Villanova prediction thread

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Wods317

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Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #140 on: February 05, 2017, 07:51:22 AM »
Per Zach B

Told Marcus LoVett didn't start because of a "minor disciplinary issue." #sjubb

Really like Marcus game but he's really letting the team down with what trouble he's getting himself into to be benched early. He obviously played a ton of minutes but still a bad look for a an older freshman. Also as people said not his first time doing this kinda thing.

Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #141 on: February 05, 2017, 08:16:45 AM »
Dante will be better than Ponds

Foolish.

He already is
Yes, unguarded he is great
Dante will be better than Ponds

Foolish.

He already is

He's a second year player. He's also not better.

He's a freshman.  Ponds was a non factor tonight. Brought nothing to the table on either side of the floor
Ponds was in foul trouble (yes, his fault), but has been much better all year than Divincenzo. Ponds is a featured player for whom opposing coaches game plan. , DiVincenzo is a role player, and a nice once, but is not a go-to guy for Nova. When guarded against tougher defense he has not been nearly as good as he has been against our defense, In fact, in the 2 games, he has had Mussini on him much of the time.

Again, nice player and Nova is lucky to have him. But, he may be the Michael Jordan of Delaware but is not going to be the Michael Jordan of the Big East.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2017, 08:17:59 AM by section3 »

Foad

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Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #142 on: February 05, 2017, 10:08:19 AM »

Poison

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Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #143 on: February 05, 2017, 10:30:15 AM »
Everyone is getting all worked up over nothing. What happened last night was exactly what everyone expected to happen. Nova is better at everything than we are. They don't have to play 40 minutes to blow us out, because they are that much better than we are.

It's simple, we need to get older and stronger, and we're gonna have to wait for that to happen. We may win 7 conference games this season, and if we do, and we return LoVett, Ponds, Ahmed Ellison and Owens, we should contend for a tourney bid next season.

But let's chill out on the Nova game. We were outclassed the second the game was scheduled.

Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #144 on: February 05, 2017, 10:38:08 AM »
Whole lot of selfish play.  A lot of guys deciding what they're going to do with the ball and not adapting.
It is not selfish it is the game plan

Yes, I'm sure Mullin and Co is telling the team to play only ISO ball and never pass.

Nobody ever gets taken out of the game for doing it so they aren't being told not to

For the most part there really aren't any acceptable options. And if you think the amount of selfish play hasn't decreased as the season has gone on, we haven't been watching the same games.
This is more the norm then the exception. Selfish isn't the right word. These guys are allowed if not encouraged to take these shots.

You're nuts if you think they're encouraged or there's even approval of those shots. Mullin isn't an idiot and isn't trying to sabotage his own team.
How many air balls from 3 are you going to watch before you change your mind ?

What's your point? That was a good look by Mussini, just a bad shot. I'll be convinced next year when we have at least 2 other good options on the bench and Ahmed can throw the ball at the basket and stay in.
Point is simple. I think we take bad shots. I think we play to fast. I think bad shooters are allowed to take bad shots. I think this happens most games.

I think you are living in some sort of alternate reality and unable to see things as they truly are.  I've said it before and I'll say it again.  It ain't the offense:

SCORING OFFENSE    G    W-L    Pts    Avg/G
1.    Creighton    23    20-3    1952    84.9
2.    Marquette    22    14-8    1832    83.3
3.    St. John's    24    11-13    1850    77.1
4.    Villanova    23    21-2    1771            77.0
5.    Xavier            22    16-6    1687    76.7
6.    Georgetown    23    13-10    1757    76.4
   Butler            23    18-5    1757    76.4
8.    Seton Hall    21    13-8    1559    74.2
9.    DePaul            22    8-14    1541    70.0
10.    Providence    24    14-10    1674    69.8



Lol. Points per game is a completely meaningless stat. We, Creighton and Marquette play super fast and Villanova plays super slow so of course we'll have more PPG than Villanova.  Our offense is nowhere near as good as Villanova's and do you think Creighton's offense even with Watson was a full 8 points better than Nova's? No shot.

If you want a team offense stat that actually matters then look for total efficiency which is points per 100 possessions. This eliminates the gaping flaw in PPG in that it is tempo neutral and it adjusts for quality of opponents. Here is the BE teams in order of points per 100 possessions and their total D1 rank out of 351 teams is in parentheses:

1. Villanova 122.6 (6)
2. Marquette 122.3 (7)
3. Creighton 119.1 (18)
4. Butler 117.9 (22)
5. Xavier 117.6 (25)
6. Georgetown 110.7 (80)
7. St. John's 110.2 (91)
8. Seton Hall 109.5 (105)
9. Providence 108.9 (116)
10. DePaul 104.9 (181)

So as you can see in reality we have the 7th best offense in the conference and 91st best in D1. Not terrible, but not good either. Offense isn't as much of a problem as defense is but it's still a problem

Not meaningless.  The points you score in a game is a good criteria for judging offense.  The points you give up a good judge of defense.

Tempo is a part of all that.

Johnny23

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Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #145 on: February 05, 2017, 10:43:41 AM »
Everyone is getting all worked up over nothing. What happened last night was exactly what everyone expected to happen. Nova is better at everything than we are. They don't have to play 40 minutes to blow us out, because they are that much better than we are.

It's simple, we need to get older and stronger, and we're gonna have to wait for that to happen. We may win 7 conference games this season, and if we do, and we return LoVett, Ponds, Ahmed Ellison and Owens, we should contend for a tourney bid next season.

But let's chill out on the Nova game. We were outclassed the second the game was scheduled.

+1. If that core group named above stays together then next year and the year after this team should be much improved with a chance at top 25 and big dance.

Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #146 on: February 05, 2017, 12:05:00 PM »
Please look at Donte's stats before you say he's better than anyone. He's good against us. That's really it.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/gamelog/_/id/3934673/donte-divincenzo

Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #147 on: February 05, 2017, 12:37:48 PM »
Please look at Donte's stats before you say he's better than anyone. He's good against us. That's really it.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/gamelog/_/id/3934673/donte-divincenzo

So what does it mean if it says he's only good against our guards?

Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #148 on: February 05, 2017, 12:38:31 PM »
Please look at Donte's stats before you say he's better than anyone. He's good against us. That's really it.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/gamelog/_/id/3934673/donte-divincenzo

So what does it mean if it says he's only good against our guards?

We suck at defense fam, we know this.

Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #149 on: February 05, 2017, 12:48:03 PM »
Per Zach B

Told Marcus LoVett didn't start because of a "minor disciplinary issue." #sjubb

Really like Marcus game but he's really letting the team down with what trouble he's getting himself into to be benched early. He obviously played a ton of minutes but still a bad look for a an older freshman. Also as people said not his first time doing this kinda thing.

Yeah I mentioned it the first time it happened and people said it was just good strategy to bring your best player off the bench

Marillac

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Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #150 on: February 05, 2017, 01:11:22 PM »
Per Zach B

Told Marcus LoVett didn't start because of a "minor disciplinary issue." #sjubb

Really like Marcus game but he's really letting the team down with what trouble he's getting himself into to be benched early. He obviously played a ton of minutes but still a bad look for a an older freshman. Also as people said not his first time doing this kinda thing.

Yeah I mentioned it the first time it happened and people said it was just good strategy to bring your best player off the bench

Ponds didn't come off the bench last night. By my count, Lovett hasn't started in five games this season.

redslope

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Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #151 on: February 05, 2017, 01:11:50 PM »
Please look at Donte's stats before you say he's better than anyone. He's good against us. That's really it.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/gamelog/_/id/3934673/donte-divincenzo

So what does it mean if it says he's only good against our guards?

We suck at defense fam, we know this.

The big difference is in the size of the guards.  Ellison is the only one who compares in size otherwise we are 5 to 7 inches shorter at guard.  Look at where the bulk of Nova's differential in rebounding came from.  Also we do well to create T/O's which has something to do with defense.  Nova protects the ball well and then we come along and their come up one short of doubling their season average.

We covered, we lost by the same amount as we did at home despite Nova having a "home court advantage", we did not quit.  The 0-11 start in first half was horrid but after that we shot over 50%.  Right now I would say the glass is half full, not half empty.

goredmen

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Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #152 on: February 05, 2017, 05:01:33 PM »
Whole lot of selfish play.  A lot of guys deciding what they're going to do with the ball and not adapting.
It is not selfish it is the game plan

Yes, I'm sure Mullin and Co is telling the team to play only ISO ball and never pass.

Nobody ever gets taken out of the game for doing it so they aren't being told not to

For the most part there really aren't any acceptable options. And if you think the amount of selfish play hasn't decreased as the season has gone on, we haven't been watching the same games.
This is more the norm then the exception. Selfish isn't the right word. These guys are allowed if not encouraged to take these shots.

You're nuts if you think they're encouraged or there's even approval of those shots. Mullin isn't an idiot and isn't trying to sabotage his own team.
How many air balls from 3 are you going to watch before you change your mind ?

What's your point? That was a good look by Mussini, just a bad shot. I'll be convinced next year when we have at least 2 other good options on the bench and Ahmed can throw the ball at the basket and stay in.
Point is simple. I think we take bad shots. I think we play to fast. I think bad shooters are allowed to take bad shots. I think this happens most games.

I think you are living in some sort of alternate reality and unable to see things as they truly are.  I've said it before and I'll say it again.  It ain't the offense:

SCORING OFFENSE    G    W-L    Pts    Avg/G
1.    Creighton    23    20-3    1952    84.9
2.    Marquette    22    14-8    1832    83.3
3.    St. John's    24    11-13    1850    77.1
4.    Villanova    23    21-2    1771            77.0
5.    Xavier            22    16-6    1687    76.7
6.    Georgetown    23    13-10    1757    76.4
   Butler            23    18-5    1757    76.4
8.    Seton Hall    21    13-8    1559    74.2
9.    DePaul            22    8-14    1541    70.0
10.    Providence    24    14-10    1674    69.8



Lol. Points per game is a completely meaningless stat. We, Creighton and Marquette play super fast and Villanova plays super slow so of course we'll have more PPG than Villanova.  Our offense is nowhere near as good as Villanova's and do you think Creighton's offense even with Watson was a full 8 points better than Nova's? No shot.

If you want a team offense stat that actually matters then look for total efficiency which is points per 100 possessions. This eliminates the gaping flaw in PPG in that it is tempo neutral and it adjusts for quality of opponents. Here is the BE teams in order of points per 100 possessions and their total D1 rank out of 351 teams is in parentheses:

1. Villanova 122.6 (6)
2. Marquette 122.3 (7)
3. Creighton 119.1 (18)
4. Butler 117.9 (22)
5. Xavier 117.6 (25)
6. Georgetown 110.7 (80)
7. St. John's 110.2 (91)
8. Seton Hall 109.5 (105)
9. Providence 108.9 (116)
10. DePaul 104.9 (181)

So as you can see in reality we have the 7th best offense in the conference and 91st best in D1. Not terrible, but not good either. Offense isn't as much of a problem as defense is but it's still a problem

Not meaningless.  The points you score in a game is a good criteria for judging offense.  The points you give up a good judge of defense.

Tempo is a part of all that.

By that measure The Citadel would have the best offense in all of D1 basketball as they average 93.1 points per game when in reality The Citadel doesn't even have a top 100 offense in D1 because they average 81 possessions a game when the NCAA average is 68

Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #153 on: February 05, 2017, 05:47:55 PM »
Dante will be better than Ponds

Foolish.

He already is
Yes, unguarded he is great
Dante will be better than Ponds

Foolish.

He already is

He's a second year player. He's also not better.

He's a freshman.  Ponds was a non factor tonight. Brought nothing to the table on either side of the floor
Ponds was in foul trouble (yes, his fault), but has been much better all year than Divincenzo. Ponds is a featured player for whom opposing coaches game plan. , DiVincenzo is a role player, and a nice once, but is not a go-to guy for Nova. When guarded against tougher defense he has not been nearly as good as he has been against our defense, In fact, in the 2 games, he has had Mussini on him much of the time.

Again, nice player and Nova is lucky to have him. But, he may be the Michael Jordan of Delaware but is not going to be the Michael Jordan of the Big East.
The difference is DiVincenzo can come off the bench and find his way with guys who have been there for three or four years and Ponds is expected to carry the team.  We should all just focus on 2018 Ponds, LoVette, Simon, Freudenberg as juniors, Reid, Diakite, Muhammed as freshman and a good recruiting class on the way. Any success we have until then is gravy.

Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #154 on: February 05, 2017, 11:02:09 PM »
Whole lot of selfish play.  A lot of guys deciding what they're going to do with the ball and not adapting.
It is not selfish it is the game plan

Yes, I'm sure Mullin and Co is telling the team to play only ISO ball and never pass.

Nobody ever gets taken out of the game for doing it so they aren't being told not to

For the most part there really aren't any acceptable options. And if you think the amount of selfish play hasn't decreased as the season has gone on, we haven't been watching the same games.
This is more the norm then the exception. Selfish isn't the right word. These guys are allowed if not encouraged to take these shots.

You're nuts if you think they're encouraged or there's even approval of those shots. Mullin isn't an idiot and isn't trying to sabotage his own team.
How many air balls from 3 are you going to watch before you change your mind ?

What's your point? That was a good look by Mussini, just a bad shot. I'll be convinced next year when we have at least 2 other good options on the bench and Ahmed can throw the ball at the basket and stay in.
Point is simple. I think we take bad shots. I think we play to fast. I think bad shooters are allowed to take bad shots. I think this happens most games.

I think you are living in some sort of alternate reality and unable to see things as they truly are.  I've said it before and I'll say it again.  It ain't the offense:

SCORING OFFENSE    G    W-L    Pts    Avg/G
1.    Creighton    23    20-3    1952    84.9
2.    Marquette    22    14-8    1832    83.3
3.    St. John's    24    11-13    1850    77.1
4.    Villanova    23    21-2    1771            77.0
5.    Xavier            22    16-6    1687    76.7
6.    Georgetown    23    13-10    1757    76.4
   Butler            23    18-5    1757    76.4
8.    Seton Hall    21    13-8    1559    74.2
9.    DePaul            22    8-14    1541    70.0
10.    Providence    24    14-10    1674    69.8



Lol. Points per game is a completely meaningless stat. We, Creighton and Marquette play super fast and Villanova plays super slow so of course we'll have more PPG than Villanova.  Our offense is nowhere near as good as Villanova's and do you think Creighton's offense even with Watson was a full 8 points better than Nova's? No shot.

If you want a team offense stat that actually matters then look for total efficiency which is points per 100 possessions. This eliminates the gaping flaw in PPG in that it is tempo neutral and it adjusts for quality of opponents. Here is the BE teams in order of points per 100 possessions and their total D1 rank out of 351 teams is in parentheses:

1. Villanova 122.6 (6)
2. Marquette 122.3 (7)
3. Creighton 119.1 (18)
4. Butler 117.9 (22)
5. Xavier 117.6 (25)
6. Georgetown 110.7 (80)
7. St. John's 110.2 (91)
8. Seton Hall 109.5 (105)
9. Providence 108.9 (116)
10. DePaul 104.9 (181)

So as you can see in reality we have the 7th best offense in the conference and 91st best in D1. Not terrible, but not good either. Offense isn't as much of a problem as defense is but it's still a problem

Not meaningless.  The points you score in a game is a good criteria for judging offense.  The points you give up a good judge of defense.

Tempo is a part of all that.

By that measure The Citadel would have the best offense in all of D1 basketball as they average 93.1 points per game when in reality The Citadel doesn't even have a top 100 offense in D1 because they average 81 possessions a game when the NCAA average is 68

Your conclusion.  Not mine.  I never said anything about who has the best offense.

goredmen

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Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #155 on: February 05, 2017, 11:11:31 PM »
Whole lot of selfish play.  A lot of guys deciding what they're going to do with the ball and not adapting.
It is not selfish it is the game plan

Yes, I'm sure Mullin and Co is telling the team to play only ISO ball and never pass.

Nobody ever gets taken out of the game for doing it so they aren't being told not to

For the most part there really aren't any acceptable options. And if you think the amount of selfish play hasn't decreased as the season has gone on, we haven't been watching the same games.
This is more the norm then the exception. Selfish isn't the right word. These guys are allowed if not encouraged to take these shots.

You're nuts if you think they're encouraged or there's even approval of those shots. Mullin isn't an idiot and isn't trying to sabotage his own team.
How many air balls from 3 are you going to watch before you change your mind ?

What's your point? That was a good look by Mussini, just a bad shot. I'll be convinced next year when we have at least 2 other good options on the bench and Ahmed can throw the ball at the basket and stay in.
Point is simple. I think we take bad shots. I think we play to fast. I think bad shooters are allowed to take bad shots. I think this happens most games.

I think you are living in some sort of alternate reality and unable to see things as they truly are.  I've said it before and I'll say it again.  It ain't the offense:

SCORING OFFENSE    G    W-L    Pts    Avg/G
1.    Creighton    23    20-3    1952    84.9
2.    Marquette    22    14-8    1832    83.3
3.    St. John's    24    11-13    1850    77.1
4.    Villanova    23    21-2    1771            77.0
5.    Xavier            22    16-6    1687    76.7
6.    Georgetown    23    13-10    1757    76.4
   Butler            23    18-5    1757    76.4
8.    Seton Hall    21    13-8    1559    74.2
9.    DePaul            22    8-14    1541    70.0
10.    Providence    24    14-10    1674    69.8



Lol. Points per game is a completely meaningless stat. We, Creighton and Marquette play super fast and Villanova plays super slow so of course we'll have more PPG than Villanova.  Our offense is nowhere near as good as Villanova's and do you think Creighton's offense even with Watson was a full 8 points better than Nova's? No shot.

If you want a team offense stat that actually matters then look for total efficiency which is points per 100 possessions. This eliminates the gaping flaw in PPG in that it is tempo neutral and it adjusts for quality of opponents. Here is the BE teams in order of points per 100 possessions and their total D1 rank out of 351 teams is in parentheses:

1. Villanova 122.6 (6)
2. Marquette 122.3 (7)
3. Creighton 119.1 (18)
4. Butler 117.9 (22)
5. Xavier 117.6 (25)
6. Georgetown 110.7 (80)
7. St. John's 110.2 (91)
8. Seton Hall 109.5 (105)
9. Providence 108.9 (116)
10. DePaul 104.9 (181)

So as you can see in reality we have the 7th best offense in the conference and 91st best in D1. Not terrible, but not good either. Offense isn't as much of a problem as defense is but it's still a problem

Not meaningless.  The points you score in a game is a good criteria for judging offense.  The points you give up a good judge of defense.

Tempo is a part of all that.

By that measure The Citadel would have the best offense in all of D1 basketball as they average 93.1 points per game when in reality The Citadel doesn't even have a top 100 offense in D1 because they average 81 possessions a game when the NCAA average is 68

Your conclusion.  Not mine.  I never said anything about who has the best offense.

You inferred that our offense isn't the problem and used the points per game stat that shows us as the 3rd best offense in the conference to validate your point.  I simply pointed out that if you use a better measure to judge offensive efficiency you would see that our offense is indeed a problem

Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #156 on: February 05, 2017, 11:21:40 PM »
Whole lot of selfish play.  A lot of guys deciding what they're going to do with the ball and not adapting.
It is not selfish it is the game plan

Yes, I'm sure Mullin and Co is telling the team to play only ISO ball and never pass.

Nobody ever gets taken out of the game for doing it so they aren't being told not to

For the most part there really aren't any acceptable options. And if you think the amount of selfish play hasn't decreased as the season has gone on, we haven't been watching the same games.
This is more the norm then the exception. Selfish isn't the right word. These guys are allowed if not encouraged to take these shots.

You're nuts if you think they're encouraged or there's even approval of those shots. Mullin isn't an idiot and isn't trying to sabotage his own team.
How many air balls from 3 are you going to watch before you change your mind ?

What's your point? That was a good look by Mussini, just a bad shot. I'll be convinced next year when we have at least 2 other good options on the bench and Ahmed can throw the ball at the basket and stay in.
Point is simple. I think we take bad shots. I think we play to fast. I think bad shooters are allowed to take bad shots. I think this happens most games.

I think you are living in some sort of alternate reality and unable to see things as they truly are.  I've said it before and I'll say it again.  It ain't the offense:

SCORING OFFENSE    G    W-L    Pts    Avg/G
1.    Creighton    23    20-3    1952    84.9
2.    Marquette    22    14-8    1832    83.3
3.    St. John's    24    11-13    1850    77.1
4.    Villanova    23    21-2    1771            77.0
5.    Xavier            22    16-6    1687    76.7
6.    Georgetown    23    13-10    1757    76.4
   Butler            23    18-5    1757    76.4
8.    Seton Hall    21    13-8    1559    74.2
9.    DePaul            22    8-14    1541    70.0
10.    Providence    24    14-10    1674    69.8



Lol. Points per game is a completely meaningless stat. We, Creighton and Marquette play super fast and Villanova plays super slow so of course we'll have more PPG than Villanova.  Our offense is nowhere near as good as Villanova's and do you think Creighton's offense even with Watson was a full 8 points better than Nova's? No shot.

If you want a team offense stat that actually matters then look for total efficiency which is points per 100 possessions. This eliminates the gaping flaw in PPG in that it is tempo neutral and it adjusts for quality of opponents. Here is the BE teams in order of points per 100 possessions and their total D1 rank out of 351 teams is in parentheses:

1. Villanova 122.6 (6)
2. Marquette 122.3 (7)
3. Creighton 119.1 (18)
4. Butler 117.9 (22)
5. Xavier 117.6 (25)
6. Georgetown 110.7 (80)
7. St. John's 110.2 (91)
8. Seton Hall 109.5 (105)
9. Providence 108.9 (116)
10. DePaul 104.9 (181)

So as you can see in reality we have the 7th best offense in the conference and 91st best in D1. Not terrible, but not good either. Offense isn't as much of a problem as defense is but it's still a problem

Not meaningless.  The points you score in a game is a good criteria for judging offense.  The points you give up a good judge of defense.

Tempo is a part of all that.

By that measure The Citadel would have the best offense in all of D1 basketball as they average 93.1 points per game when in reality The Citadel doesn't even have a top 100 offense in D1 because they average 81 possessions a game when the NCAA average is 68

Your conclusion.  Not mine.  I never said anything about who has the best offense.

You inferred that our offense isn't the problem and used the points per game stat that shows us as the 3rd best offense in the conference to validate your point.  I simply pointed out that if you use a better measure to judge offensive efficiency you would see that our offense is indeed a problem

That's right. I do disagree that our offense is a problem.  In addition to the fact that we have 5 very competent 3 point shooters,  I offer you this:

1.    RODRIGUEZ, Desi-SHU    JR    9    61    27    16    165            18.3
2.    HART,Josh-VU                   SR    11    72    20    37    201            18.3
3.    LOVETT, Marcus-SJU            FR    12    72    24    43    211             17.6
4.    PRYOR, Rodney-GU            SR    10    66    20    19    171             17.1
5.    PONDS, Shamorie-SJU    FR    12    64    21    56    205     17.1

That's right.  We have two scorers in the league's top five. No other BE offense can claim that.

goredmen

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Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #157 on: February 05, 2017, 11:43:54 PM »
Whole lot of selfish play.  A lot of guys deciding what they're going to do with the ball and not adapting.
It is not selfish it is the game plan

Yes, I'm sure Mullin and Co is telling the team to play only ISO ball and never pass.

Nobody ever gets taken out of the game for doing it so they aren't being told not to

For the most part there really aren't any acceptable options. And if you think the amount of selfish play hasn't decreased as the season has gone on, we haven't been watching the same games.
This is more the norm then the exception. Selfish isn't the right word. These guys are allowed if not encouraged to take these shots.

You're nuts if you think they're encouraged or there's even approval of those shots. Mullin isn't an idiot and isn't trying to sabotage his own team.
How many air balls from 3 are you going to watch before you change your mind ?

What's your point? That was a good look by Mussini, just a bad shot. I'll be convinced next year when we have at least 2 other good options on the bench and Ahmed can throw the ball at the basket and stay in.
Point is simple. I think we take bad shots. I think we play to fast. I think bad shooters are allowed to take bad shots. I think this happens most games.

I think you are living in some sort of alternate reality and unable to see things as they truly are.  I've said it before and I'll say it again.  It ain't the offense:

SCORING OFFENSE    G    W-L    Pts    Avg/G
1.    Creighton    23    20-3    1952    84.9
2.    Marquette    22    14-8    1832    83.3
3.    St. John's    24    11-13    1850    77.1
4.    Villanova    23    21-2    1771            77.0
5.    Xavier            22    16-6    1687    76.7
6.    Georgetown    23    13-10    1757    76.4
   Butler            23    18-5    1757    76.4
8.    Seton Hall    21    13-8    1559    74.2
9.    DePaul            22    8-14    1541    70.0
10.    Providence    24    14-10    1674    69.8



Lol. Points per game is a completely meaningless stat. We, Creighton and Marquette play super fast and Villanova plays super slow so of course we'll have more PPG than Villanova.  Our offense is nowhere near as good as Villanova's and do you think Creighton's offense even with Watson was a full 8 points better than Nova's? No shot.

If you want a team offense stat that actually matters then look for total efficiency which is points per 100 possessions. This eliminates the gaping flaw in PPG in that it is tempo neutral and it adjusts for quality of opponents. Here is the BE teams in order of points per 100 possessions and their total D1 rank out of 351 teams is in parentheses:

1. Villanova 122.6 (6)
2. Marquette 122.3 (7)
3. Creighton 119.1 (18)
4. Butler 117.9 (22)
5. Xavier 117.6 (25)
6. Georgetown 110.7 (80)
7. St. John's 110.2 (91)
8. Seton Hall 109.5 (105)
9. Providence 108.9 (116)
10. DePaul 104.9 (181)

So as you can see in reality we have the 7th best offense in the conference and 91st best in D1. Not terrible, but not good either. Offense isn't as much of a problem as defense is but it's still a problem

Not meaningless.  The points you score in a game is a good criteria for judging offense.  The points you give up a good judge of defense.

Tempo is a part of all that.

By that measure The Citadel would have the best offense in all of D1 basketball as they average 93.1 points per game when in reality The Citadel doesn't even have a top 100 offense in D1 because they average 81 possessions a game when the NCAA average is 68

Your conclusion.  Not mine.  I never said anything about who has the best offense.

You inferred that our offense isn't the problem and used the points per game stat that shows us as the 3rd best offense in the conference to validate your point.  I simply pointed out that if you use a better measure to judge offensive efficiency you would see that our offense is indeed a problem

That's right. I do disagree that our offense is a problem.  In addition to the fact that we have 5 very competent 3 point shooters,  I offer you this:

1.    RODRIGUEZ, Desi-SHU    JR    9    61    27    16    165            18.3
2.    HART,Josh-VU                   SR    11    72    20    37    201            18.3
3.    LOVETT, Marcus-SJU            FR    12    72    24    43    211             17.6
4.    PRYOR, Rodney-GU            SR    10    66    20    19    171             17.1
5.    PONDS, Shamorie-SJU    FR    12    64    21    56    205     17.1

That's right.  We have two scorers in the league's top five. No other BE offense can claim that.

Yes no other Big East offense can claim that because no other Big East team plays as fast as we do. We average more possessions per game than every other team which gives our guys more chances to score than every other team, so it would surprising if we didn't have two of the top 5 scorers in the conference. This is also meaningless as our top 2 guys are a bigger part of our offense than the top 2 guys for other offenses due to our limited scoring options and depth.

Lets break it down:

Player A scores 17 points on 6-18 shooting.
Player B scores 15 points on 5-10 shooting.

Who had the better game? Obviously player B did, but if the only stat you look at is points per game you'd incorrectly think Player A was better.

The same can be applied to team scoring:

Team A averages 77 points per game but averages 80 possessions per game
Team B averages 73 points per game but averages 71 possessions per game

Again, Team B is obviously the much better offense despite averaging 4 points less per game than Team A
« Last Edit: February 05, 2017, 11:46:01 PM by goredmen »

Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #158 on: February 06, 2017, 12:06:36 AM »
Whole lot of selfish play.  A lot of guys deciding what they're going to do with the ball and not adapting.
It is not selfish it is the game plan

Yes, I'm sure Mullin and Co is telling the team to play only ISO ball and never pass.

Nobody ever gets taken out of the game for doing it so they aren't being told not to

For the most part there really aren't any acceptable options. And if you think the amount of selfish play hasn't decreased as the season has gone on, we haven't been watching the same games.
This is more the norm then the exception. Selfish isn't the right word. These guys are allowed if not encouraged to take these shots.

You're nuts if you think they're encouraged or there's even approval of those shots. Mullin isn't an idiot and isn't trying to sabotage his own team.
How many air balls from 3 are you going to watch before you change your mind ?

What's your point? That was a good look by Mussini, just a bad shot. I'll be convinced next year when we have at least 2 other good options on the bench and Ahmed can throw the ball at the basket and stay in.
Point is simple. I think we take bad shots. I think we play to fast. I think bad shooters are allowed to take bad shots. I think this happens most games.

I think you are living in some sort of alternate reality and unable to see things as they truly are.  I've said it before and I'll say it again.  It ain't the offense:

SCORING OFFENSE    G    W-L    Pts    Avg/G
1.    Creighton    23    20-3    1952    84.9
2.    Marquette    22    14-8    1832    83.3
3.    St. John's    24    11-13    1850    77.1
4.    Villanova    23    21-2    1771            77.0
5.    Xavier            22    16-6    1687    76.7
6.    Georgetown    23    13-10    1757    76.4
   Butler            23    18-5    1757    76.4
8.    Seton Hall    21    13-8    1559    74.2
9.    DePaul            22    8-14    1541    70.0
10.    Providence    24    14-10    1674    69.8



Lol. Points per game is a completely meaningless stat. We, Creighton and Marquette play super fast and Villanova plays super slow so of course we'll have more PPG than Villanova.  Our offense is nowhere near as good as Villanova's and do you think Creighton's offense even with Watson was a full 8 points better than Nova's? No shot.

If you want a team offense stat that actually matters then look for total efficiency which is points per 100 possessions. This eliminates the gaping flaw in PPG in that it is tempo neutral and it adjusts for quality of opponents. Here is the BE teams in order of points per 100 possessions and their total D1 rank out of 351 teams is in parentheses:

1. Villanova 122.6 (6)
2. Marquette 122.3 (7)
3. Creighton 119.1 (18)
4. Butler 117.9 (22)
5. Xavier 117.6 (25)
6. Georgetown 110.7 (80)
7. St. John's 110.2 (91)
8. Seton Hall 109.5 (105)
9. Providence 108.9 (116)
10. DePaul 104.9 (181)

So as you can see in reality we have the 7th best offense in the conference and 91st best in D1. Not terrible, but not good either. Offense isn't as much of a problem as defense is but it's still a problem

Not meaningless.  The points you score in a game is a good criteria for judging offense.  The points you give up a good judge of defense.

Tempo is a part of all that.

By that measure The Citadel would have the best offense in all of D1 basketball as they average 93.1 points per game when in reality The Citadel doesn't even have a top 100 offense in D1 because they average 81 possessions a game when the NCAA average is 68

Your conclusion.  Not mine.  I never said anything about who has the best offense.

You inferred that our offense isn't the problem and used the points per game stat that shows us as the 3rd best offense in the conference to validate your point.  I simply pointed out that if you use a better measure to judge offensive efficiency you would see that our offense is indeed a problem

That's right. I do disagree that our offense is a problem.  In addition to the fact that we have 5 very competent 3 point shooters,  I offer you this:

1.    RODRIGUEZ, Desi-SHU    JR    9    61    27    16    165            18.3
2.    HART,Josh-VU                   SR    11    72    20    37    201            18.3
3.    LOVETT, Marcus-SJU            FR    12    72    24    43    211             17.6
4.    PRYOR, Rodney-GU            SR    10    66    20    19    171             17.1
5.    PONDS, Shamorie-SJU    FR    12    64    21    56    205     17.1

That's right.  We have two scorers in the league's top five. No other BE offense can claim that.

St. John's has playmakers. Need to develop into better decision makers and all around players.
Follow Johnny Jungle on Twitter at @Johnny_Jungle

thetruth8734

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Re: Villanova prediction thread
« Reply #159 on: February 06, 2017, 12:30:19 AM »
Anyone who watches/knows anything about basketball can see Ponds is a much better player than DiVincenzo. Put Ponds on Villanova where the defense isn't keyed in on him and he would have playmakers like Brunson and Hart to get him wide open looks  like DiVincenzo has, and Ponds would thrive (not that he isn't already). Put Divincenzo on St. John's where he would have to create his own shots and have defenses focusing on him and he's nothing more than a rich man's Mussini this season. It's unbelievable that people are actually ripping Ponds when he's arguably the best player on our team and averaging 17ppg 5rpg and 3apg in the Big East as a freshman..... If he ends up staying all 4 years I think he's Big East POY material, and could be arguably one of the best players in the country eventually if he keeps progressing.