The missing ingredient.....

I keep scratching my head, and always seem to come back to the change in performance when Dunlap left.  Why was the performance so much better that first year with recruits from Lavin's predecessor? Team performance prior to that was similar to the present. What are your thoughts?

Lavin and Dunlap both on the sidelines.  Somewhat disciplined players.

Brains. iQ

That team was all seniors.  The main players now are juniors, a freshmen and one or two sophomores depending on what King Crimson' s role will be going forward.  Your comparison is askewed.  Comparing next years team with our lone tournament appearing team makes more sense.

Not only was that team all seniors but they were phycially developed, older, mature men in their early 20's, playing against teams with freshmen and sophmores. And let's not forget that season started off as a disaster until Lavin got the team to buy into his system.

Not only was that team all seniors but they were phycially developed, older, mature men in their early 20's, playing against teams with freshmen and sophmores. And let's not forget that season started off as a disaster until Lavin got the team to buy into his system.

His system that year was the match up zone, and let Hardy do his thing. Problem is, what is his system now

Not only was that team all seniors but they were phycially developed, older, mature men in their early 20's, playing against teams with freshmen and sophmores. And let's not forget that season started off as a disaster until Lavin got the team to buy into his system.

They were 1 year older than D'angelo, Phil, Dom, Branch, Gift etc are.   Jakarr also prepped for a year so he's nearly a junior.
They're not that young.   This team has a ton of  experience.   

Quote from: loughlinguy on January 10, 2014, 10:44:31 AM

Not only was that team all seniors but they were phycially developed, older, mature men in their early 20's, playing against teams with freshmen and sophmores. And let's not forget that season started off as a disaster until Lavin got the team to buy into his system.

They were 1 year older than D'angelo, Phil, Dom, Branch, Gift etc are.   Jakarr also prepped for a year so he's nearly a junior.
They're not that young.   This team has a ton of  experience.   

The year George Mason went to the FF their seniors were only a year away from being juniors, when they didn't go to the FF. It's only a year but it's an important year.

Quote from: desco80 on January 10, 2014, 11:56:10 AM

Quote from: loughlinguy on January 10, 2014, 10:44:31 AM

Not only was that team all seniors but they were phycially developed, older, mature men in their early 20's, playing against teams with freshmen and sophmores. And let's not forget that season started off as a disaster until Lavin got the team to buy into his system.

They were 1 year older than D'angelo, Phil, Dom, Branch, Gift etc are.   Jakarr also prepped for a year so he's nearly a junior.
They're not that young.   This team has a ton of  experience.   

The year George Mason went to the FF their seniors were only a year away from being juniors, when they didn't go to the FF. It's only a year but it's an important year.

So you're saying Lavin will be a genius next year?   

Quote from: loughlinguy on January 10, 2014, 10:44:31 AM

Not only was that team all seniors but they were phycially developed, older, mature men in their early 20's, playing against teams with freshmen and sophmores. And let's not forget that season started off as a disaster until Lavin got the team to buy into his system.

They were 1 year older than D'angelo, Phil, Dom, Branch, Gift etc are.   Jakarr also prepped for a year so he's nearly a junior.
They're not that young.   This team has a ton of  experience.   

That team was better balanced in terms of talent than this current team. Hardy, Horne, DJ, Brownlee, 4/5 of the starting line up could hit a jump shot. Burrell was a formalable low post presence. Our best shooter, D'lo, shoots sub 40% from the field. We don't have a low post presence. We run and jump. Our players have higher ceilings. whether they reach though is another story.

Quote from: desco80 on January 10, 2014, 11:56:10 AM

Quote from: loughlinguy on January 10, 2014, 10:44:31 AM

Not only was that team all seniors but they were phycially developed, older, mature men in their early 20's, playing against teams with freshmen and sophmores. And let's not forget that season started off as a disaster until Lavin got the team to buy into his system.

They were 1 year older than D'angelo, Phil, Dom, Branch, Gift etc are.   Jakarr also prepped for a year so he's nearly a junior.
They're not that young.   This team has a ton of  experience.   

The year George Mason went to the FF their seniors were only a year away from being juniors, when they didn't go to the FF. It's only a year but it's an important year.

Hardy and Brownlee had 1 year of BE ball under their belts, and they were arguably the nucleus of the team.   

But, I concede the point.    I'm just not in the mood to accept any of Lavin's excuses lately, which is probably clouding my judgment, because obviously experience is important.

Quote from: Foad on January 10, 2014, 12:05:04 PM

Quote from: desco80 on January 10, 2014, 11:56:10 AM

Quote from: loughlinguy on January 10, 2014, 10:44:31 AM

Not only was that team all seniors but they were phycially developed, older, mature men in their early 20's, playing against teams with freshmen and sophmores. And let's not forget that season started off as a disaster until Lavin got the team to buy into his system.

They were 1 year older than D'angelo, Phil, Dom, Branch, Gift etc are.   Jakarr also prepped for a year so he's nearly a junior.
They're not that young.   This team has a ton of  experience.   

The year George Mason went to the FF their seniors were only a year away from being juniors, when they didn't go to the FF. It's only a year but it's an important year.

Hardy and Brownlee had 1 year of BE ball under their belts, and they were arguably the nucleus of the team.   

But, I concede the point.    I'm just not in the mood to accept any of Lavin's excuses lately, which is probably clouding my judgment, because obviously experience is important.

I must say Coach would be better served expressing his disappointment with team performance & taking responsibility to get the team going v. noting team is where he expected it to be. Players have not performed well, nor has staff. Everyone should be held accountable to improve things. Offering excuses is counterproductive. Manning up isn't.

 Here is a pearl of wisdom for ya'll.... The missing ingredient is.....wait for it...... Wins... 

 All this crap and over analysis goes away with a few decent wins.. 

Here is a pearl of wisdom for ya'll.... The missing ingredient is.....wait for it...... Wins... 

 All this crap and over analysis goes away with a few decent wins.. 

...just like in 2010!

Then, it was the players that we were ready to kick to the curb.  They were Norm's recruits and they all sucked.  Now we speak so fondly of them.  Frankly, I loved that team.  They were a great bunch of guys who ended their careers on a pretty decent run.  It was so unfortunate that DJ went down with the injury or it could have been a very good run.

These guys will learn to coach.  At some point, it will click for Rico, Tony, Darrick and Jim.  Hopefully, Lavin will then be smart enough to listen to them.

The coach's disappointment with the team is reflected in his activating Balamou and starting a walk on. He is sending a message to certain guys on the team. Whether they get it is another matter.

Here is a pearl of wisdom for ya'll.... The missing ingredient is.....wait for it...... Wins... 

 All this crap and over analysis goes away with a few decent wins.. 

Wins?  I suggest it goes away with one Win...Singular.  If they only beat Wright and Co. tomorrow,  then their record is dead on tract with what many posters expected at this point of the season.

Quote from: boo3 on January 10, 2014, 01:31:57 PM

Here is a pearl of wisdom for ya'll.... The missing ingredient is.....wait for it...... Wins... 

 All this crap and over analysis goes away with a few decent wins.. 

Wins?  I suggest it goes away with one Win...Singular.  If they only beat Wright and Co. tomorrow,  then their record is dead on tract with what many posters expected at this point of the season.

We wouldn't be far behind, but even with a win tomorrow I think we would still be behind where most fans expected the team to be.  Not by much, probably a game or two - but I think some fans expected us to split Wisconsin-Syracuse; no one thought we'd lose to PSU; and most probably expected a split between Georgetown - Xavier.   

Quote from: carmineabbatiello on January 10, 2014, 05:04:50 PM

Quote from: boo3 on January 10, 2014, 01:31:57 PM

Here is a pearl of wisdom for ya'll.... The missing ingredient is.....wait for it...... Wins... 

 All this crap and over analysis goes away with a few decent wins.. 

Wins?  I suggest it goes away with one Win...Singular.  If they only beat Wright and Co. tomorrow,  then their record is dead on tract with what many posters expected at this point of the season.

We wouldn't be far behind, but even with a win tomorrow I think we would still be behind where most fans expected the team to be.  Not by much, probably a game or two - but I think some fans expected us to split Wisconsin-Syracuse; no one thought we'd lose to PSU; and most probably expected a split between Georgetown - Xavier.   

Definitely behind because as of right now this team has no quality wins. It's going to be near impossible to make the tournament if you don't win those games (Xavier, Georgetown, Villanova, Marquette, Creighton).

Gentlemen, the missing ingredient is time.  In 2010-2011, Dunlap drew up one of the craziest defenses in the country at Lavin's request.  They all but threw away the first half of the season hoping they would be better off come February.  They were 11-8 at the end of January, with 25+ point losses to Louisville any Georgetown (sound familiar?) and losses to St. Mary's, St Bonaventure, and Fordham.  They got it.  That team was offensively challenged--even more so than this group-but they learned to get easy buckets from defense and quick secondary transition.

This team is way younger.  Our best player is a raw freshman, we have two sophs out of our top six players and our starting center is playing his first year of D-1 basketball while adjusting to  the speed of live Big East ball.  Whitesell might not be Dunlap or he might even end up being better, but the dude was just hired 5-6 months ago.  Some posters were questioning his impact after the exhibition games! 

It makes sense that it is taking this younger group some time, but I think they will be better than that 2010-2011 team.

Gentlemen, the missing ingredient is time.  In 2010-2011, Dunlap drew up one of the craziest defenses in the country at Lavin's request.  They all but threw away the first half of the season hoping they would be better off come February.  They were 11-8 at the end of January, with 25+ point losses to Louisville any Georgetown (sound familiar?) and losses to St. Mary's, St Bonaventure, and Fordham.  They got it.  That team was offensively challenged--even more so than this group-but they learned to get easy buckets from defense and quick secondary transition.

This team is way younger.  Our best player is a raw freshman, we have two sophs out of our top six players and our starting center is playing his first year of D-1 basketball while adjusting to  the speed of live Big East ball.  Whitesell might not be Dunlap or he might even end up being better, but the dude was just hired 5-6 months ago.  Some posters were questioning his impact after the exhibition games! 

It makes sense that it is taking this younger group some time, but I think they will be better than that 2010-2011 team.

I wonder how many on the boards were satisfied with the 11-8 record.  There's almost 20 games left for this group to pull even or ahead of that group.