Big East Expansion

haha

The obvious choice would be Siena. Catholic school, 15K seat home arena, 8K average attendance, good track record in coaches. But why would they do it, they'd have to be crazy. Albany is a couple of years away from D2, no thanks.

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on March 02, 2016, 03:47:45 PM

haha

Albany is a couple of years away from D2, no thanks.

Albany is a bad conference dynasty.  Conference champs and Ncaa bids 4 years running in two more weeks.  They lose at Kentucky by 13 - we lose at Creighton by 41.  Would at least come right out of the gate whooping us and Depaul.

You must be confusing them with Russel Saige or Union.

You must be confusing them with Russel Saige or Union.

You must be confusing yourself with someone whose opinion I care about.

Quote from: friendofjohnnie on March 02, 2016, 02:25:44 PM

Get BC and Notre Dame out of their damn contracts and let them play here for basketball only. BC started sucking once they left Big East.

ACC schools get 31 mill per yr BE about 2 mill.  Ain't happenen!

Plus both of those schools are Big 10 targets.  Big 10 and SEC could pluck the ~8 best programs from the ACC in the final round of major conference realignment. 

ACC's TV deal is reportedly a big economic loser for ESPN, which is under serious pressure itself.  If UNC, Duke, UVA, NC St, FSU, Clemson, BC, ND all leave for greener pastures, the next deal will be 1/3 as much or less.

BE schools get $4M/year, I believe.

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on March 02, 2016, 03:47:45 PM

haha

The obvious choice would be Siena.

But why would they do it, they'd have to be crazy.

Obviously.

Would they be?

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on March 02, 2016, 03:47:45 PM

haha

The obvious choice would be Siena. Catholic school, 15K seat home arena, 8K average attendance, good track record in coaches. But why would they do it, they'd have to be crazy. Albany is a couple of years away from D2, no thanks.

You're right. The Big East would never do it.  Siena would be another mouth to feed, and they have no TV value.  They have their decent following in Albany, but regionally in the northeast, and nationally, they have no value. 

Dayton is an outstanding program but the Ohio market is already covered with Xavier.  St. Louis is a good program because they have great resources committed, for example a tremendous arena that they fill, and a decent sized TV market. (although they have been faltering under Crews the last two years). They'd have to come in with someone else who does not play football like Gonzaga, but the Zags are just to far away.  The other good hoop school that doesn't play football is VCU.  But Smart is gone, and they overlap with GTown's TV market.

So it appears the best thing for the conference to do is to just sit back and continue to survey the landscape.  No sense in taking someone in just for the sake of it, and realizing that it was the wrong move, because you would be stuck with that decision forever.

Quote from: Foad on March 02, 2016, 04:12:40 PM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on March 02, 2016, 03:47:45 PM

haha

The obvious choice would be Siena.

But why would they do it, they'd have to be crazy.

Obviously.

Would they be?

They'd be going from a perennial contender in the MAAC to a perennial doormat in the BE. There's a benefit to the school in terms of money and exposure but little to the basketball program.

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on March 02, 2016, 10:16:38 PM

Quote from: Foad on March 02, 2016, 04:12:40 PM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on March 02, 2016, 03:47:45 PM

haha

The obvious choice would be Siena.

But why would they do it, they'd have to be crazy.

Obviously.

Would they be?

They'd be going from a perennial contender in the MAAC to a perennial doormat in the BE. There's a benefit to the school in terms of money and exposure but little to the basketball program.

That's one side for sure. Ceiling is pretty low for the best team in the MAAC though.

Loading up the conference with low to mid majors does nothing for us.

Loading up the conference with low to mid majors does nothing for us.

well said.  need to sit tight and see if additional realignment leaves any decent high majors without a home (like uconn)

Quote from: carmineabbatiello on March 02, 2016, 05:08:44 PM

You must be confusing them with Russel Saige or Union.

You must be confusing yourself with someone whose opinion I care about.

Why the vitrol?  I thought our relationship was blossoming?

Albany is a couple of years away from D2, no thanks.

Doc was right.  D2 on the horizon.

St. Louis seems like an obvious choice to me. Sizable market, geographically in a good place, fits the academic/social profile of other schools...

I just don't see another school that is so compelling that we have to absolutely make a move, outside of potential ACC schools that will be shaken up after another realignment (BC, Wake Forest) or a school like UCONN that gets left out.

Overexpansion is what killed the old Big East.  Why not stay at 10 basketball only schools? If the teams are good enough, 6 or even 7 might make the tourney in any given year.   It is important that some of our teams make deep runs in this year's tourney.  Do that, and the bids will follow next year.

The home and home format is great -- get too big, go to two divisions, and you lose that.

I think it's highly unlikely that you're going to have 6 or 7 Big East Schools make it when you're going to have at least 6 make it from the Big Ten, probably 6 from Big 12, 5 or 6 from SEC and Pac-12. That's already 21 teams.

In 1985 we sent 6 teams at our height. But there's more conferences now. Not only that but expansion helps with recruiting.

I love the current Big East format. And I'm not for expanding right now. Programs are growing and developing rivalries. St. John's-Seton Hall looks like it's going to be very competitive. But I think eventually we are going to see the Power 5 Conferences breakaway and form an amateur league. And college sports will be an afterthought. Schools like St. John's, Georgetown, Villanova, Seton Hall, Providence will all be forgotten about and left to play in College Sports which will be about as popular as D-3 sports are now.

I think that in order for those schools to survive, expanding into a legit 6th Power Conference is going to be necessary. Unless the Conference really develops into the undeniable best Basketball Conference which I'm just not sure it's capable of being. Again, I love the format and want to give it 5 good years before we really start digging into this area. But it's something we might and I think probably will have to deal with, so why not discuss it now?

Well said.  Eventually, the NCAA will be the equivalent of the NIT.  Not that we should expand any time soon...we should be ready to put together a power conference to compete with the Big Ten, and ACC's of the world when they break out.

Quote from: Foad on March 02, 2016, 04:12:40 PM

Albany is a couple of years away from D2, no thanks.

Doc was right.  D2 on the horizon.

What he meant was they have not been in D1 for very long.

Quote from: newsman13 on March 03, 2016, 10:46:02 AM

Loading up the conference with low to mid majors does nothing for us.

well said.  need to sit tight and see if additional realignment leaves any decent high majors without a home (like uconn)

No, UConn plays football.  That's what the NBE is all about now.  No football.  That was the whole point of disassociating with the football schools like Cincy and South Florida.

Quote from: Lycidas on March 02, 2016, 11:56:54 AM

Overexpansion is what killed the old Big East.  Why not stay at 10 basketball only schools? If the teams are good enough, 6 or even 7 might make the tourney in any given year.   It is important that some of our teams make deep runs in this year's tourney.  Do that, and the bids will follow next year.

The home and home format is great -- get too big, go to two divisions, and you lose that.

I think it's highly unlikely that you're going to have 6 or 7 Big East Schools make it when you're going to have at least 6 make it from the Big Ten, probably 6 from Big 12, 5 or 6 from SEC and Pac-12. That's already 21 teams.

In 1985 we sent 6 teams at our height. But there's more conferences now. Not only that but expansion helps with recruiting.

I love the current Big East format. And I'm not for expanding right now. Programs are growing and developing rivalries. St. John's-Seton Hall looks like it's going to be very competitive. But I think eventually we are going to see the Power 5 Conferences breakaway and form an amateur league. And college sports will be an afterthought. Schools like St. John's, Georgetown, Villanova, Seton Hall, Providence will all be forgotten about and left to play in College Sports which will be about as popular as D-3 sports are now.

I think that in order for those schools to survive, expanding into a legit 6th Power Conference is going to be necessary. Unless the Conference really develops into the undeniable best Basketball Conference which I'm just not sure it's capable of being. Again, I love the format and want to give it 5 good years before we really start digging into this area. But it's something we might and I think probably will have to deal with, so why not discuss it now?

Yes, but more teams will not make for a better conference unless the teams are at least as good as the ones we have now.  If they are worse you are looking dilution. Both talent wise and earnings wise.

St. Louis seems like an obvious choice to me. Sizable market, geographically in a good place, fits the academic/social profile of other schools...

I just don't see another school that is so compelling that we have to absolutely make a move, outside of potential ACC schools that will be shaken up after another realignment (BC, Wake Forest) or a school like UCONN that gets left out.

No!  No football schools.  That's what the whole thing has been about.

Quote from: apesNapes on March 03, 2016, 11:54:21 AM

Quote from: newsman13 on March 03, 2016, 10:46:02 AM

Loading up the conference with low to mid majors does nothing for us.

well said.  need to sit tight and see if additional realignment leaves any decent high majors without a home (like uconn)

No, UConn plays football.  That's what the NBE is all about now.  No football.  That was the whole point of disassociating with the football schools like Cincy and South Florida.

It wasn't the new big east that disassociated with the football schools, it was the other way around