Big East Tournament

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Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #40 on: March 12, 2016, 12:22:16 PM »
Willard's job was seemingly on the line, so he did what a desperate man would do, he got the kid he needed that he thought would turn it around. I won't give him credit for Whitehead.

However I will give him credit for Carrington and Desi. Lav dropped the ball on Carrington. I remember Chiles recruiting him aggressively at one point and we had strong momentum then it just stopped. Clearly, he would have been a great get. He wouldn't have played as much as he did for us last year, but Lavin could have made it work.

Overall, I would say Seton Hall getting it done with a soph class of local kids basically reflects how bad Lavin was recruiting the last 2 years.

Frankly, I wish folks would move along. 
What do you mean?  They were talking about it live on national television last night on the floor of Madison Square Garden at the Big East tournament.  And now you are saying posters shouldn't respond?  Marginal programs of Catholic schools can live and die by single recruits.  PEOPLE LOSE THEIR JOBS OVER THIS. You can if it's a marginal program.  Willard is getting so much glory right now, but he is just a cheater.  They weren't even ranked all year.  They underachieved.  If you can't bring this up now, when could you?
Seton Hall at 24-8, finishing third in BE behind two top five nationally ranked teams with a sophomore laden squad underachieved? I think not!

Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #41 on: March 12, 2016, 12:22:44 PM »
Steve Lavin and Donny Marshall can both #$%^ right off.
  You mean Willard, right?  You're not from Seton Hall are you ?  Because they don't seem to be to objective when it comes to this.  They can't fathom  the idea that it was a package deal.

Donny Marshall was awful and always will be awful. Honestly how dare he ask Whitehead that question right after one of the biggest victories of his life. Who cares why he didn't sign to SJU two and a half years ago? He was trying to stir the pot for God knows what reasons. Maybe FS1 needed better ratings.

Marshall and Lavin made it all about Lavin last night, Lavin the apparent victim who apparently knew was gonna get fired in the fall of 2013 when he didn't get fired until the spring of 2015. Just making excuses for his shitty recruiting and his shitty postseason record.

I used to really like Lavin, but he is a freaking nice person. Donny Marshall is a shit show. And they can both #$%^ right off.

Did Willard "cheat" to get Whitehead, yeah. But I think it's time to let it go, Lavin had plenty of chances to recruit and win games. And he chose to do neither.

Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #42 on: March 12, 2016, 12:28:49 PM »
How did Willard cheat?

Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #43 on: March 12, 2016, 12:34:28 PM »
Willard's job was seemingly on the line, so he did what a desperate man would do, he got the kid he needed that he thought would turn it around. I won't give him credit for Whitehead.

However I will give him credit for Carrington and Desi. Lav dropped the ball on Carrington. I remember Chiles recruiting him aggressively at one point and we had strong momentum then it just stopped. Clearly, he would have been a great get. He wouldn't have played as much as he did for us last year, but Lavin could have made it work.

Overall, I would say Seton Hall getting it done with a soph class of local kids basically reflects how bad Lavin was recruiting the last 2 years.

Frankly, I wish folks would move along. 
What do you mean?  They were talking about it live on national television last night on the floor of Madison Square Garden at the Big East tournament.  And now you are saying posters shouldn't respond?  Marginal programs of Catholic schools can live and die by single recruits.  PEOPLE LOSE THEIR JOBS OVER THIS. You can if it's a marginal program.  Willard is getting so much glory right now, but he is just a cheater.  They weren't even ranked all year.  They underachieved.  If you can't bring this up now, when could you?

So, what if they're talking about it on national tv?!  It was also done in a joking manner, if you didn't notice.  I was referencing to "moving along" about Carrington and Lavin. 

Not to mention, the same way you don't want anyone to stymie your repetitive "cheating" rant is the same way you're attempting to stymie me about telling folks to move along.  The smell of hypocrisy.  Well, carry on with your silly arse ranting....     


Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #44 on: March 12, 2016, 12:46:48 PM »
Willard's job was seemingly on the line, so he did what a desperate man would do, he got the kid he needed that he thought would turn it around. I won't give him credit for Whitehead.

However I will give him credit for Carrington and Desi. Lav dropped the ball on Carrington. I remember Chiles recruiting him aggressively at one point and we had strong momentum then it just stopped. Clearly, he would have been a great get. He wouldn't have played as much as he did for us last year, but Lavin could have made it work.

Overall, I would say Seton Hall getting it done with a soph class of local kids basically reflects how bad Lavin was recruiting the last 2 years.
Carrington wanted to play with Whitehead, so whoever got Whitehead also got Carrington.  Whitehead was the one who Willard chaeated to get.  So he does not get credit really for Carrington in my mind.  To me he is just a big cheater.

Can you point me to the rule that Willard violated.  I've tried looking it up and I can't find it.  I know what he did seems slimy but I can find an actual violation.  You've called him out in no uncertain terms as a cheater.  I just can't find the rule that he broke.

paultzman

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Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #45 on: March 12, 2016, 12:55:26 PM »
Willard's job was seemingly on the line, so he did what a desperate man would do, he got the kid he needed that he thought would turn it around. I won't give him credit for Whitehead.

However I will give him credit for Carrington and Desi. Lav dropped the ball on Carrington. I remember Chiles recruiting him aggressively at one point and we had strong momentum then it just stopped. Clearly, he would have been a great get. He wouldn't have played as much as he did for us last year, but Lavin could have made it work.

Overall, I would say Seton Hall getting it done with a soph class of local kids basically reflects how bad Lavin was recruiting the last 2 years.
Carrington wanted to play with Whitehead, so whoever got Whitehead also got Carrington.  Whitehead was the one who Willard chaeated to get.  So he does not get credit really for Carrington in my mind.  To me he is just a big cheater.

Can you point me to the rule that Willard violated.  I've tried looking it up and I can't find it.  I know what he did seems slimy but I can find an actual violation.  You've called him out in no uncertain terms as a cheater.  I just can't find the rule that he broke.

Because there isn't one. Good post.

Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #46 on: March 12, 2016, 01:01:25 PM »
Willard's job was seemingly on the line, so he did what a desperate man would do, he got the kid he needed that he thought would turn it around. I won't give him credit for Whitehead.

However I will give him credit for Carrington and Desi. Lav dropped the ball on Carrington. I remember Chiles recruiting him aggressively at one point and we had strong momentum then it just stopped. Clearly, he would have been a great get. He wouldn't have played as much as he did for us last year, but Lavin could have made it work.

Overall, I would say Seton Hall getting it done with a soph class of local kids basically reflects how bad Lavin was recruiting the last 2 years.
Carrington wanted to play with Whitehead, so whoever got Whitehead also got Carrington.  Whitehead was the one who Willard chaeated to get.  So he does not get credit really for Carrington in my mind.  To me he is just a big cheater.

Can you point me to the rule that Willard violated.  I've tried looking it up and I can't find it.  I know what he did seems slimy but I can find an actual violation.  You've called him out in no uncertain terms as a cheater.  I just can't find the rule that he broke.
Who leased the car Mrs. Whitehead is driving?

Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #47 on: March 12, 2016, 01:27:00 PM »
Willard's job was seemingly on the line, so he did what a desperate man would do, he got the kid he needed that he thought would turn it around. I won't give him credit for Whitehead.

However I will give him credit for Carrington and Desi. Lav dropped the ball on Carrington. I remember Chiles recruiting him aggressively at one point and we had strong momentum then it just stopped. Clearly, he would have been a great get. He wouldn't have played as much as he did for us last year, but Lavin could have made it work.

Overall, I would say Seton Hall getting it done with a soph class of local kids basically reflects how bad Lavin was recruiting the last 2 years.
Carrington wanted to play with Whitehead, so whoever got Whitehead also got Carrington.  Whitehead was the one who Willard chaeated to get.  So he does not get credit really for Carrington in my mind.  To me he is just a big cheater.

Can you point me to the rule that Willard violated.  I've tried looking it up and I can't find it.  I know what he did seems slimy but I can find an actual violation.  You've called him out in no uncertain terms as a cheater.  I just can't find the rule that he broke.

Because there isn't one. Good post.
Not such a good post.  The rule clearly stated that you can hire the high school coach of a recruit, but the hire "cannot be a contingency of the commitment".  Now you could never prove this unless the school was stupid enough to writ e the contingency into the contract, but if you really believe it was not a package deal, I don't know what to say.

Why was it already known 8 months before the job opening was even posted that Tiny would be on the staff, for example?  And of all the people in the country that the job could have gone to, why did it go to the high school coach of the All American recruit they had coming in?  I mean come on.  You don';t even suspect foul play? Even Tiny himself was quoted as saying " I asked Coach Lavin why he didn't have a spot for me on his staff".  That was from Tiny himself, after the story that he was given a job on the Seton Hall staff, for the next season, broke.  And you don't even. . . . ."suspect" it was a package deal?

Recruiting rules seem to have been taken down except for the timing of when coaches can see players and visits can take place.  I'll try to see if I can research some articles regarding this sham recruitment.  I've seen a couple of articles, from the Times for example, saying it was OK to do what he did, but those articles don't make any sense.  Post them and they will be torn apart.

Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #48 on: March 12, 2016, 01:31:57 PM »
Willard's job was seemingly on the line, so he did what a desperate man would do, he got the kid he needed that he thought would turn it around. I won't give him credit for Whitehead.

However I will give him credit for Carrington and Desi. Lav dropped the ball on Carrington. I remember Chiles recruiting him aggressively at one point and we had strong momentum then it just stopped. Clearly, he would have been a great get. He wouldn't have played as much as he did for us last year, but Lavin could have made it work.

Overall, I would say Seton Hall getting it done with a soph class of local kids basically reflects how bad Lavin was recruiting the last 2 years.

Frankly, I wish folks would move along. 
What do you mean?  They were talking about it live on national television last night on the floor of Madison Square Garden at the Big East tournament.  And now you are saying posters shouldn't respond?  Marginal programs of Catholic schools can live and die by single recruits.  PEOPLE LOSE THEIR JOBS OVER THIS. You can if it's a marginal program.  Willard is getting so much glory right now, but he is just a cheater.  They weren't even ranked all year.  They underachieved.  If you can't bring this up now, when could you?
Seton Hall at 24-8, finishing third in BE behind two top five nationally ranked teams with a sophomore laden squad underachieved? I think not!
He has quite a lot of talent led by a guy who could be in the NBA right now.  A first round pick.  Carrington a tremendous talent.  Delgado, last year's BE ROY.  Desi who is a really good player.  Sanogo and fifth year transfer Gordon who is a good player who kept the team from falling apart again because Willard could not.  Don't understand the affinity some posters have for Willard. 

Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #49 on: March 12, 2016, 01:53:42 PM »
Willard's job was seemingly on the line, so he did what a desperate man would do, he got the kid he needed that he thought would turn it around. I won't give him credit for Whitehead.

However I will give him credit for Carrington and Desi. Lav dropped the ball on Carrington. I remember Chiles recruiting him aggressively at one point and we had strong momentum then it just stopped. Clearly, he would have been a great get. He wouldn't have played as much as he did for us last year, but Lavin could have made it work.

Overall, I would say Seton Hall getting it done with a soph class of local kids basically reflects how bad Lavin was recruiting the last 2 years.

Frankly, I wish folks would move along. 
What do you mean?  They were talking about it live on national television last night on the floor of Madison Square Garden at the Big East tournament.  And now you are saying posters shouldn't respond?  Marginal programs of Catholic schools can live and die by single recruits.  PEOPLE LOSE THEIR JOBS OVER THIS. You can if it's a marginal program.  Willard is getting so much glory right now, but he is just a cheater.  They weren't even ranked all year.  They underachieved.  If you can't bring this up now, when could you?

So, what if they're talking about it on national tv?!  It was also done in a joking manner, if you didn't notice.  I was referencing to "moving along" about Carrington and Lavin. 

Not to mention, the same way you don't want anyone to stymie your repetitive "cheating" rant is the same way you're attempting to stymie me about telling folks to move along.  The smell of hypocrisy.  Well, carry on with your silly arse ranting....     
It was you who first said I wish folks would move along, not me.  They were talking about it on TV so it should be posted about.  You say they were joking as if it makes a difference.  Never underestimate the power of humor when exposing someone or something, or even just making a point.  You could even make a point, and then say, "only kidding", and it could be extremely effective.  They have taken a lot of time this week on the Lavin-Willard issue, even if they were "only kidding" and laughing. Stoner even said "only kidding" once. There's definitely something there.  Lavin can't coach, so he needs major recruits just like he needed  at UCLA.  Willard took Whitehead and with that Carrington.  It was the final factor in Lav getting fired.

One more thing, can we stop attacking each other here? If you differ with someone, just say why, and we will all be better off for having heard another perspective.

Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #50 on: March 12, 2016, 01:59:18 PM »
Willard's job was seemingly on the line, so he did what a desperate man would do, he got the kid he needed that he thought would turn it around. I won't give him credit for Whitehead.

However I will give him credit for Carrington and Desi. Lav dropped the ball on Carrington. I remember Chiles recruiting him aggressively at one point and we had strong momentum then it just stopped. Clearly, he would have been a great get. He wouldn't have played as much as he did for us last year, but Lavin could have made it work.

Overall, I would say Seton Hall getting it done with a soph class of local kids basically reflects how bad Lavin was recruiting the last 2 years.
Carrington wanted to play with Whitehead, so whoever got Whitehead also got Carrington.  Whitehead was the one who Willard chaeated to get.  So he does not get credit really for Carrington in my mind.  To me he is just a big cheater.

Can you point me to the rule that Willard violated.  I've tried looking it up and I can't find it.  I know what he did seems slimy but I can find an actual violation.  You've called him out in no uncertain terms as a cheater.  I just can't find the rule that he broke.
Who leased the car Mrs. Whitehead is driving?
That's a whole completely separate issue, Chudney, but I'm glad you brought it up. 

Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #51 on: March 12, 2016, 02:02:54 PM »
Willard's job was seemingly on the line, so he did what a desperate man would do, he got the kid he needed that he thought would turn it around. I won't give him credit for Whitehead.

However I will give him credit for Carrington and Desi. Lav dropped the ball on Carrington. I remember Chiles recruiting him aggressively at one point and we had strong momentum then it just stopped. Clearly, he would have been a great get. He wouldn't have played as much as he did for us last year, but Lavin could have made it work.

Overall, I would say Seton Hall getting it done with a soph class of local kids basically reflects how bad Lavin was recruiting the last 2 years.

Frankly, I wish folks would move along. 
What do you mean?  They were talking about it live on national television last night on the floor of Madison Square Garden at the Big East tournament.  And now you are saying posters shouldn't respond?  Marginal programs of Catholic schools can live and die by single recruits.  PEOPLE LOSE THEIR JOBS OVER THIS. You can if it's a marginal program.  Willard is getting so much glory right now, but he is just a cheater.  They weren't even ranked all year.  They underachieved.  If you can't bring this up now, when could you?

So, what if they're talking about it on national tv?!  It was also done in a joking manner, if you didn't notice.  I was referencing to "moving along" about Carrington and Lavin. 

Not to mention, the same way you don't want anyone to stymie your repetitive "cheating" rant is the same way you're attempting to stymie me about telling folks to move along.  The smell of hypocrisy.  Well, carry on with your silly arse ranting....     
It was you who first said I wish folks would move along, not me.  They were talking about it on TV so it should be posted about.  You say they were joking as if it makes a difference.  Never underestimate the power of humor when exposing someone or something, or even just making a point.  You could even make a point, and then say, "only kidding", and it could be extremely effective.  They have taken a lot of time this week on the Lavin-Willard issue, even if they were "only kidding" and laughing. Stoner even said "only kidding" once. There's definitely something there.  Lavin can't coach, so he needs major recruits just like he needed  at UCLA.  Willard took Whitehead and with that Carrington.  It was the final factor in Lav getting fired.

One more thing, can we stop attacking each other here? If you differ with someone, just say why, and we will all be better off for having heard another perspective.

Frankly, who gives a freak, as Lavin is now gone, and it's time to move forward.  That madness last night was just that....  Madness!  If what occurred last night holds us back and propels Seton Hall to greatness, then I'll be surprised. 

I suggest you halt or minimize the tired rants and don't pretend the victim whenever posters call you out.  Posters have said why they disagree with you, and then you continue with the same diatribe.  No one is gonna continue to go down that road, which will probably ultimately end up in the rabbit hole.  Again, carry on.... 

paultzman

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Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #52 on: March 12, 2016, 02:10:38 PM »
Willard's job was seemingly on the line, so he did what a desperate man would do, he got the kid he needed that he thought would turn it around. I won't give him credit for Whitehead.

However I will give him credit for Carrington and Desi. Lav dropped the ball on Carrington. I remember Chiles recruiting him aggressively at one point and we had strong momentum then it just stopped. Clearly, he would have been a great get. He wouldn't have played as much as he did for us last year, but Lavin could have made it work.

Overall, I would say Seton Hall getting it done with a soph class of local kids basically reflects how bad Lavin was recruiting the last 2 years.

Frankly, I wish folks would move along. 
What do you mean?  They were talking about it live on national television last night on the floor of Madison Square Garden at the Big East tournament.  And now you are saying posters shouldn't respond?  Marginal programs of Catholic schools can live and die by single recruits.  PEOPLE LOSE THEIR JOBS OVER THIS. You can if it's a marginal program.  Willard is getting so much glory right now, but he is just a cheater.  They weren't even ranked all year.  They underachieved.  If you can't bring this up now, when could you?

So, what if they're talking about it on national tv?!  It was also done in a joking manner, if you didn't notice.  I was referencing to "moving along" about Carrington and Lavin. 

Not to mention, the same way you don't want anyone to stymie your repetitive "cheating" rant is the same way you're attempting to stymie me about telling folks to move along.  The smell of hypocrisy.  Well, carry on with your silly arse ranting....     
It was you who first said I wish folks would move along, not me.  They were talking about it on TV so it should be posted about.  You say they were joking as if it makes a difference.  Never underestimate the power of humor when exposing someone or something, or even just making a point.  You could even make a point, and then say, "only kidding", and it could be extremely effective.  They have taken a lot of time this week on the Lavin-Willard issue, even if they were "only kidding" and laughing. Stoner even said "only kidding" once. There's definitely something there.  Lavin can't coach, so he needs major recruits just like he needed  at UCLA.  Willard took Whitehead and with that Carrington.  It was the final factor in Lav getting fired.

One more thing, can we stop attacking each other here? If you differ with someone, just say why, and we will all be better off for having heard another perspective.

Frankly, who gives a freak, as Lavin is now gone, and it's time to move forward.  That madness last night was just that....  Madness!  If what occurred last night holds us back and propels Seton Hall to greatness, then I'll be surprised. 

I suggest you halt or minimize the tired rants and don't pretend the victim whenever posters call you out.  Posters have said why they disagree with you, and then you continue with the same diatribe.  No one is gonna continue to go down that road, which will probably ultimately end up in the rabbit hole.  Again, carry on.... 

Owe you one Dink!

Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #53 on: March 12, 2016, 02:28:07 PM »

Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #54 on: March 12, 2016, 07:31:42 PM »
It really is too bad Jordan never became the player Whitehead has become. That guy seems to be everywhere.

If only Jordan would have developed a reliable shot.

paultzman

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Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #55 on: March 12, 2016, 07:33:42 PM »
It really is too bad Jordan never became the player Whitehead has become. That guy seems to be everywhere.

If only Jordan would have developed a reliable shot.

And eliminated the posse.

Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #56 on: March 12, 2016, 07:38:33 PM »
It really is too bad Jordan never became the player Whitehead has become. That guy seems to be everywhere.

If only Jordan would have developed a reliable shot.

And eliminated the posse.

True, always important to remember how much outside stuff can impact game performance and development.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2016, 07:39:01 PM by survivedc »

Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #57 on: March 12, 2016, 07:46:53 PM »
Think Villanova sort of got gipped on some foul calls at the end, but that was a great job by Hall. Good energy all game long.

desco80

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Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #58 on: March 12, 2016, 07:50:48 PM »
These are the moments we envisioned when Lavin signed his first class and then followed it up with Obekpa and Jordan .
Painful to see Seton Hall enjoying them.
Just as it was to see Providence to a lesser degree last year.

We all thought SL and co. put SJU in a difference class than SHU and PC.   Looks like Cooley and Willard are getting the last laughs.

goredmen

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Re: Big East Tournament
« Reply #59 on: March 12, 2016, 07:56:07 PM »
Not to beat a dead horse but what Whitehead just did and has done at Seton Hall is why a program like ours cannot be better off missing out on a kid like him or Rawle. Here are some posts in the Whitehead thread from two prominent posters:

"Whitehead would have been great at St. John's but he is a player that can be replaced and not needed in '14. Team will have plenty of depth at the position and can reload in '15 and '16. Short term this helps Seton Hall but long term they are playing with dynamite."

"100% agreed. SHU is playing with fire and you know what happens when you play with fire."

Apparently playing with fire wins you Big East championships. We are not Kentucky, Duke or Kansas. Reloading is far from guaranteed. Missing out on elite players like that will always hurt.

I understand it's easy for me to say this in hindsight, but Rawle could have done similar things for us to what Whitehead is doing at SHU right now. To think we're better off that a player like Rawle chose Zona over us is asinine.

Willard is going to wind up getting a nice extension because he understood he had to do what it took to get a player like that to go to his previously black hole of a program. It paid off. There are no limits when you get an elite player on board.