DePaul Game Discussion

Quote from: redstorm212 on January 19, 2013, 02:17:59 PM

Quote from: desco80 on January 19, 2013, 02:13:06 PM

Quote from: crgreen on January 19, 2013, 02:02:34 PM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 19, 2013, 01:57:05 PM

I like lavin, but I just completely disagree with a lot of his tactics.

LOts of coaches use different tactics.  Of course, a lot of them don't get to the Dance 6 of 8 years, or the Sweet 16 5 of 8 years.   Or finish in the top 25 7 of 8 seasons....

CR, I love you man, and I like that you stick up for coach.   But making the Sweet 16 with all the resources and brand power UCLA gives you is like making contact in kickball.   If you miss, something is very very wrong.

Strongly disagree. If you are one of the best 16 teams in college basketball, you are a damn good team, and a damn good coach. Coach K doesn't even make the sweet 16 every year with Duke.

He kind've does 212.  Last 20 years how many times has Duke been in the sweet 16,  15? 16?   It's something like that.

In the last 6 seasons he's been there 50% of the time.

This thread has reached new level of ridiculousness.

Quote from: crgreen on January 19, 2013, 02:02:34 PM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 19, 2013, 01:57:05 PM

I like lavin, but I just completely disagree with a lot of his tactics.

LOts of coaches use different tactics.  Of course, a lot of them don't get to the Dance 6 of 8 years, or the Sweet 16 5 of 8 years.   Or finish in the top 25 7 of 8 seasons....

CR, I love you man, and I like that you stick up for coach.   But making the Sweet 16 with all the resources and brand power UCLA gives you is like making contact in kickball.  If you miss, something is very very wrong. 


edit:  with that said I thought he coached a good game.   
especially liked that he was willing to sit Phil (as Choz pointed out)
And switching defenses early in the second half definitely confused Depaul.   

Only thing I would've done differently is midway through the second half when we were up 17, I'd have rotated giving Branch, D'angelo, Jakarr a breather.   They got sloppy down the stretch, and I gotta think running all game played a part in that.   

Being an incredible UCLA honk, I hate to disagree with you.  5 S-16s (or better) in 7 years?   In the 10 years he's been gone from UCLA, they've gotten to 3.   In the 18 years before the took over UCLA they'd gotten to  4 (but had one stripped by the NCAA - so per the record books, only 3).   So in the 28 years surrounding his tenure, 6-27.   In his 7 years 5-7.     

And now back to the game-----Sir Dom seems to be taking over as the team leader as exhibited by his interaction with his teammates and a positive, energetic attitude; also the comments regarding him BY Christian during his problem time.  Keep up the leadership and play Sir.

Quote from: desco80 on January 19, 2013, 02:21:02 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on January 19, 2013, 02:17:59 PM

Quote from: desco80 on January 19, 2013, 02:13:06 PM

Quote from: crgreen on January 19, 2013, 02:02:34 PM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 19, 2013, 01:57:05 PM

I like lavin, but I just completely disagree with a lot of his tactics.

LOts of coaches use different tactics.  Of course, a lot of them don't get to the Dance 6 of 8 years, or the Sweet 16 5 of 8 years.   Or finish in the top 25 7 of 8 seasons....

CR, I love you man, and I like that you stick up for coach.   But making the Sweet 16 with all the resources and brand power UCLA gives you is like making contact in kickball.   If you miss, something is very very wrong.

Strongly disagree. If you are one of the best 16 teams in college basketball, you are a damn good team, and a damn good coach. Coach K doesn't even make the sweet 16 every year with Duke.

He kind've does 212.  Last 20 years how many times has Duke been in the sweet 16,  15? 16?   It's something like that.

In the last 6 seasons he's been there 50% of the time.

Since 2000 he's been to 10... there have only been 12 seasons since then. 

Quote from: desco80 on January 19, 2013, 02:13:06 PM

Quote from: crgreen on January 19, 2013, 02:02:34 PM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 19, 2013, 01:57:05 PM

I like lavin, but I just completely disagree with a lot of his tactics.

LOts of coaches use different tactics.  Of course, a lot of them don't get to the Dance 6 of 8 years, or the Sweet 16 5 of 8 years.   Or finish in the top 25 7 of 8 seasons....

CR, I love you man, and I like that you stick up for coach.   But making the Sweet 16 with all the resources and brand power UCLA gives you is like making contact in kickball.  If you miss, something is very very wrong. 


edit:  with that said I thought he coached a good game.   
especially liked that he was willing to sit Phil (as Choz pointed out)
And switching defenses early in the second half definitely confused Depaul.   

Only thing I would've done differently is midway through the second half when we were up 17, I'd have rotated giving Branch, D'angelo, Jakarr a breather.   They got sloppy down the stretch, and I gotta think running all game played a part in that.   

Being an incredible UCLA honk, I hate to disagree with you.  5 S-16s (or better) in 7 years?   In the 10 years he's been gone from UCLA, they've gotten to 3.   In the 18 years before the took over UCLA they'd gotten to  4 (but had one stripped by the NCAA - so per the record books, only 3).   So in the 28 years surrounding his tenure, 6-27.   In his 7 years 5-7.   

UCLA went to 3 Final Fours ...in a row... in this decade alone!     
I'm not saying that he's not a good coach though.     It's just 5 sweet sixteens in 7 years should be put into context;  he wasn't doing that from a commuter school in Queens.   

I'm done though, because I'm on your side.  I like coach Lavin a lot.   

Quote from: redstorm212 on January 19, 2013, 02:25:22 PM

Quote from: desco80 on January 19, 2013, 02:21:02 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on January 19, 2013, 02:17:59 PM

Quote from: desco80 on January 19, 2013, 02:13:06 PM

Quote from: crgreen on January 19, 2013, 02:02:34 PM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 19, 2013, 01:57:05 PM

I like lavin, but I just completely disagree with a lot of his tactics.

LOts of coaches use different tactics.  Of course, a lot of them don't get to the Dance 6 of 8 years, or the Sweet 16 5 of 8 years.   Or finish in the top 25 7 of 8 seasons....

CR, I love you man, and I like that you stick up for coach.   But making the Sweet 16 with all the resources and brand power UCLA gives you is like making contact in kickball.   If you miss, something is very very wrong.

Strongly disagree. If you are one of the best 16 teams in college basketball, you are a damn good team, and a damn good coach. Coach K doesn't even make the sweet 16 every year with Duke.

He kind've does 212.  Last 20 years how many times has Duke been in the sweet 16,  15? 16?   It's something like that.

In the last 6 seasons he's been there 50% of the time.

Since 2000 he's been to 10... there have only been 12 seasons since then.

And 13 in his last 20. Lavin 5 in his 7 with UCLA. Just saying, to imply it's not that difficult to make the sweet 16 with a notable program is not right, IMO. It takes a good coach along with good players.

Quote from: desco80 on January 19, 2013, 03:01:24 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on January 19, 2013, 02:25:22 PM

Quote from: desco80 on January 19, 2013, 02:21:02 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on January 19, 2013, 02:17:59 PM

Quote from: desco80 on January 19, 2013, 02:13:06 PM

Quote from: crgreen on January 19, 2013, 02:02:34 PM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 19, 2013, 01:57:05 PM

I like lavin, but I just completely disagree with a lot of his tactics.

LOts of coaches use different tactics.  Of course, a lot of them don't get to the Dance 6 of 8 years, or the Sweet 16 5 of 8 years.   Or finish in the top 25 7 of 8 seasons....

CR, I love you man, and I like that you stick up for coach.   But making the Sweet 16 with all the resources and brand power UCLA gives you is like making contact in kickball.   If you miss, something is very very wrong.

Strongly disagree. If you are one of the best 16 teams in college basketball, you are a damn good team, and a damn good coach. Coach K doesn't even make the sweet 16 every year with Duke.

He kind've does 212.  Last 20 years how many times has Duke been in the sweet 16,  15? 16?   It's something like that.

In the last 6 seasons he's been there 50% of the time.

Since 2000 he's been to 10... there have only been 12 seasons since then.

And 13 in his last 20. Lavin 5 in his 7 with UCLA. Just saying, to imply it's not that difficult to make the sweet 16 with a notable program is not right, IMO. It takes a good coach along with good players.

This is certainly true.  I can't argue with that.

Anyway, getting back to the game
In the last 5 games, we've pulled off 3 Big East wins, so I think this has been masked a little, but
since the Villanova game D'angelo is shooting just 31% from the field, a terrible 14% from 3pt, and only 66% from the line. 

Probably the worst shooting slump he's had since he's been at St Johns. 

We really need to get him back on track if we want to be competitive against Syracuse, Lousiville and company at the end of the month.   

Jon Rothstein ‏@JonRothstein
Business like win 4 @STJ_Basketball at DePaul. The Red Storm have the Big East's 3rd most talented roster after Cuse + Lville. #stjbb

hmmm interesting thought

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 19, 2013, 02:18:19 PM

I didn't ridicule lavin. I just Said I disagree with him sometimes. Using 3 timeouts in the first 15 minutes didn't come back to bite us but its not the smartest thing in the world. Having Dom at the front of the press worked nicely on occasion but it also lead to a lot of bad possessions and turnovers.

y

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 19, 2013, 02:18:19 PM

I didn't ridicule lavin. I just Said I disagree with him sometimes. Using 3 timeouts in the first 15 minutes didn't come back to bite us but its not the smartest thing in the world. Having Dom at the front of the press worked nicely on occasion but it also lead to a lot of bad possessions and turnovers.

like Lavin you can be certain of your opinion, but that doesn't make it right.

Absolutely agree. Did I make any outrageous statements?

i really hope he sticks around, i love his personality:

post game video interview:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=4741425266660&set=vb.65798051504&type=2&theater

My thoughts on the game:

Likes:

Thought Lavin did a good job.  Kept Phil out when he was not playing well and others were.  That should at least quell for a day the notion that he will play him blindly without regarding to performance.  The 2-3 zone worked in the second half.  Having Dom and Jakar push the ball against their forwards.  Bringing Obekpa in more in the 2nd half to deal with getting beat on the glass in the first half badly.  Last, I don't think we went into "delay" mode.  When you have a 17 point lead, it makes sense to use some clock and see if you team can execute in the half court.  The guys didn't there for a stretch in the second half, and that plus the TO's let Depaul back in the game.  But it made sense to slow things down a bit at that point and see how the team would react.  We need to learn to play with a lead.

Branch -- best game yet.  Would like to see him look to dish a bit more in the half court off the pick-and-roll, like he does on the break.  But hard to fault a guy when he is making layups and getting wide open jumpers from 15 feet in.

D-Lo -- 8 boards.  Played well in other facets even when he wasn't scoring.  Only forced a few bad shots but otherwise I thought he let the game come to him.  Would like to see Branch try and get him some more open looks in the half court, but teams are so keyed in on stopping him that others need to step up for those to become more readily available.

Dom -- great today and continues to make strides.  A bit sloppy at times on the break with the errant alley oop (no need in that spot).  6 turnovers is too many.  But otherwise great.

Obekpa -- his presence makes so much difference in the lane and he seems to be getting better on the boards.

Dislikes:

Thought Amir played well in spurts, but he was wayyyyy too sloppy on the break.  Careless with the bounce and dribble sometimes in the open floor.

Would have liked to see CJ play a bit more but when guys are performing and you have a big lead what can you do.

After going up 17, we let them back in with 3 TO's in a row and some sloppy play.  Will learn to play with a lead as the team matures.

i really hope he sticks around, i love his personality:

post game video interview:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=4741425266660&set=vb.65798051504&type=2&theater

I think he's going to be around.  He's not close to heading to the league yet.  Good player who needs a bit of work yet.  He'll be excellent once he develops his slashing game and gets stronger,

i really hope he sticks around, i love his personality:

post game video interview:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=4741425266660&set=vb.65798051504&type=2&theater

Seems like a real nice guy.

Quote from: shamsman2 on January 19, 2013, 02:22:04 PM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 19, 2013, 02:18:19 PM

I didn't ridicule lavin. I just Said I disagree with him sometimes. Using 3 timeouts in the first 15 minutes didn't come back to bite us but its not the smartest thing in the world. Having Dom at the front of the press worked nicely on occasion but it also lead to a lot of bad possessions and turnovers.

y

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 19, 2013, 02:18:19 PM

I didn't ridicule lavin. I just Said I disagree with him sometimes. Using 3 timeouts in the first 15 minutes didn't come back to bite us but its not the smartest thing in the world. Having Dom at the front of the press worked nicely on occasion but it also lead to a lot of bad possessions and turnovers.

like Lavin you can be certain of your opinion, but that doesn't make it right.

Absolutely agree. Did I make any outrageous statements?

outrageous no, "taking 3 to's is not the smartest move" I realize it's your opinion, but I question the nitpicking of this Coach or any other Coach for that matter. I believe in giving the benefit of the doubt  to these guys as they are making how many decisions during a game, based on match up, fouls, what they practiced and what he is emphasizing. Which we have no idea of what that is.

Not taking it out on you, but reading these blogs and others the players and coaches get ripped for everything. Some deserve it but most don't. Sorry for the rant, I need to take break from reading the boards 10x a day.

Quote from: redmen4life on January 19, 2013, 03:39:59 PM

i really hope he sticks around, i love his personality:

post game video interview:
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=4741425266660&set=vb.65798051504&type=2&theater

Seems like a real nice guy.

He is.  A really positive and energetic kid. 

A great stretch today, a really bad stretch and a lot in between.  DePaul is a really poor ball handling team and we took advantage.  Fed into this team's identity.  Branch was incredible and I really think Dom Pointer is benefitting on the offensive end from having a PG.  Agree that Amir didn't play well today.  As for D'Lo I think him and Branch just have to figure out where each of their spots are and where to get D'Lo the ball at.  He'll be fine. 

DePaul made their run when they turned up the pressure and we got sloppy.  We also started running false motion instead of letting Branch handle and call for ball screens, which is where we found our success.  When we have a lead we need to play into the identity of the team that GOT us that lead.

A win is a win though and we'll take it!  Hopefully we can come out and win 2 of our next 3....

By the way, as I look at the stats..

Branch, 31 minutes against ND just 1 turnover.  38 today, only 2to. 
That's very solid from your point guard. 
Also 4 steals today, his defensive prowess is starting to show. 

“@STJCoachLavin: Todays victory was another step forward for our young squad. #stjbb”

“@STJCoachLavin: Overall we were pleased with our defensive effort today in holding DePaul under 35 percent from the field. #stjbb”

“@STJCoachLavin: As expected, we are still a work in progress, but our coaching staff can see the upside as we begin to better learn how to win. #stjbb”

“@STJCoachLavin: Todays victory was another step forward for our young squad. #stjbb”

“@STJCoachLavin: Overall we were pleased with our defensive effort today in holding DePaul under 35 percent from the field. #stjbb”

“@STJCoachLavin: As expected, we are still a work in progress, but our coaching staff can see the upside as we begin to better learn how to win. #stjbb”

I see a much different team than we saw against Rutgers and Villanova. They seem to be meshing together well with Branch at Pg. He can penetrate and that mid-range shot is sweet. It's helping guys like Dom find their offensive game as well. Our team defense has improved as well. We have been forcing a lot of turnovers. I hope Greene can find a way to contribute, but until he does he's going to have to earn his minutes. 

Quote from: Linda Mirabella on January 19, 2013, 02:09:55 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on January 19, 2013, 02:03:34 PM

Of course after a win, we still have to discuss how bad of a coach Lavin is.

Is Lavin your long lost son or something?  No one is saying how bad he is but all, as fans, are entitled to criticize his moves if they so feel.  He is not perfect by any means and while there was some good progress shown by the team, clearly the game management at the end of the game from many peoples perspective was suspect.

Good one. I just think it's crazy how much criticism he gets even after a win. I don't chalk it up to bad coaching every time something doesn't go our way. S*** happens. We won, Lavin's coaching had a lot to do with this win.

I like that Lavin is starting to get in player's faces when they need it but also like the fact that he never appears to panic and recognizes when a kid needs a boost...I don't pretend to know what he said to Dlo during a timeout but it sure looked like he was trying to prop him up when he appeared to be frustrated...