Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?

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Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #200 on: January 14, 2018, 10:20:44 PM »

Obviously not all circumstances are the same so it is not fair to say all bad seasons are directly the responsibility of the HC.


Since this sentence is true, it completely dismisses everything before it. It is fair to be critical of this staff, everyone knows I have been, but to compare Mullin's record at this point to his predecessors is completely useless considering what Mullin inherited

If Mullin leaves this year, then i guarantee you it'll be five to eight years before we're back to same spot.  He absolutely has to stay, and so does all, if not the majority of the staff.  Anything choice, would be an utterly stupid decision by the athletic department.


Wait, what??? This year has been brutal and I'm not one pushing for Mullin to be ousted, but your comment makes no sense.   Can it possibly be much worse than it is now?  Why would it take a new regime 5-8 years to get to what level --- winless in BE play?  I think that level of futility can be achieved much quicker....

Precisely, that argument itself is stupid.

Do people understand right now he is 8-34 in BE play...0-6 this year and 0-4 at home.  They lost to the projected 2 worst teams at home...

And you are worried about being set back, from that....

He's getting a 4th year but please make a better argument..

Please read my posts above.  You guys are arguing about the past / sunk costs.
While it may makes sense in our hearts to grip over this season, it doesn't really benefit us.

The best way to evaluate is the expected value of the future returns.
I guarantee you a smart AD thinks of these decisions in this manner. 
It would be foolish to demolish the team and gamble on another coach.

Or more simply:  We already stink this year, and we've stunk for the better part of 25 years. What's the big deal if we stink for two more with Mullin if he's really that bad?  ... Or is it smarter to get a full roster, and then evaluate?  If the teams stinks two years from now - by all means, organize a graceful exit.  I would argue the latter - just see what happens with a full team.

Yes, the team is 0 and whatever in the big east.  But this team took #1 Nova and AZ St. close.... I think it's the smarest use of funds to continue with the current course - and then evaluate later, after they have a full team.





Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #201 on: January 14, 2018, 10:22:28 PM »

Obviously not all circumstances are the same so it is not fair to say all bad seasons are directly the responsibility of the HC.


Since this sentence is true, it completely dismisses everything before it. It is fair to be critical of this staff, everyone knows I have been, but to compare Mullin's record at this point to his predecessors is completely useless considering what Mullin inherited

If Mullin leaves this year, then i guarantee you it'll be five to eight years before we're back to same spot.  He absolutely has to stay, and so does all, if not the majority of the staff.  Anything choice, would be an utterly stupid decision by the athletic department.


Wait, what??? This year has been brutal and I'm not one pushing for Mullin to be ousted, but your comment makes no sense.   Can it possibly be much worse than it is now?  Why would it take a new regime 5-8 years to get to what level --- winless in BE play?  I think that level of futility can be achieved much quicker....

Because making a regime change would guarantee the gutter...at last with keeping the coaching staff, and returning players you have the 'optionality' of the upside of a full roster.   It's that simple.

That's not totally true.

Like anything else it all depends on who you hire.

And lastly the roster has had serious turnover every year and don't expect it to be different even with him coming back...

All I know is when you don't win early it makes it that much harder to win when you are almost forced too..the pressure becomes so enormous...
« Last Edit: January 14, 2018, 10:23:03 PM by fordham96 »

Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #202 on: January 14, 2018, 10:24:56 PM »
This is silly . I am done arguing. Either he quits and we start over. Or he comes back and we lose again. Nothing to debate.

Or he comes back we win 20 lose the 8 / 9 game and it is Glory Years around here.

Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #203 on: January 14, 2018, 10:25:12 PM »

Obviously not all circumstances are the same so it is not fair to say all bad seasons are directly the responsibility of the HC.


Since this sentence is true, it completely dismisses everything before it. It is fair to be critical of this staff, everyone knows I have been, but to compare Mullin's record at this point to his predecessors is completely useless considering what Mullin inherited

If Mullin leaves this year, then i guarantee you it'll be five to eight years before we're back to same spot.  He absolutely has to stay, and so does all, if not the majority of the staff.  Anything choice, would be an utterly stupid decision by the athletic department.


Wait, what??? This year has been brutal and I'm not one pushing for Mullin to be ousted, but your comment makes no sense.   Can it possibly be much worse than it is now?  Why would it take a new regime 5-8 years to get to what level --- winless in BE play?  I think that level of futility can be achieved much quicker....

Precisely, that argument itself is stupid.

Do people understand right now he is 8-34 in BE play...0-6 this year and 0-4 at home.  They lost to the projected 2 worst teams at home...

And you are worried about being set back, from that....

He's getting a 4th year but please make a better argument..

Please read my posts above.  You guys are arguing about the past / sunk costs.
While it may makes sense in our hearts to grip over this season, it doesn't really benefit us.

The best way to evaluate is the expected value of the future returns.
I guarantee you a smart AD thinks of these decisions in this manner. 
It would be foolish to demolish the team and gamble on another coach.

Or more simply:  We already stink this year, and we've stunk for the better part of 25 years. What's the big deal if we stink for two more with Mullin if he's really that bad?  ... Or is it smarter to get a full roster, and then evaluate?  If the teams stinks two years from now - by all means, organize a graceful exit.  I would argue the latter - just see what happens with a full team.

Yes, the team is 0 and whatever in the big east.  But this team took #1 Nova and AZ St. close.... I think it's the smarest use of funds to continue with the current course - and then evaluate later, after they have a full team.






That is a weak argument and that doesn't explain why they fired a coach who just took them to the NCAA's if the don't care about sucking for a few years.

Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #204 on: January 14, 2018, 10:25:24 PM »
This is silly . I am done arguing. Either he quits and we start over. Or he comes back and we lose again. Nothing to debate.

No.  Why be such an absolutist?  Why can you just acknowledge this season is toast, relax about it... it's like crying over split milk at this point.... just evaluate the coaching when he's had a full season or two. I would argue for next two seasons.

I get it, one could argue the team should have had more depth this year...but guess what it didn't.   We all deal with disappointment, or not meeting expectations at work, or in life, etc....so it didn't happen this year.  big deal.  Just see what happens with a full roster the next two season.

It's all about the next two years with a full roster. 

Do you not acknowledge the team would have performed better, if the coaches had more players?  I think it would be preposterous to argue that the performance wouldn't have been better.

Maybe Mullin stinks. I don't know. None of us know - because the team so short handed.   
We just have sing that same old song.. wait until next year.

Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #205 on: January 14, 2018, 10:26:41 PM »
This is silly . I am done arguing. Either he quits and we start over. Or he comes back and we lose again. Nothing to debate.
keep beating the Lavin drum tony. The same one that quit recruiting totally last 2 seasons. Im not happy about this but im ready to give mullin the same we gave lavin. Staff changes will and need to be made. I think they turn it around next season.

SJUFAN

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Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #206 on: January 14, 2018, 10:29:26 PM »
This is silly . I am done arguing. Either he quits and we start over. Or he comes back and we lose again. Nothing to debate.

Which roster in the BE do you believe has less talent than we do? 

Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #207 on: January 14, 2018, 10:30:17 PM »

Obviously not all circumstances are the same so it is not fair to say all bad seasons are directly the responsibility of the HC.


Since this sentence is true, it completely dismisses everything before it. It is fair to be critical of this staff, everyone knows I have been, but to compare Mullin's record at this point to his predecessors is completely useless considering what Mullin inherited

If Mullin leaves this year, then i guarantee you it'll be five to eight years before we're back to same spot.  He absolutely has to stay, and so does all, if not the majority of the staff.  Anything choice, would be an utterly stupid decision by the athletic department.


Wait, what??? This year has been brutal and I'm not one pushing for Mullin to be ousted, but your comment makes no sense.   Can it possibly be much worse than it is now?  Why would it take a new regime 5-8 years to get to what level --- winless in BE play?  I think that level of futility can be achieved much quicker....

Precisely, that argument itself is stupid.

Do people understand right now he is 8-34 in BE play...0-6 this year and 0-4 at home.  They lost to the projected 2 worst teams at home...

And you are worried about being set back, from that....

He's getting a 4th year but please make a better argument..

Please read my posts above.  You guys are arguing about the past / sunk costs.
While it may makes sense in our hearts to grip over this season, it doesn't really benefit us.

The best way to evaluate is the expected value of the future returns.
I guarantee you a smart AD thinks of these decisions in this manner. 
It would be foolish to demolish the team and gamble on another coach.

Or more simply:  We already stink this year, and we've stunk for the better part of 25 years. What's the big deal if we stink for two more with Mullin if he's really that bad?  ... Or is it smarter to get a full roster, and then evaluate?  If the teams stinks two years from now - by all means, organize a graceful exit.  I would argue the latter - just see what happens with a full team.

Yes, the team is 0 and whatever in the big east.  But this team took #1 Nova and AZ St. close.... I think it's the smarest use of funds to continue with the current course - and then evaluate later, after they have a full team.






That is a weak argument and that doesn't explain why they fired a coach who just took them to the NCAA's if the don't care about sucking for a few years.

It's not a weak argument. We weren't discussing Lavin, that's why I haven't brought up Lavin.

I would argue that Lavin was given more time - and had a closer to a full team to evaluate his coaching...and the school decided either he wasn't recruiting well enough, or he sucked at coaching, or both..or he recruited sketchy kids. 

Clearly they made the decision.. I thinking making a decision would be the wrong bet, would waste further resources. The best potential for positive returns would be to see how the next 24 months go. You have optionality to the upside...don't you guys see that?

Maybe Mullin is worst ever. We don't know. No one knows.  I'm just saying can't evaluate it until Mullin has been given a full roster.

Every coaching circumstance is different.  It's so hard to compare one situation vs. another.   

Parenthetically, Lavin completely blew it with recruiting the last few seasons. I would argue, rightly that Mullins recruiting is getting better - see next year's team.  Even this year stinks, I think I can argue that correctly.
« Last Edit: January 14, 2018, 10:36:30 PM by RedmenNYC »

TONYD3

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Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #208 on: January 14, 2018, 10:31:10 PM »
This is silly . I am done arguing. Either he quits and we start over. Or he comes back and we lose again. Nothing to debate.
keep beating the Lavin drum tony. The same one that quit recruiting totally last 2 seasons. Im not happy about this but im ready to give mullin the same we gave lavin. Staff changes will and need to be made. I think they turn it around next season.
You wouldn’t believe it. Don’t even like Lavin. He was ok. We are so far from ok it’s sad.

Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #209 on: January 14, 2018, 10:35:43 PM »

Obviously not all circumstances are the same so it is not fair to say all bad seasons are directly the responsibility of the HC.


Since this sentence is true, it completely dismisses everything before it. It is fair to be critical of this staff, everyone knows I have been, but to compare Mullin's record at this point to his predecessors is completely useless considering what Mullin inherited

If Mullin leaves this year, then i guarantee you it'll be five to eight years before we're back to same spot.  He absolutely has to stay, and so does all, if not the majority of the staff.  Anything choice, would be an utterly stupid decision by the athletic department.


Wait, what??? This year has been brutal and I'm not one pushing for Mullin to be ousted, but your comment makes no sense.   Can it possibly be much worse than it is now?  Why would it take a new regime 5-8 years to get to what level --- winless in BE play?  I think that level of futility can be achieved much quicker....

Because making a regime change would guarantee the gutter...at last with keeping the coaching staff, and returning players you have the 'optionality' of the upside of a full roster.   It's that simple.

That's not totally true.

Like anything else it all depends on who you hire.

And lastly the roster has had serious turnover every year and don't expect it to be different even with him coming back...

All I know is when you don't win early it makes it that much harder to win when you are almost forced too..the pressure becomes so enormous...

For certain, the pressure builds as a coach doesn't win right away.  There is no doubt about it. 

No doubt about roster turnover - it happens most everywhere.  I would expect that team should be more solidly formed next year based all the players waiting on wings.   

To me, this whole thing is so freagn' close to coming together, despite being 0 and whatever this season.

Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #210 on: January 14, 2018, 10:44:55 PM »

Obviously not all circumstances are the same so it is not fair to say all bad seasons are directly the responsibility of the HC.


Since this sentence is true, it completely dismisses everything before it. It is fair to be critical of this staff, everyone knows I have been, but to compare Mullin's record at this point to his predecessors is completely useless considering what Mullin inherited

If Mullin leaves this year, then i guarantee you it'll be five to eight years before we're back to same spot.  He absolutely has to stay, and so does all, if not the majority of the staff.  Anything choice, would be an utterly stupid decision by the athletic department.


Wait, what??? This year has been brutal and I'm not one pushing for Mullin to be ousted, but your comment makes no sense.   Can it possibly be much worse than it is now?  Why would it take a new regime 5-8 years to get to what level --- winless in BE play?  I think that level of futility can be achieved much quicker....

Because making a regime change would guarantee the gutter...at last with keeping the coaching staff, and returning players you have the 'optionality' of the upside of a full roster.   It's that simple.

That's not totally true.

Like anything else it all depends on who you hire.

And lastly the roster has had serious turnover every year and don't expect it to be different even with him coming back...

All I know is when you don't win early it makes it that much harder to win when you are almost forced too..the pressure becomes so enormous...

For certain, the pressure builds as a coach doesn't win right away.  There is no doubt about it. 

No doubt about roster turnover - it happens most everywhere.  I would expect that team should be more solidly formed next year based all the players waiting on wings.   

To me, this whole thing is so freagn' close to coming together, despite being 0 and whatever this season.


I hope you are right.  But this year has burned almost all the goodwill he earned when he was hired.  And I can't continually defend him anymore.

I defended him on the multitude of whiffs on recruiting, on the Slice disaster, on the decision to go after Zach Brown which had red flags all over him, the Sid Wilson debacle, the decision to not make any staff changes but not anymore.  Can't do it.

This is a disaster of his making.  If he has a plan that will turn this around starting this year and continuing into next year, God Bless him.  I will be the first to congratulate.  But I don't give him the benefit of the doubt anymore. 



TONYD3

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Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #211 on: January 14, 2018, 10:45:15 PM »
This is silly . I am done arguing. Either he quits and we start over. Or he comes back and we lose again. Nothing to debate.

Which roster in the BE do you believe has less talent than we do? 
The head coach is in charge of the roster isn’t he? Honestly I don’t know about the other teams. Dvr tapes the games , but I haven’t been watching. I didn’t go Saturday. My brother sold our tickets (I think to nova fans). Lost some interest . No reason to watch if we are coming in 9/10.
I think our talent is good. Definitely has issues. As did every team since Ron artest.

Shot selection- no real offense- poor to 0 defense - long stretches of not being physical which lead to poor rebounding- those are the reasons we suck
Ponds and Simon- 2 good players on a winless team- that says something- unless you think they suck now

Poison

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Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #212 on: January 14, 2018, 10:49:32 PM »
This is silly . I am done arguing. Either he quits and we start over. Or he comes back and we lose again. Nothing to debate.

No.  Why be such an absolutist?  Why can you just acknowledge this season is toast, relax about it... it's like crying over split milk at this point.... just evaluate the coaching when he's had a full season or two. I would argue for next two seasons.

I get it, one could argue the team should have had more depth this year...but guess what it didn't.   We all deal with disappointment, or not meeting expectations at work, or in life, etc....so it didn't happen this year.  big deal.  Just see what happens with a full roster the next two season.

It's all about the next two years with a full roster. 

Do you not acknowledge the team would have performed better, if the coaches had more players?  I think it would be preposterous to argue that the performance wouldn't have been better.

Maybe Mullin stinks. I don't know. None of us know - because the team so short handed.   
We just have sing that same old song.. wait until next year.


What if he stinks because he’s short handed? The person who left him short handed is responsible. I hope we figure out who did that to Mullin, but we may need help in solving the mystery.

Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #213 on: January 14, 2018, 10:50:34 PM »

Obviously not all circumstances are the same so it is not fair to say all bad seasons are directly the responsibility of the HC.


Since this sentence is true, it completely dismisses everything before it. It is fair to be critical of this staff, everyone knows I have been, but to compare Mullin's record at this point to his predecessors is completely useless considering what Mullin inherited

If Mullin leaves this year, then i guarantee you it'll be five to eight years before we're back to same spot.  He absolutely has to stay, and so does all, if not the majority of the staff.  Anything choice, would be an utterly stupid decision by the athletic department.


Wait, what??? This year has been brutal and I'm not one pushing for Mullin to be ousted, but your comment makes no sense.   Can it possibly be much worse than it is now?  Why would it take a new regime 5-8 years to get to what level --- winless in BE play?  I think that level of futility can be achieved much quicker....

Because making a regime change would guarantee the gutter...at last with keeping the coaching staff, and returning players you have the 'optionality' of the upside of a full roster.   It's that simple.

That's not totally true.

Like anything else it all depends on who you hire.

And lastly the roster has had serious turnover every year and don't expect it to be different even with him coming back...

All I know is when you don't win early it makes it that much harder to win when you are almost forced too..the pressure becomes so enormous...

For certain, the pressure builds as a coach doesn't win right away.  There is no doubt about it. 

No doubt about roster turnover - it happens most everywhere.  I would expect that team should be more solidly formed next year based all the players waiting on wings.   

To me, this whole thing is so freagn' close to coming together, despite being 0 and whatever this season.


I hope you are right.  But this year has burned almost all the goodwill he earned when he was hired.  And I can't continually defend him anymore.

I defended him on the multitude of whiffs on recruiting, on the Slice disaster, on the decision to go after Zach Brown which had red flags all over him, the Sid Wilson debacle, the decision to not make any staff changes but not anymore.  Can't do it.

This is a disaster of his making.  If he has a plan that will turn this around starting this year and continuing into next year, God Bless him.  I will be the first to congratulate.  But I don't give him the benefit of the doubt anymore.

You have no argument from me.  No one has to 'defend him'.  I'm not even defending him. The results are terrible this season - there are debacles left and right, as you have mentioned above.

I'm just arguing over and over and over... that the best course of action is to not make a massive regime change.
Just see how it goes, with what we all hope is, finally... a full roster next season and after. There is potential upside of things working.

I think a coaching regime change completely blows up the roster, deflates the fan base even more, and then the endless waiting game continues... at least with keeping the current staff; then we might capture some of the upside returns of having upper classmen, a full roster, etc.



Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #214 on: January 14, 2018, 10:52:42 PM »
This is silly . I am done arguing. Either he quits and we start over. Or he comes back and we lose again. Nothing to debate.

No.  Why be such an absolutist?  Why can you just acknowledge this season is toast, relax about it... it's like crying over split milk at this point.... just evaluate the coaching when he's had a full season or two. I would argue for next two seasons.

I get it, one could argue the team should have had more depth this year...but guess what it didn't.   We all deal with disappointment, or not meeting expectations at work, or in life, etc....so it didn't happen this year.  big deal.  Just see what happens with a full roster the next two season.

It's all about the next two years with a full roster. 

Do you not acknowledge the team would have performed better, if the coaches had more players?  I think it would be preposterous to argue that the performance wouldn't have been better.

Maybe Mullin stinks. I don't know. None of us know - because the team so short handed.   
We just have sing that same old song.. wait until next year.


What if he stinks because he’s short handed? The person who left him short handed is responsible. I hope we figure out who did that to Mullin, but we may need help in solving the mystery.

Sunk cost.   Canning him for the bad roster this year is cutting off your nose to spite your face.
You have a full roster on the horizon.

Canning him would guarantee an empty roster next year.
Keeping him gives you a full, or at least we hope, a full balanced roster next year.

Do you not acknowledge that?

Marillac

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Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #215 on: January 14, 2018, 11:08:18 PM »
We go through the same process every time:  coach has a disappointing season and the fans start going overboard. Inevitably that leads to poor recruiting class and the fans call for the coach's head. Opposing coaches point recruits to our message boards and it becomes impossible to land quality recruiting classes. The coach is fired and then we have to waste 3-4 years building a roster only to have the same cycle continue.

Lovett cost us 7-9 wins this year. He's not a +7-9 win talent, but that is the hole he left by not playing and presumably chasing away Ellison and Mussini and other recruiting options.

Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #216 on: January 14, 2018, 11:13:05 PM »
This is silly . I am done arguing. Either he quits and we start over. Or he comes back and we lose again. Nothing to debate.

No.  Why be such an absolutist?  Why can you just acknowledge this season is toast, relax about it... it's like crying over split milk at this point.... just evaluate the coaching when he's had a full season or two. I would argue for next two seasons.

I get it, one could argue the team should have had more depth this year...but guess what it didn't.   We all deal with disappointment, or not meeting expectations at work, or in life, etc....so it didn't happen this year.  big deal.  Just see what happens with a full roster the next two season.

It's all about the next two years with a full roster. 

Do you not acknowledge the team would have performed better, if the coaches had more players?  I think it would be preposterous to argue that the performance wouldn't have been better.

Maybe Mullin stinks. I don't know. None of us know - because the team so short handed.   
We just have sing that same old song.. wait until next year.


What if he stinks because he’s short handed? The person who left him short handed is responsible. I hope we figure out who did that to Mullin, but we may need help in solving the mystery.

Sunk cost.   Canning him for the bad roster this year is cutting off your nose to spite your face.
You have a full roster on the horizon.

Canning him would guarantee an empty roster next year.
Keeping him gives you a full, or at least we hope, a full balanced roster next year.

Do you not acknowledge that?


The full roster thing is a bit overplayed.  You are assuming no roster attrition next year an we know that is not likely.

Furthermore a lot of the roster issues are due to how they recruited in addition to the transfers.  Meaning the current staff is responsible for these holes.  You can't then use it as an excuse for why they are struggling.

But again all I hear is year 4 is the breakthrough, fine.  I sure hope so.

Poison

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Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #217 on: January 14, 2018, 11:14:46 PM »
This is silly . I am done arguing. Either he quits and we start over. Or he comes back and we lose again. Nothing to debate.

No.  Why be such an absolutist?  Why can you just acknowledge this season is toast, relax about it... it's like crying over split milk at this point.... just evaluate the coaching when he's had a full season or two. I would argue for next two seasons.

I get it, one could argue the team should have had more depth this year...but guess what it didn't.   We all deal with disappointment, or not meeting expectations at work, or in life, etc....so it didn't happen this year.  big deal.  Just see what happens with a full roster the next two season.

It's all about the next two years with a full roster. 

Do you not acknowledge the team would have performed better, if the coaches had more players?  I think it would be preposterous to argue that the performance wouldn't have been better.

Maybe Mullin stinks. I don't know. None of us know - because the team so short handed.   
We just have sing that same old song.. wait until next year.


What if he stinks because he’s short handed? The person who left him short handed is responsible. I hope we figure out who did that to Mullin, but we may need help in solving the mystery.

Sunk cost.   Canning him for the bad roster this year is cutting off your nose to spite your face.
You have a full roster on the horizon.

Canning him would guarantee an empty roster next year.
Keeping him gives you a full, or at least we hope, a full balanced roster next year.

Do you not acknowledge that?


I didn’t say he should be canned because he was so arrogant and lazy that the team was left without enough players to field a competitive team.

This is year 3 and we’re destroyed at home vs DePaul. Isn’t this why the University moved on from Lavin after 5 years? If we’re seeing a staff take the summer off now why don’t we move on from them and hire professionals who understand how hard you have to work to win in the BE?

In terms of players leaving if Mullin is canned, I can live with it, but I don’t think that will necessarily happen if the University hires the right consultant group to help them make their decision. Clearly, they are incapable of this kind of thinking on their own.

Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #218 on: January 14, 2018, 11:27:46 PM »
This is silly . I am done arguing. Either he quits and we start over. Or he comes back and we lose again. Nothing to debate.

No.  Why be such an absolutist?  Why can you just acknowledge this season is toast, relax about it... it's like crying over split milk at this point.... just evaluate the coaching when he's had a full season or two. I would argue for next two seasons.

I get it, one could argue the team should have had more depth this year...but guess what it didn't.   We all deal with disappointment, or not meeting expectations at work, or in life, etc....so it didn't happen this year.  big deal.  Just see what happens with a full roster the next two season.

It's all about the next two years with a full roster. 

Do you not acknowledge the team would have performed better, if the coaches had more players?  I think it would be preposterous to argue that the performance wouldn't have been better.

Maybe Mullin stinks. I don't know. None of us know - because the team so short handed.   
We just have sing that same old song.. wait until next year.


What if he stinks because he’s short handed? The person who left him short handed is responsible. I hope we figure out who did that to Mullin, but we may need help in solving the mystery.

Sunk cost.   Canning him for the bad roster this year is cutting off your nose to spite your face.
You have a full roster on the horizon.

Canning him would guarantee an empty roster next year.
Keeping him gives you a full, or at least we hope, a full balanced roster next year.

Do you not acknowledge that?


The full roster thing is a bit overplayed.  You are assuming no roster attrition next year an we know that is not likely.

Furthermore a lot of the roster issues are due to how they recruited in addition to the transfers.  Meaning the current staff is responsible for these holes.  You can't then use it as an excuse for why they are struggling.

But again all I hear is year 4 is the breakthrough, fine.  I sure hope so.

I don't think the full roster thing is overplayed.  For certain, you are correct in assuming there is always roster turnover / attrition.

That being said, we have what, like 13 scholarship commitments for next season?  Even assuming not every expected player shows up next year, it should be fairly full and balanced roster.   

If it's not a relatively full and balanced roster, then I'll be really pissed off, and all the people who want to move on from Mullin would obviously have a much stronger argument - and I would have almost no leg to stand on... i fully acknowledge that.   

I also understand the argument that that staff should held accountable for this season's short-handed team.  I just choose not penalize them as severely as some others do on this website. They got a bad break, almost literally, with LoVett's knee..and the Wilson thing seems a bit unexpected...otherwise, why would the team even sign him up if he thought he might bolt?

I don't think you and I, and most others on this site, are all the different on the evaluation of the team...none of us are blind; we see the product on the floor.  It's terrible. We are all just moderately different on where we are in terms of patience, and trying to not become fully exasperated to the point of rooting for firing the staff.

I will say it again though... my argument is not purely about giving patience, for patience's sake.  It's about getting the best 'bang for your buck'...we need to try and maximize the potential upsides... Waiting it out a year or two, with hopefully a full and balanced roster seems like the best expected return bet to me.

If it doesn't work, then we can him, destroy the roster and we return, yet again, to a re-restart mode that some are arguing for right now. I just disagree with math that people are doing in head for arguing for canning him right now. 
« Last Edit: January 14, 2018, 11:36:07 PM by RedmenNYC »

johnniesfilmmaker

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Re: Chris Mullin's seat getting hotter?
« Reply #219 on: January 15, 2018, 01:06:39 PM »
We have taken Arizona State, Villanova, Missouri, Seton Hall, and Creighton all down to the wire in games where both teams played well. It wasn't like any of them just couldn't hit a shot or anything. They were pretty much on their games and we competed with them down to the wire. Only one of those games was a home game. Something has to be said for that. We've played four bad games. DePaul, Providence, Georgetown, and UCF. UCF was the 3rd game in 4 days in Florida. Georgetown we had one of our two best players out and our only other scoring option had the flu. DePaul we let get away at the end. I think we tend to play down to poorer competition and that's just inexperience.

The big thing is convincing Shamorie to come back next season. If we can do that, this team is going to have a special year next year. They'll have depth and better interior play both offensively and defensively. Yeah, 0-6 sucks. But we could've very easily been 16-2 with a 5-2 conference record if we had more experience and depth which is all coming next season.

Year 1 was a complete wash and shouldn't even be considered when discussing Chris Mullin.

Year 2 was a fine season in a rebuilding process.

Year 3 has had its ups and downs and we've had some pretty crucial blows. It's a snake-bitten season this year with Mussini AND Ellison leaving and transfers not eligible to play yet and then Lovett getting hurt.

These next two years are the ones where we are going to see who Mullin really is as a coach and a leader. He HAS to convince Shamorie to come back for one more year and if he can't win with that team, it's time to start thinking about the future in a new direction.