Played with More Toughness: Norm Roberts Era or Steve Lavin Era

Go....

How did Linda post as Dave? 

I'd say the team that made it to the tourney in 11 that Norm recruited but Lav coached was by far the mentally and physically toughest team we've had in a long long time. DJ, Evans, Boothe  and even Horne showed no fear against bigger players and Hardy had a mental toughness that none of Lav's recruits have come close to matching.

I don't even know who the toughest guy of the Lav era is. Gift is the toughest guy on the current team as all the other bigs are soft. I think Harrison and Sheed can show some mental toughness by carrying the team to a huge road or BE tourney win

Zero chemistry. Can't build a team like its a fantasy rotisserie league.  Does anyone on this team have a role? Whose the leader? Whose the spark off the bench? The stopper? The go to guy? Hustler ? Ball hawk?

Thanks, Baldi.

Thanks, Baldi.

You're quite welcome! You recognize quality when you see it

Norm would kick the bejesus out of Lavin. I assume a tale of the tape is forthcoming.

Norm turned men into women. That's a very silly question. The 2006-2007 Red Shit Storm was the softest team we've ever had. Don't mistake a bad season opener for a lack of toughness. Pointer is one of the toughest players we've had in the last 20 years. He can't shoot. That doesn't mean he isn't tough.

Against WV, SU, Uconn, Louisville, Nova, Duke etc. how often did Norm's teams not give up from tip off? Oh, but he usually out-toughed Rutgers. (Except when the game actually mattered).

To their credit, DJ Kennedy and Paris Horne were tough players. Justin Burrell, Malik Boothe, Eugene Lawrence, Lamont Middleton, Avery Patterson, Larry Wright Qu'raan Calhoun, Anthony Mason Jr, Aaron Spears and Ricky Torres were all soft on both ends of the court.

Norm turned men into women. That's a very silly question. The 2006-2007 Red Shit Storm was the softest team we've ever had. Don't mistake a bad season opener for a lack of toughness. Pointer is one of the toughest players we've had in the last 20 years. He can't shoot. That doesn't mean he isn't tough.

Against WV, SU, Uconn, Louisville, Nova, Duke etc. how often did Norm's teams not give up from tip off? Oh, but he usually out-toughed Rutgers. (Except when the game actually mattered).

To their credit, DJ Kennedy and Paris Horne were tough players. Justin Burrell, Malik Boothe, Eugene Lawrence, Lamont Middleton, Avery Patterson, Larry Wright Qu'raan Calhoun, Anthony Mason Jr, Aaron Spears and Ricky Torres were all soft on both ends of the court.

When it comes to knowing which players are the butchest you're my go to poster.

Zero chemistry. Can't build a team like its a fantasy rotisserie league.  Does anyone on this team have a role? Whose the leader? Whose the spark off the bench? The stopper? The go to guy? Hustler ? Ball hawk?

Leaders: Greene and Harrison. Go to guy: Harrison. Spark off the bench: Pointer. Ball hawk: Pointer and Jordan. Who was our leader for 6 years under Norm Roberts? DJ Kennedy had to be. Only he wasn't good enough to carry them on either side of the ball. Eugene Lawrence was an awful leader. Justin Burrell was one of the biggest busts in school history followed by Rob Thomas, Anthony Mason Jr and Ricky Torres.

The only thing Norm did better than Lavin was recruit kids that stayed on the court, stayed in school, and for the most part, played by the rules. Except for Aaron Spears, and then Derwin Kitchen, who's absence ruined our season in 2006-2007.

Quote from: Poison on January 03, 2014, 08:28:18 AM

Norm turned men into women. That's a very silly question. The 2006-2007 Red Shit Storm was the softest team we've ever had. Don't mistake a bad season opener for a lack of toughness. Pointer is one of the toughest players we've had in the last 20 years. He can't shoot. That doesn't mean he isn't tough.

Against WV, SU, Uconn, Louisville, Nova, Duke etc. how often did Norm's teams not give up from tip off? Oh, but he usually out-toughed Rutgers. (Except when the game actually mattered).

To their credit, DJ Kennedy and Paris Horne were tough players. Justin Burrell, Malik Boothe, Eugene Lawrence, Lamont Middleton, Avery Patterson, Larry Wright Qu'raan Calhoun, Anthony Mason Jr, Aaron Spears and Ricky Torres were all soft on both ends of the court.

When it comes to knowing which players are the butchest you're my go to poster.

Make a point. You haven't yet.

Norm would kick the bejesus out of Lavin. I assume a tale of the tape is forthcoming.

Want to watch upperclassmen lose by 50 at home? Go get your tape.

Norm turned men into women. That's a very silly question. The 2006-2007 Red Shit Storm was the softest team we've ever had. Don't mistake a bad season opener for a lack of toughness. Pointer is one of the toughest players we've had in the last 20 years. He can't shoot. That doesn't mean he isn't tough.

Against WV, SU, Uconn, Louisville, Nova, Duke etc. how often did Norm's teams not give up from tip off? Oh, but he usually out-toughed Rutgers. (Except when the game actually mattered).

To their credit, DJ Kennedy and Paris Horne were tough players. Justin Burrell, Malik Boothe, Eugene Lawrence, Lamont Middleton, Avery Patterson, Larry Wright Qu'raan Calhoun, Anthony Mason Jr, Aaron Spears and Ricky Torres were all soft on both ends of the court.

Lamont Middleton was tough as nails. He was Louie's player and I'll take him in a minute. Monty Hamilton I think was the guy you meant to put in the soft column and I'll take him too. I don't want to say which 2 bigs I would give up so as not to insult current members of the roster, but their are 2 there. I would never put Boothe on a list of sof players. Geno was limited but not soft. When paired with Hill he played ok. Middleton and Hamilton might make us a top 15 team. Might be just me gabbin but that happens here.

I'm with Poison on this one, those blowout losses under Norm were pathetic.

This team has had a chance to win every game this year, just haven't come through all the way, but they have been there. I'm not saying moral victories, I don't believe in those, but I am talking a direct comparison to Norm, I'd rather be competitive and lose by 6-10, then get blown out and be down 20 at half. Those games were pathetic.

Tough is often used to describe a team short on talent, which Norm always was. The guys were tough because they couldnt score more than 60 pts, and the game plan was centered around grinding the other team to play down to our level. If you wanna call that tough, go ahead, but I'm not buying it.

I remember Norm era guys, Ryan Williams and Aaron Spears regularly getting into near-fist fights. Straight up brawls were always about to break out. In terms of in-game toughness, Harrison is fearless. Not afraid to draw contact and play physical. However, all of the guys Lavin took over from Norm his first year all had so much heart.

Norm turned men into women. That's a very silly question. The 2006-2007 Red Shit Storm was the softest team we've ever had. Don't mistake a bad season opener for a lack of toughness. Pointer is one of the toughest players we've had in the last 20 years. He can't shoot. That doesn't mean he isn't tough.

Against WV, SU, Uconn, Louisville, Nova, Duke etc. how often did Norm's teams not give up from tip off? Oh, but he usually out-toughed Rutgers. (Except when the game actually mattered).

To their credit, DJ Kennedy and Paris Horne were tough players. Justin Burrell, Malik Boothe, Eugene Lawrence, Lamont Middleton, Avery Patterson, Larry Wright Qu'raan Calhoun, Anthony Mason Jr, Aaron Spears and Ricky Torres were all soft on both ends of the court.

I agree with this for the most part. Go back and read some of the posts after games from 07-08, 08-09, 09-10 and see what was said.  We tend to remember just the year in which they made the tournament because it's our last memory of them.

Norms teams got killed not because they were soft but because they sucked. Before the Xavier game I said this team has more talent then the 99 team. I stand by that. This team is talented. But they play stupid. Their help defense isn't slow , they don't look to help until the ball is in the basket .
Basketball teams need a pg like football teams need a qb. Look at the packers.

When thinking of Norms "guys" it seems like most think about the players that Lavin took over for. I believe Norm recruited those player 5-6 years into his tenure. This is Lavin's first and second class. He was away from recruiting for awhile. We will see Lavin bring in more talented players in year five and six. Class for class, Lavin recruits are tougher and better players hands down. Who was in Norm's first two recruiting classes and tell me who is more tougher.

Norms teams got killed not because they were soft but because they sucked. Before the Xavier game I said this team has more talent then the 99 team. I stand by that. This team is talented. But they play stupid. Their help defense isn't slow , they don't look to help until the ball is in the basket .
Basketball teams need a pg like football teams need a qb. Look at the packers.

I disagree. This team is more deeper, no way are they more talented. If I was drafting a team from both rosters Barkely and Artest would be my first picks. Then I would go with Obekpa and right back to Bootsy, Postell, and Grant. I think we could have won the National Championship with that team and only one player from the current roster. We may struggle to make the tournament this year and you think we have more talent?

A loss is a loss whether it's by 50 or 10. Losing to bum teams with this talented roster is just as bad as losing by 40 with a non big east talented roster such as Norms