Is SJU the BEST athletic school in Big East?

Coach Blank does a great job with the baseball team. Two years ago was the first losing season in as long a time as I can remember, and last year they finished above .500 but didn't make it past the Big East Tourney. But they rebounded well and won the Big East this season with a fun team.

Wish more people went to the baseball games, the non-conference games are free to attend.

Quote from: Foad on May 10, 2015, 09:02:13 AM

Quote from: Dave on May 09, 2015, 08:58:33 PM

So overall is there a better school in the conference?

Odd that the one program for which Monasch presumably labors under micromanagement - he has to accept input from the BOT, donors, the administration, Lou etc - has been a disappointment and the rest of the programs - that nobody cares about and for which he presumably exercises autonomous control - are very successful. Argues for his competence, contrary to the conventional wisdom.

To be fair, Ed Manetta hired most of the coaches that are still doing well at St. John's. I think softball and W. Basketball are the only sports with new coaches (besides golf this year). Not sure about the tennis teams.

Funny you should mention Manetta...

Quote from: stjohnnie75 on May 10, 2015, 05:42:26 PM

Quote from: Foad on May 10, 2015, 09:02:13 AM

Quote from: Dave on May 09, 2015, 08:58:33 PM

So overall is there a better school in the conference?

Odd that the one program for which Monasch presumably labors under micromanagement - he has to accept input from the BOT, donors, the administration, Lou etc - has been a disappointment and the rest of the programs - that nobody cares about and for which he presumably exercises autonomous control - are very successful. Argues for his competence, contrary to the conventional wisdom.

To be fair, Ed Manetta hired most of the coaches that are still doing well at St. John's. I think softball and W. Basketball are the only sports with new coaches (besides golf this year). Not sure about the tennis teams.

Funny you should mention Manetta...

He coming back?  Would be a breath of fresh air.

Quote from: MCNPA on May 10, 2015, 04:41:30 PM

Quote from: Wods317 on May 10, 2015, 04:32:28 PM

Quote from: MCNPA on May 10, 2015, 04:14:29 PM

Quote from: Wods317 on May 10, 2015, 10:30:10 AM

The softball team had been terrible for a few years but has really bounced back. We have very well respected baseball and soccer programs although the men's team has fallen off a little late. Lacrosse is also a sport with all the talent around here that we could be good at next but aren't there yet. We are definitely in the top 2 I'd say possibly the best

Lacrosse team has actually been quite good over last few years and been at or near top 20 level the past few years.  This year is a bit of a rebuilding year because we lost a ton of starters to graduation.  Lax team has been better than average recently though.

I worked with the athletic department and helped with lax games for 3 years at St. John's and love the program but they have not been as successful as your saying. They had one very strong year around 3 years ago probably 2013 where they were borderline to be ranked. Other then that they have been at best a .500 team. They are definitely improving but if they keep some more of the tops kids home they could be very good. Sounds a lot like what people are saying about basketball. They basically started the program from scratch and the coaches have done a great job. The facilities for lacrosse are pretty poor on campus. They've done what they can to improve it but needs an overhaul.

In the past few years I think we have been ranked as high as 14th at one point.   Agree, we are not consistently ranked but have come a long way.  We are at a point where we are generallyt he best of the local teams like sbu and hofstra who we couldn't even compete with a few years ago.  It's time to make the next step.   Agree, facilities are horrible and they need real locker rooms, stands at the field etc.

Big part of why the program hasn't been as good as it can be. Hurts in other sports too. Our facilities are very very outdated for mostly every sport. If you go visit a big school with amazing facilities and then visit sju. Everything else being equal would be tough to pick sju

SJU Lax has like zero facilities. They actually have a great backdrop to play lacrosse with the D'Angelo center there but they need some locker rooms and amenities like the soccer team has.  The field is great but they have zero else.

Quote from: Marco Baldi on May 10, 2015, 07:05:08 PM

Quote from: stjohnnie75 on May 10, 2015, 05:42:26 PM

Quote from: Foad on May 10, 2015, 09:02:13 AM

Quote from: Dave on May 09, 2015, 08:58:33 PM

So overall is there a better school in the conference?

Odd that the one program for which Monasch presumably labors under micromanagement - he has to accept input from the BOT, donors, the administration, Lou etc - has been a disappointment and the rest of the programs - that nobody cares about and for which he presumably exercises autonomous control - are very successful. Argues for his competence, contrary to the conventional wisdom.

To be fair, Ed Manetta hired most of the coaches that are still doing well at St. John's. I think softball and W. Basketball are the only sports with new coaches (besides golf this year). Not sure about the tennis teams.

Funny you should mention Manetta...

He coming back?  Would be a breath of fresh air.

Doubt he is coming back. Recently took a job with the Barclays Center.

 


.

 






 

I agree that the campus gets in the way of their success. It's a shame that they can't go back in time, and think it through more before they picked Jamaica.
[/quote] I wish people would stop saying we are in Jamaica.  We're not.  Jamaica is where our mail gets sorted.  It's just a federal zip code for a federal building. It's like the Flushing post office building.  Most people whose mailing address says Flushing, don't actually LIVE in Flushing.  It's a federal designation, not a local one.

St. Johns is bordered to the north by Hillcrest, an upscale neighborhood. By Briarwood to the west, a middle class neighborhood, and Jamaica Estates, to the east a VERY, VERY, upscale neighborhood.  Has anyone here ever been to the St. John's campus?  If you have, have you looked around? Now   Jamaica, on the other hand, is a notoriously downtrodden area.  And that's being euphemistic.  (It is generally regarded as a ghetto).  However, St. John's is NOT LOCATED THERE.  Has anyone here ever been to the St.John's campus?  Did you ever see ghetto conditions around campus?  No!  You haven't!  The thing that actually hurts St. John's is that people say that it is in Jamaica when it is not.  They don't understand what a post office district is.

Many years ago when we were a top national program, I took some friends to a game at Alumni Hall.  Their initial reaction when I asked them, was "I don't know if I can go to an area like that at night.  Is it safe?  When I asked what they were talking about, they said "St. John's is in Jamaica, right"?  Then I had to explain to them about how mailing addresses in the city are listed.  It is only where the building that your mail gets sorted is.

One more thing.  If you don't like the Hillcrest Golf Course in Queens, then where should the Vincentians have bought the land?  It is a perfect location for a college.  The only thing it lacks is a subway right next to the campus.  So lets all stop telling people that SJU is in Jamaica.  It's either Hillcrest or Jamaica Estates.  There is no post office building in those neighborhoods, but there is a University.

Today St. John's Baseball won Big East regular season and Softball won Big East Championship. Over the years both programs have been perennial powerhouses.

Maybe I misunderstood what I read this morning but I thought I saw on Twitter that the Softball team was making their first appearance in the NCAA tournament this year.

http://www.redstormsports.com/sports/w-softbl/spec-rel/051015aab.html

Quote from: Dave on May 09, 2015, 08:58:33 PM

Today St. John's Baseball won Big East regular season and Softball won Big East Championship. Over the years both programs have been perennial powerhouses.

Maybe I misunderstood what I read this morning but I thought I saw on Twitter that the Softball team was making their first appearance in the NCAA tournament this year.

http://www.redstormsports.com/sports/w-softbl/spec-rel/051015aab.html

Facing Arizona Friday

Quote from: Dave on May 09, 2015, 08:58:33 PM

Today St. John's Baseball won Big East regular season and Softball won Big East Championship. Over the years both programs have been perennial powerhouses.

Maybe I misunderstood what I read this morning but I thought I saw on Twitter that the Softball team was making their first appearance in the NCAA tournament this year.

http://www.redstormsports.com/sports/w-softbl/spec-rel/051015aab.html

That's correct. The program has been very weak. When I was in school and also when I was working there they were always pretty much the weakest team we had. Only in the last couple years have they started to finally have success. Definitely not a powerhouse but nice to see them finally have success with some of the old big east teams out of the league. 

Quote from: hoyahooligan on May 10, 2015, 11:55:35 AM

Quote from: Dave on May 09, 2015, 08:58:33 PM

Today St. John's Baseball won Big East regular season and Softball won Big East Championship. Over the years both programs have been perennial powerhouses.

SJU Men's Soccer team is traditionally one of the best programs in the country while Women's team is generally competitive.

Golf team has produced quite a few pros and won Big East last year.

Lax, Tennis, Volleyball, track & field are all average. Fencing is one of the best.

and we all know about basketball teams.

So overall is there a better school in the conference?

Here are the currrent director cup standings ( Spring sports not yet included) and the standings  for the last 4 years:
14-15:  Georgetown 33, Providence 35, Villanova 54 Xavier T-95, Creighton 120, St. John's 121, DePaul 128, Marquette T-157, Butler T-172, Seton Hall T-172
13-14: Georgetown 66, Villanova 68, Providence 71, St. John's 76, DePaul T-105, Marquette 119, Creighton 126, Butler 143, Xavier T-252, Seton Hall T-289
12-13: Georgetown 63, Villanova 75, Creighton 84, Marquette 89, Providence 115, St. John's T-132, Butler T-156, Xavier T-221, DePaul T-257, Seton Hall NR
11-12: Georgetown 63, St. John's 75, Creighton 91, Villanova T-96, Marquette 110, Providence 149, Xavier T-169, DePaul T-182, Butler T-277, Seton Hall NR
10-11: Villanova 50, Georgetown 55, St. John's 94, Marquette T-96, Butler 100, Providence 113, Creighton T-114,  DePaul 140, Xavier T-150 Seton Hall T-238

And Here are the Capital 1 Cup Standings through the same period (14-15 standings are current as of May 4th)
14-15 Men: Providence 7, Villanova 23, Georgetown 27, Creighton 36, St. John's 78
14-15 Women: Georgetown 42, St. John's 66
13-14 Men St. John's T-80, Georgetown T-87, Providence T-95
13-14 Women Providence T-32, Butler T-44, Georgetown T-59, St. John's T-68
12-13 Men: Georgetown T-18, Creighton T-33, St. John's T-85,
12-13 Women: Providence T-40, Georgetown 50, St. John's T-68
11-12 Men: Creighton T-32, St. John's T-78, Marquette T-82
11-12 Women: Georgetown T-32 Villanova T-49, St. John's T-69
10-11 Men: Butler T-18, Villanova T-25
10-11 Women: Villanova T-27, Georgetown T-40, DePaul T-55, Providence T-58,

Not familiar with this. Tell me more about it

Directors Cup: http://www.nacda.com/directorscup/nacda-directorscup.html
"A program that honors institutions maintaining a broad-based program, achieving success in many sports, both men's and women's. Began in 1993-94 for Division I by NACDA and USA Today, it was expanded in 1995-96 to include Division II, III and the NAIA and, in 2011-12, expanded to the Junior/Community Colleges.
Each institution is awarded points in a pre-determined number of sports for men and women."

Capital 1 Cup : http://www.capitalonecup.com/
"The Capital One Cup is awarded annually to each of the best men's and women's Division I college athletics programs in the country. Points toward the Capital One Cup are earned and tracked throughout the year based on final standings of NCAA Championships and final official coaches' polls. One winning men's and one winning women's program will be crowned after the completion of the final NCAA spring championships. "

So basically there are already systems in place to determine which schools have the best all around athletic departments.  Obviously they use different metrics and only focus on NCAA success not conference championships( but obviously winning conference championships gets you into the NCAA championships so there's a good correlation there). The Capital one Cup was just started 5 years ago, while the directors cup has been around since the early 90s.

I think they give equal importance to badminton and sports like basketball and baseball.  So take it for what it's worth.  One of many possible metrics.  (Many people will be tempted to say that's it, the director cup standings said this or that, and take it as sacrosanct, but it's not.)