Non-conference year turns on Detroit game

UCLA will pound us inside...I wouldn't call that a likely win.  They also have time to get things together.  I would sign up for 7-5. 

I'm praying we can keep it respectable on Thursday.  Or at least hoping that Gathers and another 2 bigs see the potential of joining our other talent next year.

Let's not start acting like UCLA is great.  Tell me are they better then Texas A & M or Arizona right now?  No way.  Was SJU right there with both of those teams, yes.  UCLA is 1-4 with their only win over a D-2 school and their best player is a who knows where he will be in a month (Reeves).  Plus their backcourt is very weak.  Will see how they handle SJU pressure's.

Kentucky, Duke, and UNC look like the three best teams in the country so far to me, even with UNC losing last night. 

I may put Ohio State ahead of UNC for now.  I've watched UNC play a handful of times and, albeit, they are talented and deep, but they are soft.  They also do not defend well, either.  Henson can block shots with the best of 'em in the college ranks, but just continue to bang and bam him like the others.   

Umm fellas I highly doubt they beat detriot. Have u guys seen them? That's gonna be a problem

Umm fellas I highly doubt they beat detriot. Have u guys seen them? That's gonna be a problem

Trust me I don't think it will be easy by any stretch.  But out of the 3 road games UK, Duke and Detroit the only 1 I see with any realistic chance is Detroit.  But yeah they could lose to all 3 no doubt. 

Umm fellas I highly doubt they beat detriot. Have u guys seen them? That's gonna be a problem

Without Holman and Minnerath shortens their frontcourt depth. They are 3-4 with their wins coming against Lake Erie, Concordia (MI) and Austin Peay.   Lost to ND without Abromaitis, Bowling Green, and we smoked by Akron and GW.  They score the ball well, rebound well, but turn the ball over a lot and aren't world beaters from 3.

Quote from: kob24 on November 27, 2011, 10:29:02 PM

Umm fellas I highly doubt they beat detriot. Have u guys seen them? That's gonna be a problem

Trust me I don't think it will be easy by any stretch.  But out of the 3 road games UK, Duke and Detroit the only 1 I see with any realistic chance is Detroit.  But yeah they could lose to all 3 no doubt. 

I've had the chance to see 'em play once this season (versus Notre Dame).  It'll be tough, considering it'll be on the road.  But, it's most certainly a winnable game. 

I guess you haven't seen them play much either, kob.  Reason being....  Here is what Detroit have done up to date.

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basketball/teams/dam

Quote from: kob24 on November 27, 2011, 10:29:02 PM

Umm fellas I highly doubt they beat detriot. Have u guys seen them? That's gonna be a problem

Without Holman and Minnerath shortens their frontcourt depth. They are 3-4 with their wins coming against Lake Erie, Concordia (MI) and Austin Peay.   Lost to ND without Abromaitis, Bowling Green, and we smoked by Akron and GW.  They score the ball well, rebound well, but turn the ball over a lot and aren't world beaters from 3.

I didn't know both of those guys were gone.  I knew one of 'em weren't available, but not both.  Nevertheless, it all depends on which St. John's team shows up. 

The team from yesterday....  No way!  The team from the week prior....  Most certainly! 

Quote from: jumpinjohnny on November 27, 2011, 09:43:54 PM

UCLA will pound us inside...I wouldn't call that a likely win.  They also have time to get things together.  I would sign up for 7-5. 

I'm praying we can keep it respectable on Thursday.  Or at least hoping that Gathers and another 2 bigs see the potential of joining our other talent next year.

Let's not start acting like UCLA is great.  Tell me are they better then Texas A & M or Arizona right now?  No way.  Was SJU right there with both of those teams, yes.  UCLA is 1-4 with their only win over a D-2 school and their best player is a who knows where he will be in a month (Reeves).  Plus their backcourt is very weak.  Will see how they handle SJU pressure's.

We struggled against C W Post...... I say 1 - 4 is more likely.

Quote from: fordham96 on November 27, 2011, 09:47:42 PM

Quote from: jumpinjohnny on November 27, 2011, 09:43:54 PM

UCLA will pound us inside...I wouldn't call that a likely win.  They also have time to get things together.  I would sign up for 7-5. 

I'm praying we can keep it respectable on Thursday.  Or at least hoping that Gathers and another 2 bigs see the potential of joining our other talent next year.

Let's not start acting like UCLA is great.  Tell me are they better then Texas A & M or Arizona right now?  No way.  Was SJU right there with both of those teams, yes.  UCLA is 1-4 with their only win over a D-2 school and their best player is a who knows where he will be in a month (Reeves).  Plus their backcourt is very weak.  Will see how they handle SJU pressure's.

We struggled against C W Post...... I say 1 - 4 is more likely.

St. John's smoked CW Post.

Quote from: realfan on November 27, 2011, 11:15:56 PM

Quote from: fordham96 on November 27, 2011, 09:47:42 PM

Quote from: jumpinjohnny on November 27, 2011, 09:43:54 PM

UCLA will pound us inside...I wouldn't call that a likely win.  They also have time to get things together.  I would sign up for 7-5. 

I'm praying we can keep it respectable on Thursday.  Or at least hoping that Gathers and another 2 bigs see the potential of joining our other talent next year.

Let's not start acting like UCLA is great.  Tell me are they better then Texas A & M or Arizona right now?  No way.  Was SJU right there with both of those teams, yes.  UCLA is 1-4 with their only win over a D-2 school and their best player is a who knows where he will be in a month (Reeves).  Plus their backcourt is very weak.  Will see how they handle SJU pressure's.

We struggled against C W Post...... I say 1 - 4 is more likely.

St. John's smoked CW Post.

Yup.... late in the second half as I recall.

Quote from: mjdinkins on November 27, 2011, 11:17:35 PM

Quote from: realfan on November 27, 2011, 11:15:56 PM

Quote from: fordham96 on November 27, 2011, 09:47:42 PM

Quote from: jumpinjohnny on November 27, 2011, 09:43:54 PM

UCLA will pound us inside...I wouldn't call that a likely win.  They also have time to get things together.  I would sign up for 7-5. 

I'm praying we can keep it respectable on Thursday.  Or at least hoping that Gathers and another 2 bigs see the potential of joining our other talent next year.

Let's not start acting like UCLA is great.  Tell me are they better then Texas A & M or Arizona right now?  No way.  Was SJU right there with both of those teams, yes.  UCLA is 1-4 with their only win over a D-2 school and their best player is a who knows where he will be in a month (Reeves).  Plus their backcourt is very weak.  Will see how they handle SJU pressure's.

We struggled against C W Post...... I say 1 - 4 is more likely.

St. John's smoked CW Post.

Yup.... late in the second half as I recall.

Actually, the Johnnies were pulling away prior to halftime and went up big early in the 2nd half.

If SJU wants to have a winning non-conference season and a shot at a post season bid it probably comes down to the Detroit game on the road.  The Northeastern game hurts.  Not totally unexpected but hurt nonetheless because they have such a difficult schedule that they cannot afford to lose home non-conference games especially at Carnesecca to non-BCS schools even if those schools are better then average.  Here is the way I look at it.

2 games are near impossible for them to win at this point.  At Kentucky and at Duke.  That gets them to five losses.  Fordham at MSG they must win.  If for no other reason then to avenge last year's debacle at Rose Hill.  That game gets them to 5 wins.  UCLA at home is looking like a game they certainly can and should win.  UCLA is a mess right now and SJU should be better by then.  Gets you to 6 wins.

Detroit on the road is certainly a losable game.  No doubt.  But I think it could be the difference between 7-5 and 6-6.  Huge difference.

Is texas pan-american not a D1 school. That should be another win

Quote from: Moose on November 27, 2011, 09:03:46 PM

Quote from: Dave on November 27, 2011, 08:52:40 PM

UCLA isn't a guarantee

I'm gonna introduce Josh Smith to all the new MSG concessions

I dont think they have White Castle in LA

His burger of choice is LA Chain "Fatburger".  So fitting.

Quote from: fordham96 on November 27, 2011, 08:34:36 PM

If SJU wants to have a winning non-conference season and a shot at a post season bid it probably comes down to the Detroit game on the road.  The Northeastern game hurts.  Not totally unexpected but hurt nonetheless because they have such a difficult schedule that they cannot afford to lose home non-conference games especially at Carnesecca to non-BCS schools even if those schools are better then average.  Here is the way I look at it.

2 games are near impossible for them to win at this point.  At Kentucky and at Duke.  That gets them to five losses.  Fordham at MSG they must win.  If for no other reason then to avenge last year's debacle at Rose Hill.  That game gets them to 5 wins.  UCLA at home is looking like a game they certainly can and should win.  UCLA is a mess right now and SJU should be better by then.  Gets you to 6 wins.

Detroit on the road is certainly a losable game.  No doubt.  But I think it could be the difference between 7-5 and 6-6.  Huge difference.

Is texas pan-american not a D1 school. That should be another win

100% right I stand corrected.  So right now the Detroit game could be the difference, assuming they win their remaining home games including UCLA, between going 7-6 or 8-5.  They play 13 non-conference games instead of 12.  They get an extra freebie with T-PA.

As Moose pointed out, this is a Detroit team that has been pilling up bad losses - GW, Akron, Bowling Green ?   Their not exactly world-beaters.   It'll be tough since we're on the road.   But I'd be disappointed if we lose that game.   Honestly I haven't seen them play other than a quarter of the ND game, but the stats don't bely a terrific shooting team.   So, for now, I'm not concerned about Detroit.

Kentucky on the other hand is a whole other matter.   We simply HAVE to rebound better against UK.   Jones, Davis, and Gilchrist will take advantage of second opportunities more so than any front court we've faced.  Moe and God's Gift are going to have to play great defense, and hit the glass every time a shot goes up for us to have a chance.

Other then Kansas though, UK hasn't faced many talented teams this year - does anyone know if they've played an opponent who stayed in zone for a large part of the game?

Quote from: fordham96 on November 27, 2011, 08:34:36 PM

If SJU wants to have a winning non-conference season and a shot at a post season bid it probably comes down to the Detroit game on the road.  The Northeastern game hurts.  Not totally unexpected but hurt nonetheless because they have such a difficult schedule that they cannot afford to lose home non-conference games especially at Carnesecca to non-BCS schools even if those schools are better then average.  Here is the way I look at it.

2 games are near impossible for them to win at this point.  At Kentucky and at Duke.  That gets them to five losses.  Fordham at MSG they must win.  If for no other reason then to avenge last year's debacle at Rose Hill.  That game gets them to 5 wins.  UCLA at home is looking like a game they certainly can and should win.  UCLA is a mess right now and SJU should be better by then.  Gets you to 6 wins.

Detroit on the road is certainly a losable game.  No doubt.  But I think it could be the difference between 7-5 and 6-6.  Huge difference.

Is texas pan-american not a D1 school. That should be another win

The Broncs are a D1 school from the powerhouse Great West conference.

Kentucky is freaking long.  That will be a tough matchup for our guys.  Duke will come back hard against us for last year's beating. 

Quote from: fordham96 on November 27, 2011, 08:34:36 PM

If SJU wants to have a winning non-conference season and a shot at a post season bid it probably comes down to the Detroit game on the road.  The Northeastern game hurts.  Not totally unexpected but hurt nonetheless because they have such a difficult schedule that they cannot afford to lose home non-conference games especially at Carnesecca to non-BCS schools even if those schools are better then average.  Here is the way I look at it.

2 games are near impossible for them to win at this point.  At Kentucky and at Duke.  That gets them to five losses.  Fordham at MSG they must win.  If for no other reason then to avenge last year's debacle at Rose Hill.  That game gets them to 5 wins.  UCLA at home is looking like a game they certainly can and should win.  UCLA is a mess right now and SJU should be better by then.  Gets you to 6 wins.

Detroit on the road is certainly a losable game.  No doubt.  But I think it could be the difference between 7-5 and 6-6.  Huge difference.

Agreed with your assessment.  Detroit lost their post presence in Holman and then his replacement recently went down for the year with an injury.  Neutralize McCallum and you win.

Neutralize McCallum? Like the one guy that when for 29 or so against us-think his name was Bonneau or something, or Smith who last game went for 29. Historically we don't stop the big scorers-back in the Lou C days his philosophy was let him get his and stop everyone else and it always seems we allow the big scorer to get his.

Quote from: Moose on November 27, 2011, 08:51:37 PM

Quote from: fordham96 on November 27, 2011, 08:34:36 PM

If SJU wants to have a winning non-conference season and a shot at a post season bid it probably comes down to the Detroit game on the road.  The Northeastern game hurts.  Not totally unexpected but hurt nonetheless because they have such a difficult schedule that they cannot afford to lose home non-conference games especially at Carnesecca to non-BCS schools even if those schools are better then average.  Here is the way I look at it.

2 games are near impossible for them to win at this point.  At Kentucky and at Duke.  That gets them to five losses.  Fordham at MSG they must win.  If for no other reason then to avenge last year's debacle at Rose Hill.  That game gets them to 5 wins.  UCLA at home is looking like a game they certainly can and should win.  UCLA is a mess right now and SJU should be better by then.  Gets you to 6 wins.

Detroit on the road is certainly a losable game.  No doubt.  But I think it could be the difference between 7-5 and 6-6.  Huge difference.

Agreed with your assessment.  Detroit lost their post presence in Holman and then his replacement recently went down for the year with an injury.  Neutralize McCallum and you win.

Neutralize McCallum? Like the one guy that when for 29 or so against us-think his name was Bonneau or something, or Smith who last game went for 29. Historically we don't stop the big scorers-back in the Lou C days his philosophy was let him get his and stop everyone else and it always seems we allow the big scorer to get his.

Do you think thats the strategy the staff employs?  Do you think they really tell the kids to let the good guy do his thing and focus on the other 4?

Don't know for sure but it sure seems like it. Do you ever see our d pay extra attention to the shooter or the guy killing us. I have been following St J alot longer than you and I can tell you it was Lou's stated philosophy that one man can't beat you and he would play him straight up.