Getting Nuri back on track

Baldi-  you have a girlfriend Michelle that posts on Redmen.com?  Big Iona fan. 

 I don't really post over there much anymore. I used to alot.  I have a different screen name over on RM though..

Nope nothing to do with me

Quote from: Tha Kid on December 06, 2011, 09:05:20 AM

Foad - great analysis but u f'd up at the end.  Ced jackson was one of marillac's favorite players, and turned out to be the most successful pplayer from that st johns team.  Marillac is gonna rant now about how phil greene WILL BE cedric jackson (and I hope he is).

No one was a Cedric Jackson fan when he was the SJ shooting guard. They would have had to be demented

Quote from: Foad on December 06, 2011, 09:29:25 AM

Quote from: Tha Kid on December 06, 2011, 09:05:20 AM

Foad - great analysis but u f'd up at the end.  Ced jackson was one of marillac's favorite players, and turned out to be the most successful pplayer from that st johns team.  Marillac is gonna rant now about how phil greene WILL BE cedric jackson (and I hope he is).

No one was a Cedric Jackson fan when he was the SJ shooting guard. They would have had to be demented,

I think Bobre loved Ced. I'm not sure what that says about the rest of us or him. lol


Ooops ( I didn't realized Bobre actually posted on this thread )

Foad - great analysis but u f'd up at the end.  Ced jackson was one of marillac's favorite players, and turned out to be the most successful pplayer from that st johns team.  Marillac is gonna rant now about how phil greene WILL BE cedric jackson (and I hope he is).

Look, Nuri is in a funk.  He hasn't played this caliber of competition probably since the aau circuit his senior year of hs which wasn't that recent.  He certainly needs to snap out of it, but I have faith that the staff will help him come around.

Also marillac great pt about the shot doc.  Nuris shot is a work in progress.  Will come around eventually.  If not, he still can be a successful pg if he utilizes his other skills properly.

Quote from: Foad on December 06, 2011, 08:21:28 AM

Quote from: Marillac on December 06, 2011, 02:30:18 AM

This season, I think Phil will continue to fight his way to a bigger role at Nuri's expense.  Phil contributes so much more to team's success in every other area besides running the show when compared to Nuri, who is 0-15 from three (0-21 counting scrimmages), averages nearly 4 t.o.'s a game, and misses almost half of his ft's.  Phil is the better athlete and better defender. 

Enough please with the adoration of Phil Greene. Yes, Lindsey has looked lost the last several games and yes Phil Greene has played better than could have been expected from this class's least heralded recruit. Yes he has a bright future and yes good luck to him.

However,

Lindsey is averaging (in 5 more minutes a game)

13 pts / 5 rebounds / 3 assists

va Greene

6 pts / 2 rebounds / 1.5 assists


Lindsey is shooting

.47 (fg) / .00 (3pt) / .56 (ft)

vs Greene

.39 / .29 / .66


Lindsey has

31 TOs / 14 steals

va Greene

10 / 7


Greene has a better three point percentage, which is still atrocious, and fewer turnovers. Lindsey's numbers are better in every other category. And please do not to be telling me that the offense runs better with either of them in there, because the offense does not run better ever. It stinks.

Greene's numbers

5.8 ppg / 1.5 assists / 2.3 rebounds / .395 - .286 - .66

are slightly favorable to these of this mystery player

4.1 ppg / 1.7 assists / 3.6 rebounds / .339 - .231 - .65

That would be Cedric Jackson, who was as reviled as a player at SJ as there's been in the past 10 years - and rightfully so: he was awful. That he ended up in the NBA bodes well for Phil Greene, if he has the same work ethic. But please to be stop pretending that Greene is anything other than what he is, which is an average freshman.

What effective NBA point guard can you name that does not have a good shot?

Quote from: Tha Kid on December 06, 2011, 09:05:20 AM

Foad - great analysis but u f'd up at the end.  Ced jackson was one of marillac's favorite players, and turned out to be the most successful pplayer from that st johns team.  Marillac is gonna rant now about how phil greene WILL BE cedric jackson (and I hope he is).

Look, Nuri is in a funk.  He hasn't played this caliber of competition probably since the aau circuit his senior year of hs which wasn't that recent.  He certainly needs to snap out of it, but I have faith that the staff will help him come around.

Also marillac great pt about the shot doc.  Nuris shot is a work in progress.  Will come around eventually.  If not, he still can be a successful pg if he utilizes his other skills properly.

Quote from: Foad on December 06, 2011, 08:21:28 AM

Quote from: Marillac on December 06, 2011, 02:30:18 AM

This season, I think Phil will continue to fight his way to a bigger role at Nuri's expense.  Phil contributes so much more to team's success in every other area besides running the show when compared to Nuri, who is 0-15 from three (0-21 counting scrimmages), averages nearly 4 t.o.'s a game, and misses almost half of his ft's.  Phil is the better athlete and better defender. 

Enough please with the adoration of Phil Greene. Yes, Lindsey has looked lost the last several games and yes Phil Greene has played better than could have been expected from this class's least heralded recruit. Yes he has a bright future and yes good luck to him.

However,

Lindsey is averaging (in 5 more minutes a game)

13 pts / 5 rebounds / 3 assists

va Greene

6 pts / 2 rebounds / 1.5 assists


Lindsey is shooting

.47 (fg) / .00 (3pt) / .56 (ft)

vs Greene

.39 / .29 / .66


Lindsey has

31 TOs / 14 steals

va Greene

10 / 7


Greene has a better three point percentage, which is still atrocious, and fewer turnovers. Lindsey's numbers are better in every other category. And please do not to be telling me that the offense runs better with either of them in there, because the offense does not run better ever. It stinks.

Greene's numbers

5.8 ppg / 1.5 assists / 2.3 rebounds / .395 - .286 - .66

are slightly favorable to these of this mystery player

4.1 ppg / 1.7 assists / 3.6 rebounds / .339 - .231 - .65

That would be Cedric Jackson, who was as reviled as a player at SJ as there's been in the past 10 years - and rightfully so: he was awful. That he ended up in the NBA bodes well for Phil Greene, if he has the same work ethic. But please to be stop pretending that Greene is anything other than what he is, which is an average freshman.

What effective NBA point guard can you name that does not have a good shot?

Rajon Rondo

I agree with most of the points made but to me the biggest problem I see is the game is being played too fast for him right now. I thinks its a mental thing. He needs to remember that he is a good player, do the things he's good at and most importantly relax. He'll be fine, he's just in a rough patch right now

He couldn't be stopped against Arizona, they couldn't touch him. I don't know if it's the missed free throws against A&M or what but he needs to step up and be a leader again like he was in the first 5 or so games of the season.

What effective NBA point guard can you name that does not have a good shot?

A lot...

Jason Kidd was never a good shooter until later in his career. They used to call him ason Kidd..no J.

Mark Jackson is considered on the best of all time and he was not a good shooter.

Thinking over the years.... Rod Strickland, Brevin Knight, Andre Miller, Doc Rivers, Mookie Blaylock, Jamal Tinsley, Sebastian Telfair, Shaun Livingston, Jason Williams, Greg Anthony, Muggsy Bogues, Eric Snow...Do I have to keep going?

Quote from: realfan on December 06, 2011, 09:59:37 PM

What effective NBA point guard can you name that does not have a good shot?

A lot...

Jason Kidd was never a good shooter until later in his career. They used to call him ason Kidd..no J.

Mark Jackson is considered on the best of all time and he was not a good shooter.

Thinking over the years.... Rod Strickland, Brevin Knight, Andre Miller, Doc Rivers, Mookie Blaylock, Jamal Tinsley, Sebastian Telfair, Shaun Livingston, Jason Williams, Greg Anthony, Muggsy Bogues, Eric Snow...Do I have to keep going?

Gary Payton, Mo Cheeks....

There are guys that aren't great shooters and then there is Nuri. I like Nuri and think he should be allowed to take the ball and go, however with the possible exception of Rondo everone else mentioned on this thread were way better shooters than Nuri. Mark Jackson's senior year he was actually one of the better three point shooters in the BE. Calling Nuri a bad shooter is like calling the mom from the movie "What's Eating Gilbert Grape" fat. She is in a different category for fat and Nuri is a class by himself as bad shooters go.

There are guys that aren't great shooters and then there is Nuri. I like Nuri and think he should be allowed to take the ball and go, however with the possible exception of Rondo everone else mentioned on this thread were way better shooters than Nuri. Mark Jackson's senior year he was actually one of the better three point shooters in the BE. Calling Nuri a bad shooter is like calling the mom from the movie "What's Eating Gilbert Grape" fat. She is in a different category for fat and Nuri is a class by himself as bad shooters go.

He's shooting 46% from the field.  He's shooting zero percent from3 because he takes no threes.  He's only taken 15 3's all season.  To say he's that bad is an overstatement at this point because he doesn't really take shots from the perimeter.  no doubt he needs work, but need a larger sample size to say he's that bad.  He made some real nice midrange shots vs st Francis at home.  Give him time. His biggest problem is confidence right now.

He hasn't been getting into the lane like he was during the first couple of games. And when he does, he has turned it over. I don't know what happened to his ball handling skills either but he has just looked lost.

MCNPA
That is the point. He doesn't even attempt to shoot jumpers. And just for the record I like Nuri and enjoy watching him. My point is the way we are playing offense now by holding the ball and not attacking, it renders Nuri useless. I can live with the to's and charges. Having him stand around the perimeter is pointless!

Quote from: we are sju on December 07, 2011, 09:06:01 AM

There are guys that aren't great shooters and then there is Nuri. I like Nuri and think he should be allowed to take the ball and go, however with the possible exception of Rondo everone else mentioned on this thread were way better shooters than Nuri. Mark Jackson's senior year he was actually one of the better three point shooters in the BE. Calling Nuri a bad shooter is like calling the mom from the movie "What's Eating Gilbert Grape" fat. She is in a different category for fat and Nuri is a class by himself as bad shooters go.

He's shooting 46% from the field.  He's shooting zero percent from3 because he takes no threes.  He's only taken 15 3's all season.  To say he's that bad is an overstatement at this point because he doesn't really take shots from the perimeter.  no doubt he needs work, but need a larger sample size to say he's that bad.  He made some real nice midrange shots vs st Francis at home.  Give him time. His biggest problem is confidence right now.

15 is a good number of 3's to not hit one.  Or even come close for that matter.  If he hits hits his next he will be shooting 6% from three.  If he hits his next 4 in a row just 20%.  He needs to know his limitations and honestly just take 1-2 steps in and learn that jumper.  The 3 pointer where it is has proven to be evil for college hoops.  Make it same as NBA.

MCNPA
That is the point. He doesn't even attempt to shoot jumpers. And just for the record I like Nuri and enjoy watching him. My point is the way we are playing offense now by holding the ball and not attacking, it renders Nuri useless. I can live with the to's and charges. Having him stand around the perimeter is pointless!

  I agree. Let him play.  Be damned with the TO and charges.  At least we were competitive in those games.

Way too early to bury Nuri, he seems like he's not confident out there. I agree with the posters who say let him play his game, I think he'll adjust to this level eventually.  This is a learning/development year-we're not making any tournaments this year.

Quote from: realfan on December 06, 2011, 09:59:37 PM

What effective NBA point guard can you name that does not have a good shot?

A lot...

Jason Kidd was never a good shooter until later in his career. They used to call him ason Kidd..no J.

Mark Jackson is considered on the best of all time and he was not a good shooter.

Thinking over the years.... Rod Strickland, Brevin Knight, Andre Miller, Doc Rivers, Mookie Blaylock, Jamal Tinsley, Sebastian Telfair, Shaun Livingston, Jason Williams, Greg Anthony, Muggsy Bogues, Eric Snow...Do I have to keep going?

But not in todays game.

Quote from: Dave on December 07, 2011, 12:54:04 AM

Quote from: realfan on December 06, 2011, 09:59:37 PM

What effective NBA point guard can you name that does not have a good shot?

A lot...

Jason Kidd was never a good shooter until later in his career. They used to call him ason Kidd..no J.

Mark Jackson is considered on the best of all time and he was not a good shooter.

Thinking over the years.... Rod Strickland, Brevin Knight, Andre Miller, Doc Rivers, Mookie Blaylock, Jamal Tinsley, Sebastian Telfair, Shaun Livingston, Jason Williams, Greg Anthony, Muggsy Bogues, Eric Snow...Do I have to keep going?

But not in todays game.

80% of the nba can't shoot

There is can't shoot meaning a poor shooter and Nuri's don't even take the shot because I don't have a snowball's chance in h$ll of making it. Guess we don't have to worry about getting Nuri back on track anymore as he has become someone else's problem.

There is can't shoot meaning a poor shooter and Nuri's don't even take the shot because I don't have a snowball's chance in h$ll of making it. Guess we don't have to worry about getting Nuri back on track anymore as he has become someone else's problem.

Honestly he didn't even take enough shots for anyone to say he couldn't shoot. The only thing anyone is basing anything off of is FTs

Showtime over Nuri anyday although Nuri is a better defender!

Nuri maybe because of his upbringing , is a not as competitive as those others NBA guards that was mentioned.  That is what sets them a part Nuri. Rondo is a tenacious competitor he will help out on things don't show up on the stat sheet , to set of his poor jump shooting.Even during our winning streak Nuri used to hide in the corners & pout when things went wrong nothing major like Born ready or Cousins but a notch below & it was getting worst ever game. I was actually about to start thread about his body language. 

He can't shoot! Opposing teams  defenses  looked like they been watching a lot of film on him as the season went on, they used to sag by free throw line off of him because of his lack of Jumpshot & he just used to charge into them hence the higher T.O. ratio. FT% 57% is horrible.

Nuri is not as good as any of the JUCO guards from 2000 Hatten, Boosty or Hardy

This is a blessing in disguise if we get Amir for the 2nd semester

I just hope this doesn't mess us up with any other PA recruits because that state is a gold mine for B-Ball.