Moe and the 2012 Draft

Quote from: shamsman2 on March 13, 2012, 03:37:44 PM

Quote from: TRabinowitz on March 13, 2012, 03:08:46 PM

I agree that if he came back another year he'd be a higher pick, get a bigger first contract which could lead to a bigger second contract.  I am in total agreement on that.

HOWEVER, when you grow up in the economic situation and family situation he is in, it is in no way shape or form a "no brainer" to risk losing everything to come back another year.  At the very least its a very hard decision either way.  Don't try telling a guy or his family that sticking it out in poverty another year when theres that much money on the table is a "no brainer".  That's almost an insult to reality. 

And is he as strong as he should be?? No.  Does his jump shot need work?? Yes.  But since when were there not weight rooms and strength coaches in NBA practice facilities?? Since when were there not coaches in the NBA that can work with a player on their jumpsuit?? These can all be fixed just as easily or even MORE easily in the NBA than in college (where dumb NCAA rules only allow a few hours of workouts with coaches per week in offseason). 

Do you get better playing or practicing? I agree on the skills training he will get at the next level, but can't imagine from what I saw this year that he will get much playing time next year if he goes. The money is the issue, and the security it can bring to his family. I believe it was in the Nerlens Noel story in the NY Times, that many kids who don't have extended careers, go through their money pretty quickly, I was surprised how fast. Easy for me to say, but believe another year would benefit him greatly as he matures both physically and mentally. Watching Brad Beal of U. of  Florida last Saturday, I can see him getting solid minutes right away, don't feel that way about Moe at all.

After reading Nate Blue's comments on Boeheim, I hope Moe has someone in his family more  mature and intelligent advising him. Thought Boeheim's advice was on the money for Moe. Either way it was a pleasure watching him this year.

Whoa. I'm not if you know Nate or not but I do. He speaks his mind and his online persona may come across poorly to some but he knows what he's doing. He's very smart when it comes to this stuff. Real recognize real! Nate can read situations very well. He's very loyal too and he has St. John's interest in mind. Just let things play out.

Trying to understand your side, but after the 4th or 5th tweet, I question that opinion. I wouldn't know Nate if he walked in the door, but the Boeheim quote was not that offensive, it was just an opinion. Nate was offensive, wouldn't you agree?

Quote from: shamsman2 on March 13, 2012, 03:37:44 PM

Quote from: TRabinowitz on March 13, 2012, 03:08:46 PM

I agree that if he came back another year he'd be a higher pick, get a bigger first contract which could lead to a bigger second contract.  I am in total agreement on that.

HOWEVER, when you grow up in the economic situation and family situation he is in, it is in no way shape or form a "no brainer" to risk losing everything to come back another year.  At the very least its a very hard decision either way.  Don't try telling a guy or his family that sticking it out in poverty another year when theres that much money on the table is a "no brainer".  That's almost an insult to reality. 

And is he as strong as he should be?? No.  Does his jump shot need work?? Yes.  But since when were there not weight rooms and strength coaches in NBA practice facilities?? Since when were there not coaches in the NBA that can work with a player on their jumpsuit?? These can all be fixed just as easily or even MORE easily in the NBA than in college (where dumb NCAA rules only allow a few hours of workouts with coaches per week in offseason). 

Do you get better playing or practicing? I agree on the skills training he will get at the next level, but can't imagine from what I saw this year that he will get much playing time next year if he goes. The money is the issue, and the security it can bring to his family. I believe it was in the Nerlens Noel story in the NY Times, that many kids who don't have extended careers, go through their money pretty quickly, I was surprised how fast. Easy for me to say, but believe another year would benefit him greatly as he matures both physically and mentally. Watching Brad Beal of U. of  Florida last Saturday, I can see him getting solid minutes right away, don't feel that way about Moe at all.

After reading Nate Blue's comments on Boeheim, I hope Moe has someone in his family more  mature and intelligent advising him. Thought Boeheim's advice was on the money for Moe. Either way it was a pleasure watching him this year.

Whoa. I'm not if you know Nate or not but I do. He speaks his mind and his online persona may come across poorly to some but he knows what he's doing. He's very smart when it comes to this stuff. Real recognize real! Nate can read situations very well. He's very loyal too and he has St. John's interest in mind. Just let things play out.

i read his posts all the time.  he definitely doesn't have a filter, but you can tell that he's a fan of sju.  and i think A LOT has to do with Lavin.  he's even given Dunlap props for how he's developed Moe.  i like Nate.  he keeps it real.

Quote from: Dave on March 13, 2012, 04:05:24 PM

Quote from: shamsman2 on March 13, 2012, 03:37:44 PM

Quote from: TRabinowitz on March 13, 2012, 03:08:46 PM

I agree that if he came back another year he'd be a higher pick, get a bigger first contract which could lead to a bigger second contract.  I am in total agreement on that.

HOWEVER, when you grow up in the economic situation and family situation he is in, it is in no way shape or form a "no brainer" to risk losing everything to come back another year.  At the very least its a very hard decision either way.  Don't try telling a guy or his family that sticking it out in poverty another year when theres that much money on the table is a "no brainer".  That's almost an insult to reality. 

And is he as strong as he should be?? No.  Does his jump shot need work?? Yes.  But since when were there not weight rooms and strength coaches in NBA practice facilities?? Since when were there not coaches in the NBA that can work with a player on their jumpsuit?? These can all be fixed just as easily or even MORE easily in the NBA than in college (where dumb NCAA rules only allow a few hours of workouts with coaches per week in offseason). 

Do you get better playing or practicing? I agree on the skills training he will get at the next level, but can't imagine from what I saw this year that he will get much playing time next year if he goes. The money is the issue, and the security it can bring to his family. I believe it was in the Nerlens Noel story in the NY Times, that many kids who don't have extended careers, go through their money pretty quickly, I was surprised how fast. Easy for me to say, but believe another year would benefit him greatly as he matures both physically and mentally. Watching Brad Beal of U. of  Florida last Saturday, I can see him getting solid minutes right away, don't feel that way about Moe at all.

After reading Nate Blue's comments on Boeheim, I hope Moe has someone in his family more  mature and intelligent advising him. Thought Boeheim's advice was on the money for Moe. Either way it was a pleasure watching him this year.

Whoa. I'm not if you know Nate or not but I do. He speaks his mind and his online persona may come across poorly to some but he knows what he's doing. He's very smart when it comes to this stuff. Real recognize real! Nate can read situations very well. He's very loyal too and he has St. John's interest in mind. Just let things play out.

Trying to understand your side, but after the 4th or 5th tweet, I question that opinion. I wouldn't know Nate if he walked in the door, but the Boeheim quote was not that offensive, it was just an opinion. Nate was offensive, wouldn't you agree?

No doubt Boeheim didn't say anything 'bad' per se.
But doesnt he have his own crap he should be concerning himself with.
Lavin isn't going to comment on Uconn or Cuse matters.

Quote from: shamsman2 on March 13, 2012, 04:18:53 PM

Quote from: Dave on March 13, 2012, 04:05:24 PM

Quote from: shamsman2 on March 13, 2012, 03:37:44 PM

Quote from: TRabinowitz on March 13, 2012, 03:08:46 PM

I agree that if he came back another year he'd be a higher pick, get a bigger first contract which could lead to a bigger second contract.  I am in total agreement on that.

HOWEVER, when you grow up in the economic situation and family situation he is in, it is in no way shape or form a "no brainer" to risk losing everything to come back another year.  At the very least its a very hard decision either way.  Don't try telling a guy or his family that sticking it out in poverty another year when theres that much money on the table is a "no brainer".  That's almost an insult to reality. 

And is he as strong as he should be?? No.  Does his jump shot need work?? Yes.  But since when were there not weight rooms and strength coaches in NBA practice facilities?? Since when were there not coaches in the NBA that can work with a player on their jumpsuit?? These can all be fixed just as easily or even MORE easily in the NBA than in college (where dumb NCAA rules only allow a few hours of workouts with coaches per week in offseason). 

Do you get better playing or practicing? I agree on the skills training he will get at the next level, but can't imagine from what I saw this year that he will get much playing time next year if he goes. The money is the issue, and the security it can bring to his family. I believe it was in the Nerlens Noel story in the NY Times, that many kids who don't have extended careers, go through their money pretty quickly, I was surprised how fast. Easy for me to say, but believe another year would benefit him greatly as he matures both physically and mentally. Watching Brad Beal of U. of  Florida last Saturday, I can see him getting solid minutes right away, don't feel that way about Moe at all.

After reading Nate Blue's comments on Boeheim, I hope Moe has someone in his family more  mature and intelligent advising him. Thought Boeheim's advice was on the money for Moe. Either way it was a pleasure watching him this year.

Whoa. I'm not if you know Nate or not but I do. He speaks his mind and his online persona may come across poorly to some but he knows what he's doing. He's very smart when it comes to this stuff. Real recognize real! Nate can read situations very well. He's very loyal too and he has St. John's interest in mind. Just let things play out.

Trying to understand your side, but after the 4th or 5th tweet, I question that opinion. I wouldn't know Nate if he walked in the door, but the Boeheim quote was not that offensive, it was just an opinion. Nate was offensive, wouldn't you agree?

No doubt Boeheim didn't say anything 'bad' per se.
But doesnt he have his own crap he should be concerning himself with.
Lavin isn't going to comment on Uconn or Cuse matters.

In fairness he was asked about it by Steve Serby in the Post as part of a larger interview.  I'm sorry I don't see anything particularly offensive in his quote.

More importantly what happened to the theory put forth by some that claimed that when rival coaches said good things about Norm Roberts that they were actually subliminally saying that they wanted SJU to keep Norm because he sucks and they would presumably benefit. 

Well wouldn't that apply here to?  In other words everybody agrees that SJU is STRONGER WITH Harkless then without him next year.  Why would Boeheim be urging him to stay at SJU to the detriment of those who have to play him next year including Syracuse?

Because it's a freebie to dumpt stuff into your opponent's yard and watch them have to clean it up.  Coach your own team you whining ______________________________.

Keep in mind if Boeheim answered that question by saying he thought Moe was definitely ready for the NBA and was wasting his time in college he would be accused of meddling in another school's business and perhaps indirectly trying to impact the decision of another school's player. 

Dont think boeheim said anything wrong. Maybe theres something else that we dont know about

Quote from: Moose on March 13, 2012, 04:22:47 PM

Quote from: shamsman2 on March 13, 2012, 04:18:53 PM

Quote from: Dave on March 13, 2012, 04:05:24 PM

Quote from: shamsman2 on March 13, 2012, 03:37:44 PM

Quote from: TRabinowitz on March 13, 2012, 03:08:46 PM

I agree that if he came back another year he'd be a higher pick, get a bigger first contract which could lead to a bigger second contract.  I am in total agreement on that.

HOWEVER, when you grow up in the economic situation and family situation he is in, it is in no way shape or form a "no brainer" to risk losing everything to come back another year.  At the very least its a very hard decision either way.  Don't try telling a guy or his family that sticking it out in poverty another year when theres that much money on the table is a "no brainer".  That's almost an insult to reality. 

And is he as strong as he should be?? No.  Does his jump shot need work?? Yes.  But since when were there not weight rooms and strength coaches in NBA practice facilities?? Since when were there not coaches in the NBA that can work with a player on their jumpsuit?? These can all be fixed just as easily or even MORE easily in the NBA than in college (where dumb NCAA rules only allow a few hours of workouts with coaches per week in offseason). 

Do you get better playing or practicing? I agree on the skills training he will get at the next level, but can't imagine from what I saw this year that he will get much playing time next year if he goes. The money is the issue, and the security it can bring to his family. I believe it was in the Nerlens Noel story in the NY Times, that many kids who don't have extended careers, go through their money pretty quickly, I was surprised how fast. Easy for me to say, but believe another year would benefit him greatly as he matures both physically and mentally. Watching Brad Beal of U. of  Florida last Saturday, I can see him getting solid minutes right away, don't feel that way about Moe at all.

After reading Nate Blue's comments on Boeheim, I hope Moe has someone in his family more  mature and intelligent advising him. Thought Boeheim's advice was on the money for Moe. Either way it was a pleasure watching him this year.

Whoa. I'm not if you know Nate or not but I do. He speaks his mind and his online persona may come across poorly to some but he knows what he's doing. He's very smart when it comes to this stuff. Real recognize real! Nate can read situations very well. He's very loyal too and he has St. John's interest in mind. Just let things play out.

Trying to understand your side, but after the 4th or 5th tweet, I question that opinion. I wouldn't know Nate if he walked in the door, but the Boeheim quote was not that offensive, it was just an opinion. Nate was offensive, wouldn't you agree?

No doubt Boeheim didn't say anything 'bad' per se.
But doesnt he have his own crap he should be concerning himself with.
Lavin isn't going to comment on Uconn or Cuse matters.

In fairness he was asked about it by Steve Serby in the Post as part of a larger interview.  I'm sorry I don't see anything particularly offensive in his quote.

More importantly what happened to the theory put forth by some that claimed that when rival coaches said good things about Norm Roberts that they were actually subliminally saying that they wanted SJU to keep Norm because he sucks and they would presumably benefit. 

Well wouldn't that apply here to?  In other words everybody agrees that SJU is STRONGER WITH Harkless then without him next year.  Why would Boeheim be urging him to stay at SJU to the detriment of those who have to play him next year including Syracuse?

I know that he was asked the question its not like he volunteered it.  But he can also decline to answer it.  I think it was a sit down and not post game presser where he would be 'on the spot'.  I said I didn't see anything offense at all either. He should mind his own business.  I don't know why he was even asked the question.  The shoe fits both ways as in him saying he should leave also.  Saying he should stay can also be interpreted as a put down.

You love bringing up the Norm Nice Guy theory.  Do I think coaches say good things about their bretheren yes.  Am I smart enough to interpret 'why' they are saying that, nope.

My issue is I don't think he should be commenting on other players and what they should or shouldnt do with the NBA Draft.  Call him a great player, loads of potential.  Leave it at that.  Thats my two cents.

I don't think the question of whether or not Boeheim was out of line is relevant.  Even if he was, what Blue said on Twitter was inappropriate. 

I recognize that some of the posters on these sites are kids themselves and think that personal attacks are ok when it doesn't pertain to SJU, but in the adult world that is not how one communicates.  Blue's tweets are particularly inappropriate given the gravity of some of his unsupported claims. 

Blue touts himself as an adviser and confident of these kids.  His tweets set a poor example and suggest an immaturity and lack of judgment.

Dave -- you credit Blue for speaking his mind, but there is a difference between speaking ones mind and speaking everything that comes to ones mind.  The first is an admirable character trait, the second is the mark of a fool.

I recognize that some of the posters on these sites are kids themselves and think that personal attacks are ok when it doesn't pertain to SJU, but in the adult world that is not how one communicates. 

Ohhh the good old age debate.

Who is Nate Blue?

Who is Nate Blue?

Jim Boeheim's ex brother in law.

Quote from: Poison on March 13, 2012, 06:57:01 PM

Who is Nate Blue?

Jim Boeheim's ex brother in law.

In all serious, what does Jim Boeheim know about the NBA? Outside of the 70 first round draft picks he's sent to the pros, nothing comes to mind that would lead me to believe he has Moe Harkless' best interests at heart.

The way Nate reacted to Boeheim's correct comments leads me to believe that he thinks Moe is ready for the NBA, and that doesn't bode well for his chances of staying here.

The way Nate reacted to Boeheim's correct comments leads me to believe that he thinks Moe is ready for the NBA, and that doesn't bode well for his chances of staying here.

Exactly back to Moe.....
I think if we can bring in some frontcourt help he could be convinced to come back.

The way Nate reacted to Boeheim's correct comments leads me to believe that he thinks Moe is ready for the NBA, and that doesn't bode well for his chances of staying here.

The way he reacted to Boeheim's comments leads me to believe that he has no business opening his mouth.

Quote from: redstorm212 on March 13, 2012, 07:27:10 PM

The way Nate reacted to Boeheim's correct comments leads me to believe that he thinks Moe is ready for the NBA, and that doesn't bode well for his chances of staying here.

Exactly back to Moe.....
I think if we can bring in some frontcourt help he could be convinced to come back.

Exactly!

Quote from: redstorm212 on March 13, 2012, 07:27:10 PM

The way Nate reacted to Boeheim's correct comments leads me to believe that he thinks Moe is ready for the NBA, and that doesn't bode well for his chances of staying here.

The way he reacted to Boeheim's comments leads me to believe that he has no business opening his mouth.

How is his 'reaction' in a public forum any different than the same exact thing people do here by posting away on a message board?

Quote from: Poison on March 13, 2012, 07:40:13 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on March 13, 2012, 07:27:10 PM

The way Nate reacted to Boeheim's correct comments leads me to believe that he thinks Moe is ready for the NBA, and that doesn't bode well for his chances of staying here.

The way he reacted to Boeheim's comments leads me to believe that he has no business opening his mouth.

How is his 'reaction' in a public forum any different than the same exact thing people do here by posting away on a message board?

He actually puts his name to it. Something many people wouldn't be willing to do.

Quote from: Moose on March 13, 2012, 07:42:55 PM

Quote from: Poison on March 13, 2012, 07:40:13 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on March 13, 2012, 07:27:10 PM

The way Nate reacted to Boeheim's correct comments leads me to believe that he thinks Moe is ready for the NBA, and that doesn't bode well for his chances of staying here.

The way he reacted to Boeheim's comments leads me to believe that he has no business opening his mouth.

How is his 'reaction' in a public forum any different than the same exact thing people do here by posting away on a message board?

He actually puts his name to it. Something many people wouldn't be willing to do.

True, but some posters do use their names.