I am physically ill right now...

Quote from: stjohns86 on March 13, 2014, 09:48:15 PM

Quote from: DoodyNY33 on March 13, 2014, 09:30:18 PM

This season has only proven to me that St. John's will not have any type of sustained success any time soon.

Going back to the big recruiting class of a few years ago, would you have ever thought that we'd (maybe) have 1 NCAA Tournament to show for it?  It just goes to show you what a poor coach Lavin is.

I thought we would be an NCAA team by year 3 with this class.  And the reason that we (probobly)  are not one is that we lack that one player.  The one player that can knock dowm three's consistantly.  With all the talk of how our interior defense was it was the back to back 3's in the first half that cut our lead from 7-1 and Fourtune's back to back in the 2nd half that gave them a double diget lead. 

In this day and age in CB you need to be able to hit three's on a consistant basis.  And for what ever reason Lavin still hasn't found that player.  I really think if we had that tuype of shooter we would have 24 wins at least and would be an ncaa team.  Really think Lavin is going to have to find someone (JC-transfer) who can fill that roll.  As hard as this season ihas been we are really only a couple of jump shots away from those 24 wins.

Am I an optomist, probobly but @DePaul, Providence, Penn St and today

I get it but I am more upset about the defensive breakdowns and poor defensive rebounding in some of these games that really cost them.  1 NCAA Tourney appearance in 4 years is not good enough by Lavin's own standards.  This was the year they needed to breakthrough.  They should be really good next year but again this should have been an NCAA springboard to next year.

Quote from: stjohns86 on March 13, 2014, 09:48:15 PM

Quote from: DoodyNY33 on March 13, 2014, 09:30:18 PM

This season has only proven to me that St. John's will not have any type of sustained success any time soon.

Going back to the big recruiting class of a few years ago, would you have ever thought that we'd (maybe) have 1 NCAA Tournament to show for it?  It just goes to show you what a poor coach Lavin is.

I thought we would be an NCAA team by year 3 with this class.  And the reason that we (probobly)  are not one is that we lack that one player.  The one player that can knock dowm three's consistantly.  With all the talk of how our interior defense was it was the back to back 3's in the first half that cut our lead from 7-1 and Fourtune's back to back in the 2nd half that gave them a double diget lead. 

In this day and age in CB you need to be able to hit three's on a consistant basis.  And for what ever reason Lavin still hasn't found that player.  I really think if we had that tuype of shooter we would have 24 wins at least and would be an ncaa team.  Really think Lavin is going to have to find someone (JC-transfer) who can fill that roll.  As hard as this season ihas been we are really only a couple of jump shots away from those 24 wins.

Am I an optomist, probobly but @DePaul, Providence, Penn St and today

I get it but I am more upset about the defensive breakdowns and poor defensive rebounding in some of these games that really cost them.  1 NCAA Tourney appearance in 4 years is not good enough by Lavin's own standards.  This was the year they needed to breakthrough.  They should be really good next year but again this should have been an NCAA springboard to next year.

Quote from: fordham96 on March 13, 2014, 09:58:18 PM

Quote from: stjohns86 on March 13, 2014, 09:48:15 PM

Quote from: DoodyNY33 on March 13, 2014, 09:30:18 PM

This season has only proven to me that St. John's will not have any type of sustained success any time soon.

Going back to the big recruiting class of a few years ago, would you have ever thought that we'd (maybe) have 1 NCAA Tournament to show for it?  It just goes to show you what a poor coach Lavin is.

I thought we would be an NCAA team by year 3 with this class.  And the reason that we (probobly)  are not one is that we lack that one player.  The one player that can knock dowm three's consistantly.  With all the talk of how our interior defense was it was the back to back 3's in the first half that cut our lead from 7-1 and Fourtune's back to back in the 2nd half that gave them a double diget lead. 

In this day and age in CB you need to be able to hit three's on a consistant basis.  And for what ever reason Lavin still hasn't found that player.  I really think if we had that tuype of shooter we would have 24 wins at least and would be an ncaa team.  Really think Lavin is going to have to find someone (JC-transfer) who can fill that roll.  As hard as this season ihas been we are really only a couple of jump shots away from those 24 wins.

Am I an optomist, probobly but @DePaul, Providence, Penn St and today

I get it but I am more upset about the defensive breakdowns and poor defensive rebounding in some of these games that really cost them.  1 NCAA Tourney appearance in 4 years is not good enough by Lavin's own standards.  This was the year they needed to breakthrough.  They should be really good next year but again this should have been an NCAA springboard to next year.

NCAA springboard this year for greater success next season was precisely the target. Couple that with continued solid recruiting and we would be on our way to annual relevance, respectability and competitiveness. Too bad phase one did not come to fruition.

Quote from: paultzman on March 13, 2014, 10:05:17 PM

Quote from: fordham96 on March 13, 2014, 09:58:18 PM

Quote from: stjohns86 on March 13, 2014, 09:48:15 PM

Quote from: DoodyNY33 on March 13, 2014, 09:30:18 PM

This season has only proven to me that St. John's will not have any type of sustained success any time soon.

Going back to the big recruiting class of a few years ago, would you have ever thought that we'd (maybe) have 1 NCAA Tournament to show for it?  It just goes to show you what a poor coach Lavin is.

I thought we would be an NCAA team by year 3 with this class.  And the reason that we (probobly)  are not one is that we lack that one player.  The one player that can knock dowm three's consistantly.  With all the talk of how our interior defense was it was the back to back 3's in the first half that cut our lead from 7-1 and Fourtune's back to back in the 2nd half that gave them a double diget lead. 

In this day and age in CB you need to be able to hit three's on a consistant basis.  And for what ever reason Lavin still hasn't found that player.  I really think if we had that tuype of shooter we would have 24 wins at least and would be an ncaa team.  Really think Lavin is going to have to find someone (JC-transfer) who can fill that roll.  As hard as this season ihas been we are really only a couple of jump shots away from those 24 wins.

Am I an optomist, probobly but @DePaul, Providence, Penn St and today

I get it but I am more upset about the defensive breakdowns and poor defensive rebounding in some of these games that really cost them.  1 NCAA Tourney appearance in 4 years is not good enough by Lavin's own standards.  This was the year they needed to breakthrough.  They should be really good next year but again this should have been an NCAA springboard to next year.

NCAA springboard this year for greater success next season was precisely the target. Couple that with continued solid recruiting and we would be on our way to annual relevance, respectability and competitiveness. Too bad phase one did not come to fruition.

I think we will be relevant every year.  This is the most press I have seen for a st johns team since maybe 1999.  I think we all wanted it to be right away, well maybe it will take 5 years to start, but I rememeber what this city was like in the 80's for st john's and we are very close to getting it back again.

Quote from: paultzman on March 13, 2014, 10:05:17 PM

Quote from: fordham96 on March 13, 2014, 09:58:18 PM

Quote from: stjohns86 on March 13, 2014, 09:48:15 PM

Quote from: DoodyNY33 on March 13, 2014, 09:30:18 PM

This season has only proven to me that St. John's will not have any type of sustained success any time soon.

Going back to the big recruiting class of a few years ago, would you have ever thought that we'd (maybe) have 1 NCAA Tournament to show for it?  It just goes to show you what a poor coach Lavin is.

I thought we would be an NCAA team by year 3 with this class.  And the reason that we (probobly)  are not one is that we lack that one player.  The one player that can knock dowm three's consistantly.  With all the talk of how our interior defense was it was the back to back 3's in the first half that cut our lead from 7-1 and Fourtune's back to back in the 2nd half that gave them a double diget lead. 

In this day and age in CB you need to be able to hit three's on a consistant basis.  And for what ever reason Lavin still hasn't found that player.  I really think if we had that tuype of shooter we would have 24 wins at least and would be an ncaa team.  Really think Lavin is going to have to find someone (JC-transfer) who can fill that roll.  As hard as this season ihas been we are really only a couple of jump shots away from those 24 wins.

Am I an optomist, probobly but @DePaul, Providence, Penn St and today

I get it but I am more upset about the defensive breakdowns and poor defensive rebounding in some of these games that really cost them.  1 NCAA Tourney appearance in 4 years is not good enough by Lavin's own standards.  This was the year they needed to breakthrough.  They should be really good next year but again this should have been an NCAA springboard to next year.

NCAA springboard this year for greater success next season was precisely the target. Couple that with continued solid recruiting and we would be on our way to annual relevance, respectability and competitiveness. Too bad phase one did not come to fruition.

I think we will be relevant every year.  This is the most press I have seen for a st johns team since maybe 1999.  I think we all wanted it to be right away, well maybe it will take 5 years to start, but I rememeber what this city was like in the 80's for st john's and we are very close to getting it back again.

Quote from: stjohns86 on March 13, 2014, 10:11:28 PM

Quote from: paultzman on March 13, 2014, 10:05:17 PM

Quote from: fordham96 on March 13, 2014, 09:58:18 PM

Quote from: stjohns86 on March 13, 2014, 09:48:15 PM

Quote from: DoodyNY33 on March 13, 2014, 09:30:18 PM

This season has only proven to me that St. John's will not have any type of sustained success any time soon.

Going back to the big recruiting class of a few years ago, would you have ever thought that we'd (maybe) have 1 NCAA Tournament to show for it?  It just goes to show you what a poor coach Lavin is.

I thought we would be an NCAA team by year 3 with this class.  And the reason that we (probobly)  are not one is that we lack that one player.  The one player that can knock dowm three's consistantly.  With all the talk of how our interior defense was it was the back to back 3's in the first half that cut our lead from 7-1 and Fourtune's back to back in the 2nd half that gave them a double diget lead. 

In this day and age in CB you need to be able to hit three's on a consistant basis.  And for what ever reason Lavin still hasn't found that player.  I really think if we had that tuype of shooter we would have 24 wins at least and would be an ncaa team.  Really think Lavin is going to have to find someone (JC-transfer) who can fill that roll.  As hard as this season ihas been we are really only a couple of jump shots away from those 24 wins.

Am I an optomist, probobly but @DePaul, Providence, Penn St and today

I get it but I am more upset about the defensive breakdowns and poor defensive rebounding in some of these games that really cost them.  1 NCAA Tourney appearance in 4 years is not good enough by Lavin's own standards.  This was the year they needed to breakthrough.  They should be really good next year but again this should have been an NCAA springboard to next year.

NCAA springboard this year for greater success next season was precisely the target. Couple that with continued solid recruiting and we would be on our way to annual relevance, respectability and competitiveness. Too bad phase one did not come to fruition.

I think we will be relevant every year.  This is the most press I have seen for a st johns team since maybe 1999.  I think we all wanted it to be right away, well maybe it will take 5 years to start, but I rememeber what this city was like in the 80's for st john's and we are very close to getting it back again.

First off, did you see the attendance figures for St. John's this year?  The program is not getting back to relevancy.

Second, think about this logically.  Sure, next year will probably be an NCAA Tournament team assuming Obekpa comes back and they add more bigs to the equation.  But then what?  Harrison, Branch, Greene, Pointer will all be gone.  After how he looked in the 2nd half of this season, my guess is Jordan doesn't last to his junior year either.  Sampson is up in the air.

So we are back to square one.  Relying on another recruiting class to save our collective asses.  Here's the problem ... the coach hasn't shown an ability to bring kid's games along.  So I ask again?  Are things really so great?

Quote from: stjohns86 on March 13, 2014, 10:11:28 PM

Quote from: paultzman on March 13, 2014, 10:05:17 PM

Quote from: fordham96 on March 13, 2014, 09:58:18 PM

Quote from: stjohns86 on March 13, 2014, 09:48:15 PM

Quote from: DoodyNY33 on March 13, 2014, 09:30:18 PM

This season has only proven to me that St. John's will not have any type of sustained success any time soon.

Going back to the big recruiting class of a few years ago, would you have ever thought that we'd (maybe) have 1 NCAA Tournament to show for it?  It just goes to show you what a poor coach Lavin is.

I thought we would be an NCAA team by year 3 with this class.  And the reason that we (probobly)  are not one is that we lack that one player.  The one player that can knock dowm three's consistantly.  With all the talk of how our interior defense was it was the back to back 3's in the first half that cut our lead from 7-1 and Fourtune's back to back in the 2nd half that gave them a double diget lead. 

In this day and age in CB you need to be able to hit three's on a consistant basis.  And for what ever reason Lavin still hasn't found that player.  I really think if we had that tuype of shooter we would have 24 wins at least and would be an ncaa team.  Really think Lavin is going to have to find someone (JC-transfer) who can fill that roll.  As hard as this season ihas been we are really only a couple of jump shots away from those 24 wins.

Am I an optomist, probobly but @DePaul, Providence, Penn St and today

I get it but I am more upset about the defensive breakdowns and poor defensive rebounding in some of these games that really cost them.  1 NCAA Tourney appearance in 4 years is not good enough by Lavin's own standards.  This was the year they needed to breakthrough.  They should be really good next year but again this should have been an NCAA springboard to next year.

NCAA springboard this year for greater success next season was precisely the target. Couple that with continued solid recruiting and we would be on our way to annual relevance, respectability and competitiveness. Too bad phase one did not come to fruition.

I think we will be relevant every year.  This is the most press I have seen for a st johns team since maybe 1999.  I think we all wanted it to be right away, well maybe it will take 5 years to start, but I rememeber what this city was like in the 80's for st john's and we are very close to getting it back again.

First off, did you see the attendance figures for St. John's this year?  The program is not getting back to relevancy.

Second, think about this logically.  Sure, next year will probably be an NCAA Tournament team assuming Obekpa comes back and they add more bigs to the equation.  But then what?  Harrison, Branch, Greene, Pointer will all be gone.  After how he looked in the 2nd half of this season, my guess is Jordan doesn't last to his junior year either.  Sampson is up in the air.

So we are back to square one.  Relying on another recruiting class to save our collective asses.  Here's the problem ... the coach hasn't shown an ability to bring kid's games along.  So I ask again?  Are things really so great?

How many people show up to our first round NIT game? 1,000?

After four years, Lavin has clearly done some good things here. He has brought in terrific, tough players, many of them easy to root for. He ended the NCAA drought in his first year. But if it was unfair to minimize Lavin’s role that year — crediting Norm Roberts’ recruits and Mike Dunlap’s Xs and Os — it would be equally disingenuous to ignore that they should be farther along than this on his watch, and are instead relying on the kindness of committee strangers instead.

That they should have already put together an NCAA-worthy season with this team and these players, expectations Lavin himself courted — properly — and spoke about openly. He is about to be locked up to a sizable extension, and has earned a chance to push this farther.

But the bar is higher now. And Lavin has to be equal to those elevated hopes.

http://nypost.com/2014/03/13/early-struggles-mimic-the-season-as-a-whole-for-ousted-st-johns/

Vaccaro nailed it with that part of the article.  The increased expectations and the "higher bar" are the result of Lavin, that is a good thing. But by the same token he needs to start meeting those expectations or else he needs to e faulted for not doing so and that is how I feel.

Quote from: HowCouldUBeSoHarkless on March 13, 2014, 11:42:02 PM

How many people show up to our first round NIT game? 1,000?

Unless it's against Iona to see the Agony on Baldi's face of us beating them I'm done for the year.

This game took so much out of me. If I didn't view going to games as a social event to hang out with my friends I'd seriously consider not renewing. Probably that will change in a couple of days when the anger subsides but it speaks volumes about how angry I am right now because I haven't had this much anger since Norm's last 2 years

Quote from: DoodyNY33 on March 13, 2014, 10:19:04 PM

Quote from: stjohns86 on March 13, 2014, 10:11:28 PM

Quote from: paultzman on March 13, 2014, 10:05:17 PM

Quote from: fordham96 on March 13, 2014, 09:58:18 PM

Quote from: stjohns86 on March 13, 2014, 09:48:15 PM

Quote from: DoodyNY33 on March 13, 2014, 09:30:18 PM

This season has only proven to me that St. John's will not have any type of sustained success any time soon.

Going back to the big recruiting class of a few years ago, would you have ever thought that we'd (maybe) have 1 NCAA Tournament to show for it?  It just goes to show you what a poor coach Lavin is.

I thought we would be an NCAA team by year 3 with this class.  And the reason that we (probobly)  are not one is that we lack that one player.  The one player that can knock dowm three's consistantly.  With all the talk of how our interior defense was it was the back to back 3's in the first half that cut our lead from 7-1 and Fourtune's back to back in the 2nd half that gave them a double diget lead. 

In this day and age in CB you need to be able to hit three's on a consistant basis.  And for what ever reason Lavin still hasn't found that player.  I really think if we had that tuype of shooter we would have 24 wins at least and would be an ncaa team.  Really think Lavin is going to have to find someone (JC-transfer) who can fill that roll.  As hard as this season ihas been we are really only a couple of jump shots away from those 24 wins.

Am I an optomist, probobly but @DePaul, Providence, Penn St and today

I get it but I am more upset about the defensive breakdowns and poor defensive rebounding in some of these games that really cost them.  1 NCAA Tourney appearance in 4 years is not good enough by Lavin's own standards.  This was the year they needed to breakthrough.  They should be really good next year but again this should have been an NCAA springboard to next year.

NCAA springboard this year for greater success next season was precisely the target. Couple that with continued solid recruiting and we would be on our way to annual relevance, respectability and competitiveness. Too bad phase one did not come to fruition.

I think we will be relevant every year.  This is the most press I have seen for a st johns team since maybe 1999.  I think we all wanted it to be right away, well maybe it will take 5 years to start, but I rememeber what this city was like in the 80's for st john's and we are very close to getting it back again.

First off, did you see the attendance figures for St. John's this year?  The program is not getting back to relevancy.

Second, think about this logically.  Sure, next year will probably be an NCAA Tournament team assuming Obekpa comes back and they add more bigs to the equation.  But then what?  Harrison, Branch, Greene, Pointer will all be gone.  After how he looked in the 2nd half of this season, my guess is Jordan doesn't last to his junior year either.  Sampson is up in the air.

So we are back to square one.  Relying on another recruiting class to save our collective asses.  Here's the problem ... the coach hasn't shown an ability to bring kid's games along.  So I ask again?  Are things really so great?

Being relevent starts from a certain point and we got a lot of good press this year.  This is the first time I heard anyone mention st john's on talk radio.  And that has a lot to do with Lavin putting himself and the program outthere.  Success doesn't happen overnight, we were a dormant programfor over 10 years and we are just starting to build to a point of becoming a permanent fixture on the college basketball scene. 

I'm not trying to be a Lavin spokesperson but he was given a tough situation having to build a team from the ground up.  Getting into the NCAA's this year would have been great, but if we have to wait one more year then so be it.  Players will come and we will continue to get better, we have been there before and we will be there again.

As for Coach trying to sell this season as not a failure if they don't make the NCAA's I don't have a problem with it.  Mind you I don't agree with it but I understand he doesn't want his kids to feel like failures by saying something like that.  So don't put too much into what he is saying.

Man I just can't get up for the NIT.

Quote from: fordham96 on March 13, 2014, 08:04:46 PM

As for Coach trying to sell this season as not a failure if they don't make the NCAA's I don't have a problem with it.  Mind you I don't agree with it but I understand he doesn't want his kids to feel like failures by saying something like that.  So don't put too much into what he is saying.

Man I just can't get up for the NIT.

I disagree with that. No reason to baby grown men. The team should feel like failures, but instead of crying over it they should use it to fire them the hell up all off season. Any time I lose anything I think about it until I get a chance to redeem myself. These players should be waking up in puddles is sweat thinking about their lost opportunity.

Quote from: apesNapes on March 13, 2014, 08:23:03 PM

I posted same in the game thread.  hard to go back to work, will be very difficult to go to garden tomorrow and saturday, not sure I will have much fun watching

And I thought we disagreed on everything..    agree with everything you posted in this thread.

I was set to go tomorrow night but not now.  I have zero interest.

Just mad at everyone now.  Will get over it but just mad, mad.

Quote from: fordham96 on March 13, 2014, 08:29:33 PM

Quote from: apesNapes on March 13, 2014, 08:23:03 PM

I posted same in the game thread.  hard to go back to work, will be very difficult to go to garden tomorrow and saturday, not sure I will have much fun watching

And I thought we disagreed on everything..    agree with everything you posted in this thread.

I was set to go tomorrow night but not now.  I have zero interest.

Just mad at everyone now.  Will get over it but just mad, mad.