For those of you who keep talking about Stith transferring...read this

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MCNPA

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Bottom line is whatever he can provide as an upperclassmen PG and the only upperclassmen returning is welcome.  I don't expect huge things, but he certainly has had some good games, is capable of being aggressive and can help in other roles.

Foad

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We can can bring this thread back when Stith is shooting near 35% from three,

Perhaps he'll shoot 35 percent from 3 next year and I hope he does. But the evidence is he's an awful shooter. He was 0 percent from 3 as a frosh (0 for 6) and 22 percent last year (5 for 22). He's 5 for 28 lifetime (17 percent), 3 of those in one game vs mighty Columbia - meaning thast in his career in games other than Columbia he's a .09 percent 3 point shooter. Last year he missed every 3 pointer he attempted after November 27 and he has never made a 3 in his career in BE play. These are not good results and do not bode well for him being a 35 percent shooter next year.

pmg911

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Stith is a "work out wonder" and will never play major minutes for Lavin.

Stith will not sniff the floor during significant minutes for us, as he shouldn't.  He is not a Big East talent, plain and simple.  That being said, he will be very valuable in the development of our guards and in practice can really show these guys how the Big East game is played so I really am glad he decided to stick around.  It's just a shame he has a dreadfully ugly jump shot.  I love this story because he always seemed like more of a quiet guy and it's nice to see him take a much needed leadership role with the youngsters.

Dreadfully ugly jump shot?  Not a BiG East talent?  He's fast and athletic as h'ell.  His problem was skill, the least of which being his jumper. 

We can can bring this thread back when Stith is shooting near 35% from three, "sniffs the floor" and is our best defensive option at the point.  I never bet against a kid that is this tough and works this hard.

I agree with redmen here. Stith jumper is uuugggllly
*wipes ketchup from his eyes* - I guess Heinz sight isn’t 20/20.

Depends on how our 6'3" guards handle the quick six footers they're going to face.  Stith is quicker than Boothe but I don't know about the elite short guys we're going to see.  That'll dictate whether we play a lot of zone.  I can even see Pointer at the head of the zone at times challenging the short guys.

There are several 6'3" and taller guys who were more than capable of handling their own against smaller guards (ie, Derrick Rose and John Wall of recent).  Heck!  Kyle Anderson would make mince meat outta most shorter guards.  It's all about being skilled.

I'm sure Nurideen Lindsey, Phil Greene and when necessary, D'Angelo Harrison can hold their own against the smaller guards.

EDIT:  You're talking about defensively, I see.  Lindsey and Greene certainly have the lateral quickness to stay with quicker guards.  Quite frankly, I liked what I saw from Harrison laterally in the all-star games I witnessed.  As, far as Lindsey is all about him being properly coached and having the fortitude to play "D."   He definitely has the lateral ability to do so.
Neither Lindsey nor Harrison are known for their defense and I don't know about Greene.  Pointer is and I think that's going to get him minutes.  If Stith is going to get any I think it will be on the defensive side of the court.  We don't need him to score.  In games we're leading Malik will have a good seat to watch.

Neither Lindsey nor Harrison are known for their defense and I don't know about Greene.  Pointer is and I think that's going to get him minutes.  If Stith is going to get any I think it will be on the defensive side of the court.  We don't need him to score.  In games we're leading Malik will have a good seat to watch.

No, neither one are known for their defense.  I see lateral ability where they could be decent defenders.  It's all about them wanting it.  Greene, like Pointer, is known to be a solid defender.

I agree with you, in reference to Pointer.  He is certainly gonna see minutes due to his overall game.  I also agree with you that Stith--if, he receives minutes--will have to be on the defensive end.  In the end, I just do not see him garnering many minutes.

Stith is a "work out wonder" and will never play major minutes for Lavin.

We get it.  You don't like him. 

Poison

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He could play. Stranger things have happened. Burrell was nothing until Lavin took over. Neither was Brownlee.

MCNPA

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Most high schoolers are not known for their defensive prowess.  Guys like Amir and Sir'Dom are two exceptions.  Lindsey and Harrison have the tools.  Most kids in HS concentrate on the offensive side of things.  Defense is a secondary notion.  In college at SJU it will all be different.  Thes kids will spend hours wi Dunlap working on footwork, positioning and the finer points of defense.  They'll also be learning a ton of different zone schemes.  Most coaches don't recruit kids because they are great man defenders.  These kids are excellent athletes and will learn to play a lot better D once they get to SJU. 

All the negative posts here about Stith overlook to very basic points.  He not only impressed this staff with hard work but also by doing what they tell him. Some may remember that he gave them some good minutes in the early games (especially at St. Mary's and in the Great Alaska Shootout and I suspect the decrease in minutes that followed had more to do with the staff's decision to get Hardy minutes at the point and ultimately more minutes with Horne on the wing than it did any disapointment in Stith's performance. I expect he'll play alot, play well and that the remaining point guard time at point will go to Lindsay who's a threat off the dribble the way Hardy was.  I'd be surprised if Harrison sees time running the offense although he can guard PG's with his length and quickness. Once he learns the schemes he'll be a very good defender

Marillac

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All the negative posts here about Stith overlook to very basic points.  He not only impressed this staff with hard work but also by doing what they tell him. Some may remember that he gave them some good minutes in the early games (especially at St. Mary's and in the Great Alaska Shootout and I suspect the decrease in minutes that followed had more to do with the staff's decision to get Hardy minutes at the point and ultimately more minutes with Horne on the wing than it did any disapointment in Stith's performance. I expect he'll play alot, play well and that the remaining point guard time at point will go to Lindsay who's a threat off the dribble the way Hardy was.  I'd be surprised if Harrison sees time running the offense although he can guard PG's with his length and quickness. Once he learns the schemes he'll be a very good defender

I completely agree with Stith's minutes going to Hardy and Horne being more about getting our best five on the court than an indictment on Stith's ability. It was clear that those two needed to be on the floor as much as possible, and playing Hardy at the point was really the only way to have Hardy, Paris, and DJ on the floor together.  Paris' rebounding from two and three spots was outstanding for a player his size and he was our best defensive option. 

Harrison really impresses me.  I think he will be able to play the point as well as Nuri--if not better--but he might be more useful off the ball.  He can really get into the lane and his prowess from behind the arch will give him more opportunities to drive than the respect Nuri's defenders will give to the jumper.

to me his major problem thus far is running the offense and passing on the fast break to the  proper teammate at the right time. however after being buried by lou c  DAVID CAIN had a majestic senior season.  May malik also so prosper.
Cain always had the talent-Lou just didn't play him. It took Mahoney's desperation (no alternatives) to unleash his talent to see results.

Marillac

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Stith is a "work out wonder" and will never play major minutes for Lavin.

Workout wonders don't win Class A MVP of the NEPSAC.  Read the writeups on this kid from high school.  He controlled the pace of the game in both the NC State Championship and the NEPSAC championship.  MVP for both.
Let's see what the this kid can do when he's not afraid to miss a shot or make a mistake for fear of getting yanked for an upperclassman. 

Moose

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Stith is a "work out wonder" and will never play major minutes for Lavin.

Workout wonders don't win Class A MVP of the NEPSAC.  Read the writeups on this kid from high school.  He controlled the pace of the game in both the NC State Championship and the NEPSAC championship.  MVP for both.
Let's see what the this kid can do when he's not afraid to miss a shot or make a mistake for fear of getting yanked for an upperclassman.

But why did the NEPSAC champ and NC champ not beat out Boothe for pt? It's fair question for those to be very skeptical of Stith.
Remember who broke the Slice news

LJSA

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But why did the NEPSAC champ and NC champ not beat out Boothe for pt? It's fair question for those to be very skeptical of Stith.

He can't afford to save his best for last like David Cain if Kyle Anderson and/or Jevon Thomas show up in 2012, so Stith needs to make it happen this season. My fingers are crossed.


Workout wonders don't win Class A MVP of the NEPSAC.  Read the writeups on this kid from high school.  He controlled the pace of the game in both the NC State Championship and the NEPSAC championship.  MVP for both.
Let's see what the this kid can do when he's not afraid to miss a shot or make a mistake for fear of getting yanked for an upperclassman.

But why did the NEPSAC champ and NC champ not beat out Boothe for pt? It's fair question for those to be very skeptical of Stith.

A very fair skepticism, Moose.  I hope Stith comes out like a gangbuster and prove some folks (myself, included) wrong.  I have my doubts.  There have been many kids who played well in high school only to flounder in college, Marillac.  It happens. 

No offense, but there was probably a reason he wasn't really recruited by other high majors.  Contrary to your belief, Stith--like other players who have played any sport--can get yanked and be replaced by an underclassmen or youth.  Skill doesn't discriminate.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2011, 06:12:43 PM by mjdinkins »

Marillac

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Workout wonders don't win Class A MVP of the NEPSAC.  Read the writeups on this kid from high school.  He controlled the pace of the game in both the NC State Championship and the NEPSAC championship.  MVP for both.
Let's see what the this kid can do when he's not afraid to miss a shot or make a mistake for fear of getting yanked for an upperclassman.

But why did the NEPSAC champ and NC champ not beat out Boothe for pt? It's fair question for those to be very skeptical of Stith.

A very fair skepticism, Moose.  I hope Stith comes out like a gangbuster and prove some folks (myself, included) wrong.  I have my doubts.  There have been many kids who played well in high school only to flounder in college, Marillac.  It happens. 

No offense, but there was probably a reason he wasn't really recruited by other high majors.  Contrary to your belief, Stith--like other players who have played any sport--can get yanked and be replaced by an underclassmen or youth.  Skill doesn't discriminate.


It is a fair question and I do have my doubts about Stith, but I recognize the value of this type of player.  I don't agree with your statement that Stith can be replaced so easily.  He's our only upperclassman and from day one he will be the only true defensive option for defending quick guards.  High school kids always have a long way to go in terms of learning defense--especially complicated zones like STJ will employ next season.  I think Greene will be a fantastic defender before long, but Nuri and Harrison (and most offensively talented guards) have been said to be lacking here.  I honestly think Harrison will at least be as good as Hardy, however. 

 Let's let him play one game as a junior and let our rookies play one game as underclassman before we say he can be replaced so easily.  If we had this recruiting class coming in after JB2 and Hardy finished their junior season, we'd all be saying the same things about them sitting behind the stud younger players.

There will be times this season-- and probably next--where these young kids are just fazed by a big run or have their lunches eaten by an older, more physical team.  That is when you bring in the veteran to calm things down and bring up the toughness.  That is something a freshman, no matter how talented, can provide. 
« Last Edit: July 21, 2011, 06:35:55 PM by Marillac »

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It is a fair question and I do have my doubts about Stith, but I recognize the value of this type of player.  I don't agree with your statement that Stith can be replaced so easily.  He's our only upperclassman and from day one he will be the only true defensive option for defending quick guards.  High school kids always have a long way to go in terms of learning defense--especially complicated zones like STJ will employ next season.  I think Greene will be a fantastic defender before long, but Nuri and Harrison (and most offensively talented guards) have been said to be lacking here.  I honestly think Harrison will at least be as good as Hardy, however.

You say some things with such certainty and absolutes.  Stith plays far too tentative to say anything about him with certainty.  Not to mention, the use of upperclassmen can be an overrated term.  I also wonder what makes you think Stith can defend quicker guards.  He's built and moves well in a straight line, but he looks a tad stiff if you ask me.   

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Let's let him play one game as a junior and let our rookies play one game as underclassman before we say he can be replaced so easily.  If we had this recruiting class coming in after JB2 and Hardy finished their junior season, we'd all be saying the same things about them sitting behind the stud younger players.

Goes both ways.....  Let's see what Stith can do before saying, he can't be easily replaced.  One could see potential in Brownlee and Hardy.  What have you honestly seen from Stith to compare him to Brownlee and Hardy after their junior seasons?

"There will be times this season-- and probably next--where these young kids are just fazed by a big run or have their lunches eaten by an older, more physical team.  That is when you bring in the veteran to calm things down and bring up the toughness.  That is something a freshman, no matter how talented, can provide."

Once again, what has Stith done to make you soooo confident that he'll be able to provide that type of leadership?  Do not discredit Lindsey just because he wasn't on the team a season ago.  He has the skill level and he could possibly provide leadership.  Hey! Stith could very well be that kinda leader, but that doesn't mean his skill level will be able to match his heart.  Wrong!  There are or have been freshmen who have provided toughness and leadership.  We had one back in '97'-98....  His name was Ron Artest.  He also was skilled.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2011, 07:03:26 PM by mjdinkins »

MCNPA

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Workout wonders don't win Class A MVP of the NEPSAC.  Read the writeups on this kid from high school.  He controlled the pace of the game in both the NC State Championship and the NEPSAC championship.  MVP for both.
Let's see what the this kid can do when he's not afraid to miss a shot or make a mistake for fear of getting yanked for an upperclassman.

But why did the NEPSAC champ and NC champ not beat out Boothe for pt? It's fair question for those to be very skeptical of Stith.

A very fair skepticism, Moose.  I hope Stith comes out like a gangbuster and prove some folks (myself, included) wrong.  I have my doubts.  There have been many kids who played well in high school only to flounder in college, Marillac.  It happens. 

No offense, but there was probably a reason he wasn't really recruited by other high majors.  Contrary to your belief, Stith--like other players who have played any sport--can get yanked and be replaced by an underclassmen or youth.  Skill doesn't discriminate.


It is a fair question and I do have my doubts about Stith, but I recognize the value of this type of player.  I don't agree with your statement that Stith can be replaced so easily.  He's our only upperclassman and from day one he will be the only true defensive option for defending quick guards.  High school kids always have a long way to go in terms of learning defense--especially complicated zones like STJ will employ next season.  I think Greene will be a fantastic defender before long, but Nuri and Harrison (and most offensively talented guards) have been said to be lacking here.  I honestly think Harrison will at least be as good as Hardy, however. 

 Let's let him play one game as a junior and let our rookies play one game as underclassman before we say he can be replaced so easily.  If we had this recruiting class coming in after JB2 and Hardy finished their junior season, we'd all be saying the same things about them sitting behind the stud younger players.

There will be times this season-- and probably next--where these young kids are just fazed by a big run or have their lunches eaten by an older, more physical team.  That is when you bring in the veteran to calm things down and bring up the toughness.  That is something a freshman, no matter how talented, can provide.

We play a TON of zones.  Not sure why Marillac, you think the idea of having the best man-defender matters as much as it does, when we play zone after zone. I don't think Stith is even a stellar defender, but rather a good one. Jim Boeheim doesn't recruit players because they are fantastic man defenders, because he teaches them how to work within his 2-3.  Stith's defensive prowess, while helpful, is not nearly as important for our success as having kids that can put baskets down, especially with the schemes we play.  In addition, Nuri, Harrison and Greene are much longer and taller.  I also think that Stith's athleticism is being a bit overrated.  He's not a laterally quick player and doesn't have great vision on offense.  His speed is straight-line.  I don't doubt he will offer quite a few benefits to the team like leadership, defense, experience but the truth remains that he won't garner big minutes in any way because he can't score. 

Not sure why Nuri is being written off either.  The kid is an excellent scorer and athlete at 6'4" and has played PG effectively in JC for at least a year now.  I don't expect his defense to be nearly as bad as some think, especially with proper coaching.  I  addition, he didn't average almost 40ppg in Philly as a junior in HS and not be able to score.  His jumpshot needs a little work form-wise, but I still don't doubt that he's a bit better than being given credit for.  We still also have Greene and D'Angelo.

Marillac

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I don't understand what you disagree with?  Are you saying that Malik won't have value?  That we should just write him off right now without ever seeing him play a game as an upperclassman or ever seeing any of our new recruits play a minute of D-1 basketball?

I believe Stith will be a very valuable asset to this team.  I certainly don't think he'll be a star, but I can envision a situation where he is called upon and comes through in big situations in the NCAA tournament next season. 

I also think he will be valuable to begin this season on the court--specifically defensively.  That role will probably lessen as the new guys develop.  Perhaps his role can be similar to that of Bobby Frasor for UNC a few years back.