Cease Fire

Overall the first time in a long time the athletic department is being run in a streamline way where there is a clear structure.

Anderson is Cragg’s hire and both have a lot to prove.  There was a lot to be desired Cragg’s coaching search, and SJUBB was fortunate to end with somebody like Anderson.

Repole gave Cragg some cover fire by going after the school President, but if the Anderson experiment is a failure it is on him, and that may undercut a lot of other things.

Ultimately I think Anderson brings needed structure and raises the floor for St. John's however I think the ceiling at the same time is limited.

I can see how the former is attractive but I'm upset by the latter.

Of course this is just my opinion and others may feel differently. I certainly hope I'm wrong.

I've seen enough of Anderson to know he's got the ship headed in the right direction.

The ship is in last place and trending towards the earth's core. What about that is the right direction?

The young core plus the newcomers next year will have this team improved by a good margin

Yes. We're going to lose two preseason all BE players and replace them with a 2 star midget and  3-star freshman and the sky's the limit. Because you're all about the middle ground. Thank goodness you're so objective.

The ship is in last place and trending towards the earth's core. What about that is the right direction?

Yes. We're going to lose two preseason all BE players and replace them with a 2 star midget and  3-star freshman and the sky's the limit. Because you're all about the middle ground. Thank goodness you're so objective.

If you can't see that he's instilled a real defensive mindset and how to rebound then you're not watching. There is something called progress that can take place without wins. This season was always about rebuilding anyway. I know you don't want to give him any credit for this so just keep pointing at the win total if it makes you feel better.

Thank goodness you're talking about preseason projections and not actual results through almost 20 real games played. If you actually watched the team and saw your two "preseason" 2nd team All BE players then you would actually realize there's nothing 2nd team All BE about Heron to this point of the season. But stick to your preseason projections when you give one of your epic game recaps because preseason sure has a lot to do with the games being played. Said no one ever.

Mullin is the face of this program as a player. That alone should render him beyond criticism after he left as a coach. It was a horrific hire and we parted ways in a timely fashion. He cost us nothing, got us to dance once in four years, and left a roster that could be competitive immediately and good the following season. That really should be the end of it.

At the same time Anderson is a flawed coach in his own regard. But what can we realistically expect here at St. John’s in 2020?  It won’t get better than this. He might be in just the right place to find the pieces he needs...guys like Champagnie and Wasu wouldn’t have even been on his radar elsewhere. He seems like a guy that can use spare parts to build something decent.

Steere has surprised me. He looked like some jacked monster when we got him but he’s very soft and seems to be lacking condition. I’m disappointed so far, but it’s possible that a lot of it can be due to not playing for over a year. He’s also only a freshman and bigs start off slow.

I remember Arkansas having some really heavy players in the past. Oliver Miller is the obvious one but they also had some other obese big man as well.

There is something called progress that can take place without wins.

So it turns out you're not what your record says you are after all. Interesting.

This season was always about rebuilding anyway.

Was it? Because a couple of weeks ago everyone was parsing their way to an 11 seed and booking their flights to Omaha for the first round. Not you though, you were the voice of reason. I recall you boldly predicting a last place finish. 

I know you don't want to give him any credit for this so just keep pointing at the win total if it makes you feel better.

Give who credit for which "this"? Give Anderson credit for last place? I'd be delighted. Because as far as I can tell he stinks and his sytem is garbage. Or do you mean give THE GREAT IRON MIKE credit for instilling "something called progress" or whatever nonsensical intercourse you're on about? I'll hold off with crediting him with that until he wins another game. Which I don't see happening until February.

Thank goodness you're talking about preseason projections and not actual results through almost 20 real games played.

No, I'm talking about actual results. Which actual results suck, because one and five sucks. You're the one yammering on about ephemeral mindsets that are being instilled and progress that manifests itself through losing.

If you actually watched the team and saw your two "preseason" 2nd team All BE players

Yeah, they're not my two preseason all BE players, they were chosen by coach of the decade Jay Wright and his contemporaries. I just quoted them.

then you would actually realize there's nothing 2nd team All BE about Heron to this point of the season.

Right. So either and follow along and use your finger if necessary either CIMA is coaching up Earlington and Champagnie because he's a genyius our he's coaching down Heron and LJF because he's not.
 

But stick to your preseason projections when you give one of your epic game recaps because preseason sure has a lot to do with the games being played. Said no one ever.

This is of course false, stupid and nonsensical. There are entire industries dedicated to preseasons: preseason polls, preseason rankings, preseason bracketology, Street and Smith, it's along list. Which in any case, they're one and five looking at one and ten. Which has nothing to do with the preseason. That has to do with stinking. Which speaking of my epic recaps I wrote this in November and it's today as fresh as a copulating daisy. So fresh I could have written it yesterday:

"it’s hard to know what would excuse St John’s slow lingering death. They were playing in the their own back yard, in their own time zone and in front of what appeared to be if not a friendly at least a nonhostile crowd and yet they managed only 38 percent from the floor, 18 percent from three, 60 percent from the free throw line, turned the ball over 16 times and had a mere nine assists on 66 shots. My working theory is that they stink."

And stink was me being generous. As is my wont.

I want an apology.

Not to me personally - but to Chris Mullin and his family, the university, JJ posters and St. John's fans everywhere. These interlopers, I know not whence they came, have come on our board (ok Dave's board) and had the unmitigated audacity to bad mouth our hero and legend (who should have been an untouchable) consistently and rigorously.

Until this happens, and thus far we stink, there will be no cease fire and they're going to hear it from me until CFC exceeds Mullin's coaching accomplishment.

Mullin is the face of our program. He is long gone as a coach. Going after him negatively at this point makes our entire fanbase look gross to anyone that looks in—and that includes prospective recruits. There is no need for such venom.

Apologies aren’t needed at this point. It will be easier to offer when we are decent again.

So it turns out you're not what your record says you are after all. Interesting.

Was it? Because a couple of weeks ago everyone was parsing their way to an 11 seed and booking their flights to Omaha for the first round. Not you though, you were the voice of reason. I recall you boldly predicting a last place finish. 



Give who credit for which "this"? Give Anderson credit for last place? I'd be delighted. Because as far as I can tell he stinks and his sytem is garbage. Or do you mean give THE GREAT IRON MIKE credit for instilling "something called progress" or whatever nonsensical intercourse you're on about? I'll hold off with crediting him with that until he wins another game. Which I don't see happening until February.



No, I'm talking about actual results. Which actual results suck, because one and five sucks. You're the one yammering on about ephemeral mindsets that are being instilled and progress that manifests itself through losing.


Yeah, they're not my two preseason all BE players, they were chosen by coach of the decade Jay Wright and his contemporaries. I just quoted them.


Right. So either and follow along and use your finger if necessary either CIMA is coaching up Earlington and Champagnie because he's a genyius our he's coaching down Heron and LJF because he's not.
 

This is of course false, stupid and nonsensical. There are entire industries dedicated to preseasons: preseason polls, preseason rankings, preseason bracketology, Street and Smith, it's along list. Which in any case, they're one and five looking at one and ten. Which has nothing to do with the preseason. That has to do with stinking. Which speaking of my epic recaps I wrote this in November and it's today as fresh as a copulating daisy. So fresh I could have written it yesterday:

"it’s hard to know what would excuse St John’s slow lingering death. They were playing in the their own back yard, in their own time zone and in front of what appeared to be if not a friendly at least a nonhostile crowd and yet they managed only 38 percent from the floor, 18 percent from three, 60 percent from the free throw line, turned the ball over 16 times and had a mere nine assists on 66 shots. My working theory is that they stink."

And stink was me being generous. As is my wont.

We were picked to finish 9th. We were supposed to stink. Our roster as a whole, 2 pre-season second team nominees and all, is the worse in the conference.

Were you as critical of Mullin during his first year? Maybe you were. I’m just not understanding what fans were expecting this year considering what he inherited.

Mullin is the face of our program. He is long gone as a coach. Going after him negatively at this point makes our entire fanbase look gross to anyone that looks in—and that includes prospective recruits. There is no need for such venom.

Apologies aren’t needed at this point. It will be easier to offer when we are decent again.

Going after the current coach doesn’t help either.

I want an apology.

Not to me personally - but to Chris Mullin and his family, the university, JJ posters and St. John's fans everywhere. These interlopers, I know not whence they came, have come on our board (ok Dave's board) and had the unmitigated audacity to bad mouth our hero and legend (who should have been an untouchable) consistently and rigorously.

Until this happens, and thus far we stink, there will be no cease fire and they're going to hear it from me until CFC exceeds Mullin's coaching accomplishment.

Are your allegiance with Mullin or the University? They had to move on for the sake of the program. Your boy crush is a bit over the top.

Are your allegiance with Mullin or the University? They had to move on for the sake of the program. Your boy crush is a bit over the top.

Not speaking for Carmine but I think his point is the lack of respect shown towards Mullin is alarming. He wasn't Norm Roberts or someone who had no prior history or connection to the school.

While he had his deficiencies and deserved some criticism there are some folk who have been extreme in their sentiments and expressions towards him and the job he did here.

It wasn't ALL bad. We can debate results and expectations for eternity but Mullin deserves respect and dignity.

We were supposed to stink.

Yes well we're certainly living down to expectations then.

Were you as critical of Mullin during his first year? Maybe you were.

I wasn't and doubt I would have been despite my deep rooted contrarianism even if Mullin had had a phalanx of wall-washers telling me what a great job he was doing when the team was in last place two weeks into the conference schedule. Which is what CIMA has. He's a great coach despite his record because he was good three decades ago in the mighty CUSA and he oozes class, like the other days when he had one of his assistants chase down Miles Powell and rip the game ball away from him. Pure class. Whereas with Mullin, people were complaining about where he was sitting when he was drinking too much water.

I’m just not understanding what fans were expecting this year considering what he inherited.

I don't know about you but I was expecting a home run. You know, it is high it is far it is deep and so on. That's what I was promised by no less personages than Jeff Capel and Mike Screwshrenski. Instead I'm got a grounded into a double play. CIMA inherited two preseason all conference players, a couple of four star recruits, a 2nd team all state player and a conference rookie of the year. (Whereas Mullin inherited Amar Alibagowiwz and Felix Balamoo.) Obviously preseason ranking and stars and past performances isn't the whole story. But it's a chapter. Another chapter is that CIMA doesn't seem to know what to do with the players he has. The half court defense is appalling and the half court offense is somewhere between atrocious and nonexistent: the only offensive play they run when they're on defense, when they try and turn the other guy over. When that works - as it did against powerhouses Central Connecticut and Albany - they're vaguely fun to watch. When it doesn't it's excrutiating. And the elephant in the room is that Coach Home Run is rountinely outcoached in the second half by coaches who are able to get their best players in a position to score, whereas CIMA can't figure out a way to stop them.

If they were going to let Mullin go after four years they should never have fired Lavin, and he's fit only to coach at Bellevue, because he's certifiable. If they were going to fire Lavin after five, they never should have hired him. This guy, even if he's successful isn't going to be here in six years - either they'll can him once he finally makes the tournament or he'll hie off to greener pastures and warmer weather - and Mike Schrewshrenski will tell Cragg to hire some  some other dunce and we'll be having this same conversation about how can you expect anything from dummy number five, look at the roster he inherited. Because here at SJU we're only happy when we're rebuilding, which we are, perpetually.

Are your allegiance with Mullin or the University?

Both. They are one and the same

They had to move on for the sake of the program.

No. They didn't.

Your boy crush is a bit over the top.

Your bad mouthing the face of our program is a bit below the bottom.
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Not speaking for Carmine but I think his point is the lack of respect shown towards Mullin is alarming. He wasn't Norm Roberts or someone who had no prior history or connection to the school.

While he had his deficiencies and deserved some criticism there are some folk who have been extreme in their sentiments and expressions towards him and the job he did here.

It wasn't ALL bad. We can debate results and expectations for eternity but Mullin deserves respect and dignity.

You know me so well Dave.

This is very scary already. With next years class being filled with JUCO's we will have 7 open scholarships in 2 years.

I think fear that if things go poorly rest of year and worse results continue next year then we leave ourselves in serious jeopardy because if year 3 is bad and you decide to make a move then a new coach is left with an empty roster OR you don't make a move and a coach is filled with a roster he doesn't want.

We need to either push some guys out or really win.

Wow, I thought we would at least make it through Anderson’s first year before people started firing him. Under no circumstances (short of something criminal) should they fire this guy after year 3. He’s rebuilt several programs already. We finally hired someone with a track record. We have to give him some time.

So it turns out you're not what your record says you are after all. Interesting.

Was it? Because a couple of weeks ago everyone was parsing their way to an 11 seed and booking their flights to Omaha for the first round. Not you though, you were the voice of reason. I recall you boldly predicting a last place finish. 



Give who credit for which "this"? Give Anderson credit for last place? I'd be delighted. Because as far as I can tell he stinks and his sytem is garbage. Or do you mean give THE GREAT IRON MIKE credit for instilling "something called progress" or whatever nonsensical intercourse you're on about? I'll hold off with crediting him with that until he wins another game. Which I don't see happening until February.



No, I'm talking about actual results. Which actual results suck, because one and five sucks. You're the one yammering on about ephemeral mindsets that are being instilled and progress that manifests itself through losing.


Yeah, they're not my two preseason all BE players, they were chosen by coach of the decade Jay Wright and his contemporaries. I just quoted them.


Right. So either and follow along and use your finger if necessary either CIMA is coaching up Earlington and Champagnie because he's a genyius our he's coaching down Heron and LJF because he's not.
 

This is of course false, stupid and nonsensical. There are entire industries dedicated to preseasons: preseason polls, preseason rankings, preseason bracketology, Street and Smith, it's along list. Which in any case, they're one and five looking at one and ten. Which has nothing to do with the preseason. That has to do with stinking. Which speaking of my epic recaps I wrote this in November and it's today as fresh as a copulating daisy. So fresh I could have written it yesterday:

"it’s hard to know what would excuse St John’s slow lingering death. They were playing in the their own back yard, in their own time zone and in front of what appeared to be if not a friendly at least a nonhostile crowd and yet they managed only 38 percent from the floor, 18 percent from three, 60 percent from the free throw line, turned the ball over 16 times and had a mere nine assists on 66 shots. My working theory is that they stink."

And stink was me being generous. As is my wont.

I’m not sure but is it a coincidence that we have played our best ball when Heron and LJ doesn’t play much (Arizona, Butler) and when Heron comes back we don’t play as good because he wants to slow it down and play a half-court set...just like last year when the Hogs had Daniel Gafford, a guy that could thrive in a half-court set, but when he wasn’t on the floor the offense and defense could be faster and more intense. Posh, McGriff, Wusu, Cole and Moore all bring tight defense and thrive in their systems that push the tempo.

we have played our best ball when Heron and LJ doesn’t play much

Yeah, when Heron and LJ which is a they which is plural don't play much Jethro, learn to conjugate simple verbs and then report back with your hot takes.

Wow, I thought we would at least make it through Anderson’s first year before people started firing him. Under no circumstances (short of something criminal) should they fire this guy after year 3. He’s rebuilt several programs already. We finally hired someone with a track record. We have to give him some time.

Personally, I’m not too worried about next year anymore. It looks like Anderson can actually get more out of Dunn and Williams than Heron and LJ and those two will only better next year and will have the benefit of playing with a pair of natural PGs.

I think the extra length from Cole and the 6’10 stretch four could add a ton of pressure. The 6’10 kid, Roberts as a junior (hopefully with another 15 lbs), Champagnie, and Earlington could make some interesting smaller lineups and Dunn at the 2 alongside a natural PG and an athletic guard/forward at the 3 could be menacing—especially with Champagnie at the four being able to defend 4 positions.