St. John's vs Wisconsin 11/8

Wow using a little kids argument. If you criticized Lavin you have to criticize Donovan.
First of all Wisconsin is better than us. They should beat us. I was not one of the apostles of Lavin claiming we are going to the Final Four. My problem with the game was we looked the same as last year and the starting lineup and rotations made no sense. Wisconsin is always good, boring but good. My issue with them is they were blowing us out and they just don't do that. Is Lavin the worst coach, no. Is he a shaky game coach? You bet, but that didn't start here, that rep preceded him here.

You know how you remove that stigma? Win a final or go to a couple final fours and people leave you alone. Heck Louie was left alone for making one final four with 4 1st round draft picks, 2 Wooden Award winners and 6 pros. I didn't hate on Jarvis as much as everyone else just for making an Elite 8. Lavin starts getting us in the tourney on a semi regular basis and I will worship at the altar of Lavin right alongside MCNPA. Crazy rotations and circle offense be damned!

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 13, 2013, 12:23:09 AM

Fire Billy Donovan! Clearly a terrible tactician. Because that is the only explanation when a team loses a game against a ranked opponent.

At least Florida hustled.

Florida played without 3 of their regulars, and had a walk on playing major mins. Not that great of a win for Wisc

Wow using a little kids argument. If you criticized Lavin you have to criticize Donovan.
First of all Wisconsin is better than us. They should beat us. I was not one of the apostles of Lavin claiming we are going to the Final Four. My problem with the game was we looked the same as last year and the starting lineup and rotations made no sense. Wisconsin is always good, boring but good. My issue with them is they were blowing us out and they just don't do that. Is Lavin the worst coach, no. Is he a shaky game coach? You bet, but that didn't start here, that rep preceded him here.

You know how you remove that stigma? Win a final or go to a couple final fours and people leave you alone. Heck Louie was left alone for making one final four with 4 1st round draft picks, 2 Wooden Award winners and 6 pros. I didn't hate on Jarvis as much as everyone else just for making an Elite 8. Lavin starts getting us in the tourney on a semi regular basis and I will worship at the altar of Lavin right alongside MCNPA. Crazy rotations and circle offense be damned!

That's the thing. It was one game. And to be honest, I don't think the offense looked the same. And we definitely didn't get blown out so I'm not sure what you were watching. It's almost like the negative nancies just want to insist we were blown out to support their Lavin can't coach agenda. Did we even score 75 in a BE game last sesason? And Wisconsin is known for their defense.

I'm not saying we looked great, our defense was garbage, but we didn't look the same as last year on offense, in my opinion.

And the whole "Lavin doesn't make adjustments" thing I think took a hit for you guys too. Because you'd think if that was true, we could have just folded after it was 33-15. Instead we outscore them the remainder of the game.

We're never going to run an offense that resembles Princeton or Wisconsin.  Perhaps an offense which provides a vehicle for our all conference star players to explode resulting in a 52 point half is the best we can hope for.

Don't negatively judge this year's offense based on past years.  Let them score in the 50's a couple of times than complain.  75 points is going to be one of the highest/the highest point total the Badgers give up all year.

Complain about the defense.  Now that would make sense.

 This team will be fine if the staff and players can get on the same page on the defensive end.  It's not that complicated.  Play defense and rebound...

 For the first time in years I'm not concerned about the offense.

I can only speak for myself, but I never said the season was over. I reacted to the last game. Specifically the first half where we got crushed. On D we allow stand still three point shooters to kill us and on offense way to resilient on Jakar Harrison. Most of the reason people were disappointe was how much the team was hyped.
Hardy team did not really take off until after Fordham loss. Sanchez showed flashes and everyone can't be wrong about Jordan.
Again I can't speak for everyone but I was just commenting about the Wisconsin game

Instead we outscore them the remainder of the game.

We outscored them because they lost their focus once they got up by 70 in the first half. They batted us around like a cat with a mouse and the two times it got close it wasn't close for very long. Us outscoring them is like the losing quarterbacks racking up 400 yards once he's down 7 TDs.

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 13, 2013, 12:05:35 PM

Instead we outscore them the remainder of the game.

We outscored them because they lost their focus once they got up by 70 in the first half. They batted us around like a cat with a mouse and the two times it got close it wasn't close for very long. Us outscoring them is like the losing quarterbacks racking up 400 yards once he's down 7 TDs.

That would be an accurate comparison if the losing QB brings his team within 4 points midway through the 4th quarter.

For those not concerned with our offense let me be the first to debunk that theory:

We have one three point shooter and as I said from day one, despite the fact that he does not have much athletic ability Harrison is more scorer than shooter. At the very least he is a volume shooter. Furthermore every team we play knows he is our only shooter. Not sure how that is going to be rectified, will be a problem all year same as it was last 2 years.

Playmaking. Greene and Harrison are not point guards and honestly it is getting late fast for Branch. From what I have seen I think he is a good combo guard with a soft touch who could probably be a 10 ppg guy but I just have not seen the playmaking.
I am in the minority of liking the ball in Pointer's hands and if Lavin is to be believed Jordan is an incredible passer.Jason Kidd and Baron Davis stuff was silly but hopefully Jordan can be a big upgrade here.

Low post scoring. GG is probably our best low post scorer. That is not a good thing.

Bottom line is if Jordan is half as good as Lavin and some of you claim then we will be much improved. If not........

We have one three point shooter

We have Harrison, Sanchez and Jordan. All can shoot 3's. We also have Hooper, but I know you refuse to admit he's on the roster.

Quote from: Foad on November 13, 2013, 12:31:02 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 13, 2013, 12:05:35 PM

Instead we outscore them the remainder of the game.

We outscored them because they lost their focus once they got up by 70 in the first half. They batted us around like a cat with a mouse and the two times it got close it wasn't close for very long. Us outscoring them is like the losing quarterbacks racking up 400 yards once he's down 7 TDs.

That would be an accurate comparison if the losing QB brings his team within 4 points midway through the 4th quarter.

During Norm's second season at SJU, we were down 2 points at #1 ranked Uconn with under 10 minutes to play in the game. (I think that's right) At the time, many people thought that the game was a moral victory. We're not at that place now, nor should we be.

Quote from: Foad on November 13, 2013, 12:31:02 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 13, 2013, 12:05:35 PM

Instead we outscore them the remainder of the game.

We outscored them because they lost their focus once they got up by 70 in the first half. They batted us around like a cat with a mouse and the two times it got close it wasn't close for very long. Us outscoring them is like the losing quarterbacks racking up 400 yards once he's down 7 TDs.

That would be an accurate comparison if the losing QB brings his team within 4 points midway through the 4th quarter.

No. It's an accurate comparison because you're all jazzed about how we scored 75 points wowee!! and how golly Wisconsin is a great defensive team. We wouldn't have scored 75 points if Wisconsin wasn't too busy laughing to play defense.

I think that more/different/older parts will result in an improved offense.  After one game,  my position is in the lead.

Sanchez looked smooth, I will give you that, just not sure playing the 5 he will attempt many. We made 2 threes all game. As much good things as I have heard about Jordan, shooting threes was never one of them. Again one game and even though his free throw shooting did not scream lights out shooter, I will reserve judgement.

As far as the American Bourgault, I think your issue about him being on the roster should be directed at the person who you are defending. I don't control PT, Hooper played a minute I believe. Unless you want Lavin trying to jugglre 10 guys or you want Greene's minutes(sign me up) or Branch's minutes cut, Hooper is not going to play. I have no idea if Shurina 2.0 can shoot and if he can you might have to start bitching at Lavin

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 13, 2013, 12:48:07 PM

Quote from: Foad on November 13, 2013, 12:31:02 PM

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 13, 2013, 12:05:35 PM

Instead we outscore them the remainder of the game.

We outscored them because they lost their focus once they got up by 70 in the first half. They batted us around like a cat with a mouse and the two times it got close it wasn't close for very long. Us outscoring them is like the losing quarterbacks racking up 400 yards once he's down 7 TDs.

That would be an accurate comparison if the losing QB brings his team within 4 points midway through the 4th quarter.

No. It's an accurate comparison because you're all jazzed about how we scored 75 points wowee!! and how golly Wisconsin is a great defensive team. We wouldn't have scored 75 points if Wisconsin wasn't too busy laughing to play defense.

No, it's really not accurate because it's implying we were blown out. We weren't.

I know it's only one game, but everyone, both positive and negative, are making a bunch of long term assumptions based on a tiny sample. 

I think Harrison, Sanchez, and Jordan will be a huge upgrade in our scoring from the 12-18 ft range..  We know Hooper can shoot. I want to see him do it in a game and in order to do that, he need some minutes.  He should get those minutes in the next few games. Then we will hopefully know what we have.

Jordan is the PG for this team.. Messing around with this any longer is a mistake. Give the kid the ball and let him run the team. Green and Branch need to compete for reserve minutes.

I expect a much more consistent season from Sampson.. Say what you want about the kid, he played like a stud against a good Wisco team. 

 Jordan, Harrison, Sampson, Sanchez-  With this core of players, scoring the rock shouldn't be ann issue assuming they mesh and share the ball.

 I sound like a broken record, but this teams success moving forward will be based on how we play defense the rest of the way.. If we play lazy , it will be a long season.. If we attack and stay disciplined, this team will be dancing and will win a few games no one expects.

Quote from: we are sju on November 13, 2013, 12:50:34 PM

We have one three point shooter

We have Harrison, Sanchez and Jordan. All can shoot 3's. We also have Hooper, but I know you refuse to admit he's on the roster.

The trapezoid hit 25 three's last season.  I'm  hoping that with a surgically repaired hip and better utilization position wise,  his percentage will increase enough to be added to this list.

Quote from: redstorm212 on November 13, 2013, 12:57:52 PM

Quote from: we are sju on November 13, 2013, 12:50:34 PM

We have one three point shooter

We have Harrison, Sanchez and Jordan. All can shoot 3's. We also have Hooper, but I know you refuse to admit he's on the roster.

The trapezoid hit 25 three's last season.  I'm  hoping that with a surgically repaired hip and better utilization position wise,  his percentage will increase enough to be added to this list.

I hope so too. But it appears his shot is much better inside the arc much like Jakarr.

Sanchez looked smooth, I will give you that, just not sure playing the 5 he will attempt many. We made 2 threes all game. As much good things as I have heard about Jordan, shooting threes was never one of them. Again one game and even though his free throw shooting did not scream lights out shooter, I will reserve judgement.

As far as the American Bourgault, I think your issue about him being on the roster should be directed at the person who you are defending. I don't control PT, Hooper played a minute I believe. Unless you want Lavin trying to jugglre 10 guys or you want Greene's minutes(sign me up) or Branch's minutes cut, Hooper is not going to play. I have no idea if Shurina 2.0 can shoot and if he can you might have to start bitching at Lavin

I saw Jordan hit ten plus free throws in a highschool game. He also hit 50+ 3's his senior year. I think his shooting will be fine.

Greene should never attempt another three as long as he lives