coker's nothingness. Neither should ever be on the court in the last 10 minutes of a game.

His shot is pretty and I'm not shy to say that. I feel pretty strongly as the conductor of the Coker bandwagon.

Coker has a deadly midrange baseline jumper, but his percentages go down because he still struggles around the basket and is often too strong on his lay-ins and putbacks.

"Deadly"? Well I guess if a really old person or infant wandered on to the court and one of Coker's misses hit them just right it could kill

Quote from: STJ11Redmen on December 30, 2010, 01:01:53 PM

Coker has a deadly midrange baseline jumper, but his percentages go down because he still struggles around the basket and is often too strong on his lay-ins and putbacks.

"Deadly"? Well I guess if a really old person or infant wandered on to the court and one of Coker's misses hit them just right it could kill

Im just curious if you have ever watched him shoot a jump shot.  He has such an uncharacteristically soft touch it's amazing to watch.  His shot floats to the hoop like a feather.  I think I've only seen him miss two jumpers in the last two years and they were both in the St. Bonaventure game.

Quote from: we are sju on December 30, 2010, 01:17:26 PM

Quote from: STJ11Redmen on December 30, 2010, 01:01:53 PM

Coker has a deadly midrange baseline jumper, but his percentages go down because he still struggles around the basket and is often too strong on his lay-ins and putbacks.

"Deadly"? Well I guess if a really old person or infant wandered on to the court and one of Coker's misses hit them just right it could kill

Im just curious if you have ever watched him shoot a jump shot.  He has such an uncharacteristically soft touch it's amazing to watch.  His shot floats to the hoop like a feather.  I think I've only seen him miss two jumpers in the last two years and they were both in the St. Bonaventure game.

While I wont claim to have seen all of the 93 shots he has missed these past 4 seasons in 167 attempts, I have seen enough. You people are crazy! Coker is not a good basketball player. Listen I just feel that since Burrell is finally starting to play as he did as  a frosh he should be rewarded. If Coker must play 5 to 10 minutes I guess it is better he does it at the beginning of each half to minimize the damage. I have been saying for 4 years now that Coker and Boothe are not good basketball players but some of you keep fooling yourselves. Keep waiting, but what you see is what you get. Listen I have been wrong once, maybe twice in the past. Case in point Brownlee.  I also never in a million years could have foreseen David Cain's senior year. Trust me on this though Coker is not good! I am sorry for those who may be of relation to him. But in the big picture being a terrible basketball player is not the worst thing.