Thursday's a play in game!

Quote from: goredmen on March 09, 2014, 07:46:32 PM

Quote from: SJUFAN on March 09, 2014, 07:03:52 PM

Quote from: goredmen on March 09, 2014, 04:46:00 PM

Quote from: Foad on March 09, 2014, 04:40:03 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on March 09, 2014, 02:38:12 PM

People keep saying this, but then I look at other teams resume's and I'm not too impressed. Not much better than ours. If we add two wins (One would be Villanova) we are 100% in.

What if the other teams add wins as well? You say we have a worse resume (theirs are "better than our") than other teams, which resumes you don't find impressive. So our is less than not very impressive. And I agree. Dayton -- one of the last four in -- for example isn't that great but they have a better resume than us. Two wins against top 20 opponents, a better conference record, losses to ranked Baylor, Saint Louis, VCU and  beat Georgia Tech, Cal, Old Miss, and unlike SJU they weren't scared to play Iona, who they beat. What if they win two games also. Still we 100 percent?

The fact is we won't be in if we only beat Providence. If some dreamers here believe thats all we need to do to get in we might as well let them. They will be the ones extra disappointed next Sunday when we arent even realistically in the conversation

Quote from: desco80 on March 09, 2014, 03:19:47 PM

I think it's dangerous to assume the Big East gets 4 teams, and therefore if X happens we'll be in best position for that 4th bid.

You need to look at the teams individually.   Committee members aren't going to be worried about whether the BE has 3 or 4 teams.   They're going to ask, is SJU better than Nebraska or Dayton or Baylor etc.

If the BE is the forth best conference then yes four teams should get in. That's why teams like Baylor gets some consideration. SJU/Prov should get in over teams like Nebraska and Arkansas. SEC was terrible this year. Only team Arkansas beat was UK twice and UK beat nobody except LOU. I think people are looking down on the BE because of the defections, can't wait for the BE to prove everyone wrong.

People are looking down on the BE because Villanova was the only team that picked up any significant non-conference wins and they dominated this league

They are 0-2 against the second place team losing by an average of 25 points.  They are an average of 5 points better than the Johnnies over two games.  I hope the johnnies get past Cotton. 

If going 16-2 while sweeping 8 of the other 9 teams in the league isnt domination i dont know what is

Quote from: Tiznow on March 09, 2014, 08:25:08 PM

Quote from: goredmen on March 09, 2014, 07:46:32 PM

Quote from: SJUFAN on March 09, 2014, 07:03:52 PM

Quote from: goredmen on March 09, 2014, 04:46:00 PM

Quote from: Foad on March 09, 2014, 04:40:03 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on March 09, 2014, 02:38:12 PM

People keep saying this, but then I look at other teams resume's and I'm not too impressed. Not much better than ours. If we add two wins (One would be Villanova) we are 100% in.

What if the other teams add wins as well? You say we have a worse resume (theirs are "better than our") than other teams, which resumes you don't find impressive. So our is less than not very impressive. And I agree. Dayton -- one of the last four in -- for example isn't that great but they have a better resume than us. Two wins against top 20 opponents, a better conference record, losses to ranked Baylor, Saint Louis, VCU and  beat Georgia Tech, Cal, Old Miss, and unlike SJU they weren't scared to play Iona, who they beat. What if they win two games also. Still we 100 percent?

The fact is we won't be in if we only beat Providence. If some dreamers here believe thats all we need to do to get in we might as well let them. They will be the ones extra disappointed next Sunday when we arent even realistically in the conversation

Quote from: desco80 on March 09, 2014, 03:19:47 PM

I think it's dangerous to assume the Big East gets 4 teams, and therefore if X happens we'll be in best position for that 4th bid.

You need to look at the teams individually.   Committee members aren't going to be worried about whether the BE has 3 or 4 teams.   They're going to ask, is SJU better than Nebraska or Dayton or Baylor etc.

If the BE is the forth best conference then yes four teams should get in. That's why teams like Baylor gets some consideration. SJU/Prov should get in over teams like Nebraska and Arkansas. SEC was terrible this year. Only team Arkansas beat was UK twice and UK beat nobody except LOU. I think people are looking down on the BE because of the defections, can't wait for the BE to prove everyone wrong.

People are looking down on the BE because Villanova was the only team that picked up any significant non-conference wins and they dominated this league

They are 0-2 against the second place team losing by an average of 25 points.  They are an average of 5 points better than the Johnnies over two games.  I hope the johnnies get past Cotton. 

If going 16-2 while sweeping 8 of the other 9 teams in the league isnt domination i dont know what is

Yes, they dominated the league. But, I would actually be optimistic if we get to play them in the BET. Like our chances based on our last game against them.

we are the big east in name only after the loss of some many good teams....until the improvement of 2 or 3 programs we are the NOT SO BIG EAST.  We will get as many teams in as deserve it, the past is meaningless. 

we are the big east in name only after the loss of some many good teams....until the improvement of 2 or 3 programs we are the NOT SO BIG EAST.  We will get as many teams in as deserve it, the past is meaningless. 

I think the BE will continue to improve. SJU is on the cusp this year to do something special, GT is normally better then this year. Only have 10 teams puts a bigger spot light on the league as oppose to a 12-16 team conferences. This maybe a wake up call as well for the league to have a tougher OOC schedule.

Quote from: Tiznow on March 09, 2014, 08:25:08 PM

Quote from: goredmen on March 09, 2014, 07:46:32 PM

Quote from: SJUFAN on March 09, 2014, 07:03:52 PM

Quote from: goredmen on March 09, 2014, 04:46:00 PM

Quote from: Foad on March 09, 2014, 04:40:03 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on March 09, 2014, 02:38:12 PM

People keep saying this, but then I look at other teams resume's and I'm not too impressed. Not much better than ours. If we add two wins (One would be Villanova) we are 100% in.

What if the other teams add wins as well? You say we have a worse resume (theirs are "better than our") than other teams, which resumes you don't find impressive. So our is less than not very impressive. And I agree. Dayton -- one of the last four in -- for example isn't that great but they have a better resume than us. Two wins against top 20 opponents, a better conference record, losses to ranked Baylor, Saint Louis, VCU and  beat Georgia Tech, Cal, Old Miss, and unlike SJU they weren't scared to play Iona, who they beat. What if they win two games also. Still we 100 percent?

The fact is we won't be in if we only beat Providence. If some dreamers here believe thats all we need to do to get in we might as well let them. They will be the ones extra disappointed next Sunday when we arent even realistically in the conversation

Quote from: desco80 on March 09, 2014, 03:19:47 PM

I think it's dangerous to assume the Big East gets 4 teams, and therefore if X happens we'll be in best position for that 4th bid.

You need to look at the teams individually.   Committee members aren't going to be worried about whether the BE has 3 or 4 teams.   They're going to ask, is SJU better than Nebraska or Dayton or Baylor etc.

If the BE is the forth best conference then yes four teams should get in. That's why teams like Baylor gets some consideration. SJU/Prov should get in over teams like Nebraska and Arkansas. SEC was terrible this year. Only team Arkansas beat was UK twice and UK beat nobody except LOU. I think people are looking down on the BE because of the defections, can't wait for the BE to prove everyone wrong.

People are looking down on the BE because Villanova was the only team that picked up any significant non-conference wins and they dominated this league

They are 0-2 against the second place team losing by an average of 25 points.  They are an average of 5 points better than the Johnnies over two games.  I hope the johnnies get past Cotton. 

If going 16-2 while sweeping 8 of the other 9 teams in the league isnt domination i dont know what is

18-0

Quote from: goredmen on March 09, 2014, 08:38:16 PM

Quote from: Tiznow on March 09, 2014, 08:25:08 PM

Quote from: goredmen on March 09, 2014, 07:46:32 PM

Quote from: SJUFAN on March 09, 2014, 07:03:52 PM

Quote from: goredmen on March 09, 2014, 04:46:00 PM

Quote from: Foad on March 09, 2014, 04:40:03 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on March 09, 2014, 02:38:12 PM

People keep saying this, but then I look at other teams resume's and I'm not too impressed. Not much better than ours. If we add two wins (One would be Villanova) we are 100% in.

What if the other teams add wins as well? You say we have a worse resume (theirs are "better than our") than other teams, which resumes you don't find impressive. So our is less than not very impressive. And I agree. Dayton -- one of the last four in -- for example isn't that great but they have a better resume than us. Two wins against top 20 opponents, a better conference record, losses to ranked Baylor, Saint Louis, VCU and  beat Georgia Tech, Cal, Old Miss, and unlike SJU they weren't scared to play Iona, who they beat. What if they win two games also. Still we 100 percent?

The fact is we won't be in if we only beat Providence. If some dreamers here believe thats all we need to do to get in we might as well let them. They will be the ones extra disappointed next Sunday when we arent even realistically in the conversation

Quote from: desco80 on March 09, 2014, 03:19:47 PM

I think it's dangerous to assume the Big East gets 4 teams, and therefore if X happens we'll be in best position for that 4th bid.

You need to look at the teams individually.   Committee members aren't going to be worried about whether the BE has 3 or 4 teams.   They're going to ask, is SJU better than Nebraska or Dayton or Baylor etc.

If the BE is the forth best conference then yes four teams should get in. That's why teams like Baylor gets some consideration. SJU/Prov should get in over teams like Nebraska and Arkansas. SEC was terrible this year. Only team Arkansas beat was UK twice and UK beat nobody except LOU. I think people are looking down on the BE because of the defections, can't wait for the BE to prove everyone wrong.

People are looking down on the BE because Villanova was the only team that picked up any significant non-conference wins and they dominated this league

They are 0-2 against the second place team losing by an average of 25 points.  They are an average of 5 points better than the Johnnies over two games.  I hope the johnnies get past Cotton. 

If going 16-2 while sweeping 8 of the other 9 teams in the league isnt domination i dont know what is

18-0

Not that impressive because the only decent team is in Kentucky and  Creighton is rated higher then them!

so you're saying that even if other bubble teams have better resumes than the 4th BE team, the BE team will make it just because they are from the BE.

Yes.

Completely stupid. 

My specialty.

I think the BE is underrated, and even if it's not, I simply enjoy watching BE basketball a great deal.   But I don't think any committee member is going to say, "well the BE deserves 4 teams in - so we gotta take SJU or Providence."    That's not how it's going to work.  I think these guys take their job seriously and compare the handfull of teams that are all on the bubble to one another. 

I think the BE is underrated, and even if it's not, I simply enjoy watching BE basketball a great deal.   But I don't think any committee member is going to say, "well the BE deserves 4 teams in - so we gotta take SJU or Providence."    That's not how it's going to work.  I think these guys take their job seriously and compare the handfull of teams that are all on the bubble to one another. 

I'm not saying the committee will reward teams just based on the conference. I'm saying the strength of the conference is a big factor. Finishing 5th in the BE is more difficult that finishing 5th in the SEC. I cant understand how Arkansas is deserving of a bid and people believe we have to win the BE tourney to get a bid. I think if we win two we get in, if we only win one, it will be difficult but I wouldn't say its impossible.

Let me be logical for a moment. Shouldn't the second half of the season have more weight than the first half? Teams don't begin to jell until the coaching and experience kick in. Looking back to losses to Penn State, etc. don't seem to me to carry the right indicators of potential performance in the Tournament. Momentum and recent performance should. The automatic qualification of a team in a weak conference seems on one hand to be fair, but not in reality. Just my two cents...and that's probably not worth much. There I've said it.

We need two wins, preferably one against Nova, to have a shot.  The idea that one win gets us in wishful thinking, at best, insanity, at worse.

If we beat Prov and then Nova, I think we pass the eye test.  Since #February we have certainly played as one of the best 64 teams in the country... 

So let me get this straight, you constantly complain about posters complaining about a coach who took a team A LOT of people on this board were predicting a Sweet 16 and instead took them to the wrong side of the bubble.. Now you are complaining when people are posting that we should get in with one more win. Starting to seem you just like to complain.

Anyone think that being in NY secretly sways the committee?  Not that they need more hype about the tourney any more. It is always good to have a story in the largest media market.

I also think that we either need 2 wins or 1 and some help. 

Anyone think that being in NY secretly sways the committee?  Not that they need more hype about the tourney any more. It is always good to have a story in the largest media market.

I also think that we either need 2 wins or 1 and some help. 

They already have NY's team as a 2 or 3 seed.

Quote from: happyrappy on March 10, 2014, 12:23:40 PM

Anyone think that being in NY secretly sways the committee?  Not that they need more hype about the tourney any more. It is always good to have a story in the largest media market.

I also think that we either need 2 wins or 1 and some help. 

They already have NY's team as a 2 or 3 seed.

Touche

From Lunardi's new article:

"Big East tournament: Conveniently, St. John's and Providence square off in a Thursday afternoon quarterfinal (with the winner likely facing Villanova). The loser is out of the NCAA picture and we'll most likely see the winner at the First Four in Dayton, Ohio."

Quote from: boo3 on March 09, 2014, 05:08:43 PM

We need two wins, preferably one against Nova, to have a shot.  The idea that one win gets us in wishful thinking, at best, insanity, at worse.

If we beat Prov and then Nova, I think we pass the eye test.  Since #February we have certainly played as one of the best 64 teams in the country... 

So let me get this straight, you constantly complain about posters complaining about a coach who took a team A LOT of people on this board were predicting a Sweet 16 and instead took them to the wrong side of the bubble.. Now you are complaining when people are posting that we should get in with one more win. Starting to seem you just like to complain.

 Not at all.  I just think we need to win at least two games in the BE tournament to get into the NCAA.   Beating Providence alone won't get it done.  It's just my opinion.

  Yours is that one win gets it done. It's my opinion, that you are lost in that regard.. I'm not "complaining",, just pointing out the error of your ways.. someone has to do it.

Not sure what kind of point you are trying to make, as per usual...

Quote from: we are sju on March 10, 2014, 09:35:55 AM

Quote from: boo3 on March 09, 2014, 05:08:43 PM

We need two wins, preferably one against Nova, to have a shot.  The idea that one win gets us in wishful thinking, at best, insanity, at worse.

If we beat Prov and then Nova, I think we pass the eye test.  Since #February we have certainly played as one of the best 64 teams in the country... 

So let me get this straight, you constantly complain about posters complaining about a coach who took a team A LOT of people on this board were predicting a Sweet 16 and instead took them to the wrong side of the bubble.. Now you are complaining when people are posting that we should get in with one more win. Starting to seem you just like to complain.

 Not at all.  I just think we need to win at least two games in the BE tournament to get into the NCAA.   Beating Providence alone won't get it done.  It's just my opinion.

  Yours is that one win gets it done. It's my opinion, that you are lost in that regard.. I'm not "complaining",, just pointing out the error of your ways.. someone has to do it.

Not sure what kind of point you are trying to make, as per usual...

Just that you don't like when people complain about Lavin and yet when someone who is not usually  a glass half full fan states he thinks we are in with a win you called me insane.
I would really be surprised if only 3 BE teams get in. If we beat Prov, we would be the clear cut 4th team. If we win 2 I don't think there is a doubt. People now saying we need to win tourney to get in I think is crazy. 

   Don't be so sensitive. I didn't direct anything at you..

  Not sure why I have this rep as a Lavin lover.. He has massively underachieved with this team, especially if we don;t make the tournament.  I have been consistent with this all season, from day one.

  What bothers me is when it is obvious that certain people completely nitpick game situation to blame the coach for a loss or poor performance.  I do believe that in the end, the players play.. They are the ones taking bad shots, missing free throws, and committing bad turnover and fouls... Everything isn't black and white on a basketball court.

 So ,no, I don't stick to a "party line" so to speak, when it comes to Lavin.. It is a fluid, evolving situation. Some days are better than others.. It's called being objective... Sorry you see it as being inconsistent... Wasn't told I had to pick sides and stick to it.

   Don't be so sensitive. I didn't direct anything at you..

  Not sure why I have this rep as a Lavin lover.. He has massively underachieved with this team, especially if we don;t make the tournament.  I have been consistent with this all season, from day one.

  What bothers me is when it is obvious that certain people completely nitpick game situation to blame the coach for a loss or poor performance.  I do believe that in the end, the players play.. They are the ones taking bad shots, missing free throws, and committing bad turnover and fouls... Everything isn't black and white on a basketball court.

 So ,no, I don't stick to a "party line" so to speak, when it comes to Lavin.. It is a fluid, evolving situation. Some days are better than others.. It's called being objective... Sorry you see it as being inconsistent... Wasn't told I had to pick sides and stick to it.

For me personally, I have not really had an issue with Lavin since Gtown game. I really didn't understand not playing Jordan after he had already played a game during his family issue, but I will chalk that one up to not being able to understand that situation personally. I don't agree with everything he does but I have never approved of everything any coach has ever done.
Everything leading up to Gtown game however was mismanagement the likes of which I have never seen. That was more than bad coaching, that was almost some sort of sabotage. 

I have moved past that and honestly as long as we make tourney all is forgiven... by me anyway. To that end I think it sends a terrible message to the new BE if they leave off a "hot" 21 win team. Can't see only giving the conference 3 bids. 

From Lunardi's new article:

"Big East tournament: Conveniently, St. John's and Providence square off in a Thursday afternoon quarterfinal (with the winner likely facing Villanova). The loser is out of the NCAA picture and we'll most likely see the winner at the First Four in Dayton, Ohio."

The bracket oft comment was a little more pestimistic, SJU has work to do to make the tournamen. He did not make it sound line if we beat Providence were in. It sounded line we need to almost win the whe thing to have a shot.