St. Thomas Aquinas Game Thread

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 06, 2015, 03:44:55 PM

Quote from: Foad on November 06, 2015, 03:34:52 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 06, 2015, 12:25:37 PM

It's unfortunate, but it's not Lavin's fault we're this bad. Had Lavin been kept you can't speculate the recruiting he would have done. You can't even rule out the possibility we land Diallo. We also had a top 40 guard signed up who is better than anyone Mullin has landed so far. So stop with the "left the cupboard bare" nonsense. He didn't choose to be fired. You're looking for someone to blame, I get it, and it's not fair to blame Mullin, but you signed up for this when you fired Lavin.

So to recap: it's not fair to blame Lavin because "you can't speculate" about the recruiting he might have done, although it's entirely possible "we land Diallo," which sounds surprisingly like speculation, which you can't do. And also the guy you've never seen play who didn't come here is better than the guy you've never seen play who did. And also leaving Mullin with three players, one of whom is Albivivoivh,  means the cupboard is not bare.

tldr: LOL.

PS I'm not looking to blame anyone. I have no doubt Mullin is going to do great in the long term and in the short IDGAF about some stupid exhibition game. Because I'm not, you know, a big girl's blouse. I don't even GAF about this entire year. They're going to stink. They'll probably even  stink next year. My only purpose here is to point out that Lavin sucked at coaching and was a reprehensible awful dung heap of a human being and that we fans, the university, college basketball, and the great state of New York are well rid of him.

I just said you can't rule out the possibility. And yes, Brandon Sampson is a higher rated recruit than anyone Mullin has landed. That is a fact.

Is he higher rated than Ponds?

247 composite had Sampson at 56 for 2015. They have ponds at 54 for 2016.   It is reasonable to think that if Sampson had stayed committed Ponds would not be committed to us.  If the question is Ponds or Sampson, ill take Ponds.

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 06, 2015, 03:44:55 PM

Quote from: Foad on November 06, 2015, 03:34:52 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 06, 2015, 12:25:37 PM

It's unfortunate, but it's not Lavin's fault we're this bad. Had Lavin been kept you can't speculate the recruiting he would have done. You can't even rule out the possibility we land Diallo. We also had a top 40 guard signed up who is better than anyone Mullin has landed so far. So stop with the "left the cupboard bare" nonsense. He didn't choose to be fired. You're looking for someone to blame, I get it, and it's not fair to blame Mullin, but you signed up for this when you fired Lavin.

So to recap: it's not fair to blame Lavin because "you can't speculate" about the recruiting he might have done, although it's entirely possible "we land Diallo," which sounds surprisingly like speculation, which you can't do. And also the guy you've never seen play who didn't come here is better than the guy you've never seen play who did. And also leaving Mullin with three players, one of whom is Albivivoivh,  means the cupboard is not bare.

tldr: LOL.

PS I'm not looking to blame anyone. I have no doubt Mullin is going to do great in the long term and in the short IDGAF about some stupid exhibition game. Because I'm not, you know, a big girl's blouse. I don't even GAF about this entire year. They're going to stink. They'll probably even  stink next year. My only purpose here is to point out that Lavin sucked at coaching and was a reprehensible awful dung heap of a human being and that we fans, the university, college basketball, and the great state of New York are well rid of him.

I just said you can't rule out the possibility. And yes, Brandon Sampson is a higher rated recruit than anyone Mullin has landed. That is a fact.

Is he higher rated than Ponds?

They are rated about the same, but I was more talking about the team this season. I'm optimistic about the future under Mullin, I'm just astounded people are trying to claim it's Lavin's fault we are going to be horrendous this year.

I guess it's to be expected with this fan base but man, let's get a reality check here. Lavin didn't walk away from the program, he was fired. He had a decent core group in place (Obekpa, Sampson, Balamou, Rysheed? and in decent shape for Diallo, Mussini, Lovett, etc, with a whole lot of recruiting time left). The team would look a lot better (this season) with Lavin still at the helm. We wouldn't lose a scrimmage by 30 pts to St Thomas Aquinas, that's for sure.

Quote from: ras on November 06, 2015, 04:17:17 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 06, 2015, 03:44:55 PM

Quote from: Foad on November 06, 2015, 03:34:52 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 06, 2015, 12:25:37 PM

It's unfortunate, but it's not Lavin's fault we're this bad. Had Lavin been kept you can't speculate the recruiting he would have done. You can't even rule out the possibility we land Diallo. We also had a top 40 guard signed up who is better than anyone Mullin has landed so far. So stop with the "left the cupboard bare" nonsense. He didn't choose to be fired. You're looking for someone to blame, I get it, and it's not fair to blame Mullin, but you signed up for this when you fired Lavin.

So to recap: it's not fair to blame Lavin because "you can't speculate" about the recruiting he might have done, although it's entirely possible "we land Diallo," which sounds surprisingly like speculation, which you can't do. And also the guy you've never seen play who didn't come here is better than the guy you've never seen play who did. And also leaving Mullin with three players, one of whom is Albivivoivh,  means the cupboard is not bare.

tldr: LOL.

PS I'm not looking to blame anyone. I have no doubt Mullin is going to do great in the long term and in the short IDGAF about some stupid exhibition game. Because I'm not, you know, a big girl's blouse. I don't even GAF about this entire year. They're going to stink. They'll probably even  stink next year. My only purpose here is to point out that Lavin sucked at coaching and was a reprehensible awful dung heap of a human being and that we fans, the university, college basketball, and the great state of New York are well rid of him.

I just said you can't rule out the possibility. And yes, Brandon Sampson is a higher rated recruit than anyone Mullin has landed. That is a fact.

Is he higher rated than Ponds?

They are rated about the same, but I was more talking about the team this season. I'm optimistic about the future under Mullin, I'm just astounded people are trying to claim it's Lavin's fault we are going to be horrendous this year.

I guess it's to be expected with this fan base but man, let's get a reality check here. Lavin didn't walk away from the program, he was fired. He had a decent core group in place (Obekpa, Sampson, Balamou, Rysheed? and in decent shape for Diallo, Mussini, Lovett, etc, with a whole lot of recruiting time left). The team would look a lot better (this season) with Lavin still at the helm. We wouldn't lose a scrimmage by 30 pts to St Thomas Aquinas, that's for sure.

agreed, the real issue with lavin's recruiting was that he failed to recruit another quality big (and then failed to get thomas cleared) two years ago after both harkless and sampson declared early.  that would have totally changed the the senior laden team's chances.

He really didn't leave the cupboard that bare.  Obviously would have been a rebuilding year, even with lavin, but he had some pieces in place, and probably would have added another top-100 player in addition to the guys that de-commited when mullin was hired, because he has always recruited some good players.

instead, mullin is faced with rebuilding, and maybe this is a good thing, because he'll get to bring in guys that fit his style of play, and I'm sure the quality of recruit will improve from what was on the floor this week.

Agree with red storm 212. Also every St. John's fan was overjoyed that Mullin was hired. I am not off the bandwagon yet. but I am not as excited.

I don't know what people are talking about.  He absolutely left the cupboard bare.  Rysheed failed out so can't count him.  We were left with Christian Jones, Alibegovic and Balamou.  Obekpa dropped out himself, he wasn't booted.  He couldn't handle discipline so he finally parted ways but he wasn't going to be scoring any points for us. He also screwed up our season last year in case people don't remember.  We had only a verbal from Sampson and some other low tier guys.  Cupboard was as bare as it gets. 

Without hypotheticals, he left us with only Balamou, Jones and Ali, who have a combined basketball production of next to nil.  That's as bare as it gets.  Couple that with the fact that Mullin and Co. came on board after most all recruits were already signed.

The team would look a lot better (this season) with Lavin still at the helm. We wouldn't lose a scrimmage by 30 pts to St Thomas Aquinas, that's for sure.

The team would not look a lot better, because Lavin would still be coaching. And he stinks. He proved that he can win with seniors, aka players who don't need to be coached. See also Davis, Baron. All you'd be hearing this year is how young the team is and how they're taking baby steps up the hill towards the hammer which was about to be hitting the rock. It's your prerogative to GAF about "a scrimmage." But a scrimmage is defined as " simulated game." As such it has no meaning.

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 06, 2015, 04:32:54 PM

The team would look a lot better (this season) with Lavin still at the helm. We wouldn't lose a scrimmage by 30 pts to St Thomas Aquinas, that's for sure.

The team would not look a lot better, because Lavin would still be coaching. And he stinks. He proved that he can win with seniors, aka players who don't need to be coached. See also Davis, Baron. All you'd be hearing this year is how young the team is and how they're taking baby steps up the hill towards the hammer which was about to be hitting the rock. It's your prerogative to GAF about "a scrimmage." But a scrimmage is defined as " simulated game." As such it has no meaning.

You must not have watched the game.

I don't know what people are talking about.  He absolutely left the cupboard bare.  Rysheed failed out so can't count him.  We were left with Christian Jones, Alibegovic and Balamou.  Obekpa dropped out himself, he wasn't booted.  He couldn't handle discipline so he finally parted ways but he wasn't going to be scoring any points for us. He also screwed up our season last year in case people don't remember.  We had only a verbal from Sampson and some other low tier guys.  Cupboard was as bare as it gets. 

Without hypotheticals, he left us with only Balamou, Jones and Ali, who have a combined basketball production of next to nil.  That's as bare as it gets.  Couple that with the fact that Mullin and Co. came on board after most all recruits were already signed.

You're just assuming he wouldn't recruit anyone else. That's extremely unfair to Lavin, but hey I guess we have to have a scapegoat.

Quote from: Foad on November 06, 2015, 05:07:59 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 06, 2015, 04:32:54 PM

The team would look a lot better (this season) with Lavin still at the helm. We wouldn't lose a scrimmage by 30 pts to St Thomas Aquinas, that's for sure.

The team would not look a lot better, because Lavin would still be coaching. And he stinks. He proved that he can win with seniors, aka players who don't need to be coached. See also Davis, Baron. All you'd be hearing this year is how young the team is and how they're taking baby steps up the hill towards the hammer which was about to be hitting the rock. It's your prerogative to GAF about "a scrimmage." But a scrimmage is defined as " simulated game." As such it has no meaning.

You must not have watched the game.

I watched the the first exhibition game coached by Coach Mullin and his 11 new players. And I consider it meaningless relative to the long term success of a program that is infinitely well off as opposed to where it would have been if the repulsive proven loser Steve Lavin were still coaching. Of course as a Lavin toady, YMMV.

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 06, 2015, 05:24:18 PM

Quote from: Foad on November 06, 2015, 05:07:59 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 06, 2015, 04:32:54 PM

The team would look a lot better (this season) with Lavin still at the helm. We wouldn't lose a scrimmage by 30 pts to St Thomas Aquinas, that's for sure.

The team would not look a lot better, because Lavin would still be coaching. And he stinks. He proved that he can win with seniors, aka players who don't need to be coached. See also Davis, Baron. All you'd be hearing this year is how young the team is and how they're taking baby steps up the hill towards the hammer which was about to be hitting the rock. It's your prerogative to GAF about "a scrimmage." But a scrimmage is defined as " simulated game." As such it has no meaning.

You must not have watched the game.

I watched the the first exhibition game coached by Coach Mullin and his 11 new players. And I consider it meaningless relative to the long term success of a program that is infinitely well off as opposed to where it would have been if the repulsive proven loser Steve Lavin were still coaching. Of course as a Lavin toady, YMMV.

I was only talking about this season. Long term I agree we are in good shape. But this is going to be a rough season.

Quote from: ras on November 06, 2015, 04:17:17 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 06, 2015, 03:44:55 PM

Quote from: Foad on November 06, 2015, 03:34:52 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 06, 2015, 12:25:37 PM

It's unfortunate, but it's not Lavin's fault we're this bad. Had Lavin been kept you can't speculate the recruiting he would have done. You can't even rule out the possibility we land Diallo. We also had a top 40 guard signed up who is better than anyone Mullin has landed so far. So stop with the "left the cupboard bare" nonsense. He didn't choose to be fired. You're looking for someone to blame, I get it, and it's not fair to blame Mullin, but you signed up for this when you fired Lavin.

So to recap: it's not fair to blame Lavin because "you can't speculate" about the recruiting he might have done, although it's entirely possible "we land Diallo," which sounds surprisingly like speculation, which you can't do. And also the guy you've never seen play who didn't come here is better than the guy you've never seen play who did. And also leaving Mullin with three players, one of whom is Albivivoivh,  means the cupboard is not bare.

tldr: LOL.

PS I'm not looking to blame anyone. I have no doubt Mullin is going to do great in the long term and in the short IDGAF about some stupid exhibition game. Because I'm not, you know, a big girl's blouse. I don't even GAF about this entire year. They're going to stink. They'll probably even  stink next year. My only purpose here is to point out that Lavin sucked at coaching and was a reprehensible awful dung heap of a human being and that we fans, the university, college basketball, and the great state of New York are well rid of him.

I just said you can't rule out the possibility. And yes, Brandon Sampson is a higher rated recruit than anyone Mullin has landed. That is a fact.

Is he higher rated than Ponds?

247 composite had Sampson at 56 for 2015. They have ponds at 54 for 2016.   It is reasonable to think that if Sampson had stayed committed Ponds would not be committed to us.  If the question is Ponds or Sampson, ill take Ponds.

You know I am the biggest Ponds fan out there, but give me Sampson if I had to choose. 

As for this Lavin and Mullin argument, it's not fair to assume what Lavin's roster would have looked like.  Doughty and Sampson both look fantastic right now and are getting rave reviews.  He was involved with Mussini and I'd bet anything that headache Jordan would still be around if he didn't lose a month of being babysat.  Obekpa too. 

It's equally unfair to judge Mullin on his first season after he scrambled to put together a staff and roster, and it's just insane to judge him after one exhibition two weeks after the first practice.  Get it together, guys.  Jesus.

Let's change the rhetoric to one that everyone will agree with, and leave out TGAPL:

The cupboard was left bare for Coach Mullin.   I don't think ANYONE here blames Mullin for Rysheed's disappearing + failing act, nor for requiring his players to be committed and disciplined which resulted in Obekpa leaving of his own volition.

If no one blames Mullin for that, let's try this one:  Does anyone blame Mullin for losing Brandon Sampson?  By all accounts, he tried his darndest to keep him and just nearly did.  I dont think anyone legitimately could blame Mullin for that either.

So if you dont blame Mullin for the departures of Rysheed and Obekpa nor Sampson's decommittment, we have what left to blame Mullin for:  losing Doughty and Randle?  If that's all we're blaming him for, let's cut the guy some slack, and let's also wait to see if Lovett qualifies.  If he does, I have a feeling we wont be hearing the names Doughty and Randle ever again here....

Even the most ardent Lavin supporter should be able to agree that Mullin should be blame free from those losses, even when they also believe Lavin is blame free for leaving the cupboard bare.

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 06, 2015, 05:24:18 PM

Quote from: Foad on November 06, 2015, 05:07:59 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 06, 2015, 04:32:54 PM

The team would look a lot better (this season) with Lavin still at the helm. We wouldn't lose a scrimmage by 30 pts to St Thomas Aquinas, that's for sure.

The team would not look a lot better, because Lavin would still be coaching. And he stinks. He proved that he can win with seniors, aka players who don't need to be coached. See also Davis, Baron. All you'd be hearing this year is how young the team is and how they're taking baby steps up the hill towards the hammer which was about to be hitting the rock. It's your prerogative to GAF about "a scrimmage." But a scrimmage is defined as " simulated game." As such it has no meaning.

You must not have watched the game.

I watched the the first exhibition game coached by Coach Mullin and his 11 new players. And I consider it meaningless relative to the long term success of a program that is infinitely well off as opposed to where it would have been if the repulsive proven loser Steve Lavin were still coaching. Of course as a Lavin toady, YMMV.

What have you seen that makes you think we're better off with Mullin than Lavin? We have played one exhibition game, and the biggest take away is the players look like the worst team to ever take the floor for St.John's.

Let's change the rhetoric to one that everyone will agree with, and leave out TGAPL:

The cupboard was left bare for Coach Mullin.   I don't think ANYONE here blames Mullin for Rysheed's disappearing + failing act, nor for requiring his players to be committed and disciplined which resulted in Obekpa leaving of his own volition.

If no one blames Mullin for that, let's try this one:  Does anyone blame Mullin for losing Brandon Sampson?  By all accounts, he tried his darndest to keep him and just nearly did.  I dont think anyone legitimately could blame Mullin for that either.

So if you dont blame Mullin for the departures of Rysheed and Obekpa nor Sampson's decommittment, we have what left to blame Mullin for:  losing Doughty and Randle?  If that's all we're blaming him for, let's cut the guy some slack, and let's also wait to see if Lovett qualifies.  If he does, I have a feeling we wont be hearing the names Doughty and Randle ever again here....

Even the most ardent Lavin supporter should be able to agree that Mullin should be blame free from those losses, even when they also believe Lavin is blame free for leaving the cupboard bare.

These arguments sound like f'n congress, polar opposites bitching & moaning. I'm waiting for someone to posit notion we would be better without Lavin (admittedly I did not like him) or Mullin. It is what it is. Support the current coach. If he falls flat on his face after three or four years, so be it. God knows we have experience with failure.

@KevinMcNamara33: At half its @RhodyMBB 48 StThomas Aquinas 38

Quote from: mullin85berry86 on November 05, 2015, 04:38:12 PM

Quote from: newsman13 on November 05, 2015, 08:44:14 AM

Agree PMG...It's games like this that make elite recruits wonder what they'd be getting into.  This was bad on so many levels.  I'm glad we got rid of the constant Lavin drama and the LaLa land approach...but.

BUT WHAT???

Are you trying to say that this year is on Mullin? Nah this shit on on LAVIN. Norm gave Lav 10 seniors, wtf did Lav give Mullin? 3 bench players from last year.  So it is what it is this year.
Not that Lavin gives a rats ass since he has a nice job now at FoxSports

Lavin left 2 guys that was would have been All Big East pre-season selections had they been able to keep them.

yeah and those two were head cases. Jordan acting like a b always wanting to go home every few weeks, and Obekpa F'ed us 2 years ago by not wanting to play in a BE tournament game, then was suspended for smoking pot and SD St. dominated the boards.
If I was Chris I wouldn't put up with that bs either.

Diallo probably would have come if Lavin was still here, instead of KU? lol. yeah ok.

Finally, Lavin couldn't coach, and was a freaking lazy recruiter. So I'm glad Mullin is here over Lavin, he won't ever be a lazy recruiter.
As for coaching, he's learning on the job, how was Lavin as coach?

@KevinMcNamara33: At half its @RhodyMBB 48 StThomas Aquinas 38

Saturday should be fun.

@CDiSano44: Will have an insider breakdown of this first taste of the 2015-16 URI Rams for @CoxHub soon. Final here: Rams 100, Aquinas 77.

What have you seen that makes you think we're better off with Mullin than Lavin? We have played one exhibition game, and the biggest take away is the players look like the worst team to ever take the floor for St.John's.

Re Mullin I haven't seen anything, because there's nothing that could have been seen. Because nothing has yet happened. He's 39 plus minutes into his coaching career and has not yet coached a regular season game. There is no there there. What I know of Mullin qua Mullin is that he has been successful at every level of basketball, in every aspect, from CYO to the NBA, over a period of 40 years. I expect that success will continue. What I know about Lavin is that he sucks at coaching and that he is vacuous, delusional histrionic narcissist. I know that he was handed the most successful sports dynasty in the history of sports at UCLA - more successful even than your dopey Yankees - and turned it to shit in half a dozen years. And then when he was given a second chance to succeed in the most glorious and invigorating environment in the history of western civilization, he bungled that as well and wore a sweatsuit while he did it. That's what I've seen that makes me think we're better off and what I know deep in my bones, as ontological fact: Steve Lavin sucks.

Quote from: Poison on November 06, 2015, 06:28:58 PM

What have you seen that makes you think we're better off with Mullin than Lavin? We have played one exhibition game, and the biggest take away is the players look like the worst team to ever take the floor for St.John's.

Re Mullin I haven't seen anything, because there's nothing that could have been seen. Because nothing has yet happened. He's 39 plus minutes into his coaching career and has not yet coached a regular season game. There is no there there. What I know of Mullin qua Mullin is that he has been successful at every level of basketball, in every aspect, from CYO to the NBA, over a period of 40 years. I expect that success will continue. What I know about Lavin is that he sucks at coaching and that he is vacuous, delusional histrionic narcissist. I know that he was handed the most successful sports dynasty in the history of sports at UCLA - more successful even than your dopey Yankees - and turned it to shit in half a dozen years. And then when he was given a second chance to succeed in the most glorious and invigorating environment in the history of western civilization, he bungled that as well and wore a sweatsuit while he did it. That's what I've seen that makes me think we're better off and what I know deep in my bones, as ontological fact: Steve Lavin sucks.

Let's see how the season plays out.