Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck

  • 1170 replies
  • 208106 views
Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #120 on: March 22, 2014, 07:51:02 PM »
I'm glad posters have brought up Jarvis as maybe that name will help us reflect on where we are as a basketball program and more broadly as an institution with Steve Lavin as our coach.  He is the highest profile person associated with St. John's University.  He is always enthusiastic and positive.  Likeable and witty.  Always grateful to the institution.  Treats the players with respect and isn't afraid to make tough decisions in their best interests.  I've always felt proud, even in losses, that he cares about his players and the reputation of the institution.  He isn't winning at the level we'd/he'd hoped but I feel like we are moving in the right direction and we're doing things the right way.  I care about winning and expect that we will win (and make the NCAAs), but laterally I think having the enigmatic Steve Lavin as our coach provides security to our institution's most valuable brand (basketball) in an uncertain world (think Buzz Williams), and enhances the value of a SJU degree.

The Jarvis era was just a blight to our program.  Scandals with the NCAA: first the Barclay thing and later the Keita and other stuff.  Probably worst of all from my perspective as a SJU guy I never got the sense that he respected our institution.  Always rumors about him leaving for a better job.  When he lost his excuse was that we didn't have the facilities to compete.  On the flip side, Lavin acts like SJU is possibly the best job in the world, he embraces our history (even the NIT history, making the most out of a disappointing season).  Jarvis just radiated negativity in my book.

I understand the shortcomings of Lavin and concede just about all the points made against him as an Xs and Os guy.  But I think his style can win with the right assistant coaches around him.  I think he is a great recruiter.  I won't be disappointed if he continues to take "hammer to rock" at SJU well into the future as think we'll continue to compete and at least be interesting.

goredmen

  • *****
  • 5066
Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #121 on: March 22, 2014, 08:17:59 PM »

I understand the shortcomings of Lavin and concede just about all the points made against him as an Xs and Os guy.  But I think his style can win with the right assistant coaches around him.  I think he is a great recruiter.  I won't be disappointed if he continues to take "hammer to rock" at SJU well into the future as think we'll continue to compete and at least be interesting.

What is his style exactly?

Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #122 on: March 22, 2014, 08:56:32 PM »
Lavin has done a good job in his time (3 or 4 years) at St. John's.  Jarvis didn't win with his class or players he got the best from Fraschilla's guys.  Lavin's biggest down fall is that he hasn't gotten as much traction in NYC nothing from NJ and he never replaced Dunlap.  If I'm coaching I want my staff to be a feeder for other Division I programs.  I'm not saying we have crap on the bench but when was the last time we heard glowing remarks about the staff???  Lavin is a recruiter, that is the best asset he has brought to St. John's when he had Dunlap he had someone who was all X's and O's and clearly that is part of what is missing because the team showed a total lack of basketball IQ and that falls on Lavin and his staff...and on the players. 
Follow me @ek_underdog

Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #123 on: March 22, 2014, 11:03:14 PM »
absolutely agree with everything underdog says.  Lavin needs to do more to keep top NY and NJ talent at home.  Harkless was a "pied piper" of sorts but not in our area.  And I agree about our coaching staff.

What is Lavin's style?  Less Xs and Os and more teacher, mentor, leader.  He wants to set a tone, foster a culture, and contribute to both the basketball and personal growth of his players.  He wants to win too, but I think he sees a big picture of life and basketball and thinks about his legacy.  His style in pregame, timeouts, and postgame is always philosophical with urgings of his players to find courage and tap the energy from deep within.  That is all good.  Lavin calls Keady his "Mr. Mayagi" but really he is projecting something onto Keady that he really strives for himself, to be a zen master coach.  The problem with being Mr. Mayagi is that a coach like that needs basketball players around him with great leadership skills and high basketball IQs or a coaching staff that can contribute the Xs and Os.  With Dunlap on our bench, it was a better dynamic as he filled that void for us.

Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #124 on: March 23, 2014, 12:24:10 AM »
That assistant from Kansas who once coached in the CUNY conference sure succeeded.

happyrappy is pretty much on point. Whoever think "the next Shaka" even things about coming here has to be puffing on the world's most potent chronic.

Also, canning a Coach coming off a 20 win season and a coach that won 20 games 2 out of 3 or 4 years (depending if you count cancer year or not) isn't the way to attract young coaching talent.

That's garbage, the twenty wins are bogus, the competition was weak, the Big East was bogus, as is playing out in the Big Dance.  Actually, this team did better last year.  If we had to face the same competition the record would have  been worse. 

For those of you who believe that we can't do any better then Lavin, go root for another team.  A real fan of the program aspires to much better then Lavin has given us.  If you happy with regular appearances in the NIT then sure Lavin is the right coach for the job but as happened at UCLA with superior talent to our present roster, the cookie will invariably crumble.

Foad

  • *****
  • 6065
Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #125 on: March 23, 2014, 08:09:52 AM »

Tha Kid

  • *****
  • 4662
"I drink and I know things"

Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #127 on: March 23, 2014, 09:38:18 AM »


Poison

  • *****
  • 16896
Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #129 on: March 23, 2014, 10:34:31 AM »
Lavin has done a good job in his time (3 or 4 years) at St. John's.  Jarvis didn't win with his class or players he got the best from Fraschilla's guys.  Lavin's biggest down fall is that he hasn't gotten as much traction in NYC nothing from NJ and he never replaced Dunlap.  If I'm coaching I want my staff to be a feeder for other Division I programs.  I'm not saying we have crap on the bench but when was the last time we heard glowing remarks about the staff???  Lavin is a recruiter, that is the best asset he has brought to St. John's when he had Dunlap he had someone who was all X's and O's and clearly that is part of what is missing because the team showed a total lack of basketball IQ and that falls on Lavin and his staff...and on the players. 

Jarvis won the nit and made the NCAAs with his own guys. Lavin won one nit game with his guys. If you want to compare Apples to apples, then actually do it.

mkras99

  • *****
  • 1162
Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #130 on: March 23, 2014, 10:44:36 AM »
Lavin leave yet?

Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #131 on: March 23, 2014, 10:55:42 AM »
jarvis won with frans riverside  guys....artist, jessie, barkley etc.

Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #132 on: March 23, 2014, 10:56:19 AM »
Hearing this is done deal. Time for both parties to move on. Get Massiello on the phone ASAP


How long does a done deal take?

nudginator59

  • *****
  • 1437
  • It's better to be a Smart ass then a Dumb shart
Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #133 on: March 23, 2014, 11:09:38 AM »
Lavin has done a good job in his time (3 or 4 years) at St. John's.  Jarvis didn't win with his class or players he got the best from Fraschilla's guys.  Lavin's biggest down fall is that he hasn't gotten as much traction in NYC nothing from NJ and he never replaced Dunlap.  If I'm coaching I want my staff to be a feeder for other Division I programs.  I'm not saying we have crap on the bench but when was the last time we heard glowing remarks about the staff???  Lavin is a recruiter, that is the best asset he has brought to St. John's when he had Dunlap he had someone who was all X's and O's and clearly that is part of what is missing because the team showed a total lack of basketball IQ and that falls on Lavin and his staff...and on the players. 

Jarvis won the nit and made the NCAAs with his own guys. Lavin won one nit game with his guys. If you want to compare Apples to apples, then actually do it.
He won nothing, the NIT was vacated...Me running onto the court after the NIT victory was vacated as well...That would would have been my excuse if MSG ever pressed charges. The NCAA has that kind of power making things no longer count right?
Cougar O' Malley

Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #134 on: March 23, 2014, 11:17:20 AM »
Hearing this is done deal. Time for both parties to move on. Get Massiello on the phone ASAP


How long does a done deal take?

With this school?

SJUFAN

  • *****
  • 2280
Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #135 on: March 23, 2014, 11:48:21 AM »
I heard from the guy on the corner that his nephew's friend's father played for the retired HS basketball coach. This may have some legs to it.

Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #136 on: March 23, 2014, 12:28:16 PM »
I'm glad posters have brought up Jarvis as maybe that name will help us reflect on where we are as a basketball program and more broadly as an institution with Steve Lavin as our coach.  He is the highest profile person associated with St. John's University.  He is always enthusiastic and positive.  Likeable and witty.  Always grateful to the institution.  Treats the players with respect and isn't afraid to make tough decisions in their best interests.  I've always felt proud, even in losses, that he cares about his players and the reputation of the institution.  He isn't winning at the level we'd/he'd hoped but I feel like we are moving in the right direction and we're doing things the right way.  I care about winning and expect that we will win (and make the NCAAs), but laterally I think having the enigmatic Steve Lavin as our coach provides security to our institution's most valuable brand (basketball) in an uncertain world (think Buzz Williams), and enhances the value of a SJU degree.

The Jarvis era was just a blight to our program.  Scandals with the NCAA: first the Barclay thing and later the Keita and other stuff.  Probably worst of all from my perspective as a SJU guy I never got the sense that he respected our institution.  Always rumors about him leaving for a better job.  When he lost his excuse was that we didn't have the facilities to compete.  On the flip side, Lavin acts like SJU is possibly the best job in the world, he embraces our history (even the NIT history, making the most out of a disappointing season).  Jarvis just radiated negativity in my book.

I understand the shortcomings of Lavin and concede just about all the points made against him as an Xs and Os guy.  But I think his style can win with the right assistant coaches around him.  I think he is a great recruiter.  I won't be disappointed if he continues to take "hammer to rock" at SJU well into the future as think we'll continue to compete and at least be interesting.

I'm just really back and forth on him.  On one hand, I agree with everything you just said.  He brings such a positive light to the St. John's brand.  He's always speaking to the press and is generally regarded as a good guy in basketball circles.  And even though I have no proof to back this up, he seems to do things the right way.

On the other hand, it's really hard to ignore the coaching deficiencies that he does have.  In a weak Big East this year, the team flat out underperformed.  From the first game of the season on, this team look extremely shaky.  Bad lineups, misuse of players, no sense of organized basketball plays, the same mistakes over and over and over, awful use of timeouts.  The list goes on.  And the fact that over the course of an entire season these issues were not fixed really speaks for itself.  But on the other hand, is the grass always greener?  I mean, yes there are some good young coaches out there.  Masiello and Hurley to name a couple.  But despite people's arguments, we've gone down this road before.  I remember reading article after article about how Norm Roberts was the right choice for St. John's.  Dick Vitale listed him as one of the hot names out there and he was a flat out home run for SJU.  And then we all quickly realized that Norm was never meant to be a HC at this level.

Either way, I just want some stability at the HC position.  Bring in somebody (or keep somebody) who wants to be here and build around them.  If that is Lavin, fine.  But make sure he has the proper assistant coaches to take this team to the next level.

Tiznow

  • ****
  • 581
Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #137 on: March 23, 2014, 12:54:43 PM »
I was speaking to a retired high school coach who confirmed what Baldi is saying.  Lavin may, in fact, be on the way out.

I was speaking with retired high school coach who confirmed that Baldi has been planning to post a BS rumor about Lavin leaving. 

Foad

  • *****
  • 6065
Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #138 on: March 23, 2014, 12:58:43 PM »
But make sure he has the proper assistant coaches to take this team to the next level.

Perhaps we could skip the next level and jump to the one after that.

SJUFAN

  • *****
  • 2280
Re: Thanks Coach Lavin, good luck
« Reply #139 on: March 23, 2014, 01:25:12 PM »
In a weak Big East this year, the team flat out underperformed. 

I'm still not sure how finishing tied for third when the coaches poll picked us to finish 5th, is considered underperforming. Yes we could have done better but we still finished higher than was predicted. Marquette on the other hand, who has as much top 100 talent on their roster as we do, was picked to finish 1st and a preseason top 25 team, finished 6th in the same weak BE. Does that mean Buzz is a terrible coach? Players need to perform, they need to make plays, make shots. I like the direction the program is heading.