An Xs and Os Assistant

Again, this is all assuming that Mullin doesn't know exactly what he's doing.  Lots of head coaches have never played a game of basketball.   Pretty sure Mullin knows a bit about the game and the different movements of 5 players on the court.   Fwiw, this is not the same as coaching football which is a lot more complex, with two sides of the ball and many more players.  Basketball is much more free-flowing, and it mainly comes down to talent and putting the ball in the basket.

Too many people think we need Sun Tzu as our assistant, because for some reason Mullin is clueless.  I just don't buy this.  Not in the least.  Basketball games are won by preparation in practice, learning the offense, proper defense etc.  Mike Dunlap the basketball mastermind, has a 22-40 record at Loyola.  You'd think he could "coach them up" with his acumen, but it doesn't seem to be working...  Time for Jedi mind tricks or maybe something more mundane like adding more talent.

This year will determine how good the team's X's and O's are from the sideline. If the coaching is not up to snuff, then I will definitely question this aspect. I look at Richmond's post as a position that could've been filled with a good sideline in-game coach. However I will reserve judgement until I see how Mullin, St. Jean and company do in the coming season.

I look at Richmond's post as a position that could've been filled with a good sideline in-game coach.

A shame Mullin couldn't have snagged someone like Jon Scheyer or Nolan Smith, Schrewshrensky's last two special assistant coaches. They could have helped with him with Xs and Os. Instead we're stuck with Mitch Richmond.

Quote from: Johnny23 on May 01, 2016, 01:03:20 PM

I look at Richmond's post as a position that could've been filled with a good sideline in-game coach.

A shame Mullin couldn't have snagged someone like Jon Scheyer or Nolan Smith, Schrewshrensky's last two special assistant coaches. They could have helped with him with Xs and Os. Instead we're stuck with Mitch Richmond.

Agreed x 100.

This year will determine how good the team's X's and O's are from the sideline. If the coaching is not up to snuff, then I will definitely question this aspect. I look at Richmond's post as a position that could've been filled with a good sideline in-game coach. However I will reserve judgement until I see how Mullin, St. Jean and company do in the coming season.

That is entirely fair. Next year is the flex year with being alot better but not quite there yet as a dominant team. If the progress is not what we want than Mullin needs to make this move to ensure in 2 years time (the following season) we are a lock NCAA team. And I think that is possible with all this talent. Next year I will be happy with NIT lock and competitive NCAA bubble.

We have plenty of talent next year and I expect us to be much better than this past season (not saying much), but everyone should remember that often it takes even very talented players some time to become good players in the Big East.  We will be young and integrating a bunch of new guys.  Adding a seasoned guy like Livington, if it happens, should help the transition.  But expectations should be calibrated a bit.  If we are a highly competitive team next season and flirt with the NIT, that would be a very good year in my book.  Beyond that is gravy. 

Quote from: Foad on May 01, 2016, 01:34:40 PM

Quote from: Johnny23 on May 01, 2016, 01:03:20 PM

I look at Richmond's post as a position that could've been filled with a good sideline in-game coach.

A shame Mullin couldn't have snagged someone like Jon Scheyer or Nolan Smith, Schrewshrensky's last two special assistant coaches. They could have helped with him with Xs and Os. Instead we're stuck with Mitch Richmond.

Agreed x 100.

lol

If we are a highly competitive team next season and flirt with the NIT, that would be a very good year in my book.   

Yes that would be a very good year for us.  And highly competitive for us, also.  I don't think Mullin will need as much talent as Lavin did to be competitive.  He needs to come close to the NCAA by the third year or he will be in trouble, I think.

Again, this is all assuming that Mullin doesn't know exactly what he's doing.  Lots of head coaches have never played a game of basketball.   Pretty sure Mullin knows a bit about the game and the different movements of 5 players on the court.   Fwiw, this is not the same as coaching football which is a lot more complex, with two sides of the ball and many more players.  Basketball is much more free-flowing, and it mainly comes down to talent and putting the ball in the basket.

Too many people think we need Sun Tzu as our assistant, because for some reason Mullin is clueless.  I just don't buy this.  Not in the least.  Basketball games are won by preparation in practice, learning the offense, proper defense etc.  Mike Dunlap the basketball mastermind, has a 22-40 record at Loyola.  You'd think he could "coach them up" with his acumen, but it doesn't seem to be working...  Time for Jedi mind tricks or maybe something more mundane like adding more talent.

Maybe Dunlap should have come back to STJ to help Lav with his talent and waited for a better position to open up, instead of doing what the did after Charlotte.

This thread is nutty. The X's and O's weren't the problem. This team was awful. The fact that we're even in games against Xavier, Marquette, Seton Hall and even Nova somewhat is amazing.

Quote from: MCNPA on May 01, 2016, 11:11:51 AM

Again, this is all assuming that Mullin doesn't know exactly what he's doing.  Lots of head coaches have never played a game of basketball.   Pretty sure Mullin knows a bit about the game and the different movements of 5 players on the court.   Fwiw, this is not the same as coaching football which is a lot more complex, with two sides of the ball and many more players.  Basketball is much more free-flowing, and it mainly comes down to talent and putting the ball in the basket.

Too many people think we need Sun Tzu as our assistant, because for some reason Mullin is clueless.  I just don't buy this.  Not in the least.  Basketball games are won by preparation in practice, learning the offense, proper defense etc.  Mike Dunlap the basketball mastermind, has a 22-40 record at Loyola.  You'd think he could "coach them up" with his acumen, but it doesn't seem to be working...  Time for Jedi mind tricks or maybe something more mundane like adding more talent.

Maybe Dunlap should have come back to STJ to help Lav with his talent and waited for a better position to open up, instead of doing what the did after Charlotte.

He inquired about coming back.   Someone told him thanks but no thanks we're good.

This thread is nutty. The X's and O's weren't the problem. This team was awful. The fact that we're even in games against Xavier, Marquette, Seton Hall and even Nova somewhat is amazing.

Don't stop their foolishness it is enjoyable

This thread is nutty. The X's and O's weren't the problem. This team was awful. The fact that we're even in games against Xavier, Marquette, Seton Hall and even Nova somewhat is amazing.

To call this thread nutty is to completely misunderstand the point of it. This year was a free pass period and no one is debating why we were bad, its clear-lack of talent, youth and new staff.  Now moving forward considering we have a boatload of talent on the way and growing experience, lets make sure its not wasted over the next few seasons. As was mentioned earlier Xs and Os with a competitive team need to be evaluated this season so by the the time they are sophomores (Lovett class) and juniors (Yakwe class) in a couple years they can make a real push. Hopefully the door is fully knocked down or close to it by year 4 and the program is completely rebuilt. That is the plan, and this is just assessing the steps that need to be taken to reach this goal.

This thread is nutty. The X's and O's weren't the problem. This team was awful. The fact that we're even in games against Xavier, Marquette, Seton Hall and even Nova somewhat is amazing.

Wow, Poison 100% on point.  Our record was worse than we were.  Don't forget we beat a Syracuse Final 4 team too, and played as hard as we could all game, every game.  Needed more talent.  We had no business taking Nova, Cuse, Xavier, Marquette to the wire every game.  We eventually lost them, but I didn't think the coaching was deficient, it was obvious from a talent standpoint that we were far behind.  Don't forget Marquette had multiple years of top recruiting classes and we still gave them fits.  Bring the talent in!

This thread is nutty. I didn't know we took nova and Xavier to the wire . Most games in reality weren't close. We gave up 50 points or close to it almost every 1st half. Not blaming it all on coaching. But to imply we gave great efforts constantly is not close to the truth.

This thread is nutty. I didn't know we took nova and Xavier to the wire . Most games in reality weren't close. We gave up 50 points or close to it almost every 1st half. Not blaming it all on coaching. But to imply we gave great efforts constantly is not close to the truth.

To be fair TONYD some people think unless players hold a sit-in on the court they are playing hard.

Quote from: Poison on May 01, 2016, 06:10:24 PM

This thread is nutty. The X's and O's weren't the problem. This team was awful. The fact that we're even in games against Xavier, Marquette, Seton Hall and even Nova somewhat is amazing.

To call this thread nutty is to completely misunderstand the point of it. This year was a free pass period and no one is debating why we were bad, its clear-lack of talent, youth and new staff.  Now moving forward considering we have a boatload of talent on the way and growing experience, lets make sure its not wasted over the next few seasons. As was mentioned earlier Xs and Os with a competitive team need to be evaluated this season so by the the time they are sophomores (Lovett class) and juniors (Yakwe class) in a couple years they can make a real push. Hopefully the door is fully knocked down or close to it by year 4 and the program is completely rebuilt. That is the plan, and this is just assessing the steps that need to be taken to reach this goal.

A clear lack of youth?

I think you are right. I have misunderstood your point. Completely.

Here is my list of what I think the team needs for next season:

1.  A F' king point guard. And that's LoVett.
2. A 2 guard who can put the ball on the floor and get his own shot. That's Ponds.
3. Durand Johnson not launching a 3 when he isn't open. He's gone.
4. Ron M'vouika getting significant playing time. Thank God he's gone.
5. A committmentto getting better in the off season. We now know that Sima and Mussini, two string beans, will remain on campus to get stronger, and work on their games.
6. Depth. We'll have more players.
7. Experience. We won't have much of this, and not much can or should be done about that in the near term.
8. Athletes who can play defense. I expect LoVett, Ponds, Owens and Ahmed to give us more defensively than Johnson, M'vouika, Balamaou, Alibegovic and Jones if only because how on earth could anyone else be worse?

I think you massively underestimate just how bad our players were. St.Jean did what he could with a heaping pile of shit. You watched them. You could see that they were significantly less talented that Norm's first team (9 wins) that had 6 scholarship players, and Mohammed Diakite was one of those players.

Without a ball handler, it was completely obvious to anyone with the slightest ability to open their eyes and look that if you press us we have no chance to compete. Not against anyone at a level higher than the MAAC. As good and as unique as the strategy was against SU, it made it clear to anyone that wasn't Mike Hopkins that there is no reason to immediately fall back into a zone against St.John's.

Mullin, in his opinion has his Dunlop. He believes that's St.Jean. I mean, it's spelled differently, sure, but his f'ing name is St.J. Maybe, quietly, he's the savior we've been waiting for all along?

Quote from: Poison on May 01, 2016, 06:10:24 PM

This thread is nutty. The X's and O's weren't the problem. This team was awful. The fact that we're even in games against Xavier, Marquette, Seton Hall and even Nova somewhat is amazing.

Wow, Poison 100% on point.  Our record was worse than we were.  Don't forget we beat a Syracuse Final 4 team too, and played as hard as we could all game, every game.  Needed more talent.  We had no business taking Nova, Cuse, Xavier, Marquette to the wire every game.  We eventually lost them, but I didn't think the coaching was deficient, it was obvious from a talent standpoint that we were far behind.  Don't forget Marquette had multiple years of top recruiting classes and we still gave them fits.  Bring the talent in!

I appreciate the compliment, but playing hard all the time is where I think the issue is. Jones wasn't playing attention on defense, and that was where he was most consistent. Johnson, Mussini and Ellison rarely closed out on shooters. M'vouika would plant his feet in cement and guys would casually dribble right by him. Alibegovic did his best, and in fairness, he did improve.

But Balamou, Johnson, M'vouika and Jones dogged it more than any STJ players I can remember in a long time. I'm thrilled that they're gone, and I can't that everyone else isn't as well.

We had freshman like Mussini, Sima and Ellison that struggled with knowing what they should have done at a particular moment in the game. They made bonehead plays constantly and it appeared that they took plays of all the time. And maybe they did. (I doubt it) But, they were freshman, and as a freshman you're entitled to not know how hard you need to play in year one. You're entitled to bone head passes which become costly turnovers, bad shots, bad finishes and all around thoughtless mistakes.

Those that think DJ Kennedy was leagues better than Malik Ellison have a short memory. He got his ass handed to him as a freshman on a nightly basis just like Malik did. DJ's team had more depth, talent and experience, but they must have lost 10 conference games by 30 points.

This November, all of us will be looking for that consistent effort, hunger to win and in turn a significant improvement. We're adding a lot of athletes, so personally, I'm expecting to see us defend like a BE team as opposed to a bunch of 50 year old guys with beer guts.

To call this thread nutty is to completely misunderstand the point of it.

Good grief. No one is misunderstanding anything. This is not the Manhattan project. You're not Oppenheimer. People aren't  disagreeing with you because your deeply complex proposal was hard for them to comprehend. They're disagreeing with you because your half formed idea was completely lacking in merit. Lest I MISCONSTRUE!!! your important post, let me quote you: "Instead of spending the money on 2 top notch recruiters, would you guys have preferred one and a Dunlap level assistant to balance it out with St. Jean helping and learning."

And the answer is a resounding no, because that's nice personic. You want to bring in an X and O guy to help Saint Jean learn to be an X and O guy so her can help Mullin with Xs and Os. That is dumb on several levels. In the first place, talent wins college BB games, not some dope scribbling on a white board. So two ace recruiters is better than one. In the similar second place, coaching is over rated. Many college BB coaches are complete meatheads and unless you're a class A buffoon like Steve Lavin who doesn't even vaguely understand the sport you don't really need any help. Jim Boeheim and Bob Knight are so dumb they can barely tie their shoes and they're in the hall of fame. In the third place, there's no evidence that Mullin needs help: he's a BB genius who's succeeded at every level of the sport for half a century. And in the fourth place, if he did need help the person to get rid of would be Saint Jean, who's allegedly the X and O guy. Because there's no reason for SJ to be "spending the money" for him to learn on the job.

"if he did need help the person to get rid of would be Saint Jean, who's allegedly the X and O guy. Because there's no reason for SJ to be "spending the money" for him to learn on the job."

Bingo.  This was my original premise.  Saint Jean should be a graduate assistant learning on the job while a Blaney type is brought in to do the X's and O's.  Yes, talent wins games.  To say NJIT or STAC is more talented than us is ludicrous (not that you said it). 

Coaching wins games.  It's why we beat Syracuse with Hopkins and Boeheim took the same players to the final four.  We need an X and O Maven.  We're not in a position to do favors for some up and coming guy's father.