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Rebounding Deficiencies

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TONYD3

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #20 on: January 03, 2013, 08:48:04 AM »
Why is it to late? We played 1 big east game
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we are sju

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #21 on: January 03, 2013, 09:02:34 AM »
Sampson and Obekpa can't be in the same sentence with rebounding.  Sampson is a solid rebounder, but Obekpa is a very poor rebounder at this point. 

Obepka has no rebounding instincts. It is weird.
Sampson is not a great rebounder. Averages what almost 6?We shoot a bad % and no one else rebounds. He gets pushed around a lot and seems off balance going after rebounds.
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DoodyNY33

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #22 on: January 03, 2013, 09:04:50 AM »
Quote from: TONYD3 on January 03, 2013, 08:48:04 AM
Why is it to late? We played 1 big east game

Let's be honest.  This team isn't getting to the NCAA Tournament this year, so why waste GG?

With GG and Sanchez, St. John's is still a bottom of the conference team at this point.
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Foad

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #23 on: January 03, 2013, 09:19:37 AM »
Quote from: we are sju on January 03, 2013, 09:02:34 AM
Sampson is not a great rebounder. Averages what almost 6?We shoot a bad % and no one else rebounds. He gets pushed around a lot and seems off balance going after rebounds.

Come on now. Sampson averages 7 rpg (6.9) as a freshman. Walter Berry averaged 9 as a junior. Jayson Williams never averaged more than 8.

So yes, he's not a "great" rebounder. Xavier McDaniel was a "great" rebounder. Denise Rodman was a "great" rebounder. Sampson is a freshman playing out of position on a team devoid of big men averaging a little below what a "great" rebounder might average. So he's a pretty good rebounder and besides Garrett seemingly the only player on the team who knows what a rebound is.
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we are sju

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2013, 09:23:12 AM »
Fun
There are a lot of rebounds to be had and someone has to get some of them. No one on this team rebounds. If we need a big rebound are you confident Sampson will go get it?

Berry also had Wennington, Glass and even Mullin grabbing rebounds with no shot clock so there were fewer shots. Williams had Sealy, Werdann and Singleton.
Harkless was a good rebounder as I never thought he was outmanned going for one.
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Foad

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #25 on: January 03, 2013, 09:45:23 AM »
Quote from: we are sju on January 03, 2013, 09:23:12 AM
There are a lot of rebounds to be had and someone has to get some of them. No one on this team rebounds. If we need a big rebound are you confident Sampson will go get it?

I'm not confident about anything. But 7 RPG from a freshman SF is pretty good and about the last thing to be complaining about. Phil Greene is awful. Dom Pointer is awful. Obekpa is one dimensional and your girlfriend Sophie Marceau and her pretty jump shot is one dimension short of being one dimensional. Sampson I'm pretty happy with, all things considered.

Question: how many rebounds do you figure Sampson should be averaging? The team averages 36. He gets 20 percent of them.
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we are sju

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #26 on: January 03, 2013, 09:52:24 AM »
I just don't get the sense that he competes for rebounds the way someone who is our primary/ only rebounder should. Some of it is his slight build but I just don't consider him a factor on the boards. He averages what a rebound and a half less than Harkless but Harkless was just more of a factor. Sampson seems to get pushed around a lot and is off balance. In truth Sampson is more of a college three and is playing out of position.
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Moose

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #27 on: January 03, 2013, 09:55:07 AM »
We have nobody under the basket when a shot is taken the majority of the time.  That's why we have no rebounds.
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we are sju

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #28 on: January 03, 2013, 09:56:19 AM »
We get pushed around a lot. Plus the volleyball thing teams do to us is sort of frustrating to watch
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Gray Chudney

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #29 on: January 03, 2013, 10:00:18 AM »
Quote from: Moose on January 03, 2013, 09:55:07 AM
We have nobody under the basket when a shot is taken the majority of the time.  That's why we have no rebounds.

We don't have a single post player.  Obekpa included.  Not sure Sanchez fits the bill, either, though he would definitely help.

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Moose

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #30 on: January 03, 2013, 10:01:07 AM »
Quote from: Gray Chudney on January 03, 2013, 10:00:18 AM
Quote from: Moose on January 03, 2013, 09:55:07 AM
We have nobody under the basket when a shot is taken the majority of the time.  That's why we have no rebounds.

We don't have a single post player.  Obekpa included.  Not sure Sanchez fits the bill, either, though he would definitely help.



The offense for some reason involves all the players spaced out along the perimeter.  One guy crashes and if by chance the ball bounces where he's not there is nobody else there.  Pretty sad.
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TONYD3

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #31 on: January 03, 2013, 10:05:19 AM »
Quote from: DoodyNY33 on January 03, 2013, 09:04:50 AM
Quote from: TONYD3 on January 03, 2013, 08:48:04 AM
Why is it to late? We played 1 big east game

Let's be honest.  This team isn't getting to the NCAA Tournament this year, so why waste GG?

waste him? he isnt even good. We would have won last night with him though. let him play this year and lets up grade. NIT season is better then nothing. Also losing closer less embrassing then what syracuse is going to do

With GG and Sanchez, St. John's is still a bottom of the conference team at this point.
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Gray Chudney

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #32 on: January 03, 2013, 10:08:46 AM »
Quote from: Moose on January 03, 2013, 10:01:07 AM
Quote from: Gray Chudney on January 03, 2013, 10:00:18 AM
Quote from: Moose on January 03, 2013, 09:55:07 AM
We have nobody under the basket when a shot is taken the majority of the time.  That's why we have no rebounds.

We don't have a single post player.  Obekpa included.  Not sure Sanchez fits the bill, either, though he would definitely help.



The offense for some reason involves all the players spaced out along the perimeter.  One guy crashes and if by chance the ball bounces where he's not there is nobody else there.  Pretty sad.

Yes exactly.  Seems like the kind of offense that an Ivy team that relies entirely on bombing threes would employ. 

But the biggest problem is on the defensive glass.  We are 298th in the country in opponent offensive rebounding percentage!!  If the defense is positioned right and boxes out correctly, any team could be an average group on the defensive boards.   Those adjustments are on coach.
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Gray Chudney

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #33 on: January 03, 2013, 10:10:17 AM »

With GG and Sanchez, St. John's is still a bottom of the conference team at this point.

Disagree.  With one or the other this team is 10-3 (1-0) right now.
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Foad

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #34 on: January 03, 2013, 10:11:31 AM »
Quote from: we are sju on January 03, 2013, 09:52:24 AM
I just don't get the sense that he competes for rebounds the way someone who is our primary/ only rebounder should. Some of it is his slight build but I just don't consider him a factor on the boards. He averages what a rebound and a half less than Harkless but Harkless was just more of a factor. Sampson seems to get pushed around a lot and is off balance. In truth Sampson is more of a college three and is playing out of position.

Expecting JS to be the primary rebounder and the second scoring option seems a bit much. How many rebounds do you reckon Obekpa would get if he spent as much energy trying for every rebound as he does trying to block every shot into the cheap seats? I'd rather see someone who does nothing well like Pointer rebound than sacrifice Sampson's offense. Albeit last night he was less Sampson than Delilah. 
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paultzman

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #35 on: January 03, 2013, 10:15:41 AM »
Quote from: Gray Chudney on January 03, 2013, 10:08:46 AM
Quote from: Moose on January 03, 2013, 10:01:07 AM
Quote from: Gray Chudney on January 03, 2013, 10:00:18 AM
Quote from: Moose on January 03, 2013, 09:55:07 AM
We have nobody under the basket when a shot is taken the majority of the time.  That's why we have no rebounds.

We don't have a single post player.  Obekpa included.  Not sure Sanchez fits the bill, either, though he would definitely help.



The offense for some reason involves all the players spaced out along the perimeter.  One guy crashes and if by chance the ball bounces where he's not there is nobody else there.  Pretty sad.

Yes exactly.  Seems like the kind of offense that an Ivy team that relies entirely on bombing threes would employ. 

But the biggest problem is on the defensive glass.  We are 298th in the country in opponent offensive rebounding percentage!!  If the defense is positioned right and boxes out correctly, any team could be an average group on the defensive boards.   Those adjustments are on coach.

Lavin seems infatuated with skilled athletes everywhere, which obviously makes us vulnerable to bulky guys like Pinkston. Gardner at Marquette, etc. Team with bulk can go inside and if we double rain 3s on us. Pinkston is capable, but not second coming of Jamal Mashburn.  Moose makes an excellent point about rebounding positioning. We may not have much physicality, but  rebounding also entails effort and positioning IMO.
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we are sju

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #36 on: January 03, 2013, 10:17:23 AM »
It is not ideal, but unfortunately Sampson is our main rebounder. Basically Harkless role from last season. I don't mean to compare the two but enough people already have. I think the 'fans" on these boards basically dismiss the former players and build up the new ones. When people were making hrie predictions for this season, hardly anyone acknowlwdged what a big loss Harkless was. Forget Sanchez, I think if Harkless stayed this could be a sweet 16 team.

CO just does not seem to have rebounding instincts. Gets caught flat footed on rebounds. Trying to block every shot while admirable does also put him in poor position at times.
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Moose

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #37 on: January 03, 2013, 10:18:56 AM »
Quote from: Gray Chudney on January 03, 2013, 10:08:46 AM
Quote from: Moose on January 03, 2013, 10:01:07 AM
Quote from: Gray Chudney on January 03, 2013, 10:00:18 AM
Quote from: Moose on January 03, 2013, 09:55:07 AM
We have nobody under the basket when a shot is taken the majority of the time.  That's why we have no rebounds.

We don't have a single post player.  Obekpa included.  Not sure Sanchez fits the bill, either, though he would definitely help.



The offense for some reason involves all the players spaced out along the perimeter.  One guy crashes and if by chance the ball bounces where he's not there is nobody else there.  Pretty sad.

Yes exactly.  Seems like the kind of offense that an Ivy team that relies entirely on bombing threes would employ. 

But the biggest problem is on the defensive glass.  We are 298th in the country in opponent offensive rebounding percentage!!  If the defense is positioned right and boxes out correctly, any team could be an average group on the defensive boards.   Those adjustments are on coach.

On the defensive boards this is how it goes-

A guy is open with a 3.  We have guys out of position.  2 not 1 but 2 guys try to close him out.  So now we have 2 guys running away from the basket.  And viola we are going right back into a crazed defensive set trying to react to another offensive board the other team's way.
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we are sju

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #38 on: January 03, 2013, 10:22:21 AM »
A guy is open with a 3.  We have guys out of position.  2 not 1 but 2 guys try to close him out.  So now we have 2 guys running away from the basket.  And viola we are going right back into a crazed defensive set trying to react to another offensive board the other team's way.

Except for the time Obepka saw Arachnophobia kid lining up to make his 20th three and inexplicably left him alone to go under the basket. But again we seem to disregard white guys.
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MCNPA

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Re: Rebounding Deficiencies
« Reply #39 on: January 03, 2013, 10:30:56 AM »
It's sad because we might not be having this discussion should Gathers not have ditched and we lost our #1 option for the of spot.  We don't have a post player which is killing us right now.  Need Sanchez cleared pronto, because even if he's not a banger, he's a 6'9" athlete who can fill the role up front alongside Obekpa and Jakarr.
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