Slice

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 05:17:44 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 05:00:40 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 04:20:28 PM

If these kids played baseball or hockey they'd already be in the minors.   Let them take their shot, if that's what they want.      The odds of any one guy making and sticking in the NBA are real slim anyway.
To each his own.   

In baseball  you have a choice. You can drafted then decide to sign (you know the offer from the team)  or go to school.
In basketball and football you don't have that choice

Understood, I don't think they vastly overestimate where they'll get drafted though.  The Harrisons are second round picks whether they come out this year or next year.
the scouts look for potential, not necessarily production.  They can be all americans next year and still be far behind Malik Newman and other more raw players.
Trey lyles averaged 8pts a game, and he'll be a top 10 pick. 

I think some kids used to overestimate where they would get drafted.  Omar Cook types.
But now, I think there are a lot of kids who are just done going to school, and are going to play basketball next year wherever they land.  Europe and the Dleague are viable options to these kids.

Kids need to look at big picture, a free Kentucky education and degree has value. Wait to you graduate and get drafted in second round or go to Europe then. In my book if you are not going to be a first round pick, stay in school for the free education.

Disagree. Basketball players have shelf lives. Each year they stay in school is a year of salary they will never get back. If you aren't going to improve your stock in college it makes no sense to stay. You can always go back and get your degree

Outside of the Harrisons they are all probably first round picks.

Outside of the Harrisons they are all probably first round picks.

Not Dakari

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 06:50:07 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 05:17:44 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 05:00:40 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 04:20:28 PM

If these kids played baseball or hockey they'd already be in the minors.   Let them take their shot, if that's what they want.      The odds of any one guy making and sticking in the NBA are real slim anyway.
To each his own.   

In baseball  you have a choice. You can drafted then decide to sign (you know the offer from the team)  or go to school.
In basketball and football you don't have that choice

Understood, I don't think they vastly overestimate where they'll get drafted though.  The Harrisons are second round picks whether they come out this year or next year.
the scouts look for potential, not necessarily production.  They can be all americans next year and still be far behind Malik Newman and other more raw players.
Trey lyles averaged 8pts a game, and he'll be a top 10 pick. 

I think some kids used to overestimate where they would get drafted.  Omar Cook types.
But now, I think there are a lot of kids who are just done going to school, and are going to play basketball next year wherever they land.  Europe and the Dleague are viable options to these kids.

Kids need to look at big picture, a free Kentucky education and degree has value. Wait to you graduate and get drafted in second round or go to Europe then. In my book if you are not going to be a first round pick, stay in school for the free education.

Disagree. Basketball players have shelf lives. Each year they stay in school is a year of salary they will never get back. If you aren't going to improve your stock in college it makes no sense to stay. You can always go back and get your degree

We will agree to disagree then

Do they really lose 100K by waiting to they are 22 years old?

Should Harrison have left after soph year just so he could jumpstart his European or Overseas career?



 

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 05:17:44 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 05:00:40 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 04:20:28 PM

If these kids played baseball or hockey they'd already be in the minors.   Let them take their shot, if that's what they want.      The odds of any one guy making and sticking in the NBA are real slim anyway.
To each his own.   

In baseball  you have a choice. You can drafted then decide to sign (you know the offer from the team)  or go to school.
In basketball and football you don't have that choice

Understood, I don't think they vastly overestimate where they'll get drafted though.  The Harrisons are second round picks whether they come out this year or next year.
the scouts look for potential, not necessarily production.  They can be all americans next year and still be far behind Malik Newman and other more raw players.
Trey lyles averaged 8pts a game, and he'll be a top 10 pick. 

I think some kids used to overestimate where they would get drafted.  Omar Cook types.
But now, I think there are a lot of kids who are just done going to school, and are going to play basketball next year wherever they land.  Europe and the Dleague are viable options to these kids.

Kids need to look at big picture, a free Kentucky education and degree has value. Wait to you graduate and get drafted in second round or go to Europe then. In my book if you are not going to be a first round pick, stay in school for the free education.

"education and degree has value" - if you like being ranked 393rd in ROI (on Payscale.com's site - lol...but St. John's is 452)  Might as well go to Manhattan - 33rd on the list - strong....

Quote from: goredmen on April 09, 2015, 07:12:47 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 06:50:07 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 05:17:44 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 05:00:40 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 04:20:28 PM

If these kids played baseball or hockey they'd already be in the minors.   Let them take their shot, if that's what they want.      The odds of any one guy making and sticking in the NBA are real slim anyway.
To each his own.   

In baseball  you have a choice. You can drafted then decide to sign (you know the offer from the team)  or go to school.
In basketball and football you don't have that choice

Understood, I don't think they vastly overestimate where they'll get drafted though.  The Harrisons are second round picks whether they come out this year or next year.
the scouts look for potential, not necessarily production.  They can be all americans next year and still be far behind Malik Newman and other more raw players.
Trey lyles averaged 8pts a game, and he'll be a top 10 pick. 

I think some kids used to overestimate where they would get drafted.  Omar Cook types.
But now, I think there are a lot of kids who are just done going to school, and are going to play basketball next year wherever they land.  Europe and the Dleague are viable options to these kids.

Kids need to look at big picture, a free Kentucky education and degree has value. Wait to you graduate and get drafted in second round or go to Europe then. In my book if you are not going to be a first round pick, stay in school for the free education.

Disagree. Basketball players have shelf lives. Each year they stay in school is a year of salary they will never get back. If you aren't going to improve your stock in college it makes no sense to stay. You can always go back and get your degree

We will agree to disagree then

Do they really lose 100K by waiting to they are 22 years old?

Should Harrison have left after soph year just so he could jumpstart his European or Overseas career?



 

If you have peaked and the college game will not move you up draft boards then yes, they do lose 100K or whatever it is by staying in school.

Forget basketball for a minute. If you were offered a job after your sophomore year of college for 150K per year and that offer wouldn't get any better if you stayed in school for two more years, would you have stayed? I know I'd wave goodbye to school and take that money right away. Then add the fact that basketball players can only do that job until their mid-to late 30s (if they're lucky) and those years really count.

And yes, Harrison should have. His bank account is about 300K lighter because he stayed. He'll never get that 300K back

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 07:14:46 PM

Quote from: goredmen on April 09, 2015, 07:12:47 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 06:50:07 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 05:17:44 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 05:00:40 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 04:20:28 PM

If these kids played baseball or hockey they'd already be in the minors.   Let them take their shot, if that's what they want.      The odds of any one guy making and sticking in the NBA are real slim anyway.
To each his own.   

In baseball  you have a choice. You can drafted then decide to sign (you know the offer from the team)  or go to school.
In basketball and football you don't have that choice

Understood, I don't think they vastly overestimate where they'll get drafted though.  The Harrisons are second round picks whether they come out this year or next year.
the scouts look for potential, not necessarily production.  They can be all americans next year and still be far behind Malik Newman and other more raw players.
Trey lyles averaged 8pts a game, and he'll be a top 10 pick. 

I think some kids used to overestimate where they would get drafted.  Omar Cook types.
But now, I think there are a lot of kids who are just done going to school, and are going to play basketball next year wherever they land.  Europe and the Dleague are viable options to these kids.

Kids need to look at big picture, a free Kentucky education and degree has value. Wait to you graduate and get drafted in second round or go to Europe then. In my book if you are not going to be a first round pick, stay in school for the free education.

Disagree. Basketball players have shelf lives. Each year they stay in school is a year of salary they will never get back. If you aren't going to improve your stock in college it makes no sense to stay. You can always go back and get your degree

We will agree to disagree then

Do they really lose 100K by waiting to they are 22 years old?

Should Harrison have left after soph year just so he could jumpstart his European or Overseas career?



 

If you have peaked and the college game will not move you up draft boards then yes, they do lose 100K or whatever it is by staying in school.

Forget basketball for a minute. If you were offered a job after your sophomore year of college for 150K per year and that offer wouldn't get any better if you stayed in school for two more years, would you have stayed? I know I'd wave goodbye to school and take that money right away. Then add the fact that basketball players can only do that job until their mid-to late 30s (if they're lucky) and those years really count.

And yes, Harrison should have. His bank account is about 300K lighter because he stayed. He'll never get that 300K back

However, there is evidence that shows the players who leave early only have so many years on their body playing in the NBA.  So it can be countered that they're going to play just as long in the NBA, just that they'll retire a few years older in many cases. 


This analysis started by looking at KG and other players leaving right from HS.  Despite LeBron being so strong and having terrific health on the court thus far, I think he'll break down by 37-38, retire, and not make into 40s like some other HOF stars. 

Quote from: goredmen on April 09, 2015, 07:12:47 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 06:50:07 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 05:17:44 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 05:00:40 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 04:20:28 PM

If these kids played baseball or hockey they'd already be in the minors.   Let them take their shot, if that's what they want.      The odds of any one guy making and sticking in the NBA are real slim anyway.
To each his own.   

In baseball  you have a choice. You can drafted then decide to sign (you know the offer from the team)  or go to school.
In basketball and football you don't have that choice

Understood, I don't think they vastly overestimate where they'll get drafted though.  The Harrisons are second round picks whether they come out this year or next year.
the scouts look for potential, not necessarily production.  They can be all americans next year and still be far behind Malik Newman and other more raw players.
Trey lyles averaged 8pts a game, and he'll be a top 10 pick. 

I think some kids used to overestimate where they would get drafted.  Omar Cook types.
But now, I think there are a lot of kids who are just done going to school, and are going to play basketball next year wherever they land.  Europe and the Dleague are viable options to these kids.

Kids need to look at big picture, a free Kentucky education and degree has value. Wait to you graduate and get drafted in second round or go to Europe then. In my book if you are not going to be a first round pick, stay in school for the free education.

Disagree. Basketball players have shelf lives. Each year they stay in school is a year of salary they will never get back. If you aren't going to improve your stock in college it makes no sense to stay. You can always go back and get your degree

We will agree to disagree then

Do they really lose 100K by waiting to they are 22 years old?

Should Harrison have left after soph year just so he could jumpstart his European or Overseas career?



 

Well, this is the point where being an NBA fan kicks in.  As a Knicks fan, you have to be happy with the fact that you might get a very good player in the 2nd round or as an unsigned free agent.  For the Knicks, if they get 3 rookies out of this draft & 2 from Kentucky (Towns, Harrison), I would be very enthused.

As a St Johns fan, it is frustrating bc we are vying for the same big men that UK is, and now they can also offer playing time. 

As for the financial side for the kid, it depends.  We all think, except that nice person Brandon Tierney, that Jordan can make more money staying in school this year, than winding up in the D-League.  Not true for Towns or Okeafor.  Depends.  If you are definitely a 1st round pick, you probably have to go.  If you are a lottery pick, you also have to go.  For more marginal players, it's different.

Damn.  I was complaining to myself all day about the lack of topic info appearing on this thread.  Then I added to it.  LOL.  Sorry.

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 07:14:46 PM

Quote from: goredmen on April 09, 2015, 07:12:47 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 06:50:07 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 05:17:44 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 05:00:40 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 04:20:28 PM

If these kids played baseball or hockey they'd already be in the minors.   Let them take their shot, if that's what they want.      The odds of any one guy making and sticking in the NBA are real slim anyway.
To each his own.   

In baseball  you have a choice. You can drafted then decide to sign (you know the offer from the team)  or go to school.
In basketball and football you don't have that choice

Understood, I don't think they vastly overestimate where they'll get drafted though.  The Harrisons are second round picks whether they come out this year or next year.
the scouts look for potential, not necessarily production.  They can be all americans next year and still be far behind Malik Newman and other more raw players.
Trey lyles averaged 8pts a game, and he'll be a top 10 pick. 

I think some kids used to overestimate where they would get drafted.  Omar Cook types.
But now, I think there are a lot of kids who are just done going to school, and are going to play basketball next year wherever they land.  Europe and the Dleague are viable options to these kids.

Kids need to look at big picture, a free Kentucky education and degree has value. Wait to you graduate and get drafted in second round or go to Europe then. In my book if you are not going to be a first round pick, stay in school for the free education.

Disagree. Basketball players have shelf lives. Each year they stay in school is a year of salary they will never get back. If you aren't going to improve your stock in college it makes no sense to stay. You can always go back and get your degree

We will agree to disagree then

Do they really lose 100K by waiting to they are 22 years old?

Should Harrison have left after soph year just so he could jumpstart his European or Overseas career?



 

If you have peaked and the college game will not move you up draft boards then yes, they do lose 100K or whatever it is by staying in school.

Forget basketball for a minute. If you were offered a job after your sophomore year of college for 150K per year and that offer wouldn't get any better if you stayed in school for two more years, would you have stayed? I know I'd wave goodbye to school and take that money right away. Then add the fact that basketball players can only do that job until their mid-to late 30s (if they're lucky) and those years really count.

And yes, Harrison should have. His bank account is about 300K lighter because he stayed. He'll never get that 300K back

Who's to say he didnt increase his pay by more than 300K by staying those two years? That is my opinion on the matter. Of course players can get better while being out of college, and get paid at that too. But a HUGE factor of making a career in the league is how high a priority you are. If you are drafted 20th in the first round the team selecting you will have more patience and put more resources into building you as a player as opposed if you were their second round pick. Same applies to second round pick vs undrafted and lottery vs late first.  Harkless, for example, got his millions and he got his dream, I salute him for that. But he would have been a top 5 pick if he stayed his sophomore year (See Otto Porter). Now talk about 300K hell never get back. More like 3 million.

Quote from: goredmen on April 09, 2015, 07:26:02 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 07:14:46 PM

Quote from: goredmen on April 09, 2015, 07:12:47 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 06:50:07 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 05:17:44 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 05:00:40 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 04:20:28 PM

If these kids played baseball or hockey they'd already be in the minors.   Let them take their shot, if that's what they want.      The odds of any one guy making and sticking in the NBA are real slim anyway.
To each his own.   

In baseball  you have a choice. You can drafted then decide to sign (you know the offer from the team)  or go to school.
In basketball and football you don't have that choice

Understood, I don't think they vastly overestimate where they'll get drafted though.  The Harrisons are second round picks whether they come out this year or next year.
the scouts look for potential, not necessarily production.  They can be all americans next year and still be far behind Malik Newman and other more raw players.
Trey lyles averaged 8pts a game, and he'll be a top 10 pick. 

I think some kids used to overestimate where they would get drafted.  Omar Cook types.
But now, I think there are a lot of kids who are just done going to school, and are going to play basketball next year wherever they land.  Europe and the Dleague are viable options to these kids.

Kids need to look at big picture, a free Kentucky education and degree has value. Wait to you graduate and get drafted in second round or go to Europe then. In my book if you are not going to be a first round pick, stay in school for the free education.

Disagree. Basketball players have shelf lives. Each year they stay in school is a year of salary they will never get back. If you aren't going to improve your stock in college it makes no sense to stay. You can always go back and get your degree

We will agree to disagree then

Do they really lose 100K by waiting to they are 22 years old?

Should Harrison have left after soph year just so he could jumpstart his European or Overseas career?



 

If you have peaked and the college game will not move you up draft boards then yes, they do lose 100K or whatever it is by staying in school.

Forget basketball for a minute. If you were offered a job after your sophomore year of college for 150K per year and that offer wouldn't get any better if you stayed in school for two more years, would you have stayed? I know I'd wave goodbye to school and take that money right away. Then add the fact that basketball players can only do that job until their mid-to late 30s (if they're lucky) and those years really count.

And yes, Harrison should have. His bank account is about 300K lighter because he stayed. He'll never get that 300K back

Who's to say he didnt increase his pay by more than 300K by staying those two years? That is my opinion on the matter. Of course players can get better while being out of college, and get paid at that too. But a HUGE factor of making a career in the league is how high a priority you are. If you are drafted 20th in the first round the team selecting you will have more patience and put more resources into building you as a player as opposed if you were their second round pick. Same applies to second round pick vs undrafted and lottery vs late first.  Harkless, for example, got his millions and he got his dream, I salute him for that. But he would have been a top 5 pick if he stayed his sophomore year (See Otto Porter). Now talk about 300K hell never get back. More like 3 million.

Yes, I agree that if there is a chance a player can increase his draft stock then it would make sense to stay in college for another year. However, it is my opinion that the Harrison twins will not get better by staying another year in college and that is the driving factor behind my argument

This is a great thread about Slice.

This has gotten far afield from slice, but you also have to consider that NBA teams expect you to improve with another year in school.  Trey Lyles is being drafted for the player they think he will be, not who he is now.
The challenge for somebody like rysheed, is to return to school and improve more than everybody expects him to.

This is a great thread about Slice.

In Maher's world its a thread about pizza

Quote from: jregina22 on April 09, 2015, 07:54:58 PM

This is a great thread about Slice.

In Maher's world its a thread about pizza

leave me out of this. I don't think I've posted once on this thread

Hearing it may not be official until next week.

Now back to Slice on this Slice Thread, formerly known as the UK Team going Pro Thread!

This is getting interesting, and more than a bit humorous. 

First we heard that Coach R.'s wife wanted to be in NYC, Pittsburg, or staying in KY.

Now we hear on the other site that Coach R.'s fiancée is turning in her loaner car.

I am now anxiously waiting to read what Coach R.'s mistress (Boo!), dog walker and barber are planning on doing before casting my vote as to whether Coach R. is joining our coaching staff.

Such is life in the fast lane of JJ Threads.

Quote from: goredmen on April 09, 2015, 07:26:02 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 07:14:46 PM

Quote from: goredmen on April 09, 2015, 07:12:47 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 06:50:07 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 05:17:44 PM

Quote from: sju89tr on April 09, 2015, 05:00:40 PM

Quote from: desco80 on April 09, 2015, 04:20:28 PM

If these kids played baseball or hockey they'd already be in the minors.   Let them take their shot, if that's what they want.      The odds of any one guy making and sticking in the NBA are real slim anyway.
To each his own.   

In baseball  you have a choice. You can drafted then decide to sign (you know the offer from the team)  or go to school.
In basketball and football you don't have that choice

Understood, I don't think they vastly overestimate where they'll get drafted though.  The Harrisons are second round picks whether they come out this year or next year.
the scouts look for potential, not necessarily production.  They can be all americans next year and still be far behind Malik Newman and other more raw players.
Trey lyles averaged 8pts a game, and he'll be a top 10 pick. 

I think some kids used to overestimate where they would get drafted.  Omar Cook types.
But now, I think there are a lot of kids who are just done going to school, and are going to play basketball next year wherever they land.  Europe and the Dleague are viable options to these kids.

Kids need to look at big picture, a free Kentucky education and degree has value. Wait to you graduate and get drafted in second round or go to Europe then. In my book if you are not going to be a first round pick, stay in school for the free education.

Disagree. Basketball players have shelf lives. Each year they stay in school is a year of salary they will never get back. If you aren't going to improve your stock in college it makes no sense to stay. You can always go back and get your degree

We will agree to disagree then

Do they really lose 100K by waiting to they are 22 years old?

Should Harrison have left after soph year just so he could jumpstart his European or Overseas career?



 

If you have peaked and the college game will not move you up draft boards then yes, they do lose 100K or whatever it is by staying in school.

Forget basketball for a minute. If you were offered a job after your sophomore year of college for 150K per year and that offer wouldn't get any better if you stayed in school for two more years, would you have stayed? I know I'd wave goodbye to school and take that money right away. Then add the fact that basketball players can only do that job until their mid-to late 30s (if they're lucky) and those years really count.

And yes, Harrison should have. His bank account is about 300K lighter because he stayed. He'll never get that 300K back

Who's to say he didnt increase his pay by more than 300K by staying those two years? That is my opinion on the matter. Of course players can get better while being out of college, and get paid at that too. But a HUGE factor of making a career in the league is how high a priority you are. If you are drafted 20th in the first round the team selecting you will have more patience and put more resources into building you as a player as opposed if you were their second round pick. Same applies to second round pick vs undrafted and lottery vs late first.  Harkless, for example, got his millions and he got his dream, I salute him for that. But he would have been a top 5 pick if he stayed his sophomore year (See Otto Porter). Now talk about 300K hell never get back. More like 3 million.

That is correct. As long as the players up their insurance policies for injury, they should be better off.  In your example, Moe actually missed out on almost 4.3 MIL.


Even worst case scenario and he goes 10th instead of 5th the next year.  Moe would have broken even.  So it's a bit more complicated than your example, since there weren't any guarantees Moe would have gone 5th.


Additionally, as my dad taught me when I frist set foot on a golf course to caddy at age 13, it's not how much you make if you spend all you make every year.  If Moe has the right advisors around him, we hopefully won't  see him on a 30 for 30 "Broke, Part II."

I think no sightings of Slice tonight out watching for KY means we have him.....probably,

I think no sightings of Slice tonight out watching for KY means we have him.....probably,

I love this KSR photo and their comments as always make me cringe - some reasonable comments this time


http://kentuckysportsradio.com/basketball-2/is-it-time-to-say-goodbye-to-slice/