Creighton Game Thread

Quote from: redmen not storm on January 29, 2014, 01:19:08 AM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 29, 2014, 12:17:14 AM

I just watched it. Heard Doug was outscoring us 28-27 and was expecting to see a rout. What I saw was a team who for the most part looked like the better team who just lost to a better player. That kid made play after play. Now that doesnt mean I dont have some gripes. The first with the reffs; they took jordan from us right from the get go and he was looking like he was going to have a great game from the tip. Two really questionable fouls and one drive in which creighton slapped his arm so hard you could hear it on TV. No call. McDermott was getting away with elbows all night and that hook in the last minute was unbelievable. UNBELIEVABLE. The reff was standing right there. That was followed by a bogus offensive foul call and a easily spotted illegal screen on the mcDermott three to win it. Now we did get some calls our way while we made our run but nothing which was game changing worthy.




Now for Lavin, why have Obekpa guarding him in that spot? 11 seconds left and they wont have time to set up a post play having to go the full court. Obekpa played great on him in the second but you dont want him following him full court. He was the one guy you cant leave and he did just that. That falls on Chris too.  Secondly, what was that play he drew up with 3 seconds left? No body moved. You set up a play where rysheed gets the ball on the run and he realistically can get to the 3 point line and put up a decent look. Instead he was sitting underneath the far rim.

Tough one to lose. Believe it or not, we win that game and we were back on the bubble.

Upstate see above. Here is the correct view. Obekpa is our best bid defender in the paint, not in a full court last second going the length of the floor situation. Had creighton had Doug take the ball up the court when they saw obekpa on him he would have easily dribbled past obekpa into the lane where you are now hoping a help defender can somehow stop him without fouling.

Why is the logic of this so hard to comprehend?  You're right about one thing though, I would've rather seen dom on him in that specific situation.

Haha...because someone else agreed with you, I'm wrong?  You won't be able to convince me that Lavin was in the wrong for having CO on Dougie.  Guess we'll have to agree to disagree. 

Playing devils advocate with your logic....what has Jakarr shown on defense in his entire carreer at St.John's that would give you confidence that he should have been on Dougie?

I wouldn't have put CO on him in that situation if for no other reason than Obekpa has little to no experience guarding someone on the perimeter.    When has Chris ever had to fight over the top of a screen?    He's just not used to that because the guys he normally guards aren't shooters.   Then, throw in his tendancy to think it's his job to give help in the lane.... and you can see why that play developed as it did.

We should have won ... we got screwed .... and ... screwed again ... we had it taken from us with total BS

Stop bawling you big girl's blouse. It's unseemly. There was a minute left when McDermott hooked his man. Fifty seconds left, SJ down 2 when Jordan was called for the phantom foul. The game was tied with 11 seconds to go. It was all very winnable. SJU lost because they failed to defend the best player in the state of Nebraska coming out of a TO, the entire focus of which, presumably, was about how to defend the best player in Nebraska. Instead of whining about the officials, why not enjoy the moral victory.

When I feel blue I always try and do something constructive. For example, this morning I ordered my CBI tickets. Buck up. Brighter days ahead: we get to play Seton Hall and DePaul again in February.

Quote from: upstate32 on January 29, 2014, 02:10:16 AM

Quote from: redmen not storm on January 29, 2014, 01:19:08 AM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 29, 2014, 12:17:14 AM

I just watched it. Heard Doug was outscoring us 28-27 and was expecting to see a rout. What I saw was a team who for the most part looked like the better team who just lost to a better player. That kid made play after play. Now that doesnt mean I dont have some gripes. The first with the reffs; they took jordan from us right from the get go and he was looking like he was going to have a great game from the tip. Two really questionable fouls and one drive in which creighton slapped his arm so hard you could hear it on TV. No call. McDermott was getting away with elbows all night and that hook in the last minute was unbelievable. UNBELIEVABLE. The reff was standing right there. That was followed by a bogus offensive foul call and a easily spotted illegal screen on the mcDermott three to win it. Now we did get some calls our way while we made our run but nothing which was game changing worthy.




Now for Lavin, why have Obekpa guarding him in that spot? 11 seconds left and they wont have time to set up a post play having to go the full court. Obekpa played great on him in the second but you dont want him following him full court. He was the one guy you cant leave and he did just that. That falls on Chris too.  Secondly, what was that play he drew up with 3 seconds left? No body moved. You set up a play where rysheed gets the ball on the run and he realistically can get to the 3 point line and put up a decent look. Instead he was sitting underneath the far rim.

Tough one to lose. Believe it or not, we win that game and we were back on the bubble.

Upstate see above. Here is the correct view. Obekpa is our best bid defender in the paint, not in a full court last second going the length of the floor situation. Had creighton had Doug take the ball up the court when they saw obekpa on him he would have easily dribbled past obekpa into the lane where you are now hoping a help defender can somehow stop him without fouling.

Why is the logic of this so hard to comprehend?  You're right about one thing though, I would've rather seen dom on him in that specific situation.

Haha...because someone else agreed with you, I'm wrong?  You won't be able to convince me that Lavin was in the wrong for having CO on Dougie.  Guess we'll have to agree to disagree. 

Playing devils advocate with your logic....what has Jakarr shown on defense in his entire carreer at St.John's that would give you confidence that he should have been on Dougie?

The fact that Obekpa left the best senior in the country open for a three cant convince you? That is the one thing you cannot do. You stick to him like glue.

Not sure how Obekpa leaving his man is on Lavin?   You just said so yourself...."Obekpa left the best senior in the country open". 

win that game and we were back on the bubble.

On the bubble? Good grief. We're on the bubble of Division II. We're 12-9 and 2-6 in conference. We're 3 and 6 in 2014. The phrase you're looking for is "we suck." We'll be lucky to make the NIT.

Quote from: STJ11Redmen on January 29, 2014, 12:34:05 AM

Last shot easily could have been a 4-point play too.

In fairness, it could've been a moving screen against the offense as well.

Yep!

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 29, 2014, 12:17:14 AM

win that game and we were back on the bubble.

On the bubble? Good grief. We're on the bubble of Division II. We're 12-9 and 2-6 in conference. We're 3 and 6 in 2014. The phrase you're looking for is "we suck." We'll be lucky to make the NIT.

But a "solid, could have, should have, what if" 2-6 record. No points for that guys.  Beat M'Q!

Quote from: upstate32 on January 29, 2014, 02:10:16 AM

Quote from: redmen not storm on January 29, 2014, 01:19:08 AM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 29, 2014, 12:17:14 AM

I just watched it. Heard Doug was outscoring us 28-27 and was expecting to see a rout. What I saw was a team who for the most part looked like the better team who just lost to a better player. That kid made play after play. Now that doesnt mean I dont have some gripes. The first with the reffs; they took jordan from us right from the get go and he was looking like he was going to have a great game from the tip. Two really questionable fouls and one drive in which creighton slapped his arm so hard you could hear it on TV. No call. McDermott was getting away with elbows all night and that hook in the last minute was unbelievable. UNBELIEVABLE. The reff was standing right there. That was followed by a bogus offensive foul call and a easily spotted illegal screen on the mcDermott three to win it. Now we did get some calls our way while we made our run but nothing which was game changing worthy.




Now for Lavin, why have Obekpa guarding him in that spot? 11 seconds left and they wont have time to set up a post play having to go the full court. Obekpa played great on him in the second but you dont want him following him full court. He was the one guy you cant leave and he did just that. That falls on Chris too.  Secondly, what was that play he drew up with 3 seconds left? No body moved. You set up a play where rysheed gets the ball on the run and he realistically can get to the 3 point line and put up a decent look. Instead he was sitting underneath the far rim.

Tough one to lose. Believe it or not, we win that game and we were back on the bubble.

Upstate see above. Here is the correct view. Obekpa is our best bid defender in the paint, not in a full court last second going the length of the floor situation. Had creighton had Doug take the ball up the court when they saw obekpa on him he would have easily dribbled past obekpa into the lane where you are now hoping a help defender can somehow stop him without fouling.

Why is the logic of this so hard to comprehend?  You're right about one thing though, I would've rather seen dom on him in that specific situation.

Haha...because someone else agreed with you, I'm wrong?  You won't be able to convince me that Lavin was in the wrong for having CO on Dougie.  Guess we'll have to agree to disagree. 

Playing devils advocate with your logic....what has Jakarr shown on defense in his entire carreer at St.John's that would give you confidence that he should have been on Dougie?

I wouldn't have put CO on him in that situation if for no other reason than Obekpa has little to no experience guarding someone on the perimeter.    When has Chris ever had to fight over the top of a screen?    He's just not used to that because the guys he normally guards aren't shooters.   Then, throw in his tendancy to think it's his job to give help in the lane.... and you can see why that play developed as it did.

I'm sure this doesn't come as a surprise as I've been defending this standpoint for a while now....but in theory I liked the assignment.  If CO doesn't drift into the paint, McDermott gets the ball at the top of the key and would have had to put the ball on the floor.  Which is a much tougher shot than a catch and shoot. 

Maybe he still makes it off the dribble, and we still lose. 

Someone said after the play that this play was Lavin's fault for Obekpa being assigned to McDermott.  All I'm saying is, I don't think you can blame Lavin for the way this sequence played out. 

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 29, 2014, 09:30:11 AM

Quote from: upstate32 on January 29, 2014, 02:10:16 AM

Quote from: redmen not storm on January 29, 2014, 01:19:08 AM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 29, 2014, 12:17:14 AM

I just watched it. Heard Doug was outscoring us 28-27 and was expecting to see a rout. What I saw was a team who for the most part looked like the better team who just lost to a better player. That kid made play after play. Now that doesnt mean I dont have some gripes. The first with the reffs; they took jordan from us right from the get go and he was looking like he was going to have a great game from the tip. Two really questionable fouls and one drive in which creighton slapped his arm so hard you could hear it on TV. No call. McDermott was getting away with elbows all night and that hook in the last minute was unbelievable. UNBELIEVABLE. The reff was standing right there. That was followed by a bogus offensive foul call and a easily spotted illegal screen on the mcDermott three to win it. Now we did get some calls our way while we made our run but nothing which was game changing worthy.




Now for Lavin, why have Obekpa guarding him in that spot? 11 seconds left and they wont have time to set up a post play having to go the full court. Obekpa played great on him in the second but you dont want him following him full court. He was the one guy you cant leave and he did just that. That falls on Chris too.  Secondly, what was that play he drew up with 3 seconds left? No body moved. You set up a play where rysheed gets the ball on the run and he realistically can get to the 3 point line and put up a decent look. Instead he was sitting underneath the far rim.

Tough one to lose. Believe it or not, we win that game and we were back on the bubble.

Upstate see above. Here is the correct view. Obekpa is our best bid defender in the paint, not in a full court last second going the length of the floor situation. Had creighton had Doug take the ball up the court when they saw obekpa on him he would have easily dribbled past obekpa into the lane where you are now hoping a help defender can somehow stop him without fouling.

Why is the logic of this so hard to comprehend?  You're right about one thing though, I would've rather seen dom on him in that specific situation.

Haha...because someone else agreed with you, I'm wrong?  You won't be able to convince me that Lavin was in the wrong for having CO on Dougie.  Guess we'll have to agree to disagree. 

Playing devils advocate with your logic....what has Jakarr shown on defense in his entire carreer at St.John's that would give you confidence that he should have been on Dougie?

The fact that Obekpa left the best senior in the country open for a three cant convince you? That is the one thing you cannot do. You stick to him like glue.

Not sure how Obekpa leaving his man is on Lavin?   You just said so yourself...."Obekpa left the best senior in the country open". 

It was Lavin who put obekpa on him.  Im sure about everyone was saying before they inbounded that it wasnt a good idea. I know I was.

Quote from: desco80 on January 29, 2014, 09:48:06 AM

Quote from: upstate32 on January 29, 2014, 02:10:16 AM

Quote from: redmen not storm on January 29, 2014, 01:19:08 AM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 29, 2014, 12:17:14 AM

I just watched it. Heard Doug was outscoring us 28-27 and was expecting to see a rout. What I saw was a team who for the most part looked like the better team who just lost to a better player. That kid made play after play. Now that doesnt mean I dont have some gripes. The first with the reffs; they took jordan from us right from the get go and he was looking like he was going to have a great game from the tip. Two really questionable fouls and one drive in which creighton slapped his arm so hard you could hear it on TV. No call. McDermott was getting away with elbows all night and that hook in the last minute was unbelievable. UNBELIEVABLE. The reff was standing right there. That was followed by a bogus offensive foul call and a easily spotted illegal screen on the mcDermott three to win it. Now we did get some calls our way while we made our run but nothing which was game changing worthy.




Now for Lavin, why have Obekpa guarding him in that spot? 11 seconds left and they wont have time to set up a post play having to go the full court. Obekpa played great on him in the second but you dont want him following him full court. He was the one guy you cant leave and he did just that. That falls on Chris too.  Secondly, what was that play he drew up with 3 seconds left? No body moved. You set up a play where rysheed gets the ball on the run and he realistically can get to the 3 point line and put up a decent look. Instead he was sitting underneath the far rim.

Tough one to lose. Believe it or not, we win that game and we were back on the bubble.

Upstate see above. Here is the correct view. Obekpa is our best bid defender in the paint, not in a full court last second going the length of the floor situation. Had creighton had Doug take the ball up the court when they saw obekpa on him he would have easily dribbled past obekpa into the lane where you are now hoping a help defender can somehow stop him without fouling.

Why is the logic of this so hard to comprehend?  You're right about one thing though, I would've rather seen dom on him in that specific situation.

Haha...because someone else agreed with you, I'm wrong?  You won't be able to convince me that Lavin was in the wrong for having CO on Dougie.  Guess we'll have to agree to disagree. 

Playing devils advocate with your logic....what has Jakarr shown on defense in his entire carreer at St.John's that would give you confidence that he should have been on Dougie?

I wouldn't have put CO on him in that situation if for no other reason than Obekpa has little to no experience guarding someone on the perimeter.    When has Chris ever had to fight over the top of a screen?    He's just not used to that because the guys he normally guards aren't shooters.   Then, throw in his tendancy to think it's his job to give help in the lane.... and you can see why that play developed as it did.

I'm sure this doesn't come as a surprise as I've been defending this standpoint for a while now....but in theory I liked the assignment.  If CO doesn't drift into the paint, McDermott gets the ball at the top of the key and would have had to put the ball on the floor.  Which is a much tougher shot than a catch and shoot. 

Maybe he still makes it off the dribble, and we still lose. 

Someone said after the play that this play was Lavin's fault for Obekpa being assigned to McDermott.  All I'm saying is, I don't think you can blame Lavin for the way this sequence played out. 

Fair enough

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 29, 2014, 12:17:14 AM

win that game and we were back on the bubble.

On the bubble? Good grief. We're on the bubble of Division II. We're 12-9 and 2-6 in conference. We're 3 and 6 in 2014. The phrase you're looking for is "we suck." We'll be lucky to make the NIT.

RPI in mid 70's before the game. A road win against the 20th best team in the country doesnt put us in the low 60's?

RPI in mid 70's before the game. A road win against the 20th best team in the country doesnt put us in the low 60's?

If you'd like to discuss whether this is an NCAA tournament team I'd be happy to.

Cant shoot foul shots, cant shoot 3's - this team has to work way too hard for its points. The lack of a pure shooter is such a detriment to this team.

That's it in a nutshell. We don't have enough shooters/pure scorers. It has nothing to do with the offense we run. We had wide open looks all night. No one wants to take the shot. That's what an offense is designed to do, get a good look at the basket, not a layup. Look at Creighton's offense, McD just made shots, that's the difference. Take him out and the rest of the team shot 38%, 28% from three.

the fact that you guys are even talking about the NCAA Tournament, Bubble or anything in that realm in the same sentence as this atrocious team is laughable

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 29, 2014, 12:17:14 AM

win that game and we were back on the bubble.

On the bubble? Good grief. We're on the bubble of Division II. We're 12-9 and 2-6 in conference. We're 3 and 6 in 2014. The phrase you're looking for is "we suck." We'll be lucky to make the NIT.

You are correct Sir.
I imagine they would they need to play above .500 over the last 10 games to make the NIT.     

Quote from: Foad on January 29, 2014, 09:58:58 AM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 29, 2014, 12:17:14 AM

win that game and we were back on the bubble.

On the bubble? Good grief. We're on the bubble of Division II. We're 12-9 and 2-6 in conference. We're 3 and 6 in 2014. The phrase you're looking for is "we suck." We'll be lucky to make the NIT.

You are correct Sir.
I imagine they would they need to play above .500 over the last 10 games to make the NIT.     

Relax Desco! Told General Petraeus meeting Lavin for lunch at Sly Fox tomorrow to discuss the "February Surge Plan".  Commences Saturday hopefully.

just rewatched that last shot. That wasn't a moving screen, it was a running screen.lol  Guy almost tackled CO. Great shot by McD but man we always find a new way to loose nightly .

Quote from: redslope on January 28, 2014, 11:39:45 PM

McDermott is "Mullinesque".  Can't wait to see him in person in the Garden.  Only thing good we can take out of this is now all the remaining games are in February and March when team is supposed to peak. 

Did you see Mullin play at St.John's?

YES--all four years and as a senior at XHS--both players have this very smooth; effortless way of shooting.  Both are not what someone would call great athletes but they are pure shooters who can hit from anywhere

Quote from: Foad on January 29, 2014, 09:58:58 AM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 29, 2014, 12:17:14 AM

win that game and we were back on the bubble.

On the bubble? Good grief. We're on the bubble of Division II. We're 12-9 and 2-6 in conference. We're 3 and 6 in 2014. The phrase you're looking for is "we suck." We'll be lucky to make the NIT.

You are correct Sir.
I imagine they would they need to play above .500 over the last 10 games to make the NIT.     

STJ will get to 8 conference wins before they get to 8 conference losses.

Quote from: desco80 on January 29, 2014, 10:38:14 AM

Quote from: Foad on January 29, 2014, 09:58:58 AM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 29, 2014, 12:17:14 AM

win that game and we were back on the bubble.

On the bubble? Good grief. We're on the bubble of Division II. We're 12-9 and 2-6 in conference. We're 3 and 6 in 2014. The phrase you're looking for is "we suck." We'll be lucky to make the NIT.

You are correct Sir.
I imagine they would they need to play above .500 over the last 10 games to make the NIT.     

STJ will get to 8 conference wins before they get to 8 conference losses.

   

Quote from: CC on January 29, 2014, 01:23:09 PM

Quote from: desco80 on January 29, 2014, 10:38:14 AM

Quote from: Foad on January 29, 2014, 09:58:58 AM

Quote from: Amaseinyourface2 on January 29, 2014, 12:17:14 AM

win that game and we were back on the bubble.

On the bubble? Good grief. We're on the bubble of Division II. We're 12-9 and 2-6 in conference. We're 3 and 6 in 2014. The phrase you're looking for is "we suck." We'll be lucky to make the NIT.

You are correct Sir.
I imagine they would they need to play above .500 over the last 10 games to make the NIT.     

STJ will get to 8 conference wins before they get to 8 conference losses.

   

I'm serious, you will see. They are going to rip off 6 in a row now.