Bourgault and Hooper????

Quote from: newsman13 on January 10, 2013, 04:59:10 PM

Quote from: STJFAN on January 10, 2013, 04:47:11 PM

Quote from: Moose on January 10, 2013, 04:24:11 PM

Quote from: newsman13 on January 10, 2013, 04:21:16 PM

when he's out there, he's frozen out by players who don't want to give up their minutes to him.
 

Interesting theory.

Or maybe the players' know he's garbage so they pass the ball to someone else. I think that's a more likely theory. Players' want to win, nothing to gain by not passing a player a ball that will help you win, especially from those who are not competing at the same position.

right...a guy who shoots 40 percent from three and can hit his free throws...that's real garbage.  i'd rather have that kind of garbage than human highlight reel wanabes who can't put the ball in the ocean....and who are turnover machines at the foul line as pointed out by the game announcers.

There's more to it than stats and last I looked Marco was shooting 34% from three and 32% from the field. He has attempted 28 shots so far and 23 of them from three. I couldn't tell you if he was a good free throw shooter because he hasn't attempted any yet, is that's on coach Lavin to? He is a one dimensional player that is an insult to one dimensional players. What is with the love affair with Marco? Some of you may have a man crush.

Bottom line is last night he had the biggest PLUS differential on the team at PLUS 8 for the game and they scored 12 points in those 5 minutes which extends to 96 over 40 minutes without him scoring and getting only one rebound.  He had to have some influence in that stat--even if it was as a decoy.

Quote from: STJFAN on January 10, 2013, 04:47:11 PM

Quote from: Moose on January 10, 2013, 04:24:11 PM

Quote from: newsman13 on January 10, 2013, 04:21:16 PM

when he's out there, he's frozen out by players who don't want to give up their minutes to him.
 

Interesting theory.

Or maybe the players' know he's garbage so they pass the ball to someone else. I think that's a more likely theory. Players' want to win, nothing to gain by not passing a player a ball that will help you win, especially from those who are not competing at the same position.

Obviously you missed my sarcasm.

Seriously.  Newsie's sounding like Alex Jones more and more.  Looks like he didn't get out of FNC fast enough. 

Agree lavin does little to get Marco open. Marco does little to invoke himself would rather his minutes go to Felix. Felix gets himself into games .

Quote from: Chilleb on January 10, 2013, 03:29:45 PM

Quote from: Moose on January 10, 2013, 03:18:46 PM

Quote from: Chilleb on January 10, 2013, 03:12:30 PM

Quote from: Moose on January 10, 2013, 01:44:52 PM

Quote from: gman on January 10, 2013, 01:42:41 PM

Quote from: Moose on January 10, 2013, 01:29:47 PM

Quote from: gman on January 10, 2013, 01:27:42 PM

I don't have a problem having two spot up zone busters, but they need to run plays for them. I'm more over Dom. He has zero bball iq. He showed it time and time again last night and his ft shooting is terrible. I'd like to see his ship open up. Amir has much more upside.

Funny you say that about Dom coming off arguably he's 2nd best game of the year.  2-3 from the field.  7 boards.  6 of 8 from the line is solid.

Stats aside I saw him do a lot of dumb things. I'm just not a fan, name be he will prove me wrong.  He is an athlete but not a smart basketball player

He had 2 turnovers last night.  How many dumb things could he have done. 

No question he's an athlete and not a smart player.  Every couple games he has a good all around effort like last night.  Too far and few between however for arguably the highest ranked guy in last years class.

Moose I hear you but when your a top 30 recruit getting 20+ minutes a bit more consistency is expected from you, let's not baby Dom with his 2nd best performance last night of the season. When colleges enroll projected honor roll students who turn out to be really 1.8 GPA students they don't praise them once the GPA goes to 1.9, they are dismissed. This team is in need of that every night plus more and he doesn't show up. Like what is lavin doing? Did he recruit Dom to be a undersized 4? Oh wait what about the point guard talk before the season? As loyal fans I think we deserve answers, clarity and a better product. Greene must sit, Dom must sit.

I'm not babying him.  Just laying facts on the table.  Tough to say he should sit after his game last night.  Tough to say he's bad from the line when he went 6-8 last night. Etc....

Agree with all else you said.

Why as fans have we begin to put back on the ( settle for less) norm Roberts attitude and be satisfied with those types of performances, if the kid would have went for 18 10 and 6 then we give him some due for a breakout game like that, but those numbers are futile and should just speak more of how much of a bust he's been so far. When Dom was first recruited here none of us though that we would be praising a breakout game of 10 and 7 for him half way thru season 2 and he's been healthy since day 1.

Where did I say breakout?  I said it was one of his two or three best games of the year.  That's a fact.  You want him and you want Phil sitting.  Who do you want to play exactly.

As much as it sucks were 1-2 in conference all 3 games came down to 1 possession.

Last I checked last night we barely hit 50 points and Harrison as always had the bulk.  I'd point a finger to Karr last night who is same age as Pointer and more of offensive threat.  He hasn't done anything in 3 BE games.  All I wanted from Dom was a slight improvement YOY.  Not seeing it.  Plenty of stats I'm sure show players peak end of 2nd year into 3rd.  Im sure there a tons of examples that show it sooner as well.  Its not a cut and dry scenario.

Didn't say you said breakout moose, I'm saying that in comparison to his usual this can be labeled a breakout game for him, I agree with some pointing to karr, but I then I go back to guys have to be put in positions where he can succeed, I think last night ( I could be mistaken) was karr's first real highlight dunk of the year with a bit of defense on the picture, when his whole highlight tape coming in was nothing but posters. Karr is being forced to much to create his own offense, something he's not particularly strong in yet as oppose to having someone get him easy baskets, and I would love to see more of branch more of C jones instead of using Dom as a undersized 4 just use jones and more of Felix.

Chille, IMO part of jakarr's problem is that he's making his moves too late.  He can go by especially if he goes early at players.  Another issue are that his picks are terrible and his rolls are nonexistent.  When he rolls it is intended to get him open for a pass.  When he doesn't roll after the pick or lazily does so, he eliminates an opportunity to get the ball in his hands.  Offense only works if the kids buy in and learn to do some of these simple things better.

Quote from: STJFAN on January 10, 2013, 05:18:51 PM

What is with the love affair with Marco?

The white player is always the most popular player.

If he showed any game at all,  the Chris comparisions would be raining down.

While that would explain your love of Matt Brust, it does not apply to Marco as he is French, and no one really likes the French. I think it has more to do with people getting tired of Greene, Pointer and Garrett's inability to hit a jumper.

Quote from: carmineabbatiello on January 10, 2013, 05:27:56 PM

Quote from: STJFAN on January 10, 2013, 05:18:51 PM

What is with the love affair with Marco?

The white player is always the most popular player.

If he showed any game at all,  the Chris comparisions would be raining down.

While that would explain your love of Matt Brust, it does not apply to Marco as he is French, and no one really likes the French. I think it has more to do with people getting tired of Greene, Pointer and Garrett's inability to hit a jumper.

No, it's the skin color.

Quote from: STJFAN on January 10, 2013, 05:18:51 PM

What is with the love affair with Marco?

The white player is always the most popular player.

If he showed any game at all,  the Chris comparisions would be raining down.

Seriously? I think it's more the fact that he's supposedly a deadeye 3pt shooter and we desperately need a 3 point threat.

Quote from: carmineabbatiello on January 10, 2013, 05:27:56 PM

Quote from: STJFAN on January 10, 2013, 05:18:51 PM

What is with the love affair with Marco?

The white player is always the most popular player.

If he showed any game at all,  the Chris comparisions would be raining down.

Seriously? I think it's more the fact that he's supposedly a deadeye 3pt shooter and we desperately need a 3 point threat.

True.  Where's Avery "single game 3-point record holder" Patterson when you need him?

Quote from: newsman13 on January 10, 2013, 04:59:10 PM

Quote from: STJFAN on January 10, 2013, 04:47:11 PM

Quote from: Moose on January 10, 2013, 04:24:11 PM

Quote from: newsman13 on January 10, 2013, 04:21:16 PM

when he's out there, he's frozen out by players who don't want to give up their minutes to him.
 

Interesting theory.

Or maybe the players' know he's garbage so they pass the ball to someone else. I think that's a more likely theory. Players' want to win, nothing to gain by not passing a player a ball that will help you win, especially from those who are not competing at the same position.

right...a guy who shoots 40 percent from three and can hit his free throws...that's real garbage.  i'd rather have that kind of garbage than human highlight reel wanabes who can't put the ball in the ocean....and who are turnover machines at the foul line as pointed out by the game announcers.

There's more to it than stats and last I looked Marco was shooting 34% from three and 32% from the field. He has attempted 28 shots so far and 23 of them from three. I couldn't tell you if he was a good free throw shooter because he hasn't attempted any yet, is that's on coach Lavin to? He is a one dimensional player that is an insult to one dimensional players. What is with the love affair with Marco? Some of you may have a man crush.

But if he is your best (or at minimum one of your better) option, then you have to find time for him so that he can either 1) develop or 2) eliminate himself from consideration for PT...

To date, he has not been given enough (nor consistent) time to have eliminated himself nor develop...has a role but needs a distributor to be effective...PG4 is not that distributor..
 

Quote from: newsman13 on January 10, 2013, 04:59:10 PM

Quote from: STJFAN on January 10, 2013, 04:47:11 PM

Quote from: Moose on January 10, 2013, 04:24:11 PM

Quote from: newsman13 on January 10, 2013, 04:21:16 PM

when he's out there, he's frozen out by players who don't want to give up their minutes to him.
 

Interesting theory.

Or maybe the players' know he's garbage so they pass the ball to someone else. I think that's a more likely theory. Players' want to win, nothing to gain by not passing a player a ball that will help you win, especially from those who are not competing at the same position.

right...a guy who shoots 40 percent from three and can hit his free throws...that's real garbage.  i'd rather have that kind of garbage than human highlight reel wanabes who can't put the ball in the ocean....and who are turnover machines at the foul line as pointed out by the game announcers.

There's more to it than stats and last I looked Marco was shooting 34% from three and 32% from the field. He has attempted 28 shots so far and 23 of them from three. I couldn't tell you if he was a good free throw shooter because he hasn't attempted any yet, is that's on coach Lavin to? He is a one dimensional player that is an insult to one dimensional players. What is with the love affair with Marco? Some of you may have a man crush.

i'm looking at his junior college stats...the free throw line is the same.  it's called the law of large numbers.  that's something that apparently won't apply this season.

and carmine...how about giving the racism crap a rest? 

Quote from: STJFAN on January 10, 2013, 05:18:51 PM

Quote from: newsman13 on January 10, 2013, 04:59:10 PM

Quote from: STJFAN on January 10, 2013, 04:47:11 PM

Quote from: Moose on January 10, 2013, 04:24:11 PM

Quote from: newsman13 on January 10, 2013, 04:21:16 PM

when he's out there, he's frozen out by players who don't want to give up their minutes to him.
 

Interesting theory.

Or maybe the players' know he's garbage so they pass the ball to someone else. I think that's a more likely theory. Players' want to win, nothing to gain by not passing a player a ball that will help you win, especially from those who are not competing at the same position.

right...a guy who shoots 40 percent from three and can hit his free throws...that's real garbage.  i'd rather have that kind of garbage than human highlight reel wanabes who can't put the ball in the ocean....and who are turnover machines at the foul line as pointed out by the game announcers.

There's more to it than stats and last I looked Marco was shooting 34% from three and 32% from the field. He has attempted 28 shots so far and 23 of them from three. I couldn't tell you if he was a good free throw shooter because he hasn't attempted any yet, is that's on coach Lavin to? He is a one dimensional player that is an insult to one dimensional players. What is with the love affair with Marco? Some of you may have a man crush.

But if he is your best (or at minimum one of your better) option, then you have to find time for him so that he can either 1) develop or 2) eliminate himself from consideration for PT...

To date, he has not been given enough (nor consistent) time to have eliminated himself nor develop...has a role but needs a distributor to be effective...PG4 is not that distributor..

To be fair, playing with a distributor would help. However it is also true that he is finding time to develop and/or eliminate himself and that occurs in practice.

and carmine...how about giving the racism crap a rest?

I don't consider it racism.  I think it's quite natural for a fanbase to develop an affinity for the player that most resembles them when they look in the mirror.

Even in the movie "Invictus" when the national rugby team went to give a clinic at the segregated black encampment,  none of the children cared about meeting star player and captain Matt Damon but were thrilled to see and even started a chant of "Chester, Chester, Chester".

I don't consider it racism.  I think it's quite natural for a fanbase to develop an affinity for the player that most resembles them when they look in the mirror.

All SJU white guy team-my era
1. Chris Mullin
2. Bill Wennington
3. Robert Werdann
4. Ron Rowan
5. Matt Brust
That team would struggle

Quote from: STJFAN on January 10, 2013, 05:18:51 PM

Quote from: newsman13 on January 10, 2013, 04:59:10 PM

Quote from: STJFAN on January 10, 2013, 04:47:11 PM

Quote from: Moose on January 10, 2013, 04:24:11 PM

Quote from: newsman13 on January 10, 2013, 04:21:16 PM

when he's out there, he's frozen out by players who don't want to give up their minutes to him.
 

Interesting theory.

Or maybe the players' know he's garbage so they pass the ball to someone else. I think that's a more likely theory. Players' want to win, nothing to gain by not passing a player a ball that will help you win, especially from those who are not competing at the same position.

right...a guy who shoots 40 percent from three and can hit his free throws...that's real garbage.  i'd rather have that kind of garbage than human highlight reel wanabes who can't put the ball in the ocean....and who are turnover machines at the foul line as pointed out by the game announcers.

There's more to it than stats and last I looked Marco was shooting 34% from three and 32% from the field. He has attempted 28 shots so far and 23 of them from three. I couldn't tell you if he was a good free throw shooter because he hasn't attempted any yet, is that's on coach Lavin to? He is a one dimensional player that is an insult to one dimensional players. What is with the love affair with Marco? Some of you may have a man crush.

i'm looking at his junior college stats...the free throw line is the same.  it's called the law of large numbers.  that's something that apparently won't apply this season.

and carmine...how about giving the racism crap a rest?

Nuri shot 74% from the free throw line at Redlands CC, how did that turn out? Marco may be a good free throw shooter but my point about us not knowing is more about his lack of aggression. He does nothing with the ball when he catches it but pass it to someone else. No one is saying that we have to run D'lo off screens, and he's not quick by any stretch. D'lo takes his shots and he's a damn good shooter. At some point, Marco has to assert himself, but maybe, just maybe..... he might be unable to. Can't that be a possibility? Doesn't mean he isn't useful to the team.   

I don't consider it racism.  I think it's quite natural for a fanbase to develop an affinity for the player that most resembles them when they look in the mirror.

All SJU white guy team-my era
1. Chris Mullin
2. Bill Wennington
3. Robert Werdann
4. Ron Rowan
5. Matt Brust
That team would struggle

Good you wrote in the "my era" part or you might have started a riot.  The Al Seiden fans would have hammered you.   

Not familar with his work, but he sounds like a dentist. Guys prior to my era would be Paultz, Schaefer, Loughery and the McGuires I guess.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Seiden

In case anyone else was not familar with Dr Seiden's work

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Seiden

In case anyone else was not familar with Dr Seiden's work

Averaged 20 and 22 points in the pre-shotclock era?  Pretty much puts him ahead of Chris on the all-time, all-time list.

Ken McIntyre and maybe his brother Bobby deserve some consideration too.