Our staff...

i've questioned what hicks is doing.  right now, it seems he's only taking up space.  i thought he'd be an nyc pipeline.

no one complained about the recruiting before.  true, we're not going after mcdonald a-a's...

isn't that a problem to anyone?

it isn't the x's and o's...it's the players.

It's both.  With Dunlap things would be different as the Xs and Os would be better which would solve a lot of problems.  With a more complete roster including shooters the lack of perfect xs and os wouldn't matter as much.  It's hard to get everything perfect --- we just need ONE of those to be better to be a force.  Both better and we're a title contender.  In year 1 with his own players, I'm OK with this provided these issues are addressed going forward...

Quote from: simplyred on March 06, 2013, 10:08:22 AM

Guys are jumping ship faster than we did with Norm.  Lol!

Are expectations higher under Lavin than Norm?
Then timeline should be sped up.

Norm had NCAA sanctions hanging over his head. He came into a program that had two Big East players, a handful of MAAC level talent and walk ons that he was forced to play.

Granted Roberts was too stupid to actually make anyone a better player, but the scenarios that the coaches had were dramatically different. Lavin was handed the opportunity to one, coach seniors, and then he was given what was basically a clean slate to build the program in his vision.

If we are going to accept excuses for Lavin, then let's go back in time, forgive Norm for all of the bad luck he had to deal with. (and we know there was plenty)

Quote from: boo3 on March 06, 2013, 10:57:08 AM

Quote from: paultzman on March 06, 2013, 10:53:10 AM

Quote from: Moose on March 06, 2013, 10:49:04 AM

Quote from: simplyred on March 06, 2013, 10:08:22 AM

Guys are jumping ship faster than we did with Norm.  Lol!

Are expectations higher under Lavin than Norm?
Then timeline should be sped up.

From an investment/return perspective, we are paying major $ for this staff compared to previous regime. Fair to expect decent results? Why not?

  Sure, but it also depends on your time horizon.  You want instant results or are you prepared to wait 3-5 years for your return?   Most people looking for instant gratification or a "quick profit" end up getting burned...

Never implied "instant" results, but IMO next year's results should be evaluated to see if we are on the right track.

  Results every year should be evaluated and yes, next year is big.   To continue to use your investment analogy, if you aren't prepared for a little turbulence along the way, you should probably not invest so much or invest your time and energy into something safer...

 Probably why I gave up season tickets at the end of Norm's error.  Wasn't worth the investment.....and still isn't, IMO. 

coach Cal has never had an uperclassman

Quote from: boo3 on March 06, 2013, 10:57:08 AM

Quote from: paultzman on March 06, 2013, 10:53:10 AM

Quote from: Moose on March 06, 2013, 10:49:04 AM

Quote from: simplyred on March 06, 2013, 10:08:22 AM

Guys are jumping ship faster than we did with Norm.  Lol!

Are expectations higher under Lavin than Norm?
Then timeline should be sped up.

From an investment/return perspective, we are paying major $ for this staff compared to previous regime. Fair to expect decent results? Why not?

  Sure, but it also depends on your time horizon.  You want instant results or are you prepared to wait 3-5 years for your return?   Most people looking for instant gratification or a "quick profit" end up getting burned...

Are we going to be good next year and year after then take a step back for another 2 years.  That's kind of the cycle I'm seeing setup.  Are teams only good with the upperclassmen I guess is my question.

That is exactly right. We'll be good next year, and then we'll be 16-15 again with Pointer, Greene, Garrett and Obekpa as our stars.

Quote from: Moose on March 06, 2013, 11:02:57 AM

Quote from: boo3 on March 06, 2013, 10:57:08 AM

Quote from: paultzman on March 06, 2013, 10:53:10 AM

Quote from: Moose on March 06, 2013, 10:49:04 AM

Quote from: simplyred on March 06, 2013, 10:08:22 AM

Guys are jumping ship faster than we did with Norm.  Lol!

Are expectations higher under Lavin than Norm?
Then timeline should be sped up.

From an investment/return perspective, we are paying major $ for this staff compared to previous regime. Fair to expect decent results? Why not?

  Sure, but it also depends on your time horizon.  You want instant results or are you prepared to wait 3-5 years for your return?   Most people looking for instant gratification or a "quick profit" end up getting burned...

Are we going to be good next year and year after then take a step back for another 2 years.  That's kind of the cycle I'm seeing setup.  Are teams only good with the upperclassmen I guess is my question.

That is exactly right. We'll be good next year, and then we'll be 16-15 again with Pointer, Greene, Garrett and Obekpa as our stars.

I disagree - I think Pointer-Garrett-Obekpa as seniors (junior for CO) will result in a NCAA team assuming Lavin recruits like he has when he has had ships available.

I say bring in Norm, Jarvis and Deuce back as assistants.  We can go to the freelance offense.

coach Cal has never had an uperclassman

he recruits from the top of the deck.  we don't.

coach Cal has never had an uperclassman

Quote from: paultzman on March 06, 2013, 11:00:07 AM

Quote from: boo3 on March 06, 2013, 10:57:08 AM

Quote from: paultzman on March 06, 2013, 10:53:10 AM

Quote from: Moose on March 06, 2013, 10:49:04 AM

Quote from: simplyred on March 06, 2013, 10:08:22 AM

Guys are jumping ship faster than we did with Norm.  Lol!

Are expectations higher under Lavin than Norm?
Then timeline should be sped up.

From an investment/return perspective, we are paying major $ for this staff compared to previous regime. Fair to expect decent results? Why not?

  Sure, but it also depends on your time horizon.  You want instant results or are you prepared to wait 3-5 years for your return?   Most people looking for instant gratification or a "quick profit" end up getting burned...

Never implied "instant" results, but IMO next year's results should be evaluated to see if we are on the right track.

  Results every year should be evaluated and yes, next year is big.   To continue to use your investment analogy, if you aren't prepared for a little turbulence along the way, you should probably not invest so much or invest your time and energy into something safer...

 Probably why I gave up season tickets at the end of Norm's error.  Wasn't worth the investment.....and still isn't, IMO. 

Fair enough Boo.

Quote from: Poison on March 06, 2013, 11:06:24 AM

Quote from: Moose on March 06, 2013, 11:02:57 AM

Quote from: boo3 on March 06, 2013, 10:57:08 AM

Quote from: paultzman on March 06, 2013, 10:53:10 AM

Quote from: Moose on March 06, 2013, 10:49:04 AM

Quote from: simplyred on March 06, 2013, 10:08:22 AM

Guys are jumping ship faster than we did with Norm.  Lol!

Are expectations higher under Lavin than Norm?
Then timeline should be sped up.

From an investment/return perspective, we are paying major $ for this staff compared to previous regime. Fair to expect decent results? Why not?

  Sure, but it also depends on your time horizon.  You want instant results or are you prepared to wait 3-5 years for your return?   Most people looking for instant gratification or a "quick profit" end up getting burned...

Are we going to be good next year and year after then take a step back for another 2 years.  That's kind of the cycle I'm seeing setup.  Are teams only good with the upperclassmen I guess is my question.

That is exactly right. We'll be good next year, and then we'll be 16-15 again with Pointer, Greene, Garrett and Obekpa as our stars.

I disagree - I think Pointer-Garrett-Obekpa as seniors (junior for CO) will result in a NCAA team assuming Lavin recruits like he has when he has had ships available.

Yeah.  It would be year after that worries me if the cycle starts again.

Quote from: paultzman on March 06, 2013, 11:00:07 AM

Quote from: boo3 on March 06, 2013, 10:57:08 AM

Quote from: paultzman on March 06, 2013, 10:53:10 AM

Quote from: Moose on March 06, 2013, 10:49:04 AM

Quote from: simplyred on March 06, 2013, 10:08:22 AM

Guys are jumping ship faster than we did with Norm.  Lol!

Are expectations higher under Lavin than Norm?
Then timeline should be sped up.

From an investment/return perspective, we are paying major $ for this staff compared to previous regime. Fair to expect decent results? Why not?

  Sure, but it also depends on your time horizon.  You want instant results or are you prepared to wait 3-5 years for your return?   Most people looking for instant gratification or a "quick profit" end up getting burned...

Never implied "instant" results, but IMO next year's results should be evaluated to see if we are on the right track.

  Results every year should be evaluated and yes, next year is big.   To continue to use your investment analogy, if you aren't prepared for a little turbulence along the way, you should probably not invest so much or invest your time and energy into something safer...

 Probably why I gave up season tickets at the end of Norm's error.  Wasn't worth the investment.....and still isn't, IMO. 

It would have been, if Lavin didn't ruin the season.

Would it be so crazy to ask Lavin to do the game prep? Isn't he the coach? Other than say cute shit to the media, he hasn't shown that he's good at this.

We don't need to hire an Xs and Os assistant. We need to hire a coach who knows how to coach. The Xs and Os guy should be LAVIN! He's the F'n coach. What the Hell does he do?

The answer to the first question is yes and if you think any coach at the Big East level is does pre game video scout, you really don't understand how a Div I staff works. The head coach surrounds himself with talented assistants he trusts to get him to the game and then its his job to take over.

You think guys like Pitino, Boeheim, Calipari are do game prep work and video scouting..?

Coach Lavin had the ultimate #2 guy in Dunlap, he was a basketball machine and did the job of two guys. On top of that he could actually get out there and show the kids what he is trying to teach them.

The bottom line is that right now we have a very weak staff.

I think Lavin does a great job with the kids and they will run through a wall for him. He just needs better people around him.

Offensive coordinator, boxing trainer and body language coach. Those are the three areas we are weakest in.

Offensive coordinator, boxing trainer and body language coach. Those are the three areas we are weakest in.

Shooting coach.

Would it be so crazy to ask Lavin to do the game prep? Isn't he the coach? Other than say cute shit to the media, he hasn't shown that he's good at this.

We don't need to hire an Xs and Os assistant. We need to hire a coach who knows how to coach. The Xs and Os guy should be LAVIN! He's the F'n coach. What the Hell does he do?

The answer to the first question is yes and if you think any coach at the Big East level is does pre game video scout, you really don't understand how a Div I staff works. The head coach surrounds himself with talented assistants he trusts to get him to the game and then its his job to take over.

You think guys like Pitino, Boeheim, Calipari are do game prep work and video scouting..?

Coach Lavin had the ultimate #2 guy in Dunlap, he was a basketball machine and did the job of two guys. On top of that he could actually get out there and show the kids what he is trying to teach them.

The bottom line is that right now we have a very weak staff.

I think Lavin does a great job with the kids and they will run through a wall for him. He just needs better people around him.

Jim Boeheim may not do his own prep work, but he doesn't need another coach to do the Xs and Os part for him. He can do it himself. His team's have a POV. They play a certain way every year, and it works very well, always. Lou played man to man to defense. His players could defend, so when they would play a high scoring team like Uconn or Syracuse, they had an answer, because they had a POV.

This team, which is Lavin's has no POV. They play an average zone, and they stink at man to man. They can't shoot, and they can't pass. Lavin looks more and more like Brian Mahoney every day.

Quote"Shooting coach."

Offensive cordinator has huge job ahead of him. Shooting, free throw shooting, passing, ball movement, moving w/o ball, dribbling North to South not in a circle.

If Keady and Lavin still travel to school together I would love to hear a tape of their conversation today.

Keady must be getting at least itchy with the way things are unraveling.

If Keady and Lavin still travel to school together I would love to hear a tape of their conversation today.

Lavin-Tough game, Phil looked real good tonight though
Keady-What time is Matlock on tonight?
Lavin-I don't know but my circle motion offense is really coming together, by 2015 it should really be humming. I wonder if coach Knight was impressed?
Keady-I hate that bastard
Lavin-Was it me or do you think Marco eye rolled me when I took him out 5 seconds after I put him in
Keady-That Betty White is one hot dish!
Lavin-I think I am going to have to suspend Marco
Keady-Did someone hide my Makers Mark again?
Lavin- Hammer to rock

If Keady and Lavin still travel to school together I would love to hear a tape of their conversation today.

Lavin-Tough game, Phil looked real good tonight though
Keady-What time is Matlock on tonight?
Lavin-I don't know but my circle motion offense is really coming together, by 2015 it should really be humming. I wonder if coach Knight was impressed?
Keady-I hate that bastard
Lavin-Was it me or do you think Marco eye rolled me when I took him out 5 seconds after I put him in
Keady-That Betty White is one hot dish!
Lavin-I think I am going to have to suspend Marco
Keady-Did someone hide my Makers Mark again?
Lavin- Hammer to rock

Hysterical! You have a gift. 

The barometer of how the staff has done is whether the sophomores have gotten better from last year

Sir'Dom improved this year, but I didn't see any progress in the games of Harrison, Greene, or Garrett