Next years backcourt

Quote from: Moose on March 04, 2013, 09:00:13 AM

Quote from: fordham96 on March 04, 2013, 08:52:51 AM

Just to give you an idea of why I think some of you guys overreact and read too much into 1 or 2 bad games and then suddenly claim we need an overhaul, look around the league at scoring averages and shooting percentages.  Look how many games, and I mean games involving top teams, are being played in the 50's and even 40's.  Goergetown is the hottest team and they were unbelievably offensively challenged for weeks.  Couldn't break 50 in several games.  Heck against Tennessee they couldn't break 37.  Yesterday's Pitt-Nova game was 8-8 with 9 1/12 minutes to go in the 1st half.  Combined 16 points.  A couple of weeks ago ND fell behind 19-3 on the road at Pitt, scored ONLY 51 total points and still WON by 9.  In other words after scoring 19 points early on Pitt scored 23 points TOTAL the rest of the game.  Scored 23 points in more then 1 half of basketball.  And those teams are LOCKS to make the NCAA's.

BTW-Louisville has won 8 of 9 with the only loss being that crazy 5 OT loss to ND.  OK bear with me.  Their backcourt of Russ Smith and Peyton Siva (generally regarded as one of the best in the country and Siva was pre-season POY in the BE) is shooting .402 and .412 from the field and .324 and .298 from the 3 point line.  Furthermore Siva is coming off a brilliant 0-9 (0-8 from 3) against Syracuse, a game they won.  That is a Junior and Senior starter.

This is not to say we don't have things to address in recruiting.  But saying things like "Greene is not a BE player" or "We need to recruit Severe" are knee jerk reactions that are not true and simply don't reflect reality.

What does that say about the state of college basketball though.  Good defense is great and all but sitting thru a 45-42 game is downright painful.

Out of the Top 25 teams in PPG.  There are a fair number of heavy hitters - Duke, Zags, UNC, Indiana, Michigan, Iowa State, Missouri, NC State (supposedly runs same offense as us)

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/statistics/team/_/stat/scoring-per-game

The object is to score at least one more point than your opponent.  I'd rather win 43-42 than lose 87-86.  Look at that list.  Indiana is #1 in the country and Iona is in the middle of the MAAC conference.  Gotta score and play defense.

What about the other teams I mentioned?  They are ranked or tournament bound.

Also needs to be acknowledged that 43-42 games as the norm aren't going to have recruits banging down our door.

Didn't Lavin mention we would be a running team.  A running team scoring 43 points isn't screaming efficiency.

Quote from: fordham96 on March 04, 2013, 08:52:51 AM

Just to give you an idea of why I think some of you guys overreact and read too much into 1 or 2 bad games and then suddenly claim we need an overhaul, look around the league at scoring averages and shooting percentages.  Look how many games, and I mean games involving top teams, are being played in the 50's and even 40's.  Goergetown is the hottest team and they were unbelievably offensively challenged for weeks.  Couldn't break 50 in several games.  Heck against Tennessee they couldn't break 37.  Yesterday's Pitt-Nova game was 8-8 with 9 1/12 minutes to go in the 1st half.  Combined 16 points.  A couple of weeks ago ND fell behind 19-3 on the road at Pitt, scored ONLY 51 total points and still WON by 9.  In other words after scoring 19 points early on Pitt scored 23 points TOTAL the rest of the game.  Scored 23 points in more then 1 half of basketball.  And those teams are LOCKS to make the NCAA's.

BTW-Louisville has won 8 of 9 with the only loss being that crazy 5 OT loss to ND.  OK bear with me.  Their backcourt of Russ Smith and Peyton Siva (generally regarded as one of the best in the country and Siva was pre-season POY in the BE) is shooting .402 and .412 from the field and .324 and .298 from the 3 point line.  Furthermore Siva is coming off a brilliant 0-9 (0-8 from 3) against Syracuse, a game they won.  That is a Junior and Senior starter.

This is not to say we don't have things to address in recruiting.  But saying things like "Greene is not a BE player" or "We need to recruit Severe" are knee jerk reactions that are not true and simply don't reflect reality.

What does that say about the state of college basketball though.  Good defense is great and all but sitting thru a 45-42 game is downright painful.

Out of the Top 25 teams in PPG.  There are a fair number of heavy hitters - Duke, Zags, UNC, Indiana, Michigan, Iowa State, Missouri, NC State (supposedly runs same offense as us)

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/statistics/team/_/stat/scoring-per-game

I don't disagree we need to be more efficient offensively, that's been painfully obvious all season.   
But I also can't help but notice that the other conferences play a very different style of ball.
I watch Big10 games and guys are spinning in the lane, pump faking 3 and 4 times, taking off from the foul line to start their layups....  you do that in the Big East and you're getting hacked.  Plain and Simple.    Points in the paint are far tougher in this league than anywhere else, and the refs call it differently too.

That doesn't mean we score enough - we definitely don't.   But our games are a lot more physical, and that makes them less pretty. 

Quote from: Moose on March 04, 2013, 09:00:13 AM

Quote from: fordham96 on March 04, 2013, 08:52:51 AM

Just to give you an idea of why I think some of you guys overreact and read too much into 1 or 2 bad games and then suddenly claim we need an overhaul, look around the league at scoring averages and shooting percentages.  Look how many games, and I mean games involving top teams, are being played in the 50's and even 40's.  Goergetown is the hottest team and they were unbelievably offensively challenged for weeks.  Couldn't break 50 in several games.  Heck against Tennessee they couldn't break 37.  Yesterday's Pitt-Nova game was 8-8 with 9 1/12 minutes to go in the 1st half.  Combined 16 points.  A couple of weeks ago ND fell behind 19-3 on the road at Pitt, scored ONLY 51 total points and still WON by 9.  In other words after scoring 19 points early on Pitt scored 23 points TOTAL the rest of the game.  Scored 23 points in more then 1 half of basketball.  And those teams are LOCKS to make the NCAA's.

BTW-Louisville has won 8 of 9 with the only loss being that crazy 5 OT loss to ND.  OK bear with me.  Their backcourt of Russ Smith and Peyton Siva (generally regarded as one of the best in the country and Siva was pre-season POY in the BE) is shooting .402 and .412 from the field and .324 and .298 from the 3 point line.  Furthermore Siva is coming off a brilliant 0-9 (0-8 from 3) against Syracuse, a game they won.  That is a Junior and Senior starter.

This is not to say we don't have things to address in recruiting.  But saying things like "Greene is not a BE player" or "We need to recruit Severe" are knee jerk reactions that are not true and simply don't reflect reality.

What does that say about the state of college basketball though.  Good defense is great and all but sitting thru a 45-42 game is downright painful.

Out of the Top 25 teams in PPG.  There are a fair number of heavy hitters - Duke, Zags, UNC, Indiana, Michigan, Iowa State, Missouri, NC State (supposedly runs same offense as us)

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/statistics/team/_/stat/scoring-per-game

I don't disagree we need to be more efficient offensively, that's been painfully obvious all season.   
But I also can't help but notice that the other conferences play a very different style of ball.
I watch Big10 games and guys are spinning in the lane, pump faking 3 and 4 times, taking off from the foul line to start their layups....  you do that in the Big East and you're getting hacked.  Plain and Simple.    Points in the paint are far tougher in this league than anywhere else, and the refs call it differently too.

That doesn't mean we score enough - we definitely don't.   But our games are a lot more physical, and that makes them less pretty. 

I've found the Big 10 to be especially physical. The BE has physical teams like Pitt, Georgetown, Nova, Marquette & Louisville, but the Big 10 sans their 3 garbage teams (Northwestern, Nebraska & Penn State) are all physical teams.

Quote from: desco80 on March 04, 2013, 01:06:12 PM

Quote from: Moose on March 04, 2013, 09:00:13 AM

Quote from: fordham96 on March 04, 2013, 08:52:51 AM

Just to give you an idea of why I think some of you guys overreact and read too much into 1 or 2 bad games and then suddenly claim we need an overhaul, look around the league at scoring averages and shooting percentages.  Look how many games, and I mean games involving top teams, are being played in the 50's and even 40's.  Goergetown is the hottest team and they were unbelievably offensively challenged for weeks.  Couldn't break 50 in several games.  Heck against Tennessee they couldn't break 37.  Yesterday's Pitt-Nova game was 8-8 with 9 1/12 minutes to go in the 1st half.  Combined 16 points.  A couple of weeks ago ND fell behind 19-3 on the road at Pitt, scored ONLY 51 total points and still WON by 9.  In other words after scoring 19 points early on Pitt scored 23 points TOTAL the rest of the game.  Scored 23 points in more then 1 half of basketball.  And those teams are LOCKS to make the NCAA's.

BTW-Louisville has won 8 of 9 with the only loss being that crazy 5 OT loss to ND.  OK bear with me.  Their backcourt of Russ Smith and Peyton Siva (generally regarded as one of the best in the country and Siva was pre-season POY in the BE) is shooting .402 and .412 from the field and .324 and .298 from the 3 point line.  Furthermore Siva is coming off a brilliant 0-9 (0-8 from 3) against Syracuse, a game they won.  That is a Junior and Senior starter.

This is not to say we don't have things to address in recruiting.  But saying things like "Greene is not a BE player" or "We need to recruit Severe" are knee jerk reactions that are not true and simply don't reflect reality.

What does that say about the state of college basketball though.  Good defense is great and all but sitting thru a 45-42 game is downright painful.

Out of the Top 25 teams in PPG.  There are a fair number of heavy hitters - Duke, Zags, UNC, Indiana, Michigan, Iowa State, Missouri, NC State (supposedly runs same offense as us)

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/statistics/team/_/stat/scoring-per-game

I don't disagree we need to be more efficient offensively, that's been painfully obvious all season.   
But I also can't help but notice that the other conferences play a very different style of ball.
I watch Big10 games and guys are spinning in the lane, pump faking 3 and 4 times, taking off from the foul line to start their layups....  you do that in the Big East and you're getting hacked.  Plain and Simple.    Points in the paint are far tougher in this league than anywhere else, and the refs call it differently too.

That doesn't mean we score enough - we definitely don't.   But our games are a lot more physical, and that makes them less pretty. 

I've found the Big 10 to be especially physical. The BE has physical teams like Pitt, Georgetown, Nova, Marquette & Louisville, but the Big 10 sans their 3 garbage teams (Northwestern, Nebraska & Penn State) are all physical teams.

Agreed.  B10 was always known for prodding teams.  There was some flash because of the schools involved but they could bang with the best of the them.

Quote from: Poison on March 04, 2013, 01:17:05 PM

Quote from: desco80 on March 04, 2013, 01:06:12 PM

Quote from: Moose on March 04, 2013, 09:00:13 AM

Quote from: fordham96 on March 04, 2013, 08:52:51 AM

Just to give you an idea of why I think some of you guys overreact and read too much into 1 or 2 bad games and then suddenly claim we need an overhaul, look around the league at scoring averages and shooting percentages.  Look how many games, and I mean games involving top teams, are being played in the 50's and even 40's.  Goergetown is the hottest team and they were unbelievably offensively challenged for weeks.  Couldn't break 50 in several games.  Heck against Tennessee they couldn't break 37.  Yesterday's Pitt-Nova game was 8-8 with 9 1/12 minutes to go in the 1st half.  Combined 16 points.  A couple of weeks ago ND fell behind 19-3 on the road at Pitt, scored ONLY 51 total points and still WON by 9.  In other words after scoring 19 points early on Pitt scored 23 points TOTAL the rest of the game.  Scored 23 points in more then 1 half of basketball.  And those teams are LOCKS to make the NCAA's.

BTW-Louisville has won 8 of 9 with the only loss being that crazy 5 OT loss to ND.  OK bear with me.  Their backcourt of Russ Smith and Peyton Siva (generally regarded as one of the best in the country and Siva was pre-season POY in the BE) is shooting .402 and .412 from the field and .324 and .298 from the 3 point line.  Furthermore Siva is coming off a brilliant 0-9 (0-8 from 3) against Syracuse, a game they won.  That is a Junior and Senior starter.

This is not to say we don't have things to address in recruiting.  But saying things like "Greene is not a BE player" or "We need to recruit Severe" are knee jerk reactions that are not true and simply don't reflect reality.

What does that say about the state of college basketball though.  Good defense is great and all but sitting thru a 45-42 game is downright painful.

Out of the Top 25 teams in PPG.  There are a fair number of heavy hitters - Duke, Zags, UNC, Indiana, Michigan, Iowa State, Missouri, NC State (supposedly runs same offense as us)

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/statistics/team/_/stat/scoring-per-game

I don't disagree we need to be more efficient offensively, that's been painfully obvious all season.   
But I also can't help but notice that the other conferences play a very different style of ball.
I watch Big10 games and guys are spinning in the lane, pump faking 3 and 4 times, taking off from the foul line to start their layups....  you do that in the Big East and you're getting hacked.  Plain and Simple.    Points in the paint are far tougher in this league than anywhere else, and the refs call it differently too.

That doesn't mean we score enough - we definitely don't.   But our games are a lot more physical, and that makes them less pretty. 

I've found the Big 10 to be especially physical. The BE has physical teams like Pitt, Georgetown, Nova, Marquette & Louisville, but the Big 10 sans their 3 garbage teams (Northwestern, Nebraska & Penn State) are all physical teams.

Agreed.  B10 was always known for prodding teams.  There was some flash because of the schools involved but they could bang with the best of the them.

I'm afraid to even think of what would happen to us vs a legit Big Ten team.

Key is Jakar.  Does he stay??  If so, Obekpa, Sampson, Sanchez, Branch start.  We will arguably have one of the best front courts in college basketball.  Shooting guard spot important but .....

What scares me is I don't think Jakar stays.  Weak draft and NBA drafts on potential.

Agree with this assessment. Next year could be very good, as in Final Four potential good, or it could be very bad, as in losing record bad.

And it really all depends on what happens with Jakarr and Harrison this offseason.

Quote from: survivedc on March 03, 2013, 08:11:57 PM

The irony here is pretty annoying though. Coming in to the season, we talked about how we had a surplus at the guard spot (I think anyway) and now it seems we have a surplus at the forward/center spots with Sanchez, Sampson and Obekpa seriously improving his rebounding.



On another note, I'm excited about Balamou and Marco for next year though if they develop to the game play like they should.

With Sampson obekpa Sanchez pointer Garrett gift, we might have the deepest front court in the country next year. Play Branch 35 mpg and we are going to be good

I would like to add that the team seems to be grooming Pointer to run the point a bit. We will be fine if he keeps working on his handle and his outside shot

 Final Four?   Get me to sweet 16 weekend and I'll do backflips.

Final Four?   Get me to sweet 16 weekend and I'll do backflips.

+1

Final Four?   Get me to sweet 16 weekend and I'll do backflips.

Sweet 16? Let's get back to the tourney first. Then I'll do backflips. 2nd round? Cartwheels. Sweet 16? Painting the SJ logo on the hood of my car. Elite 8? Buying everyone on this board drinks. Final Four? I will kiss a homeless man on the lips and give him a $100 steak dinner near MSG. Championship? I donate my life savings to SJ and die happy.

Writing this down in my calendar.  I'm holding you too back flips if we make the tourney next year...or if we miraculously make it this year.  Regarding the homeless man...1. What did he do to deserve this?  2.  Will you buy him the dinner before or after you molest him? 

Quote from: Gray Chudney on March 03, 2013, 08:15:24 PM

Quote from: survivedc on March 03, 2013, 08:11:57 PM

The irony here is pretty annoying though. Coming in to the season, we talked about how we had a surplus at the guard spot (I think anyway) and now it seems we have a surplus at the forward/center spots with Sanchez, Sampson and Obekpa seriously improving his rebounding.



On another note, I'm excited about Balamou and Marco for next year though if they develop to the game play like they should.

With Sampson obekpa Sanchez pointer Garrett gift, we might have the deepest front court in the country next year. Play Branch 35 mpg and we are going to be good

I would like to add that the team seems to be grooming Pointer to run the point a bit. We will be fine if he keeps working on his handle and his outside shot

Pointer is great against the garbage teams. I am happy with his improvement, but more anything, he needs to work on his jump shot. They give him 3 feet when he has the ball.

Actually when set and he has time Pointer does not have a bad touch. His FT shooting is also much better lately. I would not have a problem with Pointer taking a couple more threes.