Marcus Lovett hopeful to get cleared

Don't finals run through the 18th?  This is Friday.  I never understood why they had given the eligibility date as the 18th.  And part of the problem is that the profs don't have to give the grades for a stated period of time.  It's part of their CBA.  And also, it is verboten for a member of the athletic department to speak to a Professor about an athlete.  They cannot put pressure on a professor.  University regulation.  Luckily for us, Bobby G is not a member of the AD.  And he  understands the importance of the basketball program to the University, so hopefully he can gently prod some teachers to expedite this matter.

Then maybe the NCAA can move quickly also.  They already know the courses he is taking, so how difficult will it be to examine a fifteen credit transcript.  They are already familiar with his case so it should not be to much of a problem on their end, unless they want it to be. I don't think they will bust his chops intentionally.

Why assume that St. John's is at fault here? All reports were  the staff performed due diligence on LoVett's case and that they were fairly confident he would be cleared initially. Insiders have said that LoVett did what he had to do and that the NCAA thought he had made up too much work in his last year and applied standards to his case that will go into effect next year. Maybe they are reconsidering his status because he was not treated fairly by them. Your constant negativity can be tiring. Didn't you have 'Cuse trampling us by 50?

(Post above in response to Poison's  last comment)

Why assume that St. John's is at fault here? All reports were  the staff performed due diligence on LoVett's case and that they were fairly confident he would be cleared initially. Insiders have said that LoVett did what he had to do and that the NCAA thought he had made up too much work in his last year and applied standards to his case that will go into effect next year. Maybe they are reconsidering his status because he was not treated fairly by them. Your constant negativity can be tiring. Didn't you have 'Cuse trampling us by 50?

Why assume that St.John's is at fault? I haven't, and if you read more carefully, you'd see that. What I said is that I would guess that both sides are at fault. We'll see. But, since you mentioned it, one might assume that St.John's is at fault because of Amir Garrett, Norvel Pelle, Jakarr Sampson, Orlando Sanchez, Marco Bourgault, Adonis Delarosa, Keith Thomas and now, Marcus LoVett. Are we all just supposed to believe that NCAA truly has it in for us?

Amir Garrett was delay only one term or am I mistaken. How did long it take to get him qualified?

Amir Garrett was delay only one term or am I mistaken. How did long it take to get him qualified?

Garrett played after sitting out the first semester of his freshman year. He played in December.

This is exam week.  while exams end on Friday, Marcus may have courses that take exams prior to that day.  The NCAA may be accepting of a transcript without formally examining the documentation at present but will allow SJU to self certify and then review  when they do an "audit" of the athletic department.

Then again it is the NCAA and anything is possible 

Poison, my point was why assume that St. John's is at fault at all here?  I am aware of our past history, and there are certainly recruits with questionable credentials on your list, but this  current staff was not involved with any of them.   I think that, in LoVett's case, due diligence was performed.  I'd like to think that Mullin and company are conducting business a little differently than what may have gone on before.  You don't build a team around a point guard that you expect to have issues qualifying. With Slice and Matt A as our primary recruiters I don't expect that we'll be picking up any bogus transcripts in parking lots.  Whatever the issues of LoVett's individual case are, he certainly shouldn't be prejudged as guilty because of what may have gone on at St. John's under different coaching regimes before he applied here.

Poison, my point was why assume that St. John's is at fault at all here?  I am aware of our past history, and there are certainly recruits with questionable credentials on your list, but this  current staff was not involved with any of them.   I think that, in LoVett's case, due diligence was performed.  I'd like to think that Mullin and company are conducting business a little differently than what may have gone on before.  You don't build a team around a point guard that you expect to have issues qualifying. With Slice and Matt A as our primary recruiters I don't expect that we'll be picking up any bogus transcripts in parking lots.  Whatever the issues of LoVett's individual case are, he certainly shouldn't be prejudged as guilty because of what may have gone on at St. John's under different coaching regimes before he applied here.

If St.John's has a different team of people reviewing the academic qualifications of a recruit than it did last year, we'd have no reason to believe that this is on them other than the fact that it just appears that this happens at STJ because they are a bunch of careless idiots who don't do their homework. I find it hard to believe that's not part of this. Like I said, we'll see.

Maybe we should stop focusing on the past in regards to Marcus' high school grades. As the old saying goes, the past is the past.

As  someone responsible for a good deal of college students, I believe that Coach Mullin has been monitoring Marcus' academic progress all semester. Colleges can (and do) create academic computer reports on key athletes. It rarely ever comes down to the final week as to whether a student is going to do well or not. 

We keep hearing that Marcus has been doing pretty good so far. That is a darn good sign.

I think the issue here is how fast can the NCAA decide on Marcus' eligibility.

It will be great to see him do his moves on the court for us this season.

Quote from: Lycidas on December 15, 2015, 12:41:32 AM

Poison, my point was why assume that St. John's is at fault at all here?  I am aware of our past history, and there are certainly recruits with questionable credentials on your list, but this  current staff was not involved with any of them.   I think that, in LoVett's case, due diligence was performed.  I'd like to think that Mullin and company are conducting business a little differently than what may have gone on before.  You don't build a team around a point guard that you expect to have issues qualifying. With Slice and Matt A as our primary recruiters I don't expect that we'll be picking up any bogus transcripts in parking lots.  Whatever the issues of LoVett's individual case are, he certainly shouldn't be prejudged as guilty because of what may have gone on at St. John's under different coaching regimes before he applied here.

If St.John's has a different team of people reviewing the academic qualifications of a recruit than it did last year, we'd have no reason to believe that this is on them other than the fact that it just appears that this happens at STJ because they are a bunch of careless idiots who don't do their homework. I find it hard to believe that's not part of this. Like I said, we'll see.

You seem to assume that the school only views potential players in two categories: definitely eligible and definitely ineligible.  Most of the kids you named, including Lovett, are somewhere in between.  It's up to the staff and the university to determine if it's strategically worth their resources to put up a fight with the NCAA - it is a subjective, calculated gamble each time.  The last staff was fighting because they'd be shorthanded due to other failures on the recruiting trail; it appears that this staff is more discerning and legitimately thinks Lovett should be eligible.  I believe Mullin has recruited high character kids so far and will continue to operate primarily away from the eligibility grey area (with the exception of international kids).

Quote from: Poison on December 15, 2015, 06:54:58 AM

Quote from: Lycidas on December 15, 2015, 12:41:32 AM

Poison, my point was why assume that St. John's is at fault at all here?  I am aware of our past history, and there are certainly recruits with questionable credentials on your list, but this  current staff was not involved with any of them.   I think that, in LoVett's case, due diligence was performed.  I'd like to think that Mullin and company are conducting business a little differently than what may have gone on before.  You don't build a team around a point guard that you expect to have issues qualifying. With Slice and Matt A as our primary recruiters I don't expect that we'll be picking up any bogus transcripts in parking lots.  Whatever the issues of LoVett's individual case are, he certainly shouldn't be prejudged as guilty because of what may have gone on at St. John's under different coaching regimes before he applied here.

If St.John's has a different team of people reviewing the academic qualifications of a recruit than it did last year, we'd have no reason to believe that this is on them other than the fact that it just appears that this happens at STJ because they are a bunch of careless idiots who don't do their homework. I find it hard to believe that's not part of this. Like I said, we'll see.

You seem to assume that the school only views potential players in two categories: definitely eligible and definitely ineligible.  Most of the kids you named, including Lovett, are somewhere in between.  It's up to the staff and the university to determine if it's strategically worth their resources to put up a fight with the NCAA - it is a subjective, calculated gamble each time.  The last staff was fighting because they'd be shorthanded due to other failures on the recruiting trail; it appears that this staff is more discerning and legitimately thinks Lovett should be eligible.  I believe Mullin has recruited high character kids so far and will continue to operate primarily away from the eligibility grey area (with the exception of international kids).

I assume because they don't say much about it. I think by and large we're all guessing here. My issue is that at St.John's every season comes with an eligibility distraction. The fascinating part of this is that they are so different from one another. I don't know how they track recruits or anythung about their system, but after 5 straight years of this, at what point do you look in the mirror and say maybe it's us?

Mind you, everything you said is probably right on regarding LoVett. It's just that it's been 5 straight years of this, and I'd like us not to be famous for it.

Quote from: Gray Chudney on December 15, 2015, 09:34:19 AM

Quote from: Poison on December 15, 2015, 06:54:58 AM

Quote from: Lycidas on December 15, 2015, 12:41:32 AM

Poison, my point was why assume that St. John's is at fault at all here?  I am aware of our past history, and there are certainly recruits with questionable credentials on your list, but this  current staff was not involved with any of them.   I think that, in LoVett's case, due diligence was performed.  I'd like to think that Mullin and company are conducting business a little differently than what may have gone on before.  You don't build a team around a point guard that you expect to have issues qualifying. With Slice and Matt A as our primary recruiters I don't expect that we'll be picking up any bogus transcripts in parking lots.  Whatever the issues of LoVett's individual case are, he certainly shouldn't be prejudged as guilty because of what may have gone on at St. John's under different coaching regimes before he applied here.

If St.John's has a different team of people reviewing the academic qualifications of a recruit than it did last year, we'd have no reason to believe that this is on them other than the fact that it just appears that this happens at STJ because they are a bunch of careless idiots who don't do their homework. I find it hard to believe that's not part of this. Like I said, we'll see.

You seem to assume that the school only views potential players in two categories: definitely eligible and definitely ineligible.  Most of the kids you named, including Lovett, are somewhere in between.  It's up to the staff and the university to determine if it's strategically worth their resources to put up a fight with the NCAA - it is a subjective, calculated gamble each time.  The last staff was fighting because they'd be shorthanded due to other failures on the recruiting trail; it appears that this staff is more discerning and legitimately thinks Lovett should be eligible.  I believe Mullin has recruited high character kids so far and will continue to operate primarily away from the eligibility grey area (with the exception of international kids).

I assume because they don't say much about it. I think by and large we're all guessing here. My issue is that at St.John's every season comes with an eligibility distraction. The fascinating part of this is that they are so different from one another. I don't know how they track recruits or anythung about their system, but after 5 straight years of this, at what point do you look in the mirror and say maybe it's us?

Mind you, everything you said is probably right on regarding LoVett. It's just that it's been 5 straight years of this, and I'd like us not to be famous for it.

Fair point, though I am confidently guessing that the new staff will not make this a habit.  This sort of thing was a product of laziness and lacking culture control of the previous regime.  You don't have to continually push the envelope with eligibility if you construct a roster properly and demand your players do their schoolwork some of the time. 

Quote from: Gray Chudney on December 15, 2015, 09:34:19 AM

Quote from: Poison on December 15, 2015, 06:54:58 AM

Quote from: Lycidas on December 15, 2015, 12:41:32 AM

Poison, my point was why assume that St. John's is at fault at all here?  I am aware of our past history, and there are certainly recruits with questionable credentials on your list, but this  current staff was not involved with any of them.   I think that, in LoVett's case, due diligence was performed.  I'd like to think that Mullin and company are conducting business a little differently than what may have gone on before.  You don't build a team around a point guard that you expect to have issues qualifying. With Slice and Matt A as our primary recruiters I don't expect that we'll be picking up any bogus transcripts in parking lots.  Whatever the issues of LoVett's individual case are, he certainly shouldn't be prejudged as guilty because of what may have gone on at St. John's under different coaching regimes before he applied here.

If St.John's has a different team of people reviewing the academic qualifications of a recruit than it did last year, we'd have no reason to believe that this is on them other than the fact that it just appears that this happens at STJ because they are a bunch of careless idiots who don't do their homework. I find it hard to believe that's not part of this. Like I said, we'll see.

You seem to assume that the school only views potential players in two categories: definitely eligible and definitely ineligible.  Most of the kids you named, including Lovett, are somewhere in between.  It's up to the staff and the university to determine if it's strategically worth their resources to put up a fight with the NCAA - it is a subjective, calculated gamble each time.  The last staff was fighting because they'd be shorthanded due to other failures on the recruiting trail; it appears that this staff is more discerning and legitimately thinks Lovett should be eligible.  I believe Mullin has recruited high character kids so far and will continue to operate primarily away from the eligibility grey area (with the exception of international kids).

I assume because they don't say much about it. I think by and large we're all guessing here. My issue is that at St.John's every season comes with an eligibility distraction. The fascinating part of this is that they are so different from one another. I don't know how they track recruits or anythung about their system, but after 5 straight years of this, at what point do you look in the mirror and say maybe it's us?

Mind you, everything you said is probably right on regarding LoVett. It's just that it's been 5 straight years of this, and I'd like us not to be famous for it.

If Lovett was def going to be eligible from the jump, he probably would not be here.

Quote from: Poison on December 15, 2015, 10:19:11 AM

Quote from: Gray Chudney on December 15, 2015, 09:34:19 AM

Quote from: Poison on December 15, 2015, 06:54:58 AM

Quote from: Lycidas on December 15, 2015, 12:41:32 AM

Poison, my point was why assume that St. John's is at fault at all here?  I am aware of our past history, and there are certainly recruits with questionable credentials on your list, but this  current staff was not involved with any of them.   I think that, in LoVett's case, due diligence was performed.  I'd like to think that Mullin and company are conducting business a little differently than what may have gone on before.  You don't build a team around a point guard that you expect to have issues qualifying. With Slice and Matt A as our primary recruiters I don't expect that we'll be picking up any bogus transcripts in parking lots.  Whatever the issues of LoVett's individual case are, he certainly shouldn't be prejudged as guilty because of what may have gone on at St. John's under different coaching regimes before he applied here.

If St.John's has a different team of people reviewing the academic qualifications of a recruit than it did last year, we'd have no reason to believe that this is on them other than the fact that it just appears that this happens at STJ because they are a bunch of careless idiots who don't do their homework. I find it hard to believe that's not part of this. Like I said, we'll see.

You seem to assume that the school only views potential players in two categories: definitely eligible and definitely ineligible.  Most of the kids you named, including Lovett, are somewhere in between.  It's up to the staff and the university to determine if it's strategically worth their resources to put up a fight with the NCAA - it is a subjective, calculated gamble each time.  The last staff was fighting because they'd be shorthanded due to other failures on the recruiting trail; it appears that this staff is more discerning and legitimately thinks Lovett should be eligible.  I believe Mullin has recruited high character kids so far and will continue to operate primarily away from the eligibility grey area (with the exception of international kids).

I assume because they don't say much about it. I think by and large we're all guessing here. My issue is that at St.John's every season comes with an eligibility distraction. The fascinating part of this is that they are so different from one another. I don't know how they track recruits or anythung about their system, but after 5 straight years of this, at what point do you look in the mirror and say maybe it's us?

Mind you, everything you said is probably right on regarding LoVett. It's just that it's been 5 straight years of this, and I'd like us not to be famous for it.

If Lovett was def going to be eligible from the jump, he probably would not be here.

He wouldn't have been uncommitted when this staff was hired if that was the case. You live with these risks because the reward is worth it.

Quote from: we are sju on December 15, 2015, 10:50:13 AM

Quote from: Poison on December 15, 2015, 10:19:11 AM

Quote from: Gray Chudney on December 15, 2015, 09:34:19 AM

Quote from: Poison on December 15, 2015, 06:54:58 AM

Quote from: Lycidas on December 15, 2015, 12:41:32 AM

Poison, my point was why assume that St. John's is at fault at all here?  I am aware of our past history, and there are certainly recruits with questionable credentials on your list, but this  current staff was not involved with any of them.   I think that, in LoVett's case, due diligence was performed.  I'd like to think that Mullin and company are conducting business a little differently than what may have gone on before.  You don't build a team around a point guard that you expect to have issues qualifying. With Slice and Matt A as our primary recruiters I don't expect that we'll be picking up any bogus transcripts in parking lots.  Whatever the issues of LoVett's individual case are, he certainly shouldn't be prejudged as guilty because of what may have gone on at St. John's under different coaching regimes before he applied here.

If St.John's has a different team of people reviewing the academic qualifications of a recruit than it did last year, we'd have no reason to believe that this is on them other than the fact that it just appears that this happens at STJ because they are a bunch of careless idiots who don't do their homework. I find it hard to believe that's not part of this. Like I said, we'll see.

You seem to assume that the school only views potential players in two categories: definitely eligible and definitely ineligible.  Most of the kids you named, including Lovett, are somewhere in between.  It's up to the staff and the university to determine if it's strategically worth their resources to put up a fight with the NCAA - it is a subjective, calculated gamble each time.  The last staff was fighting because they'd be shorthanded due to other failures on the recruiting trail; it appears that this staff is more discerning and legitimately thinks Lovett should be eligible.  I believe Mullin has recruited high character kids so far and will continue to operate primarily away from the eligibility grey area (with the exception of international kids).

I assume because they don't say much about it. I think by and large we're all guessing here. My issue is that at St.John's every season comes with an eligibility distraction. The fascinating part of this is that they are so different from one another. I don't know how they track recruits or anythung about their system, but after 5 straight years of this, at what point do you look in the mirror and say maybe it's us?

Mind you, everything you said is probably right on regarding LoVett. It's just that it's been 5 straight years of this, and I'd like us not to be famous for it.

If Lovett was def going to be eligible from the jump, he probably would not be here.

He wouldn't have been uncommitted when this staff was hired if that was the case. You live with these risks because the reward is worth it.

I know. You guys are right.

We took a risk or two and as of now it looks like Yakwe and Lovett will both be eligible before the start of conference play.  I say that landing two guys that caliber and getting them eligible is a win for SJU staff who had no team to field.  Both seem like good kids and talented players.  I have no problem with these types of risks at times.  Need to bring the high level talent in and sooner is better than later.

Quote from: Lycidas on December 14, 2015, 10:25:11 PM

Why assume that St. John's is at fault here? All reports were  the staff performed due diligence on LoVett's case and that they were fairly confident he would be cleared initially. Insiders have said that LoVett did what he had to do and that the NCAA thought he had made up too much work in his last year and applied standards to his case that will go into effect next year. Maybe they are reconsidering his status because he was not treated fairly by them. Your constant negativity can be tiring. Didn't you have 'Cuse trampling us by 50?

Why assume that St.John's is at fault? I haven't, and if you read more carefully, you'd see that. What I said is that I would guess that both sides are at fault. We'll see. But, since you mentioned it, one might assume that St.John's is at fault because of Amir Garrett, Norvel Pelle, Jakarr Sampson, Orlando Sanchez, Marco Bourgault, Adonis Delarosa, Keith Thomas and now, Marcus LoVett. Are we all just supposed to believe that NCAA truly has it in for us?

NCAA has a hard on for smaller private schools not named Duke - especially the two I root for (St. John's and The U).

NCAA has screwed over Saint John's, Miami, and USC big time.

It's what they do. They try to make examples of smaller schools while allowing their cash cows to run amuck: OSU, every SEC school, etc.

If this takes up through the start of conference play then the redshirt discussion would become legitimate. If we are not on the right side of tournament picture at time of decision then I would think long and hard about it. There is a big difference between December 15th with 3 OOC games to go and January 15th with 15 games left on the season. Of course I think it should all come down to what Marcus wants to do, hes earned the right to play if he wishes to do so.

Quote from: Poison on December 14, 2015, 10:36:46 PM

Quote from: Lycidas on December 14, 2015, 10:25:11 PM

Why assume that St. John's is at fault here? All reports were  the staff performed due diligence on LoVett's case and that they were fairly confident he would be cleared initially. Insiders have said that LoVett did what he had to do and that the NCAA thought he had made up too much work in his last year and applied standards to his case that will go into effect next year. Maybe they are reconsidering his status because he was not treated fairly by them. Your constant negativity can be tiring. Didn't you have 'Cuse trampling us by 50?

Why assume that St.John's is at fault? I haven't, and if you read more carefully, you'd see that. What I said is that I would guess that both sides are at fault. We'll see. But, since you mentioned it, one might assume that St.John's is at fault because of Amir Garrett, Norvel Pelle, Jakarr Sampson, Orlando Sanchez, Marco Bourgault, Adonis Delarosa, Keith Thomas and now, Marcus LoVett. Are we all just supposed to believe that NCAA truly has it in for us?

NCAA has a hard on for smaller private schools not named Duke - especially the two I root for (St. John's and The U).

NCAA has screwed over Saint John's, Miami, and USC big time.

It's what they do. They try to make examples of smaller schools while allowing their cash cows to run amuck: OSU, every SEC school, etc.

OSU and plenty of SEC got in plenty of trouble. USC and Miami are big time.