Seth Davis SI SJU Opinion

Quote from: newsman13 on December 15, 2016, 10:37:04 AM

Quote from: Johnny23 on December 15, 2016, 10:17:02 AM

Quote from: newsman13 on December 15, 2016, 10:09:27 AM

If...and it's a big if...Mullin doesn't succeed, they the expectations have to be lowered.

Right now, we're just another NYC/area college basketball team.  Put us down with Hofstra, Stony Brook, LIU, Iona, Fordham and the like.  If Mullin can't put us in the national picture, we have to accept where we are and let it go. We're a mid major school in a major conference.

It's less frustrating to realize this than to accept beat downs by the perennial big time schools as business as usual.

Not necessarily. Mullin doesn't define the future of SJU basketball as much some like to think. If he doesn't work out, then you find a true experienced coach and maybe he has more success here. That may have been a better hire in the first place.

What experienced coach??? Tim Welch...Mihalic...Cluess...Bobby Knight?  Lavin was the gold standard and somehow that became star crossed.  Mullin was a home run post Lavin.  Everyone else is a bunt single.

If Lavin was the gold standard then we're setting the bar way too low. Lavin was a crappy in-game coach and player development guy and that never changed. Great recruiter and program salesman and that's it.

One of the problems is that SJU only targets a small list of coaches and usually in the Northeast mostly. I would give a guy like Gregg Marshall a blank check and he would turn this program into a contender in two years. But SJU for some reason only targets guys from a small pool of prospective candidates. As Seth mentioned in this article recruiting is now a national and international game. Sure it's nice to have a guy with local recruiting roots but not a must to build a winning program.

Quote from: Johnny23 on December 15, 2016, 10:44:38 AM

Quote from: newsman13 on December 15, 2016, 10:37:04 AM

Quote from: Johnny23 on December 15, 2016, 10:17:02 AM

Quote from: newsman13 on December 15, 2016, 10:09:27 AM

If...and it's a big if...Mullin doesn't succeed, they the expectations have to be lowered.

Right now, we're just another NYC/area college basketball team.  Put us down with Hofstra, Stony Brook, LIU, Iona, Fordham and the like.  If Mullin can't put us in the national picture, we have to accept where we are and let it go. We're a mid major school in a major conference.

It's less frustrating to realize this than to accept beat downs by the perennial big time schools as business as usual.

Not necessarily. Mullin doesn't define the future of SJU basketball as much some like to think. If he doesn't work out, then you find a true experienced coach and maybe he has more success here. That may have been a better hire in the first place.

What experienced coach??? Tim Welch...Mihalic...Cluess...Bobby Knight?  Lavin was the gold standard and somehow that became star crossed.  Mullin was a home run post Lavin.  Everyone else is a bunt single.

If Lavin was the gold standard then we're setting the bar way too low. Lavin was a crappy in-game coach and player development guy and that never changed. Great recruiter and program salesman and that's it.

One of the problems is that SJU only targets a small list of coaches and usually in the Northeast mostly. I would give a guy like Gregg Marshall a blank check and he would turn this program into a contender in two years. But SJU for some reason only targets guys from a small pool of prospective candidates. As Seth mentioned in this article recruiting is now a national and international game. Sure it's nice to have a guy with local recruiting roots but not a must to build a winning program.

Lavin had a handful of players who got NBA looks, but that's in the past, so not going there.

I stated this once before....  Marshall has a luxurious situation at Wichita State (ie,charter jet for recruiting trips and away games; use of a private jet for a handful of personal trips; a couple courtesy vehicles).

So, that blank check you speak of can't be written by St. John's.  Frankly, I doubt he'd even be interested.

Quote from: Johnny23 on December 15, 2016, 10:44:38 AM

Quote from: newsman13 on December 15, 2016, 10:37:04 AM

Quote from: Johnny23 on December 15, 2016, 10:17:02 AM

Quote from: newsman13 on December 15, 2016, 10:09:27 AM

If...and it's a big if...Mullin doesn't succeed, they the expectations have to be lowered.

Right now, we're just another NYC/area college basketball team.  Put us down with Hofstra, Stony Brook, LIU, Iona, Fordham and the like.  If Mullin can't put us in the national picture, we have to accept where we are and let it go. We're a mid major school in a major conference.

It's less frustrating to realize this than to accept beat downs by the perennial big time schools as business as usual.

Not necessarily. Mullin doesn't define the future of SJU basketball as much some like to think. If he doesn't work out, then you find a true experienced coach and maybe he has more success here. That may have been a better hire in the first place.

What experienced coach??? Tim Welch...Mihalic...Cluess...Bobby Knight?  Lavin was the gold standard and somehow that became star crossed.  Mullin was a home run post Lavin.  Everyone else is a bunt single.

If Lavin was the gold standard then we're setting the bar way too low. Lavin was a crappy in-game coach and player development guy and that never changed. Great recruiter and program salesman and that's it.

One of the problems is that SJU only targets a small list of coaches and usually in the Northeast mostly. I would give a guy like Gregg Marshall a blank check and he would turn this program into a contender in two years. But SJU for some reason only targets guys from a small pool of prospective candidates. As Seth mentioned in this article recruiting is now a national and international game. Sure it's nice to have a guy with local recruiting roots but not a must to build a winning program.

Lavin had a handful of players who got NBA looks, but that's in the past, so not going there.

I stated this once before....  Marshall has a luxurious situation at Wichita State (ie,charter jet for recruiting trips and away games; use of a private jet for a handful of personal trips; a couple courtesy vehicles).

So, that blank check you speak of can't be written by St. John's.  Frankly, I doubt he'd even be interested.

Quote from: Wods317 on December 15, 2016, 01:34:38 PM

Quote from: Poison on December 15, 2016, 01:07:56 PM

Quote from: Wods317 on December 15, 2016, 12:22:36 PM

The good thing we have going for us when we hire another coach (whenever that is) is that we play in a great city, in a great conference and we have a historically good program even though the last 15 years have been more bad then good. There will be talented coaches who will want to come here because they see all the positives and think they can be the guy to turn this around. I don't see any big name coach leaving a top 25 program no but for an up and coming coach this will be an attractive job.

People gave Lavin shit for living in Soho. Really, can you blame him?

Not even sure what you're talking about but thanks. A good mid major coach would love to coach in the one of the best conferences in the country especially in NY/NJ because of the local talent, not much to debate there. Talking about young mid major coaches not Coach K here.

Insert eyeball roll here. 

Quote from: Foad on December 14, 2016, 12:03:37 PM

Quote from: TONYD3 on December 14, 2016, 11:59:40 AM

I wish mullin luck ... 

I hope he quits

every day i come on here thinking tony cant get more negative. Proven wrong every day.

Respectfully what do you see that I don't ? I don't hate Chris mullin. But I don't like him enough to not have a basketball season for possible 5 years . I want to be positive . I Think we beat DePaul at home and win maybe another 1/2 games. Mullin didn't come in and save us. He is making 2 million a year. I am not going to the game Sunday and I went all through norms years . I think penn state who isn't good ( has never had players like Lovett and ponds) shoots at a high percentage and beats us.

Collins?

Personally I was against this hire. 

Quote from: Poison on December 15, 2016, 09:17:54 AM

Personally I was against this hire. 

Yeah, personally I was against the hire too.  Replacing a coach off of an Ncaa tournament appearance at moribund ST. JOHN's  seemed/seems absurdly ridiculous. 

Than Chris was announced and I was sold on the romantic notion of it all.

It's no wonder as we have a minute and rightfully so frustrated fan base.

But please riddle me this...Why should our living legend have a shorter leash than any coach we've ever had in which to turn this thing around?

That seems absurdly ridiculous as well.

Quote from: carmineabbatiello on December 15, 2016, 05:56:52 PM

Quote from: Poison on December 15, 2016, 09:17:54 AM

Personally I was against this hire. 

Yeah, personally I was against the hire too.  Replacing a coach off of an Ncaa tournament appearance at moribund ST. JOHN's  seemed/seems absurdly ridiculous. 

Than Chris was announced and I was sold on the romantic notion of it all.

It's no wonder as we have a minute and rightfully so frustrated fan base.

But please riddle me this...Why should our living legend have a shorter leash than any coach we've ever had in which to turn this thing around?

That seems absurdly ridiculous as well.

Because he may not win 10 games in 2 seasons

Norm got a long rein. Can we afford Chris a few seasons before we jettison him .

Quote from: valgoth on December 15, 2016, 06:18:06 PM

Norm got a long rein. Can we afford Chris a few seasons before we jettison him .

I miscounted. He already has 11 wins. Norm getting more years was a mistake . That was clearly proven Lavin's first year. (To everyone except foad)Why make that mistake again? I truly am not trying to bother you guys. Is Chris mullin going to a coaches clinic over the summer? How is he going to get better? We play 0 defense. Deleware state could have dropped 100 on us.
I will stop crying when ther is some progress. Nova and Xavier are really good. No one else has that much talent. I hoping either my mind is changed because we are playing better or enough people's mind changes so we get a new staff.

Quote from: TONYD3 on December 15, 2016, 06:28:32 PM

Quote from: valgoth on December 15, 2016, 06:18:06 PM

Norm got a long rein. Can we afford Chris a few seasons before we jettison him .

I miscounted. He already has 11 wins. Norm getting more years was a mistake . That was clearly proven Lavin's first year. (To everyone except foad)Why make that mistake again? I truly am not trying to bother you guys. Is Chris mullin going to a coaches clinic over the summer? How is he going to get better? We play 0 defense. Deleware state could have dropped 100 on us.
I will stop crying when ther is some progress. Nova and Xavier are really good. No one else has that much talent. I hoping either my mind is changed because we are playing better or enough people's mind changes so we get a new staff.

8 + 5 = 13

Also again, can't believe people are already trying to get rid of Mullin. Just beyond my brains comprehension.

Quote from: valgoth on December 15, 2016, 06:18:06 PM

Norm got a long rein. Can we afford Chris a few seasons before we jettison him .

I miscounted. He already has 11 wins. Norm getting more years was a mistake . That was clearly proven Lavin's first year. (To everyone except foad)Why make that mistake again? I truly am not trying to bother you guys. Is Chris mullin going to a coaches clinic over the summer? How is he going to get better? We play 0 defense. Deleware state could have dropped 100 on us.
I will stop crying when ther is some progress. Nova and Xavier are really good. No one else has that much talent. I hoping either my mind is changed because we are playing better or enough people's mind changes so we get a new staff.

Quote from: valgoth on December 15, 2016, 06:18:06 PM

Norm got a long rein. Can we afford Chris a few seasons before we jettison him .

I miscounted. He already has 11 wins. Norm getting more years was a mistake . That was clearly proven Lavin's first year. (To everyone except foad)Why make that mistake again? I truly am not trying to bother you guys. Is Chris mullin going to a coaches clinic over the summer? How is he going to get better? We play 0 defense. Deleware state could have dropped 100 on us.
I will stop crying when ther is some progress. Nova and Xavier are really good. No one else has that much talent. I hoping either my mind is changed because we are playing better or enough people's mind changes so we get a new staff.