Amazing how.....

Before someone plays here how great they are but when they leave they stink.

People now saying that Christian Jones will more than make up for Sampson are insane! The funny thing is last year people were saying they thought Sampson was better than Harkless. That was crazy but since Harkless left, par for the course around here. So now I guess Jones is better than Harkless becuase Sampson was better than Harkless and  Jones is better than Sampson.

It's going to be a long offseason. I hope some of you mellow out and watch some baseball or something this summer.

Before someone plays here how great they are but when they leave they stink.

People now saying that Christian Jones will more than make up for Sampson are insane! The funny thing is last year people were saying they thought Sampson was better than Harkless. That was crazy but since Harkless left, par for the course around here. So now I guess Jones is better than Harkless becuase Sampson was better than Harkless and  Jones is better than Sampson.

People being one person on the board. Lets not go overboard.

Hype tends to happen before games are played. Remember when GG was supposed to be a force this year down low?

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 01:40:33 PM

Before someone plays here how great they are but when they leave they stink.

People now saying that Christian Jones will more than make up for Sampson are insane! The funny thing is last year people were saying they thought Sampson was better than Harkless. That was crazy but since Harkless left, par for the course around here. So now I guess Jones is better than Harkless becuase Sampson was better than Harkless and  Jones is better than Sampson.

People being one person on the board. Lets not go overboard.

Hype tends to happen before games are played. Remember when GG was supposed to be a force this year down low?

Marillac as well and the funny thing about that is I believe he was one of the guys saying Sampson was better than Harkless.

We had one year's worth of posts about how great Sanchez was and he broke Nuri's record of going from being great to sucking according to people.

Quote from: Dave on March 26, 2014, 01:43:12 PM

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 01:40:33 PM

Before someone plays here how great they are but when they leave they stink.

People now saying that Christian Jones will more than make up for Sampson are insane! The funny thing is last year people were saying they thought Sampson was better than Harkless. That was crazy but since Harkless left, par for the course around here. So now I guess Jones is better than Harkless becuase Sampson was better than Harkless and  Jones is better than Sampson.

People being one person on the board. Lets not go overboard.

Hype tends to happen before games are played. Remember when GG was supposed to be a force this year down low?

Marillac as well and the funny thing about that is I believe he was one of the guys saying Sampson was better than Harkless.

We had one year's worth of posts about how great Sanchez was and he broke Nuri's record of going from being great to sucking according to people.

We made the NIT after a second straight late season collapse, and having lost our second and fourth leading scorers and leading and 2nd leading rebounder - who we're replacing with a redshirt and some HS senior who hasn't committed yet - are in the midst of addition by subtraction. Only at Saint John's.

Quote from: Dave on March 26, 2014, 01:43:12 PM

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 01:40:33 PM

Before someone plays here how great they are but when they leave they stink.

People now saying that Christian Jones will more than make up for Sampson are insane! The funny thing is last year people were saying they thought Sampson was better than Harkless. That was crazy but since Harkless left, par for the course around here. So now I guess Jones is better than Harkless becuase Sampson was better than Harkless and  Jones is better than Sampson.

People being one person on the board. Lets not go overboard.

Hype tends to happen before games are played. Remember when GG was supposed to be a force this year down low?

Marillac as well and the funny thing about that is I believe he was one of the guys saying Sampson was better than Harkless.

We had one year's worth of posts about how great Sanchez was and he broke Nuri's record of going from being great to sucking according to people.

Wrong there.  I loved Moe.
October 2011:  "Hahaha
With his jumper and versatility Moe looks like a lock for the lottery if he is in fact 6'8.5."
http://johnnyjungle.com/forum/index.php?topic=2869.480

Nov 2, 2011:  Nov 2: " I think he stays but this kid has lottery written all over him."

Before someone plays here how great they are but when they leave they stink.

People now saying that Christian Jones will more than make up for Sampson are insane! The funny thing is last year people were saying they thought Sampson was better than Harkless. That was crazy but since Harkless left, par for the course around here. So now I guess Jones is better than Harkless becuase Sampson was better than Harkless and  Jones is better than Sampson.

Maybe the question will be is Jones better than Pointer?

I totally agree with you WASJU. Happens at every school. Me though, I thought it before the season. Is jones gonna be miles better then Sampson? No, there's a good chance he won't put up those numbers. It is my opinion that jones will help us more and that he's a better fit.  Jakarr was not my type of player, I said it countless of times throughout the year.

Great thread though.

I think there is a difference between people who think Jones will be a good player, and the revisionists that now say Sampson wasn't that good.

Sampson wasn't perfect, but he was a pretty good player.  Just because he didn't live up to our expectations for him, doesn't mean he wasn't valuable.

Quote from: Dave on March 26, 2014, 01:43:12 PM

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 01:40:33 PM

Before someone plays here how great they are but when they leave they stink.

People now saying that Christian Jones will more than make up for Sampson are insane! The funny thing is last year people were saying they thought Sampson was better than Harkless. That was crazy but since Harkless left, par for the course around here. So now I guess Jones is better than Harkless becuase Sampson was better than Harkless and  Jones is better than Sampson.

People being one person on the board. Lets not go overboard.

Hype tends to happen before games are played. Remember when GG was supposed to be a force this year down low?

Marillac as well and the funny thing about that is I believe he was one of the guys saying Sampson was better than Harkless.

We had one year's worth of posts about how great Sanchez was and he broke Nuri's record of going from being great to sucking according to people.

Also not sure if you missed me killing Sampson's NBA hopes the last two years.  One poster said that he hoped Sampson didn't read my posts or else he would develop an inferiority complex. 
I also killed Jones.

Being a better player is a different thing than being better for a certain team.  Horace Grant was not better than Dominique Wilkens, but he helped the Bulls more than Wilkins would have. 

I am not a huge fan of Jones if you haven't gathered that from my posts. 

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 01:47:06 PM

Quote from: Dave on March 26, 2014, 01:43:12 PM

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 01:40:33 PM

Before someone plays here how great they are but when they leave they stink.

People now saying that Christian Jones will more than make up for Sampson are insane! The funny thing is last year people were saying they thought Sampson was better than Harkless. That was crazy but since Harkless left, par for the course around here. So now I guess Jones is better than Harkless becuase Sampson was better than Harkless and  Jones is better than Sampson.

People being one person on the board. Lets not go overboard.

Hype tends to happen before games are played. Remember when GG was supposed to be a force this year down low?

Marillac as well and the funny thing about that is I believe he was one of the guys saying Sampson was better than Harkless.

We had one year's worth of posts about how great Sanchez was and he broke Nuri's record of going from being great to sucking according to people.

Also not sure if you missed me killing Sampson's NBA hopes the last two years.  One poster said that he hoped Sampson didn't read my posts or else he would develop an inferiority complex. 
I also killed Jones.

Being a better player is a different thing than being better for a certain team.  Horace Grant was not better than Dominique Wilkens, but he helped the Bulls more than Wilkins would have. 

I am not a huge fan of Jones if you haven't gathered that from my posts. 

Marillac, this team is not overly talented so taking away talented players will hurt. I understanf your point, but I don't think it applies on this team. Especially up front.

Quote from: Marillac on March 26, 2014, 04:11:44 PM

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 01:47:06 PM

Quote from: Dave on March 26, 2014, 01:43:12 PM

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 01:40:33 PM

Before someone plays here how great they are but when they leave they stink.

People now saying that Christian Jones will more than make up for Sampson are insane! The funny thing is last year people were saying they thought Sampson was better than Harkless. That was crazy but since Harkless left, par for the course around here. So now I guess Jones is better than Harkless becuase Sampson was better than Harkless and  Jones is better than Sampson.

People being one person on the board. Lets not go overboard.

Hype tends to happen before games are played. Remember when GG was supposed to be a force this year down low?

Marillac as well and the funny thing about that is I believe he was one of the guys saying Sampson was better than Harkless.

We had one year's worth of posts about how great Sanchez was and he broke Nuri's record of going from being great to sucking according to people.

Also not sure if you missed me killing Sampson's NBA hopes the last two years.  One poster said that he hoped Sampson didn't read my posts or else he would develop an inferiority complex. 
I also killed Jones.

Being a better player is a different thing than being better for a certain team.  Horace Grant was not better than Dominique Wilkens, but he helped the Bulls more than Wilkins would have. 

I am not a huge fan of Jones if you haven't gathered that from my posts. 

Marillac, this team is not overly talented so taking away talented players will hurt. I understanf your point, but I don't think it applies on this team. Especially up front.

Maybe this team had too many guys who thought they were better than they were, some obviously had inflated personal expectations.  maybe now with guys like jones and whoever comes in '14 , we get role player, team oriented grit type players.  With all of the top 100 off the board they guys coming in should be more team focused and not worried about impressing scouts

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 04:18:46 PM

Quote from: Marillac on March 26, 2014, 04:11:44 PM

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 01:47:06 PM

Quote from: Dave on March 26, 2014, 01:43:12 PM

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 01:40:33 PM

Before someone plays here how great they are but when they leave they stink.

People now saying that Christian Jones will more than make up for Sampson are insane! The funny thing is last year people were saying they thought Sampson was better than Harkless. That was crazy but since Harkless left, par for the course around here. So now I guess Jones is better than Harkless becuase Sampson was better than Harkless and  Jones is better than Sampson.

People being one person on the board. Lets not go overboard.

Hype tends to happen before games are played. Remember when GG was supposed to be a force this year down low?

Marillac as well and the funny thing about that is I believe he was one of the guys saying Sampson was better than Harkless.

We had one year's worth of posts about how great Sanchez was and he broke Nuri's record of going from being great to sucking according to people.

Also not sure if you missed me killing Sampson's NBA hopes the last two years.  One poster said that he hoped Sampson didn't read my posts or else he would develop an inferiority complex. 
I also killed Jones.

Being a better player is a different thing than being better for a certain team.  Horace Grant was not better than Dominique Wilkens, but he helped the Bulls more than Wilkins would have. 

I am not a huge fan of Jones if you haven't gathered that from my posts. 

Marillac, this team is not overly talented so taking away talented players will hurt. I understanf your point, but I don't think it applies on this team. Especially up front.

Maybe this team had too many guys who thought they were better than they were, some obviously had inflated personal expectations.  maybe now with guys like jones and whoever comes in '14 , we get role player, team oriented grit type players.  With all of the top 100 off the board they guys coming in should be more team focused and not worried about impressing scouts

Role players are great, but we only have two very good players and neither can play the 4 or 5. With Sampson I think we would have made the tourney next year. W/o him no way! I am not saying he was great but he did get some easy baskets and he could make 15 foot jumpers. The difference in talent between him and everyone other than DLO/Jordan is vast!

Quote from: Trone on March 26, 2014, 04:23:16 PM

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 04:18:46 PM

Quote from: Marillac on March 26, 2014, 04:11:44 PM

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 01:47:06 PM

Quote from: Dave on March 26, 2014, 01:43:12 PM

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 01:40:33 PM

Before someone plays here how great they are but when they leave they stink.

People now saying that Christian Jones will more than make up for Sampson are insane! The funny thing is last year people were saying they thought Sampson was better than Harkless. That was crazy but since Harkless left, par for the course around here. So now I guess Jones is better than Harkless becuase Sampson was better than Harkless and  Jones is better than Sampson.

People being one person on the board. Lets not go overboard.

Hype tends to happen before games are played. Remember when GG was supposed to be a force this year down low?

Marillac as well and the funny thing about that is I believe he was one of the guys saying Sampson was better than Harkless.

We had one year's worth of posts about how great Sanchez was and he broke Nuri's record of going from being great to sucking according to people.

Also not sure if you missed me killing Sampson's NBA hopes the last two years.  One poster said that he hoped Sampson didn't read my posts or else he would develop an inferiority complex. 
I also killed Jones.

Being a better player is a different thing than being better for a certain team.  Horace Grant was not better than Dominique Wilkens, but he helped the Bulls more than Wilkins would have. 

I am not a huge fan of Jones if you haven't gathered that from my posts. 

Marillac, this team is not overly talented so taking away talented players will hurt. I understanf your point, but I don't think it applies on this team. Especially up front.

Maybe this team had too many guys who thought they were better than they were, some obviously had inflated personal expectations.  maybe now with guys like jones and whoever comes in '14 , we get role player, team oriented grit type players.  With all of the top 100 off the board they guys coming in should be more team focused and not worried about impressing scouts

Role players are great, but we only have two very good players and neither can play the 4 or 5. With Sampson I think we would have made the tourney next year. W/o him no way! I am not saying he was great but he did get some easy baskets and he could make 15 foot jumpers. The difference in talent between him and everyone other than DLO/Jordan is vast!

I agree 100% with his talent being vastly greater than everyone besides sheed/dlo.  however, he did disappoint and although his natural talent is hard to replace , his numbers aren't.  The good news if jones and some combination of new '14 players can provide rebounding and a presence down low then i think we can actually improve.  Big bodies may be more helpful than jakarrs raw talent.  We have the guards to score, while watching the NCAA tourney so far the glaring difference between good tourney teams and SJU to me was the size they have inside.  Good teams typically have big strong post players, we had beanpoles, jones in my mind will be a welcome addition but he certainly is not enough, and ADR seems too raw.  The players that come in over the next month or so will be crucial. Going to need 1 or 2 guys that can play some post mins right away, they dont have to be great players just need to be able to rebound and do the dirty work.

Christian Jones = Magic Johnson

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 04:26:56 PM

Quote from: Trone on March 26, 2014, 04:23:16 PM

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 04:18:46 PM

Quote from: Marillac on March 26, 2014, 04:11:44 PM

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 01:47:06 PM

Quote from: Dave on March 26, 2014, 01:43:12 PM

Quote from: we are sju on March 26, 2014, 01:40:33 PM

Before someone plays here how great they are but when they leave they stink.

People now saying that Christian Jones will more than make up for Sampson are insane! The funny thing is last year people were saying they thought Sampson was better than Harkless. That was crazy but since Harkless left, par for the course around here. So now I guess Jones is better than Harkless becuase Sampson was better than Harkless and  Jones is better than Sampson.

People being one person on the board. Lets not go overboard.

Hype tends to happen before games are played. Remember when GG was supposed to be a force this year down low?

Marillac as well and the funny thing about that is I believe he was one of the guys saying Sampson was better than Harkless.

We had one year's worth of posts about how great Sanchez was and he broke Nuri's record of going from being great to sucking according to people.

Also not sure if you missed me killing Sampson's NBA hopes the last two years.  One poster said that he hoped Sampson didn't read my posts or else he would develop an inferiority complex. 
I also killed Jones.

Being a better player is a different thing than being better for a certain team.  Horace Grant was not better than Dominique Wilkens, but he helped the Bulls more than Wilkins would have. 

I am not a huge fan of Jones if you haven't gathered that from my posts. 

Marillac, this team is not overly talented so taking away talented players will hurt. I understanf your point, but I don't think it applies on this team. Especially up front.

Maybe this team had too many guys who thought they were better than they were, some obviously had inflated personal expectations.  maybe now with guys like jones and whoever comes in '14 , we get role player, team oriented grit type players.  With all of the top 100 off the board they guys coming in should be more team focused and not worried about impressing scouts

Role players are great, but we only have two very good players and neither can play the 4 or 5. With Sampson I think we would have made the tourney next year. W/o him no way! I am not saying he was great but he did get some easy baskets and he could make 15 foot jumpers. The difference in talent between him and everyone other than DLO/Jordan is vast!

I agree 100% with his talent being vastly greater than everyone besides sheed/dlo.  however, he did disappoint and although his natural talent is hard to replace , his numbers aren't.  The good news if jones and some combination of new '14 players can provide rebounding and a presence down low then i think we can actually improve.  Big bodies may be more helpful than jakarrs raw talent.  We have the guards to score, while watching the NCAA tourney so far the glaring difference between good tourney teams and SJU to me was the size they have inside.  Good teams typically have big strong post players, we had beanpoles, jones in my mind will be a welcome addition but he certainly is not enough, and ADR seems too raw.  The players that come in over the next month or so will be crucial. Going to need 1 or 2 guys that can play some post mins right away, they dont have to be great players just need to be able to rebound and do the dirty work.

Remember , we as of now are bringing back an experienced starting 5 with Sheed, DLO, greene, pointer and obekpa.  Things arent as bad as they seem, just need a couple of the right pieces to push us over the edge, no stars needed at this point which is fortunate since none seem to be left

Christian Jones = Magic Johnson

Christian Jones = big capable body, his floor is him being the same as gift who was not great and had terrible hands but was useful

To get to 70 points a game w/o Sampson, Harrison and Jordan will have to combine for close to 40 points a game.

We did so many things poorly these last two years.  You have to be good before you can be great, and we simply weren't good.  We were awful or spectacular, but never good or consistent.

Sampson could be lethal on the right team in the right role.  That team wasn't St. John's and tht role certainly was not what he played.  He killed us on the defensive end all year and on the offensive end at the end of nearly every key game.  He couldn't buy the front end of a 1-and-1 in the 2nd half. 

Alley-oops are great...tomahawks are a big boost...but you have to box out, play d, and set solid screens before any of that other stuff matters.  All I'm saying is IF we can find someone to do that...all is not lost.

We did so many things poorly these last two years.  You have to be good before you can be great, and we simply weren't good.  We were awful or spectacular, but never good or consistent.

Sampson could be lethal on the right team in the right role.  That team wasn't St. John's and tht role certainly was not what he played.  He killed us on the defensive end all year and on the offensive end at the end of nearly every key game.  He couldn't buy the front end of a 1-and-1 in the 2nd half. 

Alley-oops are great...tomahawks are a big boost...but you have to box out, play d, and set solid screens before any of that other stuff matters.  All I'm saying is IF we can find someone to do that...all is not lost.

agreed, and in my opinion that type of player is likely to be around at this stage of the cycle, we aren't in need of a supreme talent just a player as described above.