Mosque near Ground Zero

"Maybe we should block Christians from building churches near abortion clinics because of the nutcases that go and kill people in them, correct?? Isn't THAT act spurred by RADICALS who believe they are following the way of their scripture??"


   If the head of that particular church made statements to the effect that those abortion doctors had brought violence upon themselves by performing abortions, then maybe they shouldn't build it next to a clinic. ....

If you're talking about Rauf's quotes during the 60 Minutes piece, you are completely misinterpreting the quotes.  "The United States` policies were an accessory to the crime that happened.”  That was in response to a question about what spurred an attack from Al Qaeda. 

Also, the issue is that by saying its not "right" for a mosque to be built is punishing a whole religion for the actions of an EXTREMELY radical few.  Just like blocking a church from being built near an abortion clinic in which violence took place would be punishing a whole religion for the actions of a radical few.  It's stereotyping.  The Muslim religion and the Qu'ran is not based in violence, just as the New Testament isn't based in violence. Once again, the actions of a radical few of a certain religion shouldn't lead to the stereotyping of a full group of people.

Quote from: boo3 on August 29, 2010, 10:37:35 AM

"Maybe we should block Christians from building churches near abortion clinics because of the nutcases that go and kill people in them, correct?? Isn't THAT act spurred by RADICALS who believe they are following the way of their scripture??"


   If the head of that particular church made statements to the effect that those abortion doctors had brought violence upon themselves by performing abortions, then maybe they shouldn't build it next to a clinic. ....

If you're talking about Rauf's quotes during the 60 Minutes piece, you are completely misinterpreting the quotes.  "The United States` policies were an accessory to the crime that happened.”  That was in response to a question about what spurred an attack from Al Qaeda. 

Also, the issue is that by saying its not "right" for a mosque to be built is punishing a whole religion for the actions of an EXTREMELY radical few.  Just like blocking a church from being built near an abortion clinic in which violence took place would be punishing a whole religion for the actions of a radical few.  It's stereotyping.  The Muslim religion and the Qu'ran is not based in violence, just as the New Testament isn't based in violence. Once again, the actions of a radical few of a certain religion shouldn't lead to the stereotyping of a full group of people.

Who bombed the World Trade Center back in 1993? Was that the Zen Buddhists? No it was guess who? The Muslims. How many times are we going to let them shit on us?

They want to open it on 9/11 as well.  ...

Incorrect.  That was a false report and there is no evidence that this will open on 9/11/2011.  In fact, the Imam has said there is no chance he would do that.  Educate yourself.

Quote from: TRabinowitz on August 29, 2010, 11:11:21 AM

Quote from: boo3 on August 29, 2010, 10:37:35 AM

"Maybe we should block Christians from building churches near abortion clinics because of the nutcases that go and kill people in them, correct?? Isn't THAT act spurred by RADICALS who believe they are following the way of their scripture??"


   If the head of that particular church made statements to the effect that those abortion doctors had brought violence upon themselves by performing abortions, then maybe they shouldn't build it next to a clinic. ....

If you're talking about Rauf's quotes during the 60 Minutes piece, you are completely misinterpreting the quotes.  "The United States` policies were an accessory to the crime that happened.”  That was in response to a question about what spurred an attack from Al Qaeda. 

Also, the issue is that by saying its not "right" for a mosque to be built is punishing a whole religion for the actions of an EXTREMELY radical few.  Just like blocking a church from being built near an abortion clinic in which violence took place would be punishing a whole religion for the actions of a radical few.  It's stereotyping.  The Muslim religion and the Qu'ran is not based in violence, just as the New Testament isn't based in violence. Once again, the actions of a radical few of a certain religion shouldn't lead to the stereotyping of a full group of people.

Who bombed the World Trade Center back in 1993? Was that the Zen Buddhists? No it was guess who? The Muslims. How many times are we going to let them shit on us?

It's an EXTREMIST group of Muslims. 

Who protests the funerals of American soldiers???  Was that Zen Buddhists?? Don't think so.  That's the Westboro Baptist Church, an EXTREMIST group of Christians.  So I guess all Christians are hate-filled animals who have no respect for our soldiers, huh??  You're trying to lump Muslims together based on the actions of an extremist group, so why can't I lump Christians together??

Quote from: Marco Baldi on August 30, 2010, 09:34:00 AM

Quote from: TRabinowitz on August 29, 2010, 11:11:21 AM

Quote from: boo3 on August 29, 2010, 10:37:35 AM

"Maybe we should block Christians from building churches near abortion clinics because of the nutcases that go and kill people in them, correct?? Isn't THAT act spurred by RADICALS who believe they are following the way of their scripture??"


   If the head of that particular church made statements to the effect that those abortion doctors had brought violence upon themselves by performing abortions, then maybe they shouldn't build it next to a clinic. ....

If you're talking about Rauf's quotes during the 60 Minutes piece, you are completely misinterpreting the quotes.  "The United States` policies were an accessory to the crime that happened.”  That was in response to a question about what spurred an attack from Al Qaeda. 

Also, the issue is that by saying its not "right" for a mosque to be built is punishing a whole religion for the actions of an EXTREMELY radical few.  Just like blocking a church from being built near an abortion clinic in which violence took place would be punishing a whole religion for the actions of a radical few.  It's stereotyping.  The Muslim religion and the Qu'ran is not based in violence, just as the New Testament isn't based in violence. Once again, the actions of a radical few of a certain religion shouldn't lead to the stereotyping of a full group of people.

Who bombed the World Trade Center back in 1993? Was that the Zen Buddhists? No it was guess who? The Muslims. How many times are we going to let them shit on us?

It's an EXTREMIST group of Muslims. 

Who protests the funerals of American soldiers???  Was that Zen Buddhists?? Don't think so.  That's the Westboro Baptist Church, an EXTREMIST group of Christians.  So I guess all Christians are hate-filled animals who have no respect for our soldiers, huh??  You're trying to lump Muslims together based on the actions of an extremist group, so why can't I lump Christians together??

Are they still Muslims? They attack the same buildings twice, now the Muslims(extremist or not) are trying to set up shop near the scene of the crime? I would be ashamed and embarassed, they  need to police themselves ans show some respect. Build somewhere else. Maybe on Mars

Quote from: TRabinowitz on August 30, 2010, 10:09:15 AM

Quote from: Marco Baldi on August 30, 2010, 09:34:00 AM

Quote from: TRabinowitz on August 29, 2010, 11:11:21 AM

Quote from: boo3 on August 29, 2010, 10:37:35 AM

"Maybe we should block Christians from building churches near abortion clinics because of the nutcases that go and kill people in them, correct?? Isn't THAT act spurred by RADICALS who believe they are following the way of their scripture??"


   If the head of that particular church made statements to the effect that those abortion doctors had brought violence upon themselves by performing abortions, then maybe they shouldn't build it next to a clinic. ....

If you're talking about Rauf's quotes during the 60 Minutes piece, you are completely misinterpreting the quotes.  "The United States` policies were an accessory to the crime that happened.”  That was in response to a question about what spurred an attack from Al Qaeda. 

Also, the issue is that by saying its not "right" for a mosque to be built is punishing a whole religion for the actions of an EXTREMELY radical few.  Just like blocking a church from being built near an abortion clinic in which violence took place would be punishing a whole religion for the actions of a radical few.  It's stereotyping.  The Muslim religion and the Qu'ran is not based in violence, just as the New Testament isn't based in violence. Once again, the actions of a radical few of a certain religion shouldn't lead to the stereotyping of a full group of people.

Who bombed the World Trade Center back in 1993? Was that the Zen Buddhists? No it was guess who? The Muslims. How many times are we going to let them shit on us?

It's an EXTREMIST group of Muslims. 

Who protests the funerals of American soldiers???  Was that Zen Buddhists?? Don't think so.  That's the Westboro Baptist Church, an EXTREMIST group of Christians.  So I guess all Christians are hate-filled animals who have no respect for our soldiers, huh??  You're trying to lump Muslims together based on the actions of an extremist group, so why can't I lump Christians together??

Are they still Muslims? They attack the same buildings twice, now the Muslims(extremist or not) are trying to set up shop near the scene of the crime? I would be ashamed and embarassed, they  need to police themselves ans show some respect. Build somewhere else. Maybe on Mars

Yet I'm sure you think it's ridiculous when foreigners hate all Americans just because of our government/military, right?  I know I do.

Quote from: Marco Baldi on August 30, 2010, 11:20:18 AM

Quote from: TRabinowitz on August 30, 2010, 10:09:15 AM

Quote from: Marco Baldi on August 30, 2010, 09:34:00 AM

Quote from: TRabinowitz on August 29, 2010, 11:11:21 AM

Quote from: boo3 on August 29, 2010, 10:37:35 AM

"Maybe we should block Christians from building churches near abortion clinics because of the nutcases that go and kill people in them, correct?? Isn't THAT act spurred by RADICALS who believe they are following the way of their scripture??"


   If the head of that particular church made statements to the effect that those abortion doctors had brought violence upon themselves by performing abortions, then maybe they shouldn't build it next to a clinic. ....

If you're talking about Rauf's quotes during the 60 Minutes piece, you are completely misinterpreting the quotes.  "The United States` policies were an accessory to the crime that happened.”  That was in response to a question about what spurred an attack from Al Qaeda. 

Also, the issue is that by saying its not "right" for a mosque to be built is punishing a whole religion for the actions of an EXTREMELY radical few.  Just like blocking a church from being built near an abortion clinic in which violence took place would be punishing a whole religion for the actions of a radical few.  It's stereotyping.  The Muslim religion and the Qu'ran is not based in violence, just as the New Testament isn't based in violence. Once again, the actions of a radical few of a certain religion shouldn't lead to the stereotyping of a full group of people.

Who bombed the World Trade Center back in 1993? Was that the Zen Buddhists? No it was guess who? The Muslims. How many times are we going to let them shit on us?

It's an EXTREMIST group of Muslims. 

Who protests the funerals of American soldiers???  Was that Zen Buddhists?? Don't think so.  That's the Westboro Baptist Church, an EXTREMIST group of Christians.  So I guess all Christians are hate-filled animals who have no respect for our soldiers, huh??  You're trying to lump Muslims together based on the actions of an extremist group, so why can't I lump Christians together??

Are they still Muslims? They attack the same buildings twice, now the Muslims(extremist or not) are trying to set up shop near the scene of the crime? I would be ashamed and embarassed, they  need to police themselves ans show some respect. Build somewhere else. Maybe on Mars

Yet I'm sure you think it's ridiculous when foreigners hate all Americans just because of our government/military, right?  I know I do.

No, I think its ridiculous that our government bails out these countries knowing that they still hate us and laugh at us. Menawhile, our genius leaders hesitate to help our own.
Maybe we should listen to the opinions of the victims' families on this one?

This has NOTHING to do with another country, it has to do with OUR Freedom of Religion (you know, those American values you like to talk about??) and it has to do with not stereotyping Al Qaeda with the Muslim and Islam world.

This has NOTHING to do with another country, it has to do with OUR Freedom of Religion (you know, those American values you like to talk about??) and it has to do with not stereotyping Al Qaeda with the Muslim and Islam world.

You dont think that 9/11 was an attack on America?

     you bleeding heart liberals are something else.

Quote from: TRabinowitz on August 30, 2010, 04:34:27 PM

This has NOTHING to do with another country, it has to do with OUR Freedom of Religion (you know, those American values you like to talk about??) and it has to do with not stereotyping Al Qaeda with the Muslim and Islam world.

You dont think that 9/11 was an attack on America?

What does that have to do with anything I just said?? Of course it was an attack on America.  You're clumping Muslims into one group.  Al Qaeda are the RADICALIST form of Muslims.  Just like the Westboro Baptist Church is the RADICAL form of Christians.

So again, lets see how YOU like the stereotyping that you're doing of Muslims:

"Aren't the Westboro Baptist Church members still Christians? Those Christians love to protest the funerals of dead American soldiers, and now those Christians want to set up a (normal, non Westboro Baptist) church near (insert military cemetary).  I would be ashamed and embarrassed.  Those Christians need to police themselves and show some respect.  Build somewhere else. Maybe on Mars"

See how I did that?? I turned YOUR form of radicals into the norm of YOUR religion, just like you did to Muslims.

So when you say sensitivity, why connect the building of a regular MOSQUE to your feelings??  If Muslims wanted to set up a gym near Ground Zero, would there be the same reaction?? Probably not, because its the stereotype in peoples minds that terrorism is the norm for Muslims. When in fact, its as much of the norm as protesting soldiers funerals is to Christianity. 

And boo3 has already stated a falsehood that this is set to open on 9/11, which was merely a rumor and is absolutely not true.     

Personally, I'm not a fan of organized religion, but it helps people cope with their day-to-day lives and sometimes find meaning. As long as the respective leaders don't advocate violence or bilk their customers too much, I don't have a problem with it.

As for this particular mosque, they have a right to build it there as much as anyone, but I would advise them that, in the spirit of sensitivity, they set up shop a few blocks away-- just as, for example, the US should have a right to build an embassy in Nagasaki, but understand that it might not be an advisable or sensitive location and vise versa building a Shaolin temple in Pearl Harbor.

As for TRabinowitz, I'm not sure how much you have traveled in the Middle East (excluding Israel) or even parts of Eurasia and Northern Africa, but I would not characterize radicalized Islam as a marginalized few. Frankly, I understand that you are trying to do an honorable thing and defend one's freedom of religion, but I hope you aren't naive enough to think that this was just the unfortunate manifestation of a radicalized few. Poverty, illiteracy, a floundering sense of identity, and unfortunately violent religious propaganda have galvanized quite a few young men, particularly in Yemen. 

A few books that you might be interested in are The Looming Tower by Lawrence Wright, Jawbreaker by Gary Berntsen, Ghost Wars by Steve Coll, or The Shia Revival by Vali Nasr.

  Come on Baldi!  You can't lump them all together.  just like you can't lump all St.John's fans together just because a few "radicals" decide to wear bags on their heads.   We are not all obnoxious and rude.....



  PS.  I believe everything i see on Fox news

NTSG-    great post BTW...

Personally, I'm not a fan of organized religion, but it helps people cope with their day-to-day lives and sometimes find meaning. As long as the respective leaders don't advocate violence or bilk their customers too much, I don't have a problem with it.

As for this particular mosque, they have a right to build it there as much as anyone, but I would advise them that, in the spirit of sensitivity, they set up shop a few blocks away....

It IS a few blocks away.  How many blocks away do people want to "allow" or "tolerate" Muslims to build a structure??     Also, I am fully aware of that the culture is far more violent in terms of thinking in the Middle East.  However, that doesn't have to do with the basis of the basics of Islam.  The thinking is still radical.  A small percentage of twisted human beings doesn't excuse stereotyping and prejudice.

We are not talking about middle eastern muslims here.  We are talking about the rights of american muslims to build a mosque. I am torn on the issue, but what I am not torn about is baldi's insensitive, uneducated bigotry.  Jews and Catholics were not always thought of as highly in this country a while back yet I bet we all support upholding it then. I associate the horrible attack on America w al qaeda, and more w some middle eastern governments bc I would not be surprised if they at least passively knew something - they certainly turned a blind eye. But grouping in all american muslims w al qaeda? Gimme a #$%^ing break. Are you calling the late Malik Sealy and all the other american muslims terrorists, baldi?  If you do, get the f off this board. 

  Come on Baldi!  You can't lump them all together.  just like you can't lump all St.John's fans together just because a few "radicals" decide to wear bags on their heads.   We are not all obnoxious and rude.....



  PS.  I believe everything i see on Fox news

It was the freedom of expression that allows me to do that.  I hope that was a joke.  Using the $$ I paid for a ticket to ask for a new college coach (and doing it boldly by wearing a bag) certainly different than the prejudice of a large group of people because of the actions of a few.

Hey, I was thinking, maybe we shouldn't build churches on land in which we murdered Native Americans out of sensitivity to their people and cultures.


Oh, wait a minute......

 Boldly would have been removing the mask, and then chanting for the removal of the coach.  Not hiding behind a bag.  But yes, it was a joke. 

We are not talking about middle eastern muslims here.  We are talking about the rights of american muslims to build a mosque. I am torn on the issue, but what I am not torn about is baldi's insensitive, uneducated bigotry.  Jews and Catholics were not always thought of as highly in this country a while back yet I bet we all support upholding it then. I associate the horrible attack on America w al qaeda, and more w some middle eastern governments bc I would not be surprised if they at least passively knew something - they certainly turned a blind eye. But grouping in all american muslims w al qaeda? Gimme a #$%^ing break. Are you calling the late Malik Sealy and all the other american muslims terrorists, baldi?  If you do, get the f off this board. 

I have the right to hate and be a bigot dont I? By you judging me, you are no better.

These animals killed alot of good people.And they are still at it, turn the news on.

So those who judge bigotry are no better than bigots?

Your reality is so warped you aren't even worth it.  It is am embarassment that anyone, let alone a site moderator, would spew this words. I hope one of the mods deletes all of baldi's posts which go wat the f over the line.